Incorrect Bitcore(BTX) Circulating Supply on CMC

[b20lopez]

Hi,

If we go for Option 2.

What will be our Max SUPPLY? 21million?

[gwestcot]

Hi,

If we go for Option 2.

What will be our Max SUPPLY? 21million?

Max supply is always going to be 21 million.

[minestro]

Option 4 , proposal
Define a maximum date to claim the btx to the btc holders and close that topic, The remaining coins are included in the airdrop, can this be done?

That would require a hard fork so I don't think it is the preferable option.

Not preferable is mild.
This would be absolute madness. You can't take coins out of the blockchain on an explicit date or a decision of even the devs. Something like that would destroy every trust into the currency.

[Diabolicus]

This whole discussion proves once again how broken a metric the market cap really is.
Same as CPU speed is solely measured in GHz and the number of megapixels is the only thing that influences picture quality of cameras.

Makes you wonder how many other promising projects are misrepresented on CMC?

edit: Must be option 1, of course. Anything else is nonsense.

edit2: Have you contacted coincap.io or coingecko.com as well? Or do those blindly rely on CMC data? (oh, and send coincap.io a BTX logo while you are at it)

[gwestcot]

Option 4 , proposal
Define a maximum date to claim the btx to the btc holders and close that topic, The remaining coins are included in the airdrop, can this be done?

That would require a hard fork so I don't think it is the preferable option.

Not preferable is mild.
This would be absolute madness. You can't take coins out of the blockchain on an explicit date or a decision of even the devs. Something like that would destroy every trust into the currency.

Well to be fair Ethereum did something very similar with the DAO hard fork and they are still one of the most trusted coins out there. That being said, it is still not preferable.

[YuriyK]

Option 2.

[keyzersoze]

Option 4 , proposal
Define a maximum date to claim the btx to the btc holders and close that topic, The remaining coins are included in the airdrop, can this be done?

Greetings Community,

As many of you know, the Bitcore team have been trying to work through the issues with CMC about our circulating supply being incorrectly displayed. I believe CMC views our "virtually forked" coins to Bitcoin holders to not be in circulation so in response our circulating supply has been arbitrarily frozen at 1,195,602 as of November 6th. Since November 6th, we have tried to establish direct contact and consequently we have been waiting for our circulating supply to be corrected. We are now creating this poll to enlist the help of the community in determining a good solution to the problem. Below is a brief description regarding each option and also the spreadsheet that documents everything from the airdrops, first claiming period, virtual fork, development fund addresses, and even the supply from mining. We stopped the calculations at block 84700 so anything that has occurred after that is not accounted for in the spreadsheet. We hope that you find this poll satisfactory and if you have any questions then please be sure to ask.

Sincerely,

Your Bitcore Team

Option 1: Circulating Supply includes the "virtually forked" coins

This option would essentially mean that all coins not currently controlled by the development team are considered in circulation. The numbers are documented below in the spreadsheet and this would mean the circulating supply would be 9,945,943.897515 as of block 84700. We think that this treatment is very fair since the coins are not in our possession and it is exactly how Bitcoin, Bitcoin Cash, and even additional forks have been calculated by CMC.

Option 2: Circulating Supply does not include the "virtually forked" coins but still all of other coins

This option would not consider the "virtually forked" coins to be in circulation but all other coins would still be counted in the circulating supply. The circulating supply for this option would be 1,625,941.46974566. All additional airdrops and coins mined beyond block 84700 would of course have to be added to the running total.

Option 3: Circulating Supply should be permanently frozen at 1,195,602

This option would mean that our circulating supply, despite any proven numbers, would be permanently frozen at 1,195,602.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1gzHqrDDCHyfBtA4H4wl15VYHQzwwfULcJq1r4JcVnOA/edit?usp=sharing

Was there any response when, how and if they would consider the virtual forked coins as circulating supply. As there would be: never, when they are transferred from the fork address or when the fork address' amount is changed in any way?
They can't only say, "Sorry guys, it's done. The supply is going to be frozen forever.". Are they going to at least count the future airdrops into the circulating supply? That's all very strange.
Why do they don't count the virtual fork into the circulating supply? The money is accessible for the ones having the needed private key as every other address on the blockchain. I really don't get on what grounds they're arguing to not count the virtual forked coins. What's the criterium for a coin to be count into the circulating supply. There has to be a definition from their side.

