[ANN] HORIZON (HZ) New ANN thread

[l8orre]

Does NXT have this weird thing about the decimals?

sorry, I can't remember off hand right now- the information does exist somewhere, though.
there were very lively discussions about decimals in the NXT community.

I was not an NXT core dev (no java), but I wrote a bunch of apps in python using the NXT API and I also issued a bunch of assets.
most of them testing assets on the Phoenix blockchain.

all too long ago to remember details- you can trawl the old NXT forum for info on this, I am sure the discussions are there, or you could ask on the ARDOR slack, the devs are still there, and also some old timers.

https://nxtforum.org
https://ardornxt.slack.com (invite should be on NXT forum or ARDOR forum, or in ARDOR thread here)

my personal recommendation would be to start with a fresh blockchain for your own purposes if it is feasible for you,
the code has matured considerably since then (HZ is very old codebase) and you won't have the ballast of HZ
- but maybe just continuing HZ blockchain could be a neat and lean way of doing it also, if you can keep it going

[1715369069]

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[markm]

Well I managed to make my minimalist change take effect (by killing and restarting my browser), only to discover that they are not relying just on preventing you from typing in decimals; there are also further checks so although my change let me type in some decimals for HZ price of an asset that itself has 8 decimals, I was on submission of the form told there was an error in the input.

So I don't think I am going to persevere with the change, in case there are all kinds of places checking this, like maybe it could check when creating blocks, or when transmitting transactions, or gosh knows where else.

I am just going to assume they must have good reasons for the restriction, and avoid making assets with 8 decimals in future even if the asset is intended to represent coins that normally, on their own blockchains, do have 8 decimals.

In the meantime this does mean cheap coins will run into problems more and more as their price falls toward the price of a HZ, and the HORIZON platform will cease to be useful for actually doing non-manual trading of them when they are worth less than a HZ.

For now what the heck folks can always go ahead and use the STELLAR platform instead for such assets if they want to use an automated market rather than just do manual trades with trusted partners by sending them something and being sent something in return.

(The spot markets are so far mostly used just as a way for folks to easily get a few HZ to pay fees with anyway, by trying to keep some small buy offers in place for each asset so when folks get their assets on the HORIZON platform they can sell one or a few for a few HZ to get them started; really most actual trading takes place manually, generally by consulting the current prices shown at http://galaxies.mygamesonline.org/latestrates.inc and adjusting for whatever markup or markdown the parties agree to and for any drift they feel may exist between the "latest rates" when they were calculated and the current state of the actual, possibly quite volatile, markets.)

A bit of a pity maybe for players who do not like the idea of having to commit ten STELLAR Lumens per trust line in order to trade on the STELLAR platform, but then again once you have committed that the actual transaction fees on the STELLAR network look like they could be a lot cheaper than the 1 HZ fee on HORIZON, depending of course how expensive a whole Lumen gets to be and how cheap a single HZ turns out to be.

I guess it is a bit of a pity for DeVCoin too since it means it will take longer for us to be able to get around to starting to try to get folks to actually buy DeVCoins in order to pay debts that are denominated in DeVCoins. (Currently because DeVCoins are so cheap compared to the size of the debts typically we just let folks pay in some other currency by looking up the current price in DeVCoins of the asset they want to pay with in the above-mentioned "Latest Rates" include-file, which has had the unfortunate result of allowing the vast amount of DeVCoin-denominated debt to not actually cause the price of DeVCoin to increase.)

-MarkM-

[markm]

Someone created a "Discord" for HORIZON, here is an invite link: https://discord.gg/CG4n5MQ

-MarkM-

[markm]

HZ can now be traded on the Stellar network.

See http://makemoney.knotwork.com/stellar/

-MarkM-

[realdantreccia]

Well I managed to make my minimalist change take effect (by killing and restarting my browser), only to discover that they are not relying just on preventing you from typing in decimals; there are also further checks so although my change let me type in some decimals for HZ price of an asset that itself has 8 decimals, I was on submission of the form told there was an error in the input.

