Fair Profit for Coin Founders

[eCoinomist]

But I first have to make money cause I can't launch a pure charity coin with no money.  I wish I could.

If you think everything is about money and profit, then I think you are on a wrong track.

Money and profit all boil down to one thing "power & control".
But Steeve Jobs and Bill Gates, while motivated by such things, weren't doing it for power & control, they did it because it is their purpose/mission in life, just like passionate actors/singers act/sing because that is what they LOVE doing, because it's their passion and what life means to them.

If you lived in medieval age, you did not need to have money/gold or silver to feed and take care of the orphans, you just needed to be a king.

These days you can accomplish similar things by being a president, but not as easily as it was for the dictating king 300 years ago.

[Vlad2Vlad]

But I first have to make money cause I can't launch a pure charity coin with no money.  I wish I could.

If you think everything is about money and profit, then I think you are on a wrong track.

Money and profit all bowl down to one thing "power & control".
But Steeve Jobs and Bill Gates, while motivated by such things, weren't doing it for power & control, they did it because it is their purpose/mission in life, just like passionate actors/singers act/sing because that is what they LOVE doing, because it's their passion and what life means to them.

If you lived in medieval age, you did not need to have money/gold or silver to feed and take care of the orphans, you just needed to be a king.

These days you can accomplish similar things by being a president, but not as easily as it was for the dictating king 300 years ago.

I Simply don't have the money to launch a charity coin.  I'm not working a regular Job and I have 2 kids. I'm struggling.  That's what I meant. I thought if I had success with a for profit coin then i could easily launch a charity coin. 

I can't give to charity when I'm charity myself.  Tough spot to be in.

[eCoinomist]

I Simply don't have the money to launch a charity coin.  I'm not working a regular Job and I have 2 kids. I'm struggling.  That's what I meant. I thought if I had success with a for profit coin then i could easily launch a charity coin.  

I can't give to charity when I'm charity myself.  Tough spot to be in.

another reason to join eMunie, we are already doing what you envisioned, plus the founder Dan is a talented experienced dev himself - that's why I joined it (I can't code these things myself, but I had ideas, visions for a digital currency).

I shared my ideas with the founder, and they were taken onboard (compare original system vs. this new update) - more than 70% of original ideas were changed because people like me cared to join and make it a better system.

Everyone has his/her own strength, and from my experience of bootstrap outsourcing over 100 freelancers to date, I can tell right of the bat, that if you are thinking of a software development project, but can't code it yourself, consider it FAILED!!! (unless you have millions $ to drain).

[freedomno1]

Well as long as one is aware that 95% of economists tend to be wrong at any one time your a little bit ahead
I also laugh at the people who think it won't succeed but with the all the BS articles spreading around the internet cannot blame those who look at the surface and it will be their loss.
Unless your a Nouriel Roubini though would not be be able to say we can see the future buts that speculation

Well, I've been saying these things for 3 months now.  Things like alt coins will soon greatly increase in number and that's already started. 3 moths ago most thought that wouldn't happen for years to come.

And I said bitcoin was going to walstreet and Main Street, and already, faster than even predicted its applied for an ETF.  I said 2014, would see an explosion in not just bitcoin value but most alt coins.  

And 3 months ago I never read anyone make such bullish remarks and yet they've all come true. I wrote a few articles stating these things for Devcoin - so at least I can back up my claims next year if I'm right and all the doubters jump out saying:  oh, we knew it all along.  

Cause most can't even imagine what's coming.  If they could they'd be holding to every coin and buy more. I'm buying most coins even the ones which are thought to have no future like ixCoin, and the ultra cheap like Devcoin.

Those who take a little risk now can make millions in the next 2 years.  The state and the banks badly want digital cash to make it - way too much power and smart money on our side for this thing to not blow up to the mother of all bubbles.

Sad thing is most here will sell way too early.  Most here will sell it all if they see $100,000 in their accounts. But that's a predetermined outcome and that's why this thing will work so well for many more people but those who get in early stand to make by far the most money.  And this, right now, is early.

And roubini, he was saying buy gold the last 2 years while I was telling everyone I know to dump it.  So at least once I was right and he was wrong.  Lol.  But gold will spike like mad, but not until late 2015.  

And in the short run gold will breach $1,000 and head to $500. And I said this 3 moths ago in one of my articles when gold was $1400.  Nobody then was taking about $1,000 and $500 was crazy talk.

