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Author Topic: Reporting Mt. Gox to the Japan Financial Services Agency  (Read 5397 times)
Nagle
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June 25, 2011, 05:49:36 AM
 #1

It may be time to report Mt. Gox to the Japan Financial Services Agency, which regulates money transfer firms in Japan.

Japan's Financial Services Agency regulates money transfer firms which operate in Japan.  For example, SBI Remit is a registered money transfer firm. They transfer to and from various currencies and can move money around the world. They even support mobile phones.  Mt. Gox comes squarely under the same regulations they do.

Here's are some excerpts from the regulations:

"Only banks licensed under the Banking Act of Japan (Act No. 59 of 1981, as amended) and certain other financial institutions handling deposits licensed under other applicable laws (collectively, the Banks) are permitted to engage in ‘money remittance transactions’....

"However due to the innovation of information-communication technology, persons/entities other than Banks can easily conduct services that are similar to the traditional fund transfer business conducted by Banks. This, therefore, means that the line between permitted and prohibited services is blurred and it has been argued that, by considering customer protection, it is necessary to sort this issue out and set new regulations on fund transfer services by permitting certain entities other than the Banks to engage in the business of such services.

"The PSA will allow companies that are not licensed Banks to engage in the business of ‘money remittance transactions’ in Japan provided that: (i) they are registered as ‘fund transfer business operators’ (operators); and (ii) they are able to engage in services to the extent that such transactions fall under the category of a ‘certain small amount of transactions’. Details of the ‘certain small amount’ mentioned in (ii) above will be provided for in the cabinet order. However, in light of discussions at the National Diet of Japan, such amount is expected to be between JPY500,000 and JPY1,000,000 or less."

"An entity which intends to be an operator will be subject to a registration requirement and certain regulations including the security of its assets and other customer protection measures, supervision and measures against money laundering."

"In order to be registered as an operator under the PSA, an applicant must satisfy certain requirements, such as the applicant must be a stock company (kabushiki kaisha) or a foreign entity which has the equivalent registration in its home country and has an office(s) and representative in Japan; the applicant must have sufficient financial standing to conduct business appropriately and properly; the applicant must have a satisfactory organisational structure to conduct business appropriately and properly; and the applicant must have a compliance system to ensure observance with the relevant laws and regulations. "

"The PSA will impose an obligation on an operator to secure the assets in amounts equal to or more than the total amount of: (i) funds which an operator is transmitting; and (ii) procedural costs in relation to reimbursement of such funds as set out in (i), so that the transferred funds can reach the recipient even in the event of an operator’s insolvency."

"In the event of an operator’s insolvency, users have rights to recover their assets from the above secured assets in priority to an operator's general creditors, pursuant to the procedures provided in the PSA."

There's more, but you get the general idea.

The Japan Financial Services Agency enforces these regulations.

    Financial Services Agency
    The Central Common Government Offices No. 7,
    3-2-1 Kasumigaseki, Chiyoda-ku, Tokyo, 100-8967 Japan
 
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TheGer
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June 25, 2011, 06:49:18 AM
 #2

Stop acting like a
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June 25, 2011, 06:58:42 AM
 #3

Oh yes, that's exactly what a peep-to-peer cryptocurrency needs. Government regulation!

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June 25, 2011, 07:59:38 AM
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If you think they've done something illegal, then go for it. Nobody's going to stop you. Let us know when you give up. It would be my guess that, just be like everyone else who's threatened or suggested that we do some legal or governmental thing to Mt. Gox, you'll quietly do nothing more than complain some more. This is because you realize that suggesting something that you want others to "rise up and do" is completely different than saying you're going to do something yourself and doing it.

If you want something done, it's on you, pal. Lead the way. Ignite the charge. Let us know how it progresses.

Or, you know, do the expected thing to just bitch and moan and then disappear from this thread.

Please, prove me wrong. I'm pretty jaded by attempts like this.

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cryptoanarchist
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June 25, 2011, 01:08:44 PM
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Someone needs to be reported to the National Agency of Douchebaggery
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June 25, 2011, 01:15:31 PM
 #6

reporting anyone... i bet you had no friends in schooltime

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June 25, 2011, 03:08:36 PM
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Do it.  It's long overdue.  I'm surprised the Japanese government hasn't cracked down on them already, it's only a matter of time...

Enjoying the dose of reality or getting a laugh out of my posts? Feel free to toss me a penny or two, everyone else seems to be doing it! 1Kn8NqvbCC83zpvBsKMtu4sjso5PjrQEu1
Nagle
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June 25, 2011, 03:36:42 PM
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Do it.  It's long overdue.  I'm surprised the Japanese government hasn't cracked down on them already, it's only a matter of time...
I don't have any money trapped in Mt. Gox. Many of the people who do have a good reason to file a complaint. Especially since Mt. Gox just missed their re-opening deadline yet again.

Something is very, very wrong at Mt. Gox. Millions of dollars may be lost if action isn't taken.

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June 25, 2011, 04:57:38 PM
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Do it.  It's long overdue.  I'm surprised the Japanese government hasn't cracked down on them already, it's only a matter of time...
I don't have any money trapped in Mt. Gox. Many of the people who do have a good reason to file a complaint. Especially since Mt. Gox just missed their re-opening deadline yet again.

Something is very, very wrong at Mt. Gox. Millions of dollars may be lost if action isn't taken.




Serves those people right.  Anyone stupid enough to trade at a shady, completely unregulated exchage deserves to get their money stolen.  Welcome to the real world of no regulation.  It's going to be a rough lesson for a lot of people.