So I don't think I am going to persevere with the change, in case there are all kinds of places checking this, like maybe in could check when creating blocks, or when transmitting transactions, or gosh knows where else.

I am just going to assume they must have good reasons for the restriction, and avoid making assets with 8 decimals in future even if the asset is intended to represent coins that normally, on their own blockchains, do have 8 decimals.

In the meantime this does mean cheap coins will run into problems more and more as their price falls toward the price of a HZ, and the HORIZON platform will cease to be useful for actually doing non-manual trading of them when they are worth less than a HZ.

For now what the heck folks can always go ahead and use the STELLAR platform instead for such assets if they want to use an automated market rather than just do manual trades with trusted partners by sending them something and being sent something in return.

(The spot markets are so far mostly used just as a way for folks to easily get a few HZ to pay fees with anyway, by trying to keep some small buy offers in place for each asset so when folks get their assets on the HORIZON platform they can sell one or a few for a few HZ to get them started; really most actual trading takes place manually, generally by consulting the current prices shown at http://galaxies.mygamesonline.org/latestrates.inc and adjusting for whatever markup or markdown the parties agree to and for any drift they feel may exist between the "latest rates" when they were calculated and the current state of the actual, possibly quite volatile, markets.)

A bit of a pity maybe for players who do not like the idea of having to commit ten STELLAR Lumens per trust line in order to trade on the STELLAR platform, but then again once you have committed that the actual transaction fees on the STELLAR network look like they could be a lot cheaper than the 1 HZ fee on HORIZON, depending of course how expensive a whole Lumen gets to be and how cheap a single HZ turns out to be.

I guess it is a bit of a pity for DeVCoin too since it means it will take longer for us to be able to get around to starting to try to get folks to actually buy DeVCoins in order to pay debts that are denominated in DeVCoins. (Currently because DeVCoins are so cheap compared to the size of the debts typically we just let folks pay in some other currency by looking up the current price in DeVCoins of the asset they want to pay with in the above-mentioned "Latest Rates" include-file, which has had the unfortunate result of allowing the vast amount of DeVCoin-denominated debt to not actually cause the price of DeVCoin to increase.)

-MarkM-

Hi markm,

not to be snarky, but I believe VirWox could be a reason that decimals tend to be a bit of a problem when trying to create more than one currency using a decimal point.  In Nova Scotia, I'm sure you are used to using "." whereas over in French Canada it is common to use "," (comma). I found out up to 75 countries uses commas, with some not using decimal point or decimal comma seperators at all. For instance, Sierra Leonean Leones use "Cents" as a subdivision, just meaning one hundred cents make up one (ISO 4217) "SLL"... SLL happens to be used by the Paypal to Virwox "SLL" (Second Life Linden) trade which is a common way people get PayPal deposits onto an exchange (VirWox is a virtual currency exchange) for BTC, which they can exchange for their SLL. Perhaps the HORIZON network knows this since Stellar/IBM World Wire use ISO 4217 codes already. Therefore, whatever currency you created with a "decimal point" is likely "the" decimal point currency in HORIZON platform's mind.  I would assume HORIZON communicates with enough API to help relay info from IBM World Wire to Stellar.

Then again, I'm just a noob. Maybe try using a "," for other currencies to as the decimal point. If you want 0.0001 BTC/(any "currency" - money in circulation) try 0,0001.  If none else works, consider 100 stroops is a denomination of XLM and used on Horizon already as well since it communicates with both horizon.stellar.org and the testnet.stellar.org (or whatever the stellar or horizon testnet site is).

Maybe VirWox trading SLL as a virtual currency for "real life" currency such as EUR and USD as seen on virwox.com is the problem here.

