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Author Topic: Official p2pool.nl KnC Jupiter Group Buy Thread  (Read 1990 times)
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btceic (OP)
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June 12, 2013, 03:21:39 AM
Last edit: June 15, 2013, 11:14:32 AM by btceic
 #1

Hello to all and congratulations on buying into the 4.2 TH/s KnC Jupiter group buy hosted by Tyrion70 and Blastbob from p2pool.nl.

For reference, Tyrion70 and Blastbob can be reached via their blog at: http://p2pool.nl/blog/

This thread is open to all that have participated and is a single point for all of us to discuss matters that pertain to it.

If you would like, you can say hello and the amount of shares that you purchased.

I bought 10 shares.










Good evening everyone!

Allright, we've finished the IPO agreement. Now before we start, the following:

We've had to rewrite original agreements in the post because some things just need to be airtight when you do an IPO, also this share will hopefully be traded for many years to come and the original post wasn't setup to be on an exchange. We believe the changes made do not change anything for you (or us as a matter of fact) but clarify things and remove irrelevant things. We want you to take this opportunity to ask questions, check for mistakes and making sure we haven't forgotten anything.

We kindly request that if you feel somethings is not right, not clear, missing (or worse Wink) etc, you let us know either by PM, Email or on topic. If you want to discuss it we'd prefer PM, Email or IRC (#p2poolnl on freenode). This because we need consensus with all of you (and there are more than 100 of you  Grin). I'll reserve the post below for

Allright, about the IPO. We decided to do this on bitfunder.com. I know we have mentioned btct.co before but we've had a really pleasant talk with the owner Ukyo, the trade volume of bitfunder is almost the same as btct.co. Also Ukyo helped us tremendously with setting up the agreement and most importantly, bitfunder will enable us to expand our operation in a special way (more on that below). Read more about bitfunder here https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=130117.0.

So what's next. Below you'll find the complete agreement. As said wednesday, we want to try to finalize these over the weekend. In total 840 shares were sold (7 miners *120 shares). If a 67% mayority of shareholders (exclusing our own shares!) is in favor of the agreement we will finalize them and start the IPO.

Below the agreements we've added a short summary of changes. We look forward to your reviews and comments. We've tried to be as thorough and precise as possible, but please remember both of us are not native English speakers and people simply make mistakes Smiley

Thanks!

BlastBob & Tyrion70

--------- START AGREEMENTS --------
About the asset

ADDICTION started as a groupbuy on bitcointalk. 12 14typo KNC Jupiters were bought with the intention of making it an investment on an exchange. We thought this was best for multiple reasons. First of all it would allow shareholders an easy way to trade shares, even before the KNC miners are delivered. Second it would greatly simplify the administration of paying out dividends. Lastly if done right it would allow us to expand the operation and issue more shares. More on that later.

The Conditions

We are bound to the conditions we started out with on Bitcointalk. The original conditions can still be found here. Irrelevant parts have been removed and conditions were rewritten to accomodate the IPO. A summary of changes made to the original agreement are outlined below the original conditions.

Shares

Currently 148800 shares are issued. These shares represent the total hashing power of ADDICTION. As of this writing ADDICTION's hashing power comes from 12 KNC Jupiter miners. Total estimated hashrate of ADDICTION should be 4200GH/s. A bi-weekly average hashing rate will be published together with financial statements in order to determine the hashing equivalent of each share.

Dividends

Dividends are payed bi-weekly.

Payments

Payment are based on the total proceeds from the total hashrate of ADDICTED minus the costs described below. Detailed reports regarding the total mined amount will be made available bi-weekly together with dividend payment.

Costs

costs consist of the following one-time costs:
- the USD/BTC market difference at the time of purchase due to the fact that shares were payend in BTC and miners were bought with USD
- funding for power supplies for the miners
- costs for shipping and setting up the miners at the chosen facility
- one time costs for repairs / replacement parts during operation
- tax, duty or other governmental fees
and the following returning costs
- costs for hosting of the miners
- Unforeseen expenses to maintain efficient operation not exceeding 1BTC per month
- tax, duty or other governmental fees

A details expense report will be made available bi-weekly. Expenses not mentioned above exceeding 0.5 BTC cannot be made without consulting the shareholders. through a vote.