Hmm this is long guess I'll reply

Sure the alts coins will increase in number but they won't gain any traction unless some significant improvements can be made to them there is a key difference between a real change and improvement and a mimic like most alt coins being spammed out now.
Instant blockchain compression trading over exchanges instant built in clients and ease of use there is no point in reinventing the wheel
Makes more sense to make the car and improve on it instead of another horse based carriage

If you want a premine look at ripple and their closed source code as of today.

In 2014 there will be an increase in the value of altcoins that really do provide decent changes
Litecoin PPCcoin Namecoin and Devcoin perhaps more to the point is that you need to convince me and the market that what the coin of yours in the future will provide is different from the other imitator coins and make it worth the time.

He-he 3 months ago people were reeling from the stench of a 250 to 100 dollar drop that said someone has tried living on bitcoin for a week it still needs time to develop and a coin is not as important as the services it can provide

I'm saying you need ammo to build the infrastructure and it's a silly notion to assume that you can make the industry change without needing to put some real work into it the pros and cons of it realistically depend on how you make it are the options more profitable to make a coin or develop on current structures whatever reaches the most people will result in the profit as long as you understand the risk and the safety measures of making a proper currency then that's fine it's necessary to realize the reasons behind the growth and the need for a coin. Utilizing the best profit will come from recognizing the failings of any current currency and improving upon it and bringing change that is the scenario we are in.

Ultimately there are a lot of mixed signals in the market but there are opportunities out there that the market hasn't realized and the market will need to realize that and lock in some rates today to ensure some larger profits tomorrow the location of the investment and where is the best place to put capital is your call.

http://business.financialpost.com/2013/06/24/miners-writedowns-top-17-billion-as-roubini-sees-gold-dropping-to-1000/

[Vlad2Vlad]

@freedomno1,

What can I say.  Money makes the world go 'round and I've got none.

Sad to sit and watch this train go by.  I did buy some mining gear from BFL, maybe that will come next month and then maybe I can make something with that - enough to launch a righteous coin.

[Vlad2Vlad]

I Simply don't have the money to launch a charity coin.  I'm not working a regular Job and I have 2 kids. I'm struggling.  That's what I meant. I thought if I had success with a for profit coin then i could easily launch a charity coin.  

I can't give to charity when I'm charity myself.  Tough spot to be in.

another reason to join eMunie, we are already doing what you envisioned, plus the founder Dan is a talented experienced dev himself - that's why I joined it (I can't code these things myself, but I had ideas, visions for a digital currency).

I shared my ideas with the founder, and they were taken onboard (compare original system vs. this new update) - more than 70% of original ideas were changed because people like me cared to join and make it a better system.

Everyone has his/her own strength, and from my experience of bootstrap outsourcing over 100 freelancers to date, I can tell right of the bat, that if you are thinking of a software development project, but can't code it yourself, consider it FAILED!!! (unless you have millions $ to drain).

So you want me to give all my ideas to the founder of another coin?  Why would I do that?  It's like Gates saying, hey jobs, here's office for you computer Cause it's lacking that.

Sorry man, as much as I want to see a great coin launched and also a good charity coin, there's no way I'm just gonna give away anything I've got to make some other guy's coin better instead of focusing on trying to get mine off the ground.  I'm glad to see you're that trusting and giving but I'm not.

I want to see if I can get a coin launched and if I give any good ideas to another guy that's gone.  And I get a thanks and he gets rich.  That's too much for me.

[coinerd]

It's like Gates saying, hey jobs, here's office for you computer Cause it's lacking that

Wait, didn't that happen?

Then when it didn't work, I seem to recall him shoring them up a bit with a little purchase of stock.

Totally off topic but that was a pretty ironic example.

[freedomno1]

@freedomno1,

What can I say.  Money makes the world go 'round and I've got none.

Sad to sit and watch this train go by.  I did buy some mining gear from BFL, maybe that will come next month and then maybe I can make something with that - enough to launch a righteous coin.