The three latest virwox updates are pretty sporadic but with one around the time of some chaos within AXIOM splitting from the Milieu in part and HZ seemingly "abandoned" but kept alive as part of the Milieu maybe some of these VirWox changes and future actions mean something:

2019-11-04: IMPORTANT! End of Service: January 6, 2020.
We regret to inform you that we will permanently close our service on Jan. 6, 2020.

Please make sure that you have finished your trades well before 11am Central European Time on Jan. 6, 2020. You will not be able to access your account after that time!


2019-01-26: PayPal no longer supported
PayPal is no longer available on VirWoX. We apologize for any inconvenience this may cause.


2015-08-01: Linden Dollar withdrawals stopped.
Unfortunately, we can no longer send Linden Dollars from VirWoX accounts to Second Life avatars. Linden Dollars can only be bought on Second Life's LindeX exchange.

If you still have SLL in your VirWoX account, you can continue to trade them to other currencies. Also, the VirWoX Partner Network will continue as before.

[ViqRa]

HORIZON (HZ) IS still running!

HOW-TO GUIDE:
https://medium.com/@Raf21/horizon-hz-a-how-to-guide-bda4e415819a

Nodes currently active:

lfm.knotwork.com
ufbsh.no-ip.org
157.245.160.26
192.214.140.198
157.245.138.247

[ViqRa]

Anyone out there still holding HZ and wanting to sell some? Asking for a friend...

[realdantreccia]

Anyone out there still holding HZ and wanting to sell some? Asking for a friend...

Been using mine to buy the various assets MarkM listed on HORIZON platform but I do have 30 or so HZ left

Also, I'm happy to share I finally got this thing running and downloading blocks on Windows 10! Before paper wallets and MarkM's hosted web UI gateway got me access to Horizon. I'm glad I finally figured out how to get it to sync and not stall

Considering doing a tutorial to help others. What a great great project to run a node for

[realdantreccia]

HORIZON (HZ) IS still running!

HOW-TO GUIDE:
https://medium.com/@Raf21/horizon-hz-a-how-to-guide-bda4e415819a

Nodes currently active:

lfm.knotwork.com
ufbsh.no-ip.org
157.245.160.26
192.214.140.198
157.245.138.247

If I could merit you I would! Thanks for sharing just saw today!

[realdantreccia]

Unfortunately I have tried version 5.2, 5.3, 5.4 of the Java client. I am updated to Java 8. My firewall allows TCP connections for 7774 and 7776 and I'm still getting a message that I am finished downloading the blockchain using the nodes mentioned all over these Horizon threads... Everytime around 25% of the blocks have downloaded and then done. It won't start again if I restart and exec run.bat. I'm using Windows 10 and would really love to run my own node since I just bought another 5,200+ HZ tokens on STELLAR and sent them to knotwork on keybase to exchange for blockchain coins. Just being responsible. What if LFM.knotwork.com:7776 disappears? I want to support the network

[ViqRa]

Unfortunately I have tried version 5.2, 5.3, 5.4 of the Java client. I am updated to Java 8. My firewall allows TCP connections for 7774 and 7776 and I'm still getting a message that I am finished downloading the blockchain using the nodes mentioned all over these Horizon threads... Everytime around 25% of the blocks have downloaded and then done. It won't start again if I restart and exec run.bat. I'm using Windows 10 and would really love to run my own node since I just bought another 5,200+ HZ tokens on STELLAR and sent them to knotwork on keybase to exchange for blockchain coins. Just being responsible. What if LFM.knotwork.com:7776 disappears? I want to support the network

I had the same problem syncing it for the first time. Have you tried adding these to the config file?
nhz.defaultPeers=lfm.knotwork.com; ufbsh.no-ip.org
nhz.wellKnownPeers=lfm.knotwork.com; ufbsh.no-ip.org
nhz.minNumberOfKnownPeers=1
nhz.minNumberOfForkConfirmations=1

Don't know if that's is the best solution but it worked for me the first time. The nodes I set up are currently offline. Will get one up once I can.

