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Author Topic: Conception of a future CryptoCurrency Bank and what its function will be.  (Read 2272 times)
digitalindustry (OP)
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July 09, 2013, 02:09:05 PM
Last edit: July 09, 2013, 02:23:11 PM by digitalindustry
 #1

Instead of using something like a phone number, why not tie it to another wallet. So, 2 step wallet verification.
Then it would retain the anonymity that some desire.

I want to give credit here - it was this comment and the OP AliceWonder that lead me to this vision.


Let me lay this out  -


In the future for Crypto to be incorporated to the "public" and not centralized it needs to be seamless, and easy.

I envision a "Vault" its the users Crypto Vault its a specialized piece of hardware with encryption built in, but is easy to use on a custom OS, etc.

in the Set up of this device , all and any Crypto can only be sent to the users "Wallet" - basically the portable device - Possibly just a card.


This is what the future Crypto Banks will be all about -  
 

as i said , {arrogantly} - information systems are my thing:

but to be successful - Confidence and security are 1 and 2 , after the two prime features I mentioned up-thread. < read the other thread


The first Crypto banks functions will aim to provide seamless centralized security with human face to face interactions - with fees being happily paid by the Crypto community for the benefit.

These mini "Vaults" will be literally onsite at a "Bank" location - users can come to the bank and go though the ID verification process and Transfer currency savings from the "Vault" to the "Wallet".

the ID verification process has a minimum Verification with other optional extras that the Crypto user can add on possibly at extra cost.

The "Wallet" will have all the normal standard security features but in the event that a user:

1. loses their password or
2. forgets their "verification password"
3. becomes the victim of theft.


They can always use the Banks features to pause or stop the existing Wallet and go back to the Central Authority that they originally registered and ID themselves and either reset or reissue a "Wallet".

Of course the transactions of a "Vault" to a "Wallet" are one way essentially.

You may say - "how would you Pause a wallet?" - well a Wallet is a piece of firmware essentially , it doesn't have to have the security of a Vault its a usability/security trade off like old world internet banking right now, so if encrypted communication can be sent to the Wallet from the Vault or Bank on the event of theft, then the transaction can be reversed or paused, just as happens now.


**
save the Anon bullshit - this is how it will work, its a completely opt in user pays system, if you want to try to achieve complete Anon then don't opt in - most people will . seriously save it, i don't care, and neither do 99% of the population, if you are that intent on being Anon then you probably have a pretty high degree of knowledge about how to use the Technology you have , so then you don't need to use this service.

***
I could envision the ID verification process being more and more common sense and Bio-tech based. i.e  - an easy to remember  secret password , a signature and maybe a optional Eye scan, as well as the normal Drivers lic or Passport. as is used in a normal bank.

****
as its all a service and opt in , users will have a completely reverse view of this technology , {before you start to say it} it will be the Technology serving the user , the Banks will be competitive and free market institutions.  this could essentially be happening now.

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Of course as these institutions will be free market - quickly the Banks with the most confidence in their security measures will introduce Crypto - insurance for their customers. basically FDIC up to certain amounts.

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Zalfrin
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July 09, 2013, 02:23:31 PM
 #2

It was tried before with bitcoin. Lots of people got scammed when the bank went belly up.
digitalindustry (OP)
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July 09, 2013, 02:27:40 PM
 #3

It was tried before with bitcoin. Lots of people got scammed when the bank went belly up.

Can you link me - that's hard to see how that is possible ?

I'm talking about a physical location , customers walk in the door , think attractive smiling young customer service girls.

not a shady -:

Hey send us your Bitcamucallits and we'll "look after them" Guaranteed !" send all coins to NigerianpriceBitcoinsaving.xgd.exe.com

admittedly perhaps its too soon for now , because , of course most government are still in resistance mode to Cryptocurrency but as that changes , governments of the future looking nations will bring in basic regulations and minimum standards for such institutions , perhaps a very basic license system, hostile government of course will  try to use theses things to drive the bank out of business , but as that shift occurs, so does many other things. 