In that case I wish you luck squared
BFL sucks so I hope the coin works out a lot better
Would say buy 100 alt coins each but I prefer Asicminer
Too much saturation in gambling coin sites and alt coins atm

What I would like to see is advanced trading interfaces using an alt coin built into the client now that would be interesting
Heck if you could get 10 RPG companies to use a game coin between them based on a bitcoin client that works too
Or even aiming titanic scales Giant decentralized stock markets with colored tokens he-he we changed finance and the way we view money why not change the stock exchange next and mess with those damn HFT robots

Went into madness there anyways I agree watching these trains go by is annoying but it's best to just build some more capital and then decide where to maximize it if you see a good train passing by  

After all it is savers that provide the equity needed for a company to succeed
If it doesn't crash and burn == Profit
So pick the good train
Best of Luck

Some ideas
T-shirts or making metal versions of all the alt coins for sale lol
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=20292.2000;topicseen

Hmm Satoshi lol
I'm working on other things
Anyways
It’s what’s for the betterment of bitcoin that matters

[eCoinomist]

So you want me to give all my ideas to the founder of another coin?  Why would I do that?  It's like Gates saying, hey jobs, here's office for you computer Cause it's lacking that.

Sorry man, as much as I want to see a great coin launched and also a good charity coin, there's no way I'm just gonna give away anything I've got to make some other guy's coin better instead of focusing on trying to get mine off the ground.  I'm glad to see you're that trusting and giving but I'm not.

Well, as I see it you are not the Gates or the Job, because you can't code - so your metaphor is out of the windows right away.

As to the "why" question, if you have not heard of it, let me remind you:
Ideas are dozens a dime - and this comes from the founder of the multimillion dollar CDBaby.com

Why? Because your ideas will likely be wasted anyway, never to take shape and just vapor into nothingness as speculative talk.
(I don't know you, but you said you "can't code" + "no money" + "profit driven" = FAIL)

And I get a thanks and he gets rich.

You are in control of whom you trust to share your ideas.
Plus the person who gets rich off your contributed ideas, proving he is smart enough, will quickly recognise that you are an asset to him.
He will be incentivised to share the profit with you, because he knows you are the one who will make him even richer.

His wealth depends on you - the multiplier

[eCoinomist]

Buying BFL at the current state of Bitcoin and Altcoin just some what suggests to me you don't really have the mindset of an entrepreneur, another reason why I don't think your ideas will ever take fruition on your own.

[Vlad2Vlad]

It's like Gates saying, hey jobs, here's office for you computer Cause it's lacking that

Wait, didn't that happen?

Then when it didn't work, I seem to recall him shoring them up a bit with a little purchase of stock.

Totally off topic but that was a pretty ironic example.

No, not quite.  Gates used the office Jobs was lacking as a Trojan horse to gain his trust and it worked. Gates then got full access to apple's software and he store everything, mainly the interface which was years ahead of Microsoft.

A decade later when jobs came back, like in 1998 or so, softy invested like $300 million in apple for non-voting stock.  That wasn't just softy being nice, it was part of an anti trust suit against softy.  The government wanted to foster innovation and competition and it worked.

So no, my example was spot on.  Gates didn't give anything away, he got in with a lie and stole everything.

[Vlad2Vlad]

Buying BFL at the current state of Bitcoin and Altcoin just some what suggests to me you don't really have the mindset of an entrepreneur, another reason why I don't think your ideas will ever take fruition on your own.

Well, you're presuming the price of bitcoin will stay at $100 or drop while difficulty will go to 100 million.

That's a possibility but I think based on the fact that I'm certain the ETF will get approved (and I seem to be alone on this) that bitcoin will skyrocket later this year and especially next year so now is the time to buy mining rigs cause if I'm right there's gonna be a 1 year wait. 

And I also think the ETF is gonna create a craze and push bitcoin past $1,000 by next year but of course that's crazy talk at this point.  But everything I know about investing tells me there's a high probability of that happening by next year.

If that happens then the mining rigs I bought will be worth their weight in gold, literally.

You have to take some educated risks if you're gonna make it big and that's what I'm doing.  I do realize this is a very high risk at this point as no human on earth thinks Bitcoin will hit $250 next year let alone $1,000.

Good luck.

[Vlad2Vlad]

So you want me to give all my ideas to the founder of another coin?  Why would I do that?  It's like Gates saying, hey jobs, here's office for you computer Cause it's lacking that.

Sorry man, as much as I want to see a great coin launched and also a good charity coin, there's no way I'm just gonna give away anything I've got to make some other guy's coin better instead of focusing on trying to get mine off the ground.  I'm glad to see you're that trusting and giving but I'm not.

Well, as I see it you are not the Gates or the Job, because you can't code - so your metaphor is out of the windows right away.

