Lemon - defaulted loan

[jim667]

I've given Lemon a 12 BTC loan on April 28th, 2013 (tx https://blockchain.info/tx/9627f386eded9d55cb2c522f6e676c5184da5b014e09e3f44e006633cfee5809 ). One payment of 0.36 BTC has been done on May 9th (instead of by May 5th as per the agreement). The loan should have been repaid (13.44 BTC in total; 13.08 BTC outstanding) by May 26th, 2013.

Lemon has come up with various reasons for not being able to access his wallet. I consider them irrelevant.

Our last communication (email message) happened on June 9th, 2013; Lemon promised to pay before June 16th, 2013.

Lemon is involved with crypto.pm https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=176756 and escrow.pm
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=188727. I will post a link to this accusation on these threads too, as well as inform Lemon by email.

GPG-signed loan agreement follows.

-- Agreement text --
http://bitcoin-otc.com/viewratingdetail.php?nick=Lemon

I'd like a 12BTC loan, 12% interest with a four week payment term. Principal interest to be paid weekly (1.44BTC), with the last interest payment (week 4) to also include return of principal (12BTC).

Address (Lemon)
18McHYrSzjWXGRbDYe9j18Kqdbv9pUuGap

Address (Jim)
1MxTLQGWRbVRSdmrUdRqyK17cZUBQJKqtf
gpg: Signature made Sun 28 Apr 2013 09:56:49 PM UTC using RSA key ID 4A5EFEB0
gpg: Good signature from "Lemon (Trusted Goat) <me@lemon.sx>"
-- end of Agreement text --


To check the signature, save the text below to signed.txt and use the following:
base64 -d < signed.txt > msg.sig
gpg -d msg.sig
(sorry, don't know how to convert binary signed files to ascii with gnupg)
-- Signed text in base64 --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-- END of signed text in base64 --

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[Lemon]

Confirming this is defaulted. Was just alerted to this thread via SMS. Have been laid up in bed (literally) and am extremely ill. My health issues are fairly well known and documented. A recent case of food poisoning has worsened things greatly.

To Jim, I can only apologize - I will resolve this when capable - typing this on my phone is exhausting enough. In the interests of full disclosure, there is one other outstanding loan - interest repayments have already exceeded the loan itself, though the principal is overdue. There is also a sale transaction in progress that was waylaid (?) by my health issues.

I will resolve this as soon as I am able.

[BigBitz]

In further interest of disclosure the sale is with me for a sum of bitcoin [sums involved are not important yet] if Lemon does not follow through on these [which I hope he does] I will comment with further information.

Currently he has also told me he is ill [as above] and will resolve at the earliest.

[Rawted]

I practically blew a gasket in otc when i heard lemon was scamming. Glad to see thats not the case and obligations are being taken care of.

This gives me a warm fuzzy feeling.

[Lemon]

I practically blew a gasket in otc when i heard lemon was scamming. Glad to see thats not the case and obligations are being taken care of.

This gives me a warm fuzzy feeling.

Not trying to dodge any obligations. If I was out to get people, I wouldn't have put quite so much effort in to crypto.

Time to drink more fluids.

And before anybody asks, I'm on my damn phone.

[Rawted]

I practically blew a gasket in otc when i heard lemon was scamming. Glad to see thats not the case and obligations are being taken care of.

This gives me a warm fuzzy feeling.

Not trying to dodge any obligations. If I was out to get people, I wouldn't have put quite so much effort in to crypto.

Time to drink more fluids.

And before anybody asks, I'm on my damn phone.

Good stuff.

[Lemon]

Currently in a hospital with heart complications (which I will prove). Communication from me for the next few days may be very sparse.

[WuLabsWuTecH]

Currently in a hospital with heart complications (which I will prove). Communication from me for the next few days may be very sparse.

Oh no! the heart is an important organ!  Best wishes!

[danieldaniel]

Currently in a hospital with heart complications (which I will prove). Communication from me for the next few days may be very sparse.

I hope you get better! 

[San1ty]

I wouldn't be too quick to jump to conclusions, but I'd like to contribute to the topic:

I have invested in Crypto.pm (https://crypto.pm/invest), and since I have invested, communication with Lemon has been very hard / near to impossible. This has been going on for a while and I haven't received on official (signed) confirmation of my ownership of the cryptoshares I paid for.

I'm writing this down as a warning to others as this can look like a scam to some.

Anyway don't get me wrong:
I believe he'll come through and I hope he gets well soon.

PS: If other Crypto.pm investors read this, it would be nice to get in touch!

[Azelphur]

Just to add experiences with Lemon here, I'm remaining impartial on the "is he a scammer" front for now, but I will add to the best of my ability my experiences with him so far.

We have done 1 successful large BTC trade, he went first.

He says he is a lawyer, and I have employed him to do some legal work for me, however as yet the quality hasn't been up to par.
He told me he was going to send me client/lawyer agreement paperwork when I first requested his services on 18th of April, As of yet, despite multiple requests, the paperwork has still not arrived.

He was supposed to be sorting tax stuff out for me, he says that HMRC hasn't replied to him yet. In my experience, HMRC response times are far less than 2 months.

I have been having major issues with the banks, he hasn't been all that helpful with it at all.

I find myself having to contact another solicitor, because the work quite simply isn't up to par.

[BigBitz]

To re-empathize my involvement I have done several trades with Lemon.

1 - 10BTC, Lemon sent first.
2 - 10BTC, Lemon sent first.
3 - I sent Lemon money, a month ago, and still no BTC.

That's my involvement.

