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jerry0 (OP)
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November 17, 2017, 09:28:52 PM |
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So after reading about all these electrum wallets getting hacked because people downloaded malware or fake electrum wallet programs, i have a question about computer security.
First off, i use electrum on my computer. I also have a password set up for it when i try to send the btc. Thus if you don't put the password, you cannot send the btc. First thing i want to know is those people who got their electrum wallets hacked, does anyone know if they had a password for electrum for sending btc? What about to check how much is the btc balance? I assume they had this but that wouldn't matter if you download malware or a fake electrum wallet to claim your bitcoin cash or gold etc?
I use keepass to store my passwords which is great. I also use antivirus as well. But of course it seems like downloading malware... a virus protector is not enough? The other thing i thought about is this. When i start up my computer, i do not have a password set up. I use windows 10. I know you could set up a password before logging into your computer as i did this a while back but this was with a different windows version a while back. Thus what i thought about is this. If someone has my computer, couldn't they just download the fake electrum wallet or malware and then hack the electrum account? Thus if thats the case, what is the best way to make sure if someone has access to your computer to not be able to log into your computer and view your electrum/files on your computer? Because i heard the regular password you set up on windows 10 might not be enough and that is hackable? Or am i incorrect here? Because if you have electrum, you have to make sure to not download malware or those programs. But if someone has access to your computer, then is there a way for them to not have access to your computer files? Because if someone has your computer, sure they could have all your documents/files etc but if they have your electrum wallet or similar, that is very bad etc. Thus i rarely though about this. Can someone who uses windows 10 tell me what i can do to assure that if someone has access to my computer, they cannot access any files? Thus if someone has my computer, obviously that would suck but if all they get is my computer and just format it and get a new computer, well at least my electrum/files are safe etc. Im sure many people here thought about this but im wondering what is needed to be done here as i don't think i taken much precaution. Because i just hear don't download malware but not if someone has your computer. So i like opinions here.
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"In a nutshell, the network works like a distributed
timestamp server, stamping the first transaction to spend a coin. It
takes advantage of the nature of information being easy to spread but
hard to stifle." -- Satoshi
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Coin-Keeper
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November 17, 2017, 10:15:02 PM |
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I'll answer some of your questions. Its NOT Electrum that has weaknesses where security is concerned. I understand Keepass and other security measures, which are all good steps to take. The issue most people are having is that their computers get malware infecting them and that malware sits there and captures the various passwords as you enter them. You can have a really long password on Electrum but when you type it in the malware captures it and then sends it along in the background to the nefarious party that placed it on your computer in many instances. In other instances the malware redirects your transaction to a different destination BTC address, which is theirs and not any you control. To avoid many of these issues you either need to use a "cold" two computer approach, OR start using a hardware wallet. If you are online and using a computer where the SEED is present, even in encrypted form, its too likely to encounter malware. Bottom line; the infected computer is the problem not Electrum. I told you how to avoid these issues and many other threads do the same. If you have any questions please ask.
Windows 10 simple password is too weak of an approach. If you want to make sure no one accesses your machine when you are not there you must encrypt the disk. BitLocker is a MS product that is beyond anything an intruder can access if the password is halfway decent. If you have Pro or higher it is free and already part of Win 10 for you. Frankly if you are going to use Windows and not Linux I would strongly suggest you get a hardware wallet.
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jerry0 (OP)
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November 17, 2017, 10:23:14 PM |
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Hi there. When you say 2 computer approach, you mean use one computer sole for bitcoin and altcoin and trading etc? And the other computer for everything else? Or just the one computer to keep bitcoin and altcoins etc?
The thing is if you don't download malware, should you be fine though if you take precaution?
The thing is im sure most people just keep their bitcoin on their main computer right assuming they don't download certain things on that computer? The other thing is how would i put a password on my computer where if someone has access to my computer, they cannot view my electrum and other things? Because the same could be said of if you have a separate computer where you only use it to send receive bitcoin and other coins. If someone were to get access to it, they could just download malware or some program and get access to your coins right? So i want to know what to do on the computer where they can't view whats on my computer.