[realdantreccia]

Unfortunately I have tried version 5.2, 5.3, 5.4 of the Java client. I am updated to Java 8. My firewall allows TCP connections for 7774 and 7776 and I'm still getting a message that I am finished downloading the blockchain using the nodes mentioned all over these Horizon threads... Everytime around 25% of the blocks have downloaded and then done. It won't start again if I restart and exec run.bat. I'm using Windows 10 and would really love to run my own node since I just bought another 5,200+ HZ tokens on STELLAR and sent them to knotwork on keybase to exchange for blockchain coins. Just being responsible. What if LFM.knotwork.com:7776 disappears? I want to support the network

I had the same problem syncing it for the first time. Have you tried adding these to the config file?
nhz.defaultPeers=lfm.knotwork.com; ufbsh.no-ip.org
nhz.wellKnownPeers=lfm.knotwork.com; ufbsh.no-ip.org
nhz.minNumberOfKnownPeers=1
nhz.minNumberOfForkConfirmations=1

Don't know if that's is the best solution but it worked for me the first time. The nodes I set up are currently offline. Will get one up once I can.

First of all, thank you for actively trying to help people get up and running in this topic! Seems a little lonely here

Second, I do have those in my conf. And a few other addresses I found from a Wizard's web UI.

Let's just say this guy might be the first WINDOWS user to successfully download the complete Horizon blockchain as well as actively run a Java server while forging blocks from his own locally hosted UI

I just wish more people understood but its devs and community members like you that help people like me realize the value is as (secretly) strong on this platform as it is in the humanity of these devs/business figureheads who get constantly shit on in the media. Perhaps that protects the chain from self centrists. And maybe I'll never get a USD value out of HZ that one would think worthwhile to put in the effort. But I will run this server forever, so long as I can maintain it. It was the most challenging experience in setting it up - but I learned so much and persistence paid off. At least in what I find valuable.

[ViqRa]

Unfortunately I have tried version 5.2, 5.3, 5.4 of the Java client. I am updated to Java 8. My firewall allows TCP connections for 7774 and 7776 and I'm still getting a message that I am finished downloading the blockchain using the nodes mentioned all over these Horizon threads... Everytime around 25% of the blocks have downloaded and then done. It won't start again if I restart and exec run.bat. I'm using Windows 10 and would really love to run my own node since I just bought another 5,200+ HZ tokens on STELLAR and sent them to knotwork on keybase to exchange for blockchain coins. Just being responsible. What if LFM.knotwork.com:7776 disappears? I want to support the network

I had the same problem syncing it for the first time. Have you tried adding these to the config file?
nhz.defaultPeers=lfm.knotwork.com; ufbsh.no-ip.org
nhz.wellKnownPeers=lfm.knotwork.com; ufbsh.no-ip.org
nhz.minNumberOfKnownPeers=1
nhz.minNumberOfForkConfirmations=1

Don't know if that's is the best solution but it worked for me the first time. The nodes I set up are currently offline. Will get one up once I can.

First of all, thank you for actively trying to help people get up and running in this topic! Seems a little lonely here

Second, I do have those in my conf. And a few other addresses I found from a Wizard's web UI.

Let's just say this guy might be the first WINDOWS user to successfully download the complete Horizon blockchain as well as actively run a Java server while forging blocks from his own locally hosted UI

I just wish more people understood but its devs and community members like you that help people like me realize the value is as (secretly) strong on this platform as it is in the humanity of these devs/business figureheads who get constantly shit on in the media. Perhaps that protects the chain from self centrists. And maybe I'll never get a USD value out of HZ that one would think worthwhile to put in the effort. But I will run this server forever, so long as I can maintain it. It was the most challenging experience in setting it up - but I learned so much and persistence paid off. At least in what I find valuable.