Hosting

Miners are hosted at a facility of operators choice. Choice of facility will be based on a number of things like network facilities, power facilities, airconditioning, location, on-site support etcetera.

Delivery

Miners are expected september/october 2013.

In case of non-delivery
We believe KNC will keep its promises. In case KNC does not deliver we will do everything in our power to refund your (and our own) investments. We cannot guarantee this however. Buying these shares means you agree to not hold us responsible in case KNC does not deliver.

Expanding the operation

We want to be able to expand our operation in order to keep profitable. In order to do that we calculate Hash/share on a bi-weekly basis. This number will be used when issuing new shares.

For example. Total hashing power of 144800 shares is 4200GH. Which is 28.23MH per share. If we were to buy a new miner that delivers 200GH we can issue 200.000 / 28,23 == 7084 new shares. This ensures that all shares are equal.

Newly issues shares will be kept in a special depot until the miner they represent is up-and-running. While in depot, these shares will not yield dividend and will not be tradeable. New shares are not prices above market value, but never below costprice (ie. the price of the miner it represents). Once an tranch is issued and the miner is working, any profits (difference between cost-price and issued shares) are payed out as dividends to current shareholders. Once that's done the new shares are released.

Expanding with miners that are not directly deliverable (like KNC's) cannot be done without a vote.

--------- END AGREEMENTS --------

Changes to original agreement

- We waived our right to retain the miners after 24 months of operation. Miners are simply assets of ADDICTION.
- Shares have been multiplied by 100 to allow smaller transfers.
- Costs have been specified in more detail
- Added several conditions on when a vote is called for
- Changed share definition to an equivalent of total ADDICTION hashing power
- Removed miner specifications to allow for expansion
- Removed part on how to acquire shares

♫ This situation, which side are you on? Are you getting out? Are you dropping bombs? Have you heard of diplomatic resolve? ♫ How To Run A Cheap Full Bitcoin Node For $19 A Year ♫ If I knew where it was, I would take you there. There’s much more than this. ♫ Track Your Bitcoins Value
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June 12, 2013, 04:35:05 AM
 #2

Hi, purchased 4 shares. My "back of the envelope" (ok, Excel) calculations with some WAGs as to where we are headed (mainly using 18% difficulty increases every two weeks):

Estimated delivery: September 15
Estimated difficulty when delivered: 50,000,000
GH/share: 2.8
Estimated BTC/day/share at delivery: 0.028
Estimated time to full ROI: 21 days after start of mining
Estimated time to 100% profit: 49 days after start of mining
Estimated total BTC earned per share (24 months): 2.1
Estimated final ROI: 325%

Of course the last two are the hardest--we probably aren't going to increase at 18% every two weeks for two years (we'd have a difficulty of 85 billion in June '15). Very difficult to know how that will pan out. But it's sure nice to see a 20 day ROI even starting in September@50,000,000 difficulty.

Even if we start at 100,000,000 difficulty, full ROI is about 48 days.

I will try to keep this updated as we get closer to delivery.
(Edited to reflect 2.8 GH/share vs. 2.9 earlier)
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June 12, 2013, 04:46:47 AM
 #3

Just for fun I made up some certificates, enjoy!

If anybody has any real skills in photoshop or gimp, I can send over the original PSD.




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btceic (OP)
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June 12, 2013, 04:49:56 AM
 #4

Hi, purchased 4 shares. My "back of the envelope" (ok, Excel) calculations with some WAGs as to where we are headed (mainly using 18% difficulty increases every two weeks):

Estimated delivery: September 15
Estimated difficulty when delivered: 50,000,000
GH/share: 2.8
Estimated BTC/day/share at delivery: 0.028
Estimated time to full ROI: 21 days after start of mining
Estimated time to 100% profit: 49 days after start of mining
Estimated total BTC earned per share (24 months): 2.1
Estimated final ROI: 325%

Of course the last two are the hardest--we probably aren't going to increase at 18% every two weeks for two years (we'd have a difficulty of 85 billion in June '15). Very difficult to know how that will pan out. But it's sure nice to see a 20 day ROI even starting in September@50,000,000 difficulty.

