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Author Topic: Are the mods getting paid from this forum?  (Read 10496 times)
JordanL
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June 17, 2013, 06:12:56 AM
 #201

Thanks to theymos and the mods for clearing this up. I certainly agree with the general consensus that the mods deserve payment for their efforts.

To those who are complaining about a lack of transparency; they have been completely transparent here, giving exact details as soon as they were asked. theymos even very clearly answered the question about the board's ownership.


"other useful purposes"

Paying a reasonable amount to admins and mods is exactly something everyone should expect when reading this phrase.
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Matthew N. Wright
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June 17, 2013, 06:23:34 AM
 #202

there is no reason to support this business.

As far as I understand it, the only way to support "this business" is with ads. If you don't like what they use the ad money for (paying mods to mod), why not just stop buying ads (this is assuming you even buy them in the first place)?

Well, there's also donations of course, which I'm sure many people now feel they made mistakes giving as the funds did not go to the purpose advertised now after 12 months.

I agree with you that if you don't want to support the business of bitcointalk.org, you shouldn't buy ads, but I think it goes a bit beyond that, down to lending credibility by even using it. I'm pondering the right thing to do right now. If it were just this, I could excuse it perhaps, but that dirty broken reputation system that is basically a toy for slander is borderline last straw.

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June 17, 2013, 06:32:32 AM
 #203

I strongly support Matthew's decision to leave the forum forever in protest of these mod payments. What a hero.

Someone correct me if I am wrong but the donations were not used to pay mods.

Right.

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Matthew N. Wright
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June 17, 2013, 06:40:31 AM
 #204

Someone correct me if I am wrong but the donations were not used to pay mods.
Where did I say otherwise? The issue with donations is different than the issue with ad space. The issue with ad space is that it's not only opaque, it's downright misleading. No one cares if the mods are paid, they care that it's not mentioned and instead it claims it's for use in creating a forum (which isn't happening). The issue with donations is that it mislead people to donate large amounts of money (6000 bitcoins) in order to do something that was never done, in 12 months time, and instead of doing that more funds are continuously collected.

Basically, Theymos is guilty of what BFL is guilty for. Accepting shitloads of money on promise to deliver, and not only not delivering, but continuing to find reasons for needing money (despite having an insanely large surplus of it, hundreds of times what is needed for the proposed use). I question his integrity by not addressing and admitting this. Where is the new forum software Theymos? Don't you think it's dishonest to solicit money from the community for a "good cause" and then just sit on the money and never "get around" to using the money for the intended purpose? Don't you think lying about what you'll do in order to get donations is a type of scamming? People didn't donate so they could make you rich. They donated so that the new forum could be created.

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June 17, 2013, 06:51:34 AM
 #205

I thought people were donating 50 btc so they could have those cute little colored half gold circles under their names and be able to view the juicy staff only forum where they exchange seedy sex crazed nymphet photos.

I remember posts by Theymos requesting to hire someone familiar with SMF for coding and upgrades but I don't remember that being a contingency or promise for donations. Are you sure you got that one right Matt?

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June 17, 2013, 06:57:41 AM
 #206

Someone correct me if I am wrong but the donations were not used to pay mods.
Where did I say otherwise? The issue with donations is different than the issue with ad space. The issue with ad space is that it's not only opaque, it's downright misleading. No one cares if the mods are paid, they care that it's not mentioned and instead it claims it's for use in creating a forum (which isn't happening). The issue with donations is that it mislead people to donate large amounts of money (6000 bitcoins) in order to do something that was never done, in 12 months time, and instead of doing that more funds are continuously collected.

Basically, Theymos is guilty of what BFL is guilty for. Accepting shitloads of money on promise to deliver, and not only not delivering, but continuing to find reasons for needing money (despite having an insanely large surplus of it, hundreds of times what is needed for the proposed use). I question his integrity by not addressing and admitting this. Where is the new forum software Theymos? Don't you think it's dishonest to solicit money from the community for a "good cause" and then just sit on the money and never "get around" to using the money for the intended purpose? Don't you think lying about what you'll do in order to get donations is a type of scamming? People didn't donate so they could make you rich. They donated so that the new forum could be created.

BFL pays forum for ads and mods now get a cut of the ad revenue.

Gee I wonder why this was left out of the discussion in the other thread.  Roll Eyes

I'm not much for conspiracy theories, but it does seem like that would have been announced publicly so people would know that their advertising and donation "revenue" would be going to pay mods to censor them  Cheesy

You said it right there, not even a few pages ago, after it had already been clarified that donation were not being used. I know you have a grudge against theymos because you disagree with his decisions regarding your scammer/untrustworthy tag, but you aren't doing yourself any favors by proving him right.