IMHO that's completely BS. By their criteria to not count the forked coins, they would have to ignore most of the "sleeping whale" accounts in other blockchains. I really just don't get it and it feels very arbitrary.

That would require a hard fork so I don't think it is the preferable option.

Again, it's hard to counter cmc's arguments and reasons, if we don't know them.
What have cmc comunicated to you so far? I read on their twitter that they had "sent you a msg" after they had reverted our numbers. What did that and eventual follow up messages from them say?
I mean we're kinda working blind here.

[gwestcot]

Option 4 , proposal
Define a maximum date to claim the btx to the btc holders and close that topic, The remaining coins are included in the airdrop, can this be done?

Greetings Community,

As many of you know, the Bitcore team have been trying to work through the issues with CMC about our circulating supply being incorrectly displayed. I believe CMC views our "virtually forked" coins to Bitcoin holders to not be in circulation so in response our circulating supply has been arbitrarily frozen at 1,195,602 as of November 6th. Since November 6th, we have tried to establish direct contact and consequently we have been waiting for our circulating supply to be corrected. We are now creating this poll to enlist the help of the community in determining a good solution to the problem. Below is a brief description regarding each option and also the spreadsheet that documents everything from the airdrops, first claiming period, virtual fork, development fund addresses, and even the supply from mining. We stopped the calculations at block 84700 so anything that has occurred after that is not accounted for in the spreadsheet. We hope that you find this poll satisfactory and if you have any questions then please be sure to ask.

Sincerely,

Your Bitcore Team

Option 1: Circulating Supply includes the "virtually forked" coins

This option would essentially mean that all coins not currently controlled by the development team are considered in circulation. The numbers are documented below in the spreadsheet and this would mean the circulating supply would be 9,945,943.897515 as of block 84700. We think that this treatment is very fair since the coins are not in our possession and it is exactly how Bitcoin, Bitcoin Cash, and even additional forks have been calculated by CMC.

Option 2: Circulating Supply does not include the "virtually forked" coins but still all of other coins

This option would not consider the "virtually forked" coins to be in circulation but all other coins would still be counted in the circulating supply. The circulating supply for this option would be 1,625,941.46974566. All additional airdrops and coins mined beyond block 84700 would of course have to be added to the running total.

Option 3: Circulating Supply should be permanently frozen at 1,195,602

This option would mean that our circulating supply, despite any proven numbers, would be permanently frozen at 1,195,602.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1gzHqrDDCHyfBtA4H4wl15VYHQzwwfULcJq1r4JcVnOA/edit?usp=sharing

Was there any response when, how and if they would consider the virtual forked coins as circulating supply. As there would be: never, when they are transferred from the fork address or when the fork address' amount is changed in any way?
They can't only say, "Sorry guys, it's done. The supply is going to be frozen forever.". Are they going to at least count the future airdrops into the circulating supply? That's all very strange.
Why do they don't count the virtual fork into the circulating supply? The money is accessible for the ones having the needed private key as every other address on the blockchain. I really don't get on what grounds they're arguing to not count the virtual forked coins. What's the criterium for a coin to be count into the circulating supply. There has to be a definition from their side.

IMHO that's completely BS. By their criteria to not count the forked coins, they would have to ignore most of the "sleeping whale" accounts in other blockchains. I really just don't get it and it feels very arbitrary.

That would require a hard fork so I don't think it is the preferable option.

Again, it's hard to counter cmc's arguments and reasons, if we don't know them.
What have cmc comunicated to you so far? I read on their twitter that they had "sent you a msg" after they had reverted our numbers. What did that and eventual follow up messages from them say?
I mean we're kinda working blind here.

All I feel comfortable telling you was the one or two times they have actually answered us the discussion has been completely unproductive. I want to focus on objective things like the data and not subjective things.

[b20lopez]

I Go for Option 1.