Even if we start at 100,000,000 difficulty, full ROI is about 48 days.

I will try to keep this updated as we get closer to delivery.
(Edited to reflect 2.8 GH/share vs. 2.9 earlier)

Excellent work FloridaBear, I am excited!

♫ This situation, which side are you on? Are you getting out? Are you dropping bombs? Have you heard of diplomatic resolve? ♫ How To Run A Cheap Full Bitcoin Node For $19 A Year ♫ If I knew where it was, I would take you there. There’s much more than this. ♫ Track Your Bitcoins Value
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June 12, 2013, 05:18:26 AM
 #5

having bought 6 shares, at worst case scenario where the difficulty is 100,187,257, the full ROI would only take 35days, with 100% ROI about 75 days

Dont mind with my calculation  Grin
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June 12, 2013, 05:40:05 AM
 #6

2 shares! Smiley

looking forward to the pay days Wink
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June 12, 2013, 05:58:21 AM
 #7

I had a shortage of BTC so I purchased one share - better than nothing.  Smiley
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June 12, 2013, 05:59:57 AM
 #8

funy certificates.

Maybe add "representing __ Ghash" Smiley
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June 12, 2013, 01:41:40 PM
 #9

Proud owner of 10 shares. I am a bitcoin noob. Started doing some gpu mining about 5 month ago.
Looking forwaredto getting paid.

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June 12, 2013, 02:48:59 PM
 #10

I'm very excited about this.  I'm still kind of new to BTC and this is my first at owning shares.  Thank you to p2pool.nl for taking the time to organize this and help everyone invest in ASIC without the upfront cost. 

Aim - Slide.0
1J6UeiXtBYXmpA6uajRs3aJpUD1Tsj1CF3 - Tips?
btceic (OP)
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June 12, 2013, 07:05:51 PM
 #11

Update on the KnC open house,
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=232852.0

♫ This situation, which side are you on? Are you getting out? Are you dropping bombs? Have you heard of diplomatic resolve? ♫ How To Run A Cheap Full Bitcoin Node For $19 A Year ♫ If I knew where it was, I would take you there. There’s much more than this. ♫ Track Your Bitcoins Value
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June 12, 2013, 09:40:21 PM
 #12

Good good Smiley We are working on how to get an IPO running. Hopefully that will go smoothly.

Current news from bitcoinorama and some emails between me and sam@knc also making this more real.

The only thing i can think of is delivery time. And its said September/October area.

I am excited!

Bitrated user: blastbob.
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June 12, 2013, 09:49:31 PM
 #13

Hey guys! (and gals??)

Thanks for putting this up btceid, I've added this to my notifications so if anything pops up I'll know Smiley

I like the certificates ;-)

Will be posting an update in the other thread in a few minutes...

Cheers!

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June 12, 2013, 11:52:33 PM
 #14

Hi All,

Time for another update. We haven't been sitting still but instead decided to put the pressure on ourselves to get the IPO done asap.

We're actually finalizing the "paperwork" today and tomorrow and we'll be able to provide more information on friday. since we are in the process of rewriting the original agreements in the post to agreements that are "IPO worthy".

What's going to happen next?
- Friday we'll publish the proposed terms of the IPO
- Over the weekend we'll update these and make them final
- Next week between monday and wednesday each of you will receive a PM or E-mail detailing how many shares you have and giving information on how you can access your shares on the exchange. You will be asked to confirm this PM or E-mail.
- Next weekend (22 June) we will finalize the IPO

So far you've been the best shareholder's we've seen in all the groupbuys; we are very proud of that and will do our utmost best to keep you this happy and satisfied.

Thanks!
Blastbob & Tyrion70

♫ This situation, which side are you on? Are you getting out? Are you dropping bombs? Have you heard of diplomatic resolve? ♫ How To Run A Cheap Full Bitcoin Node For $19 A Year ♫ If I knew where it was, I would take you there. There’s much more than this. ♫ Track Your Bitcoins Value
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June 13, 2013, 10:13:17 PM
 #15

Hey, just wanted everyone to know I flipped some ASICM passthru profits to help fund the competition (us).

