[MOVED] BITFURY group buy and HOSTING in Poland EU [3 units ordered]

[Felipeo]

A VAT-registered EU company should be able to buy stuff from bitfurystrikesback.com zero-rated.

Yes I run VAT-registered EU company so we will order without VAT.

but aren't they then liable for VAT in their home country? Likewise, if bitfurystrikesback.com exports stuff outside the EU then VAT isn't due at point of sale, but will need to be paid on entry to the destination country.

I don't know what tax law will be in non EU destination, but If in fact you have to pay whatever it will depend on the declared value of the shipment IMO.

[jlsminingcorp]

Hi Felipeo, thanks for taking the time to answer, I appreciate that. I just have one more question, if I can try your patience for a little longer. So VAT-registered companies need to charge their customers VAT at the local rate right? (unless customers themselves are VAT-registered). So in a simple case, if a VAT-registered company in the UK buys a shovel for £100 they can claim the VAT back on this from HMRC (or get it VAT free when they purchase) and get the shovel for £83.33. However, when they sell the shovel to a customer for, say, £85 then they need to charge the customer VAT (or absorb it in their margin) on that to give a total of £102 and then pay the VAT to HMRC. I don't mean to be patronising, I know you guys know this already, I'm just trying to get my thoughts in order and check whether I understand things correctly. So my question is what happens if that company sell shares in the shovel rather than selling it as a whole? Shouldn't VAT be charged on these shares, won't HMRC be sending a VAT bill at the end of the quarter?

Thanks again, and sorry for turning your thread into a tax accountancy advice forum !!

[Coiner.de]

Coiner.de, 1, 20, 943458f8885f51bfa304dca3db5a8f142e3aae71aeaf848f86dd59c2cd19de0b

[Felipeo]

Hi Felipeo, thanks for taking the time to answer, I appreciate that. I just have one more question, if I can try your patience for a little longer. So VAT-registered companies need to charge their customers VAT at the local rate right? (unless customers themselves are VAT-registered). So in a simple case, if a VAT-registered company in the UK buys a shovel for £100 they can claim the VAT back on this from HMRC (or get it VAT free when they purchase) and get the shovel for £83.33. However, when they sell the shovel to a customer for, say, £85 then they need to charge the customer VAT (or absorb it in their margin) on that to give a total of £102 and then pay the VAT to HMRC. I don't mean to be patronising, I know you guys know this already, I'm just trying to get my thoughts in order and check whether I understand things correctly. So my question is what happens if that company sell shares in the shovel rather than selling it as a whole? Shouldn't VAT be charged on these shares, won't HMRC be sending a VAT bill at the end of the quarter?

Thanks again, and sorry for turning your thread into a tax accountancy advice forum !!

No, shovel stays at our company, it will be used by our company so we don't need to pay VAT.

[tuxxilla]

tuxxilla, 1, 2, 1b2c9a677f2de9af216de3d1103fa911ee0a2fc6e4e3c19e68826f5b7048cef6

[jlsminingcorp]

Hi Felipeo, thanks for taking the time to answer, I appreciate that. I just have one more question, if I can try your patience for a little longer. So VAT-registered companies need to charge their customers VAT at the local rate right? (unless customers themselves are VAT-registered). So in a simple case, if a VAT-registered company in the UK buys a shovel for £100 they can claim the VAT back on this from HMRC (or get it VAT free when they purchase) and get the shovel for £83.33. However, when they sell the shovel to a customer for, say, £85 then they need to charge the customer VAT (or absorb it in their margin) on that to give a total of £102 and then pay the VAT to HMRC. I don't mean to be patronising, I know you guys know this already, I'm just trying to get my thoughts in order and check whether I understand things correctly. So my question is what happens if that company sell shares in the shovel rather than selling it as a whole? Shouldn't VAT be charged on these shares, won't HMRC be sending a VAT bill at the end of the quarter?

Thanks again, and sorry for turning your thread into a tax accountancy advice forum !!

No, shovel stays at our company, it will be used by our company so we don't need to pay VAT.

Thanks for that, I wasn't sure if you could do it like this or not. Thanks also for your patience with my pestering. Hope you enjoy your shovel!

[Bigdaddyaz]

I would be interested if the expense ratio was maybe 8-10% instead of 13%. At 13% you earn something like $2700 in month 1 alone, to cover "management" (not including electricity!), then incrementally smaller payments from there. There is already a pretty big premium on group A, and trying to make our way back to a profit at 87% payout rate could be daunting. Just bringing this up since you may have to adjust the GB anyway, depending on what happens to BTC prices.