[Lemon]

Just to add experiences with Lemon here, I'm remaining impartial on the "is he a scammer" front for now, but I will add to the best of my ability my experiences with him so far.

We have done 1 successful large BTC trade, he went first.

He says he is a lawyer, and I have employed him to do some legal work for me, however as yet the quality hasn't been up to par.
He told me he was going to send me client/lawyer agreement paperwork when I first requested his services on 18th of April, As of yet, despite multiple requests, the paperwork has still not arrived.

He was supposed to be sorting tax stuff out for me, he says that HMRC hasn't replied to him yet. In my experience, HMRC response times are far less than 2 months.

I have been having major issues with the banks, he hasn't been all that helpful with it at all.

I find myself having to contact another solicitor, because the work quite simply isn't up to par.

HMRC response times on unclear policy are nothing short of "who knows". Since I last sent paperwork, I have heard nothing from you.

[Lemon]

I wouldn't be too quick to jump to conclusions, but I'd like to contribute to the topic:

I have invested in Crypto.pm (https://crypto.pm/invest), and since I have invested, communication with Lemon has been very hard / near to impossible. This has been going on for a while and I haven't received on official (signed) confirmation of my ownership of the cryptoshares I paid for.

I'm writing this down as a warning to others as this can look like a scam to some.

Anyway don't get me wrong:
I believe he'll come through and I hope he gets well soon.

PS: If other Crypto.pm investors read this, it would be nice to get in touch!

Are you referring to your GPG agreement or not receiving one at all?

Edit: if you have not received a signed agreement then you are more than welcome to request a refund.

[Lemon]

To re-empathize my involvement I have done several trades with Lemon.

1 - 10BTC, Lemon sent first.
2 - 10BTC, Lemon sent first.
3 - I sent Lemon money, a month ago, and still no BTC.

That's my involvement.

Christ, I didn't even think it had been that long. I can only apologize.

[Lemon]

So people are aware - issues with Cryptography LTD can be dealt with via email channels. I will happily address any personal issues in this thread. Comments regarding any legal nature however will not be done publically.

Azelphur, you are welcome to email me - but I'm not seeing anything from you. You also have my phone number.

[Lemon]

So people are aware, the health complications from last night can be shortened to "God damn heart attack".

[iwilcox]

As this thread seems to be a collection of Lemon-related stuff, not just loans, I should probably mention that I still haven't received any nuPlay prototype unit, nor any firm date when I should expect it to be shipped, and nor has anyone else I've spoken to about it (although I have had two or three erratic updates over the past couple of months saying it'll be soon).  There was very brief discussion on IRC of not sending the device since Lemon wanted to send it to someone who he felt would use it as he had intended, but that discussion concluded with sticking to the original plan of sending me a unit and my returning it once I'd seen it existed.

That being said, his offer of a nuPlay prototype unit was always a freebie with no deadline; on paper Lemon owes me nothing, ever, and I mention it only for its possible relevance to Lemon keeping his word.

Those are the facts; since others have offered opinions, I'll veer away from fact towards speculation and gut feeling now.

Some forlorn posts over on the nuPlay forum seem to be asking for hardware, software or updates on when either will appear, so it appears I'm not alone, but it's impossible to verify or falsify Lemon's claims that there are customers that have received units.

I considered investing in crypto.pm, and looked carefully into Lemon's background and past projects.  For reasons I'm unable to disclose for fear of litigation, when I asked him the first of the questions my research raised for me, I asked them publicly.  It seemed important for all to be able to see whether his replies were timely and to be able to prove he said something should it be necessary.  From the ensuing questions and responses, two things made me very uneasy: first, while his answers were always plausible they were never satisfactory for me personally since I never felt he gave any enough information on any question to make his answer either verifiable or falsifiable; second, I felt he tended to prefer to divert questions away from public forums towards e-mail (making assessment of timely response and whether e-mail ever got replied to much more difficult).

I have many other more specific doubts, but since (1) I'm not sure I'd get any reply, (2) I don't expect any answers that I'd consider verifiable/falsifiable and (3) Lemon has indicated a readiness to employ litigation (I don't know whether he would or could, but if so it'd be prohibitively costly to defend whatever the outcome), suffice it to say I'd strongly advise anyone considering dealing with Lemon to perform very thorough research on him and his past projects first.  I feel obliged to add that the same is true of any stranger on the Internet you're considering sending money to.

[San1ty]

I wouldn't be too quick to jump to conclusions, but I'd like to contribute to the topic:

I have invested in Crypto.pm (https://crypto.pm/invest), and since I have invested, communication with Lemon has been very hard / near to impossible. This has been going on for a while and I haven't received on official (signed) confirmation of my ownership of the cryptoshares I paid for.

I'm writing this down as a warning to others as this can look like a scam to some.

Anyway don't get me wrong:
I believe he'll come through and I hope he gets well soon.

PS: If other Crypto.pm investors read this, it would be nice to get in touch!

Are you referring to your GPG agreement or not receiving one at all?

Edit: if you have not received a signed agreement then you are more than welcome to request a refund.

We have already talked about this multiple times on IRC and I haven't received a reply on my last mail.
I have received the written agreement and replied I was happy with the terms and then I have never received the GPG signed agreement.

[BigBitz]

To re-empathize my involvement I have done several trades with Lemon.

1 - 10BTC, Lemon sent first.
2 - 10BTC, Lemon sent first.
3 - I sent Lemon money, a month ago, and still no BTC.

That's my involvement.

Christ, I didn't even think it had been that long. I can only apologize.

Yes, it has been that long. Hopefully you will resolve all these issues soon.