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Author Topic: Poker Meeting  (Read 2809 times)
genjix
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December 14, 2010, 09:32:35 AM
 #1

Hey,

I'll keep this short but I know some of you are interested in Poker. We're a group writing Poker software and this might interest some of you. It's the text we spammed to various Poker websites.

------

Everyday 200k play on PokerStars. After the day's end, PokerStars has netted a nice $1.34 million. They give themselves a nice pat on the back while the players have been exploited. Running a Poker site is not a high-cost expense.

Rake distorts the games. Without rake, a losing player might be breakeven, a breakeven player a solid winner and a winner is a MASSIVE winner. People move up faster leading to more fish at higher stakes benefiting the whole Poker economy.

Even with the huge sums taken out of the games by the sites, they still offer shoddy service in return. PokerStars gives you a couple of TV tournaments and a piecemeal updates to their software. Cake Poker gives you atrociously bad security; any programmer can tell you how easy it is to secure your software using programming that is free on the net.

We're proposing a community run Poker room. The software will be completely free/open so anyone can inspect it to make improvements. Because eyes of the whole Poker community will be fixed on it, flaws & security problems very quickly disappear. And if you wish to make your own Poker room then you can! As the server code is also free & open.

We've been working on this rake-free Poker room. For those interested there is an online meeting between Poker players at 22:00 GMT (5PM EST) on Thursday Dec 16th in #pokerface on Freenode. For anyone not familiar with IRC you can join the chatroom here:
http://pastecoin.com/cgi-bin/irc.cgi

If you're interested in this project but won't be able to make the meeting, don't worry about it. The meeting will be logged and posted on the wiki. Even if you're not a developer we need regular poker players to tell us what they want so please attend and voice your thoughts.

See you there!

--- some screenshots of our work so far ----

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FreeMoney
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December 14, 2010, 09:47:00 AM
 #2

It's a great idea. I'll try to make it to the meeting.

I have to say though that I gladly pay rake to Poker Stars and that they have no power to exploit me whatsoever. At any time I can stop buying if it is no longer worth it to me. I'm actually a little insulted that you don't think I can evaluate the worth of the service they provide. I don't think I'm the only poker player who can think for themselves either so you might be irritating more people than you realize.

Play Bitcoin Poker at sealswithclubs.eu. We're active and open to everyone.
grondilu
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December 14, 2010, 09:52:41 AM
 #3

I don't play poker but I have to say that I'm interested in the technical problem of fair online poker games.

I know that poker used to be played on IRC and I'd be delighted if this habit could come back.  If poker was played on IRC with a free software I may start playing.

I'll be there thursday if I remember it.
genjix
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December 14, 2010, 10:13:57 AM
 #4

I have to say though that I gladly pay rake to Poker Stars and that they have no power to exploit me whatsoever. At any time I can stop buying if it is no longer worth it to me. I'm actually a little insulted that you don't think I can evaluate the worth of the service they provide. I don't think I'm the only poker player who can think for themselves either so you might be irritating more people than you realize.

Good point, I didn't realise that- thanks for the tip. I meant it in the way that all Poker sites charge the same rake. You have the choice to either play or not play.
FreeMoney
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December 14, 2010, 11:10:17 AM
 #5

I have to say though that I gladly pay rake to Poker Stars and that they have no power to exploit me whatsoever. At any time I can stop buying if it is no longer worth it to me. I'm actually a little insulted that you don't think I can evaluate the worth of the service they provide. I don't think I'm the only poker player who can think for themselves either so you might be irritating more people than you realize.

Good point, I didn't realise that- thanks for the tip. I meant it in the way that all Poker sites charge the same rake. You have the choice to either play or not play.

Yeah, obviously I'm totally cool with getting something that I value very highly for free, but that's way different than denigrating the company that currently offers the best deal to me. Glad you understand.

Play Bitcoin Poker at sealswithclubs.eu. We're active and open to everyone.
doublec
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December 14, 2010, 11:23:55 AM
 #6

Yeah, obviously I'm totally cool with getting something that I value very highly for free, but that's way different than denigrating the company that currently offers the best deal to me. Glad you understand.