[Hadrop.Boyle]

Option 4 , proposal
Define a maximum date to claim the btx to the btc holders and close that topic, The remaining coins are included in the airdrop, can this be done?

Greetings Community,

As many of you know, the Bitcore team have been trying to work through the issues with CMC about our circulating supply being incorrectly displayed. I believe CMC views our "virtually forked" coins to Bitcoin holders to not be in circulation so in response our circulating supply has been arbitrarily frozen at 1,195,602 as of November 6th. Since November 6th, we have tried to establish direct contact and consequently we have been waiting for our circulating supply to be corrected. We are now creating this poll to enlist the help of the community in determining a good solution to the problem. Below is a brief description regarding each option and also the spreadsheet that documents everything from the airdrops, first claiming period, virtual fork, development fund addresses, and even the supply from mining. We stopped the calculations at block 84700 so anything that has occurred after that is not accounted for in the spreadsheet. We hope that you find this poll satisfactory and if you have any questions then please be sure to ask.

Sincerely,

Your Bitcore Team

Option 1: Circulating Supply includes the "virtually forked" coins

This option would essentially mean that all coins not currently controlled by the development team are considered in circulation. The numbers are documented below in the spreadsheet and this would mean the circulating supply would be 9,945,943.897515 as of block 84700. We think that this treatment is very fair since the coins are not in our possession and it is exactly how Bitcoin, Bitcoin Cash, and even additional forks have been calculated by CMC.

Option 2: Circulating Supply does not include the "virtually forked" coins but still all of other coins

This option would not consider the "virtually forked" coins to be in circulation but all other coins would still be counted in the circulating supply. The circulating supply for this option would be 1,625,941.46974566. All additional airdrops and coins mined beyond block 84700 would of course have to be added to the running total.

Option 3: Circulating Supply should be permanently frozen at 1,195,602

This option would mean that our circulating supply, despite any proven numbers, would be permanently frozen at 1,195,602.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1gzHqrDDCHyfBtA4H4wl15VYHQzwwfULcJq1r4JcVnOA/edit?usp=sharing

Was there any response when, how and if they would consider the virtual forked coins as circulating supply. As there would be: never, when they are transferred from the fork address or when the fork address' amount is changed in any way?
They can't only say, "Sorry guys, it's done. The supply is going to be frozen forever.". Are they going to at least count the future airdrops into the circulating supply? That's all very strange.
Why do they don't count the virtual fork into the circulating supply? The money is accessible for the ones having the needed private key as every other address on the blockchain. I really don't get on what grounds they're arguing to not count the virtual forked coins. What's the criterium for a coin to be count into the circulating supply. There has to be a definition from their side.

IMHO that's completely BS. By their criteria to not count the forked coins, they would have to ignore most of the "sleeping whale" accounts in other blockchains. I really just don't get it and it feels very arbitrary.

That would require a hard fork so I don't think it is the preferable option.

Again, it's hard to counter cmc's arguments and reasons, if we don't know them.
What have cmc comunicated to you so far? I read on their twitter that they had "sent you a msg" after they had reverted our numbers. What did that and eventual follow up messages from them say?
I mean we're kinda working blind here.

All I feel comfortable telling you was the one or two times they have actually answered us the discussion has been completely unproductive. I want to focus on objective things like the data and not subjective things.

Thats strange somehow, I believed they are professionals.

[minestro]

Option 4 , proposal
Define a maximum date to claim the btx to the btc holders and close that topic, The remaining coins are included in the airdrop, can this be done?

That would require a hard fork so I don't think it is the preferable option.

Not preferable is mild.
This would be absolute madness. You can't take coins out of the blockchain on an explicit date or a decision of even the devs. Something like that would destroy every trust into the currency.

Well to be fair Ethereum did something very similar with the DAO hard fork and they are still one of the most trusted coins out there. That being said, it is still not preferable.

That's right, not really the same but perhaps a little bit comparable. But since that day I never touched ethereum or anything etherbased again. Code is law and every action breaking this law is one of the worst things someone can do to a blockchain.

[gwestcot]

Option 4 , proposal
Define a maximum date to claim the btx to the btc holders and close that topic, The remaining coins are included in the airdrop, can this be done?

