512-qubit Quantum Computer acquired, is bitcoin doomed?

[polarhei]

If the being can run on normal conditions... The being requires helium (close to zero K) to stablize the operation. Of the being can be operated with nitrogen (L), then the bitcoin may be doomed.

[DeathAndTaxes]

Quantum computing will be big for many things, but cracking bitcoin keys - or running Windows 8 -  are probably not two of them.

Well in theory a true general purpose quantum computer with a massive number of quibits (say 30,000+) would be very useful for breaking all types of public key cryptographic including ECDSA used by Bitcoin.

The good news is like you said it is one of those things (economical fusion power being another) which has been "so close" for decades now.  The other thing is that DWAVE computer isn't a general purpose quantum computer so while the threat exists it is still academical at this point.

[1PFYcabWEwZFm2Ez5LGTx3ftz]

http://www.naturalnews.com/040859_Skynet_quantum_computing_D-Wave_Systems.html

So, does that mean Bitcoin is soon to become irrelevant?

This article almost seemed serious, until I saw the words: "[Raymond] Kurzweil is <...> the leader of the transhumanist cult -- a group of insane technology worshippers who believe they will upload their minds into quantum computers and 'merge with the machines,' achieving some weird shadow of immortality (in the same way, I suppose, that a photograph of you makes you 'immortal.')"

Then I stopped reading.

I can bet, that at least some of the technology used to write that article, was invented by the genius Raymond Kurzweil. The author (Mike Adams) is a disgusting excuse of a human being.

It is both sad and scary, that such people as the Mike Adams exist. It means, that a war between neo-Luddites and technically-savvy people is inevitable.

[Duff___Man]

No.

Yes.

it is both doomed and not doomed at the same time.

Schroedinger's Bitcoin?

[Rez]

vaccines would never harm
children

Tinfoil hat DETECTED

Come on, polio - just try to infect my child. I have HERBS, bitch.

[zimmah]

Quantum computing = the "hydrogen-powered car" of computer research.

Always "just around the corner", lots of hype and FUD, but never quite moving beyond a technical curiosity. The only way quantum computing could generate more baseless hype is if someone ports the litecoin client to run on a D-Wave box 

Quantum computing will be big for many things, but cracking bitcoin keys - or running Windows 8 -  are probably not two of them.

just like cold fusion.

[QuestionAuthority]

Looks like it might be closer than you all think.

http://www.cbc.ca/m/touch/technology/story/1.2426986

[Bitcoin Oz]

More likely to help improve their search and thus their targeted advertising through learning from your past searches etc. Google is becoming self aware in other words.

This also has applications for their cars that can drive themselves etc.

[EvilPanda]

http://www.naturalnews.com/040859_Skynet_quantum_computing_D-Wave_Systems.html

So, does that mean Bitcoin is soon to become irrelevant?

When they announced the great hadron collider, there was a group of idiots writing articles how it's gonna open a portal to another dimension or suck Earth into a black hole.
This is exactly the same level of journalism.

[zimmah]

http://www.naturalnews.com/040859_Skynet_quantum_computing_D-Wave_Systems.html

So, does that mean Bitcoin is soon to become irrelevant?

When they announced the great hadron collider, there was a group of idiots writing articles how it's gonna open a portal to another dimension or suck Earth into a black hole.
This is exactly the same level of journalism.

what if we actually did get sucked into an alternate universe but we didn't realize, and the people at power now are the ones behind the LHC and they trapped us in a matrix like scheme, and satoshi is also one of the guys from the original universe, but he has gone rogue.

and now they're trying to make really powerful agents to stop the bitcoin threath.

[Taras]

No.

Yes.

it is both doomed and not doomed at the same time.

Yes, this is the correct answer.

No, it is not. It is doomed, it is not doomed and it is both doomed and not doomed. In quantum world, there are three states.

Wrong, there are infinite states, that's what make it that useful

Wrong, number of states is a very big but finite number.

Wrong

Wrong

Wrong

Wrong

[lorix]

Bitcoin isn't doomed.

Quantum computers have the potential to be hashing monsters in the near term should anyone come up with a Quantum Miner to crunch SHA256 algos, but the algorithm that protects our keys is Elliptic Curve cryptography based which is many orders or magnitude higher.

That's not to say it's impossible for Quantum Computers to catch up.

But even if this was the case, the moment any real risk came up we always have the option of having Bitcoin's equivalent of a constitutional amendment, a hard fork. Provided it was properly managed, scheduled and agreed on there is no reason a stronger encryption function couldn't be implemented onto the blockchain.

Think about the transition from IPV4 to IPV6 - it didn't stop the old addresses from working, it just added the extra functionality on top and anyone who wanted to take advantage of the new functionality simply opts into it.

Much the same for Bitcoin, there just has to be consensus.

So quit worrying - Bitcoin is community run and can evolve to handle anything that gets thrown at it.  

[DeathAndTaxes]

Quantum computers have the potential to be hashing monsters in the near term should anyone come up with a Quantum Miner to crunch SHA256 algos, but the algorithm that protects our keys is Elliptic Curve cryptography based which is many orders or magnitude higher.