Again, I'm interested just a little concerned about the expenses.

Thanks for listening.

[pajak666]

I would be interested if the expense ratio was maybe 8-10% instead of 13%. At 13% you earn something like $2700 in month 1 alone, to cover "management" (not including electricity!), then incrementally smaller payments from there. There is already a pretty big premium on group A, and trying to make our way back to a profit at 87% payout rate could be daunting. Just bringing this up since you may have to adjust the GB anyway, depending on what happens to BTC prices.

Again, I'm interested just a little concerned about the expenses.

Thanks for listening.

I've answered this before.
I will copy paste it again.

And the air cooling? And the power to run it? And the redundant internet connection? And the space where all the stuff is placed? And all the work made to set up things?
No hard feelings but simply imagine all the costs and fact that we you are saving 23% at the beginning of the hosting deal becouse there is no VAT applied. We can provide that since we are legitimate tax payers as registered company.

Simple math: You are saving yourself some time and money (+10% even with 13% hosting fee)
First month that might be quite good payout, since there was no big difficulty jump. But then it might become battle over pennies, and would you like to take care of sth everyday for 300$ a month?
this 3% will be hard to feel by investors anyway, but it's necessary to keep the stuff running in good conditions.
Sorry to hear that it's too much for you.
Feel free to join in anytime

[Adamlm]

I'd be interested but I see there is no big interest in this buy just a few hours before its end.
With current status: 46/300, let's say +10-20 till the end, what exactly are you going to buy? 25 GH/s devices?

[Coiner.de]

Yes, they will buy starter kits.
As we are just shy of three starter kits I added a buffer order.

Coiner.de, 1, 10, 95786c80ce63185b376bf093915d61e4063bc7509057efc2c9e5f0f1ddfacec1

"buffer"?

Please add this to the very end of the queue and only use as much shares as are needed to get that extra device.
That is, please place all following orders ( if there are any ) before this one in the queue.
I hope I made my intentions clear and you don't mind any extra effort you have.

[Adamlm]

After reading all details on pajak666's store I can assure that it looks like a legit company, all this can be verified in national business registry etc.

I'm also from Poland and I am going to support our local bitcoin mining farms

adamlm, 1, 2, 3983b0ee164c2ed48c8beeb8a56a9d54bceb66ffefcc8b7a74080caa49f0d2c3

[Bigdaddyaz]

Thanks for your response earlier today!

If you are able to reserve 3 shares for me, I'll forward payment tonight when I get home from the office.

[pajak666]

because there are still some shares left,we will hold a bit with our order to collect a bit more from our investors to make total order bigger

[Bigdaddyaz]

because there are still some shares left,we will hold a bit with our order to collect a bit more from our investors to make total order bigger

So I should still send my payment, correct (or is the GB on hold)?

[pajak666]

Anyone can buy shares for at least 24h more from that post, I am waiting for some more detailed info from Niko about closing time for orders.
I remind that even if we will not collect whole amount we will buy 25 GH/s boards instead of 400 GH/s unit, so no shares will be lost.
I got to sleep after long night car driving, in about 8 hours I will make all necessary updates about new shares that were sold.

[Coiner.de]

There was a clear deadline. Devices should have been bought immediately after the deadline.
Buy the devices until 18:00 CET or count me out.
Please send all my BTC to the address they were sent from as soon as possible then.

[cchan]

I'd like to buy one 25G miner.
Could you ship it to me after you receive it? I am in China.

Thanks.

[tuxxilla]

There was a clear deadline. Devices should have been bought immediately after the deadline.
Buy the devices until 18:00 CET or count me out.
Please send all my BTC to the address they were sent from as soon as possible then.

I totally agree with this. If we wait until all 300 shares are sold it is > august already.

[Adamlm]

There was a clear deadline. Devices should have been bought immediately after the deadline.
Buy the devices until 18:00 CET or count me out.
Please send all my BTC to the address they were sent from as soon as possible then.

Agree.
You shouldn't change the rules in that way.
People have joined your group buy with certain terms & conditions. The deadline was clear and have passed.
 

[riclas]

riclas, 1, 10, be57f42142b5eeb9d521f5e04b4f8cccf94bd9237f52e5e9f247c91693143e66

hoping you buy the 25gh/s boards for august.