Looking forward to the next 2 years (hopefully some more) with you all.
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June 13, 2013, 10:25:27 PM
 #16

Partial write up on the KnC open house, complete with pictures and questions by forum members answered.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=232852.msg2468045#msg2468045

I feel even more confident and would like to petition the group to purchase more if we can.

♫ This situation, which side are you on? Are you getting out? Are you dropping bombs? Have you heard of diplomatic resolve? ♫ How To Run A Cheap Full Bitcoin Node For $19 A Year ♫ If I knew where it was, I would take you there. There’s much more than this. ♫ Track Your Bitcoins Value
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June 14, 2013, 08:23:27 AM
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I would be interested in purchasing more.
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June 14, 2013, 09:33:00 AM
 #18

Hi, i'm Lymo and bought 7 shares.  Roll Eyes
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June 14, 2013, 06:10:43 PM
 #19

Hey all!

As promised we've just added the IPO agreements to
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=227400.msg2476296#msg2476296

Cheers!

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June 15, 2013, 07:23:57 AM
 #20

Hi i'm twisty, I bought 2 shares . I am also interested in expanding. I see now with the IPO on bitfunder this is an option . yayy Smiley
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June 15, 2013, 03:20:28 PM
 #21

hey yall!

4 shares and glad to contribute to the mining network Smiley

Trade Bitcoins @ FYB-SE ---> https://www.fybse.se
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June 20, 2013, 03:41:35 AM
 #22

4 shares.

When will ADDICTION be listed in Bitfunder?
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June 20, 2013, 06:26:48 PM
 #23

I ran some back of the napkin predictions for us. Figured the rest of us might be curious. If I overlooked anything or messed up in Excel let me know. I can also share this spreadsheet if you'd like.

I used bitcoinx to make these predictions. Also note, the actual return will probably be less given the pool/block finds.

I chose to use friedcat's 200TH prediction for the network rate by the end of 2013. Personally, I think this is exaggerated. To support that I believe it is in the best interest of miner's to use "worst case" predictions as a standard. It would be absurd to present an astronomical and incorrect number. It should, however, remain in the domain of possibility while at the same time remain large enough to dissuade the little guy. I also expect the hash rate to level out - or at least the market share. It's my prediction that eventually mining will become so competitive only the previously established mining co-ops will be able to regularly upgrade their equipment and stay in the game.

I would be interested in running this again with the Hash rate predictions from what BFL, Avalon, ASIC and KnC (possibly TerraHash?) are going to be bringing to the game in the next year. But for now I think we at least have an insight.

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June 26, 2013, 04:20:32 PM
 #24

Great News:
http://us4.campaign-archive2.com/?u=6d9133088733c220dff716f59&id=23089ebf42&e=4c6108edac

The Jupiter is officially 400GH instead of 350GH.

I'm guessing we'll get more GH/share now?
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June 26, 2013, 04:26:13 PM
 #25

Great News:
http://us4.campaign-archive2.com/?u=6d9133088733c220dff716f59&id=23089ebf42&e=4c6108edac

The Jupiter is officially 400GH instead of 350GH.

I'm guessing we'll get more GH/share now?
Correct! :-) i think 3.2GH / share (32mh per bitfunder share?)

Great news indeed!

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September 30, 2013, 10:32:10 AM
 #26

NEWS UPDATE

https://www.kncminer.com/news/news-38

Quote from: KNCMining
We have relocated most of our operation to the factory over the weekend. The first delivery of the chips have arrived and have been populated on the boards. We have begun testing and initial results are good, we will have more updates throughout the day. We know many of you are calling and we are sorry if we cannot answer your call. This is a very busy time for us but we are all hands on deck we can assure you of that.



♫ This situation, which side are you on? Are you getting out? Are you dropping bombs? Have you heard of diplomatic resolve? ♫ How To Run A Cheap Full Bitcoin Node For $19 A Year ♫ If I knew where it was, I would take you there. There’s much more than this. ♫ Track Your Bitcoins Value
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