Enjoying the dose of reality or getting a laugh out of my posts? Feel free to toss me a penny or two, everyone else seems to be doing it! 1Kn8NqvbCC83zpvBsKMtu4sjso5PjrQEu1
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June 25, 2011, 05:00:15 PM
 #10

I'm not saying Mt. Gox isn't sorely in need of some adult oversight, but what is the likely outcome of a successful complaint? It seems very possible to me that it'd be a big seizure of all computers, encryption keys and bank accounts then turned over to a team of forensic accountants. People with real money deposits would probably get their money back after an extended period, but it seems quite possible everyones BTC would be gone forever or at least held up indefinapermanently.
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June 25, 2011, 05:04:51 PM
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that won't do shit..
for all you know it could be some teenager running the MtGox server out of his mother's basement... or two 20yr olds running MtGox out of their garage (although not likely in Japan).
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June 25, 2011, 05:05:27 PM
 #12

honestly, no more uninformed rumours please

MtGox confirmed they lost around 1000$ worth of bitcoins

the large 500.000BTC transaction that we all saw right after the hackcrash was due to MtGox moving their wallet to a more secure location

they confirmed that! my account reads correctly and my bitcoins are in place...other people have already withdrawn their BTC no problem

cut the bs please

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June 26, 2011, 01:46:02 AM
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look this guy is a loser that runs this shit site. > http://downside.com/
The guy obviously has no life and wants to be a prick just to have something to do.
People like this see something happening that challenges their statist worldview and they get their panties in a bunch. 

Mind your own business, Get lost and bent Nagle!



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June 26, 2011, 02:21:42 AM
 #14

Wow, talk about argumentum ad hominem.  The OP's original post, while quite charged in implication, was pretty matter-of-fact and to the point.  Just because he posted the address of a government regulatory agency ...

It's probably good for all of us to have numbers to all sorts of agencies, should our ability to self-police not work out.

But, we should try to self-police first I think, no?  Vote with your btc's.  If gox can't get this stuff straightened out, people will eventually move to something better.  Shit, people may just collectively INVENT something better.

I'd love to work with some people on creating something like "Bitcoin Open Exchange" where everything we do is transparent (with the exception of security).  Something like Open Software for btc trading.

"... and the geeks shall inherit the earth."
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June 26, 2011, 04:12:20 AM
 #15

Mt Gox is registered with them already I'm pretty sure.

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Nagle
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June 26, 2011, 04:32:13 AM
 #16

Mt Gox is registered with them already I'm pretty sure.
Here's the officlal list of "financial instruments firms" registered with the Japan Financial Services Agency as of May 31, 2011. SBI Remit (Japan's equivalent of Western Union Money Transfer) shows up as their parent company, SBI Capital, on page 57, so this is the right place for money transfer firms.

There are also lists of every kind of financial entity in Japan. - banks, insurance companies, etc.

Not finding "Mt. Gox" or "Tibanne" anywhere.

So it looks like they're not registered.
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June 26, 2011, 04:42:33 AM
 #17

Nagle, you need to register on the International Registry of Statist Trolls.   Grin

If you don't like Mtgox - don't use em. It's that simple.
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June 26, 2011, 04:49:43 AM
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Mt Gox is registered with them already I'm pretty sure.
Here's the officlal list of "financial instruments firms" registered with the Japan Financial Services Agency as of May 31, 2011. SBI Remit (Japan's equivalent of Western Union Money Transfer) shows up as their parent company, SBI Capital, on page 57, so this is the right place for money transfer firms.

There are also lists of every kind of financial entity in Japan. - banks, insurance companies, etc.

Not finding "Mt. Gox" or "Tibanne" anywhere.

So it looks like they're not registered.

i do believe that the 1k/day and 10k/month are limits they place on everyone to avoid regulation- gl with going after them but from what i've read they religiously consult legal advice and it seems they are in good standing.  

on the other side you could be an activist complainer going after someone who was just compromised and is seeking to update their security to avoid further problems (but not fast enough for your liking).  i'll side with them on this one.  is it that shocking that the main market for a currency that only recently became widely accepted by "hackers" is "hacked"?  shocker?!?  omg wtf?  if you didn't see this coming you are R-E-T-A-R-D-E-D.  i just hope that what steps they have taken now prevent further issues.  seriously if you think any of the other "untested" sites like tradehill and 7bitcoins or whatever it is would have been able to avoid the first incident refer to my previous claim (that you are retarded).  

i mean the "crash" wasn't even a hack- it was an "i'll market order gazillions of coins to a different account i have resting bids at .00001 cents at and then instantly transfer them out thereby getting around the 1k/day limit" attempt... and the accounts that were released were (according to mtgox) innactive accounts from an auditor's comp system (not their own).

think about it this way- the "value" you place in anything is really worthless until it is high enough that you've convinced people to try and steal it.  that legitimizes it in my opinion (even though this was by no means a theft in my book).
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June 26, 2011, 04:52:15 AM
 #19

Well, Japan seems to have bigger problems than bitcoin these days... Did they fix the leaks in the nuclear reactors?
Maybe MtGox's problem is the lack of reliable power  Grin
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June 26, 2011, 04:55:19 AM
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Well, Japan seems to have bigger problems than bitcoin these days... Did they fix the leaks in the nuclear reactors?
Maybe MtGox's problem is the lack of reliable power  Grin

+1 (and the US as well don't we have a meltdown going now too?)
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