Thanks for the kind words! I didn't do much really. Just saw that STELLAR was getting all the attention and HORIZON was left a bit out.
Hoped, maybe, that a guide could introduce new or curious people to the platform.

After all, curiosity can be very profitable sometimes

[ifinta]

I joined also - to forge Horizon...

[realdantreccia]

Thanks for the kind words! I didn't do much really. Just saw that STELLAR was getting all the attention and HORIZON was left a bit out.
Hoped, maybe, that a guide could introduce new or curious people to the platform.

After all, curiosity can be very profitable sometimes

Ah yes. Being off web exchanges with your native currency but working in the background as "the" platform could be quite lucrative if such native coins were in - escrow@[somewhere?] 

I created a telegram since no one else has yet. Figured I'd grab the address before anyone else did in case the admins or people who develop this project want to take it over. For now great place for community in addition to discord For now I am the admin but I'd be happy to hand it over when the wizards come out of the shadows and admit their creation. I just run a Java server/node and use the platform from my own local hosted wallet.

https://t.me/horizonplatform

[realdantreccia]

I joined also - to forge Horizon...

Are you the creator of the fork of hz-source used in Raf's medium article?

[ifinta]

I joined also - to forge Horizon...

Are you the creator of the fork of hz-source used in Raf's medium article?

yes

[ifinta]

I joined also - to forge Horizon...

It was a failure to forge Horizon with 12 500 000 HZ? ((I transferred a little more also to my server, but it shouldn't yet count in the forging amount, I think))
As always - last times - I think, Horizon chain was forked to quickly. I stopped my server.
Me seems lfm.knotwork.com and ufbsh.no-ip.org should be restarted also.
Any hints?

[realdantreccia]

I joined also - to forge Horizon...

It was a failure to forge Horizon with 12 500 000 HZ? ((I transferred a little more also to my server, but it shouldn't yet count in the forging amount, I think))
As always - last times - I think, Horizon chain was forked to quickly. I stopped my server.
Me seems lfm.knotwork.com and ufbsh.no-ip.org should be restarted also.
Any hints?

You can have my IP. I trust all of you. I don't care. I think you all run nodes just like me in this meta game. Maybe we need a meta like file (like .TOML) or something to show where Horizon comes from... Or where its locally stored on each of our own accounts =P I dunno.

I suppose Poloniex escrow@poloniex Polonidex still takes from this network as a web based exchange and I suppose locked threads or delisted KYC exchanges might make certain versions of HZ software we use not readable forwards and backwards but if we all just admit we're in this together and CORs (Cross Origin Resource sharing) between a HZ/BTC pair exists... I mean just click the link still active over the web browser and TCP/IP and see where it forwards you:

https://www.poloniex.com/exchange/#btc_hz

I've said this so many times. It's a waiting game. I am sure there are easter eggs, or bootstraps, or tip bots we could use somewhere. Or perhaps we already have - and that's why my local app data for Keybase's desktop app is always part of the nhz.log file in my roaming folder on Windows everytime I start up my Horizon Server. Sharing is caring

So either lets all ADMIT what this actually is. Or lets all help Dan figure out how to be more productive in helping other normies from "the planet known as earth" find opportunities they just cannot accept to exist.

IFINTA: Give me some info about what OS you use, what software you're running and I will try and answer even though you are a fellow character in this game and I am probably just amusing you by posting my offer to help lol

[realdantreccia]

I have created a STELLAR market for HZ/I0C I0C/HZ swaps:

https://interstellar.exchange/app/#/trade/./I0C/GBHAQ252S4Z4AQOM4BWIRC3UHAOJIKCZQBUJGD336YH2O7W2NKRXMHA5/HZ/GBHAQ252S4Z4AQOM4BWIRC3UHAOJIKCZQBUJGD336YH2O7W2NKRXMHA5

Price is 1.000000 HZ per ~0.06 I0C. Anyone selling I0C tokens for HZ tokens on STELLAR?