You have this exactly backwards.   Quantum computers are  not particularly effective at breaking symetric encryption algorithms and hashing algorithms.   

The massive potential in encryption cracking comes from Shor's algorithm which only works on public key (asymmetric) encryption algorithms like ECDSA.   That being said the qubits requires to break 256 bit key is ~30,000 and the largest general purpose quantum computer to date is 7 qubits.

Still as you point out Bitcoin can be extended to provide quantum resistant address schemes however it also provides immediate protection in another way.  If you don't foolishly reuse an address the pubkey is unknown to an attacker until funds are spent (payments are to the pubkeyhash) and Shor's algorithm is only possible against private keys where the attacker knows the pubkey.

[nate008]

Quantum computers have the potential to be hashing monsters in the near term should anyone come up with a Quantum Miner to crunch SHA256 algos, but the algorithm that protects our keys is Elliptic Curve cryptography based which is many orders or magnitude higher.

You have this exactly backwards.   Quantum computers are  not particularly effective at breaking symetric encryption algorithms and hashing algorithms.   

The massive potential in encryption cracking comes from Shor's algorithm which only works on public key (asymmetric) encryption algorithms like ECDSA.   That being said the qubits requires to break 256 bit key is ~30,000 and the largest general purpose quantum computer to date is 7 qubits.

Still as you point out Bitcoin can be extended to provide quantum resistant address schemes however it also provides immediate protection in another way.  If you don't foolishly reuse an address the pubkey is unknown to an attacker until funds are spent (payments are to the pubkeyhash) and Shor's algorithm is only possible against private keys where the attacker knows the pubkey.

Sorry , but is that a true and working quantum computer?

[EvilPanda]

http://www.naturalnews.com/040859_Skynet_quantum_computing_D-Wave_Systems.html

So, does that mean Bitcoin is soon to become irrelevant?

When they announced the great hadron collider, there was a group of idiots writing articles how it's gonna open a portal to another dimension or suck Earth into a black hole.
This is exactly the same level of journalism.

what if we actually did get sucked into an alternate universe but we didn't realize, and the people at power now are the ones behind the LHC and they trapped us in a matrix like scheme, and satoshi is also one of the guys from the original universe, but he has gone rogue.

and now they're trying to make really powerful agents to stop the bitcoin threath.

Then only the chosen one can save us, or someone with a red pill  

[DeathAndTaxes]

Sorry , but is that a true and working quantum computer?

Yes it was able to factor 21 into 7 & 3.  One capable of breaking a 256 bit ECDSA key would need to be 4000x to 5000x larger and there has been essentially no progress in building even modestly larger QC (i.e. one that could break an already obsolete 32 bit key in a reasonable amount of time) in the last decade.

[QuestionAuthority]

Sorry , but is that a true and working quantum computer?

Yes it was able to factor 21 into 7 & 3.  One capable of breaking a 256 bit ECDSA key would need to be 4000x to 5000x larger and there has been essentially no progress in building even modestly larger QC (i.e. one that could break an already obsolete 32 bit key in a reasonable amount of time).

What you're saying is that nothing available in the present or near future can work against Bitcoin. If something capable were developed in the distant future we would simply fork Bitcoin with an improvement that defeats it. This thread should be finished now.

[Phinnaeus Gage]

http://www.naturalnews.com/040859_Skynet_quantum_computing_D-Wave_Systems.html

So, does that mean Bitcoin is soon to become irrelevant?

When they announced the great hadron collider, there was a group of idiots writing articles how it's gonna open a portal to another dimension or suck Earth into a black hole.
This is exactly the same level of journalism.

what if we actually did get sucked into an alternate universe but we didn't realize, and the people at power now are the ones behind the LHC and they trapped us in a matrix like scheme, and satoshi is also one of the guys from the original universe, but he has gone rogue.

and now they're trying to make really powerful agents to stop the bitcoin threath.

Excellent! At least I know that in another timeline I did not don a pink tutu in Las Vegas, albeit I pity them souls that were forced to listen to the Bitcoin for Goats presentation.

~TMIBTCITW

PS: This thread should be finished now.

[jellies]

I found the paper in May that put two different qubit chips up against software and hardware solvers in a very specific class of problem, and the results were that with a problem that is most suitable for the chip it found a solution in half a second, several thousand times faster than the best traditional methods.

There were a lot of ifs/buts and exceptions however the V5 and V6 chips tested, when given the right kind of problem, were indeed able to solve it (it was an annealing problem) in a grand flash.

A clear eyed summary on that May paper, and the D-Wave devices is here: http://spectrum.ieee.org/computing/hardware/dwaves-year-of-computing-dangerously

I've no doubt that quantum computing is going to be an arms race, and it will start to solve in parallel more problems over time. Whether that includes searching for keys or cryptography I've no idea but if it does you CAN BET THAT NSA WILL NOT TELL US ABOUT IT.

[Cryptolator]

That's a bit scary ! :/