That would require a hard fork so I don't think it is the preferable option.

Not preferable is mild.
This would be absolute madness. You can't take coins out of the blockchain on an explicit date or a decision of even the devs. Something like that would destroy every trust into the currency.

Well to be fair Ethereum did something very similar with the DAO hard fork and they are still one of the most trusted coins out there. That being said, it is still not preferable.

That's right, not really the same but perhaps a little bit comparable. But since that day I never touched ethereum or anything etherbased again. Code is law and every action breaking this law is one of the worst things someone can do to a blockchain.

Ya I agree... The only changes that should be made are those that clearly have consensus.

[rezurect]

I always thought coinmarketcap was impartial, but this is pretty unfair if you ask me.
Maybe coinmarketcap doesn't want btx in the top 25? And they have interests elsewhere that they are trying to protect..

[Kryptowerk]

There is an argument to be made, regarding the "lost BTX" that will probably never move after our snapshot. Let's assume it is more around 50% of the snapshot coins. So 4 Mil. will be lost forever.
My question is: So what?
It is estimated that as much as 8 Mil. Bitcoin (BTC) are lost forever. Now that's 50% of the current supply! Still, nobody cares, because it is hard to prove and worst case scenario 1 BTC is just much rarer than most people assume.
Same goes for Bitcore and its virtual fork, with the only difference that we will have a much higher total supply that is actually alive, because the snapshot was only giving 0.5 BTX : 1 BTC!

All current forks suffer the same problem, yet coinmarketcap displays them correctly.
So in my opinion it is only a matter of time (hopefully not too much longer) until cmc does display our correct numbers, which is ~9.95 Mil BTX at the moment.

[QB Horse]

BTX DNA is made of honesty and transparency, which will give reason to Bitcore.. so I agree it's just a matter of time.

It's easy to interpret the situation the way we want and we can all come up with our own scenarios and speculate on it.
We must stick to what the facts are.. and the facts are that we have issued 8M coins to BTC address holders. Some may claim their BTX rapidly, or other may do it later once the price is in the hundreds/thousands.

I think we must stick to the fact with cmc and at some point, they will correct the circulation.

In the mean, since many newcomers are confused with this topic, I would highly recommend that we give more visibility to the coin distribution on the website homepage (under the coin specifications section) and all other platforms. I think high-level details like this (below) would help to give a sentiment of transparency to all.

Total - ~16,000,000 BTX
Split into:

~1,415,000 BTX - These are "airdrop-enabled" wallets
~5,148,981 BTX - The airdrop wallet Smiley
~1,500,000 BTX - Devs' wallets - not included in airdrop. But if they would sell part of it - the ones who buy could subscribe to the airdrop.
~8,000,000 BTX - Not registered to airdrop: allocated to BTC owners  + exchanges + wallets not subscribed to airdrop.


Side note: I'm sure you came across coins that had the wrong circulation on cmc and then you went to the coin website to get the right information. Facing uncertainty, people will go to bitcore.cc to get the information. That's why it's important the we have a clear breakdown of the distribution on the homepage.

[QB Horse]

One side note...

CoinCompare does have the right circulation
https://www.cryptocompare.com/coins/btx/overview/BTC

[tmkn]

Greetings Community,

As many of you know, the Bitcore team have been trying to work through the issues with CMC about our circulating supply being incorrectly displayed. I believe CMC views our "virtually forked" coins to Bitcoin holders to not be in circulation so in response our circulating supply has been arbitrarily frozen at 1,195,602 as of November 6th. Since November 6th, we have tried to establish direct contact and consequently we have been waiting for our circulating supply to be corrected. We are now creating this poll to enlist the help of the community in determining a good solution to the problem. Below is a brief description regarding each option and also the spreadsheet that documents everything from the airdrops, first claiming period, virtual fork, development fund addresses, and even the supply from mining. We stopped the calculations at block 84700 so anything that has occurred after that is not accounted for in the spreadsheet. We hope that you find this poll satisfactory and if you have any questions then please be sure to ask.