As to the "why" question, if you have not heard of it, let me remind you:
Ideas are dozens a dime - and this comes from the founder of the multimillion dollar CDBaby.com

Why? Because your ideas will likely be wasted anyway, never to take shape and just vapor into nothingness as speculative talk.
(I don't know you, but you said you "can't code" + "no money" + "profit driven" = FAIL)

And I get a thanks and he gets rich.

You are in control of whom you trust to share your ideas.
Plus the person who gets rich off your contributed ideas, proving he is smart enough, will quickly recognise that you are an asset to him.
He will be incentivised to share the profit with you, because he knows you are the one who will make him even richer.

His wealth depends on you - the multiplier

You're putting a lot of faith in a guy you don't know, or maybe you have a lot of confidence in your ideas.  I have neither. 

I'd rather try things out on my own but your formula for FAIL is spot on.  I can't learn to program in 3 months so them for me to change the formula to WIN I need to come up with the cash.  I'll do my best.

For now I'm accumulating devcoin and ixCoin.  For some reason I have a really strong feeling that one of those 2 will hit it really big.  They're both dirt cheap. Just $1,000 in either one can make you rich if I end up being right.  Not a lot to risk for such potential.  A lot of coins will probably go up a lot after Bitocin gets their ETF but some will go up a lot more than others.

IxCoin is a clone of bitcoin and its been around a while.  Imagine being a banker and seein the bitcoin ETF working out. There's gonna be massive copying of that ETF and ixCoin would be a perfect fit for another ETF.

ixCoin is a perfect risk on a play given Bitcoin gets its ETF AND I'm convinced they will. Devcoin is a more socio-political play. I'm investing in both as much as I can.

[eCoinomist]

Well, you're presuming the price of bitcoin will stay at $100 or drop while difficulty will go to 100 million.

That's a possibility but I think based on the fact that I'm certain the ETF will get approved (and I seem to be alone on this) that bitcoin will skyrocket later this year and especially next year so now is the time to buy mining rigs cause if I'm right there's gonna be a 1 year wait. 

And I also think the ETF is gonna create a craze and push bitcoin past $1,000 by next year but of course that's crazy talk at this point.  But everything I know about investing tells me there's a high probability of that happening by next year.

If that happens then the mining rigs I bought will be worth their weight in gold, literally.

You have to take some educated risks if you're gonna make it big and that's what I'm doing.  I do realize this is a very high risk at this point as no human on earth thinks Bitcoin will hit $250 next year let alone $1,000.

Good luck.

It's not about taking risks, the point was, you could just buy lots more Bitcoin for the same money right now, instead of waiting for asics to arrive, by which point difficulty is going to skyrocket, which means for the lifetime of your purchased BFL, it would never mine as many bitcoin as if you just use the purchase money to buy bitcoin when the price is low. If bitcoins disappears, your asics are useless, so it's the same as buying bitcoin.

I also got into bitcoin just 3 months ago, but I decided to build this, instead:


Reason:

• I can still buy bitcoin anytime I want with my litecoin
• I don't waste time waiting for anything while difficulty sky rockets
• If everything bursts, I can still recoup 60% of my investment selling hardware

[Vlad2Vlad]

Dude, that's crazy.  Is that a giant GPU super computer.

Dude, I've never seen anything like that.  That's crazy.  That must eat what, 8,000 watts?  What giga hash are you getting (for bitcoin)?

You must have spent at least $25,000 building that.  And hey, if GPU's can't mine bitcoin you can't switch to litecoin.  Or sell the GPU's like you said.

Listen, buy yourself just 100,000 ixCoin.  That's gonna cost you just 4 bitcoins.  Just risk that much in case I'm right about this ETF and how it's gonna affect ixCoin.  With your super rig it would take a few years and thousands in electricity costs to mine 100,000 ixCoins.  ixCoin is a steal right now.  I hope you do it.

Congrats - timing and chance is everything and you had the vision and guts and cash to do it in a big way.  God bless you, man.

[eCoinomist]

ixCoin is a perfect risk on a play given Bitcoin gets its ETF AND I'm convinced they will. Devcoin is a more socio-political play. I'm investing in both as much as I can.

lol, did you know IxCoin is not even on major exchanges yet? , not even btc-e?

I wish I could wish you luck, but I believe in science, psychology and economics. None of them indicate any potential for BTC in the long run, let alone IxCoin.

[Vlad2Vlad]

I can't stop staring at your rig.  I saved it on my ipad.  Crazy.  I wish I had money to build a quarter of that.  That's just crazy.