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Coin-Keeper
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November 17, 2017, 10:38:12 PM |
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Assuming you are going to run Win 10. Read about BitLocker and how it encrypts every sector on the drive. YOU or any other user will have zero access to the machine unless you enter the pre boot password. Bitlocker will prevent the machine from booting at all. Be cautioned that encryption comes with other issues and you will need to have solid backups so restores can happen easily. All my machines are fully encrypted but I have been doing this for many years and they are all LUKS on linux. Give Bitlocker a read and see if that sounds like what you need. Trying to help you here, I have to stress that BitLocker will do nothing to protect your BTC if there is malware on your computer from something YOU are doing online. BitLocker simply prevents some unauthorized person from booting the machine in your absence. As experienced a computer security guru as I am, I will NEVER use a computer with the SEED (even encrypted) online for any reason. Malware writers are getting too good and sneaky, and one slip up and your coins are gone.
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jerry0 (OP)
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November 17, 2017, 10:48:36 PM |
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Hi there yes that is the name of the program i heard about bitlocker. When you say you need solid backups to restore... what do you mean exactly? You mean if you don't have the pre boot password? Or you mean if something else and like what? So as long as you remember the password like you do with say keepass, then you are fine? And is doing something like this very hard to do or easy for someone not tech savy? Would i need to have a backup copy if i make sure i do not forgot my password? And where do you store these backups? On your external hard drive etc?
Well im concerned if someone has access to my computer. Then find out i have bitcoin in my electrum etc. Then downloads malware on it. I know what you mean with the thing you mention but my concern now is if someone got access to my computer.
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Coin-Keeper
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November 18, 2017, 06:33:09 PM |
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Just for the sake of argument lets say the only thing you have to worry about is someone accessing your computer while you are away. Presuming that, the only sure fire way to secure your machine is either to totally encrypted the drive via sector by sector so that all space is encrypted, OR to lock the computer in a safe so nobody has physical access. I have guided many folks through encryption over the years in my "life". My stressing that you have backups is so that you can restore the system disk (C drive especially) if something goes wrong. Generally from the "depth" of your questions I suspect that over time something will jam on your Windows system. With proper backups you can do a complete sector based restore in under an hour and lose no sleep over it. Without the complete capability to restore an encrypted OS you are literally walking blind when sometime goes wrong. Remember the power of that encryption can become your foe in quick order if you make an operator error. You have openly admitted that you are not the "tech person". Do you plan to read/study and become one? This forum is not about computer security but you should head somewhere to read about these things before encrypting your entire drive. Lots of good forums to check out. This is not tough stuff so don't be insulted or threatened if you want to proceed. Just know up front the dangers of simply engaging BitLocker and trusting everything to that piece of software. Where BTC is concerned make absolutely certain that you have your SEED written on a piece of paper and hide it somewhere safe. With that list you can always recover your coins. Under no circumstances should you trust any hard drive with the only list of SEED words. Your suggestion to backup your Win OS to an external drive is a great one. Frankly, ALL people should have backups of their operating system so they can restore easily. I can't tell you how many associates I have had to recover from a total crash. It happens. The worst case scenario is starting from scratch with a Win install disk. That is many hours to get back to where you already are, and any data is lost during the process. Bad!
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jerry0 (OP)
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November 18, 2017, 07:47:02 PM |
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Hi there. Well im not going to lock the computer in a safe somewhere as i use my computer all the time
Well the thing is i do not know how to do the encryption thing unless there is a video or steps that show it step by step exactly. Are there videos of that?
Well if i were to do this, how long would it take to encrypt the drive with bitlocker? Also i never backed up my windows os to an external hard drive even though i have an external hard drive. I do not know how to do this. What forum would you suggest for me to do this? I use windows. But yes the main reason im concerned is if someone has access to my computer and then check my electrum wallet etc. The thing is i do have a program called axcrypt that i use to lock certain documents so if anyone got access to my computer, they can't view those documents. I was suggested to do this if i have documents i want private.