Sincerely,

Your Bitcore Team

Option 1: Circulating Supply includes the "virtually forked" coins

This option would essentially mean that all coins not currently controlled by the development team are considered in circulation. The numbers are documented below in the spreadsheet and this would mean the circulating supply would be 9,945,943.897515 as of block 84700. We think that this treatment is very fair since the coins are not in our possession and it is exactly how Bitcoin, Bitcoin Cash, and even additional forks have been calculated by CMC.

Option 2: Circulating Supply does not include the "virtually forked" coins but still all of other coins

This option would not consider the "virtually forked" coins to be in circulation but all other coins would still be counted in the circulating supply. The circulating supply for this option would be 1,625,941.46974566. All additional airdrops and coins mined beyond block 84700 would of course have to be added to the running total.

Option 3: Circulating Supply should be permanently frozen at 1,195,602

This option would mean that our circulating supply, despite any proven numbers, would be permanently frozen at 1,195,602.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1gzHqrDDCHyfBtA4H4wl15VYHQzwwfULcJq1r4JcVnOA/edit?usp=sharing

Option 2

[gwestcot]

Greetings Community,

As many of you know, the Bitcore team have been trying to work through the issues with CMC about our circulating supply being incorrectly displayed. I believe CMC views our "virtually forked" coins to Bitcoin holders to not be in circulation so in response our circulating supply has been arbitrarily frozen at 1,195,602 as of November 6th. Since November 6th, we have tried to establish direct contact and consequently we have been waiting for our circulating supply to be corrected. We are now creating this poll to enlist the help of the community in determining a good solution to the problem. Below is a brief description regarding each option and also the spreadsheet that documents everything from the airdrops, first claiming period, virtual fork, development fund addresses, and even the supply from mining. We stopped the calculations at block 84700 so anything that has occurred after that is not accounted for in the spreadsheet. We hope that you find this poll satisfactory and if you have any questions then please be sure to ask.

Sincerely,

Your Bitcore Team

Option 1: Circulating Supply includes the "virtually forked" coins

This option would essentially mean that all coins not currently controlled by the development team are considered in circulation. The numbers are documented below in the spreadsheet and this would mean the circulating supply would be 9,945,943.897515 as of block 84700. We think that this treatment is very fair since the coins are not in our possession and it is exactly how Bitcoin, Bitcoin Cash, and even additional forks have been calculated by CMC.

Option 2: Circulating Supply does not include the "virtually forked" coins but still all of other coins

This option would not consider the "virtually forked" coins to be in circulation but all other coins would still be counted in the circulating supply. The circulating supply for this option would be 1,625,941.46974566. All additional airdrops and coins mined beyond block 84700 would of course have to be added to the running total.

Option 3: Circulating Supply should be permanently frozen at 1,195,602

This option would mean that our circulating supply, despite any proven numbers, would be permanently frozen at 1,195,602.

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1gzHqrDDCHyfBtA4H4wl15VYHQzwwfULcJq1r4JcVnOA/edit?usp=sharing

Option 2

I might agree with you under certain circumstances but basically that means we get treated differently than every other coin. There are millions of Bitcoin that are never going to be in circulation and even more Bitcoin Cash. Our 1:.5 ratio actually means that BTX can have more in true circulation than either of those two.

[topps1k]

I propose a compromise. Since it is estimated by Seeking Alpha that 25% of all BTC is lost, https://seekingalpha.com/article/4082979-many-bitcoins-lost-forever, That 12.5% of BTX is removed from option 1 to account for the lost BTX and BTC. If you really want to be accurate I would say the circulating supply should be about 25% lower due small amounts never being claimed and the 12.5% Lost right off the bat.

[keyzersoze]

I propose a compromise. Since it is estimated by Seeking Alpha that 25% of all BTC is lost, https://seekingalpha.com/article/4082979-many-bitcoins-lost-forever, That 12.5% of BTX is removed from option 1 to account for the lost BTX and BTC. If you really want to be accurate I would say the circulating supply should be about 25% lower due small amounts never being claimed and the 12.5% Lost right off the bat.

Then they need to change the circulating supply on btc and bch and a lot of other coins too.
Why not just stick to calculating it like it's done on every other coin, instead of everybody and their grandmother coming up with their own numbers. fair enough?
Thank you.