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Matthew N. Wright
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June 17, 2013, 07:01:39 AM
 #207

I remember posts by Theymos requesting to hire someone familiar with SMF for coding and upgrades but I don't remember that being a contingency or promise for donations. Are you sure you got that one right Matt?

Two that immediately come to mind (there are entire threads about this though).

I've been trying to think of all of the features the perfect forum software would have, and this is what I've come up with so far. I'll eventually use the donated forum funds to pay someone to implement this.

In order to collect more money for the creation of good forum software and for other useful purposes, the forum is selling ad space in the area beneath the first post of every topic page.

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June 17, 2013, 07:04:30 AM
 #208

@BadBear: We already confirmed from Theymos that donations are not used for paying mods. Why are you confused about that or what I said? Please scroll up to this post and re-read it. No where am I saying that that is the problem, nor is paying mods a problem. Donations and ad purchases were solicited to "create a new forum", 12 months later still nothing, nothing but a surplus of funds. Asking for funds from the community for a purpose and never bothering with that purpose is not only misleading, it could be argued as fraudulent, like a charity asking for donations for a specific purpose and instead spending it on something else or never spending the money. This is 2013, we have higher standards now. Where is the new forum?

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June 17, 2013, 07:12:00 AM
 #209

@BadBear: We already confirmed from Theymos that donations are not used for paying mods. Why are you confused about that or what I said? Please scroll up to this post and re-read it. No where am I saying that that is the problem, nor is paying mods a problem. Donations and ad purchases were solicited to "create a new forum", 12 months later still nothing, nothing but a surplus of funds. Asking for funds from the community for a purpose and never bothering with that purpose is not only misleading, it could be argued as fraudulent, like a charity asking for donations for a specific purpose and instead spending it on something else or never spending the money. This is 2013, we have higher standards now. Where is the new forum?

Why are we discussing donations then?

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June 17, 2013, 07:12:25 AM
 #210

@BadBear: We already confirmed from Theymos that donations are not used for paying mods. Why are you confused about that or what I said? Please re-read my post. No where am I saying that that is the problem, not is paying mods a problem. Donations and ad purchases were solicited to "create a new forum", 12 months later still nothing, nothing but a surplus of funds.

Silly me, and I thought this thread was about mod payments, not bitching that donations aren't being used fast enough.

Carry on  Roll Eyes.

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June 17, 2013, 07:18:03 AM
 #211

@BadBear: We already confirmed from Theymos that donations are not used for paying mods. Why are you confused about that or what I said? Please scroll up to this post and re-read it. No where am I saying that that is the problem, nor is paying mods a problem. Donations and ad purchases were solicited to "create a new forum", 12 months later still nothing, nothing but a surplus of funds. Asking for funds from the community for a purpose and never bothering with that purpose is not only misleading, it could be argued as fraudulent, like a charity asking for donations for a specific purpose and instead spending it on something else or never spending the money. This is 2013, we have higher standards now. Where is the new forum?

That is why the same address was used for both the donations and the ad revenue to show transparency, but later the funds were moved prior to ModGate (couldn't think of a better term--feel free to use it). Then they were all moved again to finally settle in wallets theymos has recently been kind enough to share with us.

Speaking of ModGate, Bitcoin is overdue for a break-in (read hack).

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June 17, 2013, 07:26:26 AM
 #212

I remember posts by Theymos requesting to hire someone familiar with SMF for coding and upgrades but I don't remember that being a contingency or promise for donations. Are you sure you got that one right Matt?

Two that immediately come to mind (there are entire threads about this though).

I've been trying to think of all of the features the perfect forum software would have, and this is what I've come up with so far. I'll eventually use the donated forum funds to pay someone to implement this.

In order to collect more money for the creation of good forum software and for other useful purposes, the forum is selling ad space in the area beneath the first post of every topic page.


From the same thread, a feature was suggested that theymos shot down as being...I'll let you read it.

Would a trust system almost exactly like eBay (before they removed negative feedback) work?

I don't like any trust system that has a global trust rating. It disincentives people from posting controversial ideas.


I guess we'll never see anything like that implemented unless, of course, the scammer tag thingy interferes with ad revenue.

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June 17, 2013, 07:27:50 AM
 #213

Phin, that was in 2011, lots has changed for BTC since then.

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June 17, 2013, 07:29:52 AM
 #214

Phin, that was in 2011, lots has changed for BTC since then.

I plead Matthew! It's all his fault.  Grin

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June 17, 2013, 07:42:45 AM
 #215

I don't like any trust system that has a global trust rating. It disincentives people from posting controversial ideas.

These scores are taken from your trust network. They are not global scores.