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HCP
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November 19, 2017, 02:05:11 AM |
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Well the thing is i do not know how to do the encryption thing unless there is a video or steps that show it step by step exactly. Are there videos of that?
I recently heard about this neat thing called " Google"... and this other neat thing called " YouTube"...  What forum would you suggest for me to do this? I use windows. For general guidance on Windows OS related matters, depending on the version of Windows you are running, you should check out: https://www.tenforums.com/ or https://www.sevenforums.com/Lot's of Windows experts there with a very good understanding of the OS and various tools/utilities... they also have a lot of "step by step" guides with pretty pictures for doing a lot of Windows related stuff. |
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Abdussamad
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November 19, 2017, 05:56:31 AM |
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If someone has physical access to your computer then there is nothing you can do to prevent them from getting to your files. The best you can hope for is to slow them down so that you can move your coins to another wallet using your backups before they break in. The way to do this is to employ full disk encryption (FDE). That requires an OS reinstall so it's not easy to do. It also adds processing overhead to file access to that'll slow down your computer a little and increase battery usage if it's a portable device. These days the processing overhead isn't that great because CPUs have hardware support for encryption related instructions.
FDE only protects you when your computer is switched off so keep that in mind as well.
IMO malware is a bigger threat to most people than someone with physical access stealing from them. So just be careful what programs you download and install, use an adblocking plugin in your browser and be careful about opening links and attachments sent to you via email. Use an anti-virus program too if you are on Windows.
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jerry0 (OP)
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February 17, 2018, 10:03:53 PM |
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Can someone confirm its true that if having has physical access to your computer, they can get your files no matter what? So bitlocker on it wouldn't prevent them? On another forum they said with bitlocker password, the thief would not be able to access it no matter what.
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Xynerise
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39twH4PSYgDSzU7sLnRoDfthR6gWYrrPoD
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February 17, 2018, 11:14:45 PM |
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Can someone confirm its true that if having has physical access to your computer, they can get your files no matter what? So bitlocker on it wouldn't prevent them? On another forum they said with bitlocker password, the thief would not be able to access it no matter what.
Bitlocker is a full risk encryption tool, similar to Veracrypt. It encrypts the drive and without the key it should be theoretically impossible for the encryption to be broken, but I wouldn't trust any Windows software not to have a backdoor. In theory, yes, it is safe, but 3-letter agencies could have a backdoor. |
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jerry0 (OP)
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February 17, 2018, 11:26:10 PM |
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Hi there. So you suggest bitlocker or vercrypt? Also would you say i have to use either one of these and not have my computer with no password? Thus any thief with access to my laptop could compromise it? Or they cannot if they don't have my keepass password etc?
What do you mean 3 letter agencies have backdoor?
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Abdussamad
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February 18, 2018, 05:32:46 PM |
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Can someone confirm its true that if having has physical access to your computer, they can get your files no matter what? So bitlocker on it wouldn't prevent them? On another forum they said with bitlocker password, the thief would not be able to access it no matter what.
I explained the implications of full disk encryption in post #9 above. Please take a look at that  |
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HCP
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February 19, 2018, 03:04:46 AM |
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What do you mean 3 letter agencies have backdoor?
He is talking about the usual paranoid conspiracy theorist stuff who all believe that NSA/CIA/FBI/<Insert other 3 letter acronym here> all have "backdoor" access to all the encryption software etc. so that it doesn't matter if you use it, they'll be able to spy on you if they want... If you goal is to stop the "average" laptop thief from being able to recover anything from your PC... then bitlocker should be perfectly adequate. As for which one to use... This article suggests you use both  : https://lifehacker.com/windows-encryption-showdown-veracrypt-vs-bitlocker-1777855025 |
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