I have no problems with rooms charging rake either. They've got to pay the bills somehow. World Sports Exchange had a rake free room but it failed. Any thoughts on how you expect to fund things?
genjix
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December 14, 2010, 11:42:55 AM
 #7

About WSEX, check out my essay I wrote:
http://www.kartludox.org/index.php?title=Rake-free_Poker

We hope to cover this as on of the agendas at the meeting:
http://www.kartludox.org/index.php?title=Dec_16_2010_-_Public_Forum
(See 3rd point)

Interesting debate about Bitcoin raging on 2+2:
http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/28/internet-poker/rake-free-open-poker-room-run-poker-community-938389/

Would be nice to have some Bitcoin-FUD-fighters.
Waterfox
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December 14, 2010, 09:29:41 PM
 #8

I could help, if and only if the program will shortly be multi-platform (essentially Windows, Mac OS and *nix), either through ports or bytecode/virtual environments (e.g. Java).

genjix
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December 15, 2010, 12:39:47 AM
 #9

I could help, if and only if the program will shortly be multi-platform (essentially Windows, Mac OS and *nix), either through ports or bytecode/virtual environments (e.g. Java).

I couldn't get Mac OS to run in VirtualBox so I don't know about that.

But I run Linux so of course it will be multiplatform Smiley

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/28/internet-poker/rake-free-open-poker-room-run-poker-community-938389/index11.html#post23524794

Lots of interest on the 2+2 forums about this project.
genjix
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December 16, 2010, 04:33:45 PM
 #10

Meeting is in a few hours (1630 now, meeting starts at 2200). We've been getting tons of interest- more than I'd have imagined:

http://forumserver.twoplustwo.com/28/internet-poker/rake-free-open-poker-room-run-poker-community-938389/
http://www.liquidpoker.net/poker-forum/940985/Rake-Free__amp;_Ran_By_the_Poker_C...html

Would be good to have some Bitcoiners there as likely people will have many Bitcoin related questions which we will struggle to answer.
genjix
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December 16, 2010, 08:34:32 PM
 #11

1½ hours to go before it starts.

Meeting agenda:
http://www.kartludox.org/index.php?title=Dec_16_2010_-_Public_Forum
MoonShadow
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December 16, 2010, 09:08:24 PM
 #12

Would be good to have some Bitcoiners there as likely people will have many Bitcoin related questions which we will struggle to answer.

I'm no player myself, but I find this project intriguing.  I'll try to be there.

"The powers of financial capitalism had another far-reaching aim, nothing less than to create a world system of financial control in private hands able to dominate the political system of each country and the economy of the world as a whole. This system was to be controlled in a feudalist fashion by the central banks of the world acting in concert, by secret agreements arrived at in frequent meetings and conferences. The apex of the systems was to be the Bank for International Settlements in Basel, Switzerland, a private bank owned and controlled by the world's central banks which were themselves private corporations. Each central bank...sought to dominate its government by its ability to control Treasury loans, to manipulate foreign exchanges, to influence the level of economic activity in the country, and to influence cooperative politicians by subsequent economic rewards in the business world."

- Carroll Quigley, CFR member, mentor to Bill Clinton, from 'Tragedy And Hope'
genjix
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December 16, 2010, 09:45:41 PM
 #13

Meeting is in 10 MINUTES!!

Get yourself there. #pokerface

Webchat: http://pastecoin.com/cgi-bin/irc.cgi
MoonShadow
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December 16, 2010, 10:11:18 PM
 #14

Can't seem to break through, sorry.


"The powers of financial capitalism had another far-reaching aim, nothing less than to create a world system of financial control in private hands able to dominate the political system of each country and the economy of the world as a whole. This system was to be controlled in a feudalist fashion by the central banks of the world acting in concert, by secret agreements arrived at in frequent meetings and conferences. The apex of the systems was to be the Bank for International Settlements in Basel, Switzerland, a private bank owned and controlled by the world's central banks which were themselves private corporations. Each central bank...sought to dominate its government by its ability to control Treasury loans, to manipulate foreign exchanges, to influence the level of economic activity in the country, and to influence cooperative politicians by subsequent economic rewards in the business world."

- Carroll Quigley, CFR member, mentor to Bill Clinton, from 'Tragedy And Hope'
grondilu
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December 16, 2010, 11:05:19 PM
 #15

Meeting is in 10 MINUTES!!

Get yourself there. #pokerface

Webchat: http://pastecoin.com/cgi-bin/irc.cgi

I'm sorry I was asleep Sad  I'll try to join now.
genjix
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December 17, 2010, 05:12:10 AM
 #16

Summary of meeting for those interested,

http://poker.bitcoinvegas.com/wiki/index.php?title=Dec_16_2010_-_Public_Forum#Summary
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