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June 17, 2013, 09:11:23 AM
Last edit: June 17, 2013, 09:26:57 AM by Phinnaeus Gage
 #216

Quote
I went to Karaoke with Andrew a few weeks ago and he had told me about that. He basically sold that site to MtGox. I don't think he is connected to MtGox at all, but that doesn't have anything to do with the major concerns which (again) are:

Makes sense to me. Besides, Andrew Lee's only connection to Mt Gox is co-developing a Droid app, of which he denied doing, of which Mt Gox purchased outright said app from the same guy who just so happened to own a hosting company to fill the hosting needs of BitcoinTalk previously hosted by Mt Gox, of which donations and ad revenue were amassed to pay for future upgrades, of which some of the funds were paid to mods under the radar, which leads me to the conclusion that a lot of of-whiching was taking place.

I'm sure there's nothing nefarious about the following, but allow me to present it nonetheless.

http://www.cubewhois.com/bitcoinfoundation.org

Quote
Summary

Bitcoinfoundation.org is owned by Mark Karpeles. It is hosted in . Bitcoinfoundation.org has a Google PageRank of 4. The alexa rank of bitcoinfoundation.org is 871356. The domain name was created on 2010-12-06 and expires on 2021-12-06. Bitcoinfoundation.org is listed in DMOZ

Domain Name   bitcoinfoundation.org
Created On   2010-12-06
Changed On   2012-09-30
Expires On   2021-12-06
Owner Email Address   mark AT bitcoinfoundation.org
Tech Email Address   mark AT bitcoinfoundation.org
Admin Email Address   mark AT bitcoinfoundation.org
Owner Phone   +1.3024445240
Admin Phone   +1.3024445240
Tech Phone   +1.3024445240

Owner Address

3809 STEEPLECHASE DRIVE
Carmel Indiana
46032
US

Tech Address

3809 STEEPLECHASE DRIVE
Carmel Indiana
46032
US

Admin Address

3809 STEEPLECHASE DRIVE
Carmel Indiana
46032
US

http://who.godaddy.com/whois.aspx?domain=tuxdev.com&prog_id=GoDaddy

Quote
Registered through: GoDaddy.com, LLC (http://www.godaddy.com)
Domain Name: TUXDEV.COM
Created on: 12-Dec-11
Expires on: 12-Dec-13
Last Updated on: 23-Jan-13

Registrant:
Mutum Sigillum LLC

220 E. DELAWARE AVE, # 1085
Newark, DE 19711
us

Administrative Contact:
Karpeles, Mark magicaltux@gmail.com
Mutum Sigillum LLC
220 E. DELAWARE AVE, # 1085
Newark, DE 19711
us
3024445240

Technical Contact:
Karpeles, Mark magicaltux@gmail.com
Mutum Sigillum LLC
220 E. DELAWARE AVE, # 1085
Newark, DE 19711
us
3024445240

https://secure.in.gov/sos/online_corps/GetImage.aspx



Note the date on top and the name and address at the bottom.
Offered up as proof that Andrew Lee (and family) still live at that
address or, at the very least, AL is able to receive mail there.
I can easily provide proof that Andrew Lee has used this address
fairly recently.

As I've clearly shown, the Carmel, Indiana, address of which Andrew Lee still uses as a residence has been used as a mailing address for the following: The Bitcoin Foundation; Mt Gox; London Trust Media; and  Private Internet Access, of which provides hosting for BitcoinTalk.

Please Jehovah, don't let there be two different Andrew Lee's causing me to make possibly two mistakes in one day, and the day just started for me.

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June 17, 2013, 10:01:21 AM
 #217

So what i'm understanding here is that 1 person owns the domain, one person owns the hosting, and one person owns the hosting? isnt that what theymos already stated?

My negative trust rating is reflective of a personal vendetta by someone on default trust.
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June 17, 2013, 10:16:16 AM
 #218

Please Jehovah, don't let there be two different Andrew Lee's causing me to make possibly two mistakes in one day, and the day just started for me.

Nah, I'm looking at his father's (who owns that very nice house) business website and it's done by "London Trust" all right.
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June 17, 2013, 01:36:09 PM
 #219

London trust media aka Private internet access is providing free hosting to bitcointalk?
If yes, why theymos said he's paying for hosting https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=234009.msg2480445#msg2480445

If they are getting paid, why bitcointalk have their name& link in bottom.

John (John K.)
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June 17, 2013, 03:02:14 PM
 #220

London trust media aka Private internet access is providing free hosting to bitcointalk?
If yes, why theymos said he's paying for hosting https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=234009.msg2480445#msg2480445

If they are getting paid, why bitcointalk have their name& link in bottom.



The hosting payments should be from a long time ago - I think we've stopped paying for hosting since Mt.Gox hosted us. (and PIA afterwards)

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