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July 09, 2013, 02:37:24 PM
 #4

If you want a "bank" then use a "bank" (rather than try to create some sort of pseudo-bank).

It is not easy to become a "bank" (at least in most western countries) so you will have the *trust* of the bank itself (although even western banks have gone belly up before).

If you get a reputable bank to buy into the idea (of a BTC account) then you may have something - but if not then you are going to look like a MyBitcoin or even worse Bitcoin Savings and Trust (search for the whole pirate saga).

With CIYAM anyone can create 100% generated C++ web applications in literally minutes.

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July 09, 2013, 02:43:43 PM
 #5

Brick-and-mortar location would be a change.

Here is what I was referring to. http://blogs.telegraph.co.uk/technology/willardfoxton2/100007836/bitcoin-pirate-scandal-sec-steps-in-amid-allegations-that-the-whole-thing-was-a-ponzi-scheme/
digitalindustry (OP)
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July 09, 2013, 03:33:09 PM
 #6

If you want a "bank" then use a "bank" (rather than try to create some sort of pseudo-bank).

It is not easy to become a "bank" (at least in most western countries) so you will have the *trust* of the bank itself (although even western banks have gone belly up before).

If you get a reputable bank to buy into the idea (of a BTC account) then you may have something - but if not then you are going to look like a MyBitcoin or even worse Bitcoin Savings and Trust (search for the whole pirate saga).


ok we are shifting around words here , but essentially i understand what you are leading to , a "Bank" has the trust that would be needed to "buy in" the existing customers.

i understand , and as things shift , it may go that way , very unlikely that it will happen in the "West" like that first.

but in other nations I could totally see it.

** what about Long Term Bitocin Management LLC ? : D

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July 09, 2013, 03:41:29 PM
 #7


HA HA yeah ok , well put it this way I stopped reading after this :

"In November 2011, a user calling himself Pirateat40 launched a "Bitcoin Savings and Trust", which claimed to allow users to invest their Bitcoins at an interest rate of seven per cent a week – over 3,000 per cent a year."

of course - we all realize these things are a little different no?

i really love that name "Pirateat40" , of course had it been Doubloons stolen the whole affair would be on the up and up  : D



{at the SEC office}

{Phone rings}

[John  we'd had an incident! {panting down the phone}  there has been a number of Cryptocurrency stolen from an online "Bank" run by a man named Pirateat40]

[We believe most were Doubloons]

John - [ Doubloons ! Christ ! he gets away with it AGAIN , Steve you know we can't prosecute , he has a Pirate name !  God DAM SEC law. ! ]

{phone slams down}





**** edit

ha ha "Savings and Loans" ha ha ,"Pirateat40" well have you ever heard of a Darwin award ? , i'm sorry dude , but come on ha ha ha !

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July 09, 2013, 03:41:58 PM
 #8

** what about Long Term Bitocin Management LLC ? : D

Actually I think you'll find that the Winklevoss twins are doing precisely that!

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July 09, 2013, 03:47:48 PM
 #9


I'm thinking about opening a Surgery - out the front I'm going to put a huge Chainsaw with neon around it and blood dripping from it - under it the sign will read:

"Home Style Surgery"
"Guaranteed a Results!"
"We save you money because we don't have formal qualifications"



 

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digitalindustry (OP)
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July 09, 2013, 03:58:58 PM
 #10

** what about Long Term Bitocin Management LLC ? : D

Actually I think you'll find that the Winklevoss twins are doing precisely that!


yeah - its possible - but if that is the intent , {and i'm not a conspiracy theorist on this subject} , i think they are going to fail miserably , if the Government gets in on trying to recycle money though Paper to naked short Bitcoin, what will happen is that the market will demand to see the blockchain - simple , this is not Gold this is not Silver.

and after that , the EFT experiment will be deleted from history and life will go on.