[eCoinomist]

Dude, that's crazy.  Is that a giant GPU super computer.

Dude, I've never seen anything like that.  That's crazy.  That must eat what, 8,000 watts?  What giga hash are you getting (for bitcoin)?

You must have spent at least $25,000 building that.  And hey, if GPU's can't mine bitcoin you can't switch to litecoin.  Or sell the GPU's like you said.

Listen, buy yourself just 100,000 ixCoin.  That's gonna cost you just 4 bitcoins.  Just risk that much in case I'm right about this ETF and how it's gonna affect ixCoin.  With your super rig it would take a few years and thousands in electricity costs to mine 100,000 ixCoins.  ixCoin is a steal right now.  I hope you do it.

Congrats - timing and chance is everything and you had the vision and guts and cash to do it in a big way.  God bless you, man.

Costed about $18,000 USD. It gives me 17,200 MH/s for scrypt mining. I don't mine bitcoin, only litecoin or alts and convert them to bitcoin if the ratio is good.

Eats only 6,000 watts.

IxCoin is a steal because its worth nothing now and less than nothing in the future - that's what I believe.

[Vlad2Vlad]

ixCoin is a perfect risk on a play given Bitcoin gets its ETF AND I'm convinced they will. Devcoin is a more socio-political play. I'm investing in both as much as I can.

lol, did you know IxCoin is not even on major exchanges yet? , not even btc-e?

I wish I could wish you luck, but I believe in science, psychology and economics. None of them indicate any potential for BTC in the long run, let alone IxCoin.

It trades on vircurex but yeah, it's a zombie coin.

I'm a man of science too man, you can't be an economist and not love math and science.  

But None of this makes sense. Bitcoin doesn't make sense.  These alt coins being allowed to function and undermine the dollar makes no sense.

Bitcoin getting its own ETF is going to shock the entire investment world and that makes zero sense.

There's much more than meets the eye here.  This is all being manipulated.  The banks, multinationals and especially the government have so much to gain from a global crypto currency.  They want the masses to love digital money and giving it away for free is the best way.  This is my biggest premise for thinking the ETF Is a done deal and there's going to be a bitcoin and alt coin madness very soon, latest next year.  

I know, my entire theory is based on a conspiracy theory, but nothing else makes any sense from a fundamental point of view.  Bitcoin should have crashed within days or weeks back down to near zero but instead if found stability at around $100.  That's just not possible.  

There's so much more going on here than anybody realizes and of that ETF gets approved - because there's no way it should, then its going to really confirm my theory.  We'll find out soon.

[Vlad2Vlad]

Dude, that's crazy.  Is that a giant GPU super computer.

Dude, I've never seen anything like that.  That's crazy.  That must eat what, 8,000 watts?  What giga hash are you getting (for bitcoin)?

You must have spent at least $25,000 building that.  And hey, if GPU's can't mine bitcoin you can't switch to litecoin.  Or sell the GPU's like you said.

Listen, buy yourself just 100,000 ixCoin.  That's gonna cost you just 4 bitcoins.  Just risk that much in case I'm right about this ETF and how it's gonna affect ixCoin.  With your super rig it would take a few years and thousands in electricity costs to mine 100,000 ixCoins.  ixCoin is a steal right now.  I hope you do it.

Congrats - timing and chance is everything and you had the vision and guts and cash to do it in a big way.  God bless you, man.

Costed about $18,000 USD. It gives me 17,200 MH/s for scrypt mining. I don't mine bitcoin, only litecoin or alts and convert them to bitcoin if the ratio is good.

Eats only 6,000 watts.

IxCoin is a steal because its worth nothing now and less than nothing in the future - that's what I believe.

So that means you'd get about 17 Giga hash if you'd mine bitcoin.  10 to 1 is the ratio I was getting with my tiny human computer.

4 bitcoins is not a lot to risk, a week of your rig working.  Fine, just buy 25,000 ixcoins.  I don't get anything out of it, I just feel so strongly its going up that I feel the need to tell people about it.

Either way, good luck with everything man.  Who knows, maybe BFL will come though.  With roughly $4,000 I bought about 80 giga hash from BFL, but the energy consumption is probably around 800 watts. 

But you're right, if bitcoin goes away those things are paper weight so its a big risk for $4,000.  But since I believe bitcoin is going much higher it was a no brainier for me but I've been wrong plenty of times before.

Good luck.