I think they have large stake in the currency and want to expose it too frightened and spooked equity and commodity investors , and it will likely be a huge boon .

not just for Bitcoin , but possibly for all cryptocurrency - as when people where having conspiracies about Facebook I was cheering those idiots along.  

Ha ha the Government agencies had a great idea to wrap up and control all the information, all they did was expose TV generation humans to Net information , i'm guessing they either didn't understand the implications or didn't care.

but it was pretty big trade off - they gained nothing ,and turned a bunch of TV generation humans into conspiracy theorists . ,

which i for one support RT has a motto "Question more" i like it because i support all conspiracy theorists , theorems are questions , questions means brain activity the opposite to what a TV aims to do.

= so what was Facebook? a way to try to capture TV generation information, i love Facebook ! as much as i love this EFT, and for similar reasons .

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July 10, 2013, 04:44:42 AM
 #11

Guess most the cost to set up something like that would be in security . 

In some ways more than a fiat bank in that respect , but after which there would be constant profit. For the service .
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July 10, 2013, 04:57:09 AM
 #12

If you want a "bank" then use a "bank" (rather than try to create some sort of pseudo-bank).

It is not easy to become a "bank" (at least in most western countries) so you will have the *trust* of the bank itself (although even western banks have gone belly up before).

If you get a reputable bank to buy into the idea (of a BTC account) then you may have something - but if not then you are going to look like a MyBitcoin or even worse Bitcoin Savings and Trust (search for the whole pirate saga).


What about a credit union?
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July 10, 2013, 06:32:44 AM
 #13

If you want a "bank" then use a "bank" (rather than try to create some sort of pseudo-bank).

It is not easy to become a "bank" (at least in most western countries) so you will have the *trust* of the bank itself (although even western banks have gone belly up before).

If you get a reputable bank to buy into the idea (of a BTC account) then you may have something - but if not then you are going to look like a MyBitcoin or even worse Bitcoin Savings and Trust (search for the whole pirate saga).


What about a credit union?

+1

What about storage facility's , they have onsite 24hour guards , these are not " banks" , but I do understand the financial trust aspect.
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July 10, 2013, 06:53:56 AM
 #14

If you want a "bank" then use a "bank" (rather than try to create some sort of pseudo-bank).

It is not easy to become a "bank" (at least in most western countries) so you will have the *trust* of the bank itself (although even western banks have gone belly up before).

If you get a reputable bank to buy into the idea (of a BTC account) then you may have something - but if not then you are going to look like a MyBitcoin or even worse Bitcoin Savings and Trust (search for the whole pirate saga).


What about a credit union?
How does that differ in practice?

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July 10, 2013, 07:15:27 AM
 #15

Maybe the trust of a bitcoin bank lies in price stability too and for now i can't imagine people loaning bitcoins from a bank. So why keep them at a bank when you can keep them on a usb stick or 5 to make sure you still got them if 1 fails.   

void
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July 10, 2013, 02:15:48 PM
Last edit: July 10, 2013, 02:29:34 PM by digitalindustry
 #16

Maybe the trust of a bitcoin bank lies in price stability too and for now i can't imagine people loaning bitcoins from a bank. So why keep them at a bank when you can keep them on a usb stick or 5 to make sure you still got them if 1 fails.    

the "Bank" does nothing more than the Ancient principal of a "Bank" , it protects the digital savings, but in a more advanced manner -


there is no loaning , well not in this conception , but in fact i couldn't see why there couldn't be.. , but there certainly couldn't be a Fractional reserve system, so a Loan would be at the "Banks" own risk.

then again - the market would determine that risk as well.



this is where a supportive government would come into play, as they would regulate policy that Loans could not be derived from savings as such and should be "At the risk" of the "Bank" itself, - if the Opt in user wishes to gain "interest" then they can "Opt in" to an access system which makes available say a % of the saving for loan at risk, and gain a modest amount of interest, this would likely offset some or all of the fees, but the main pricipal of the "Bank" would be to simply protect the Savings, there would be no "Big" "Money" like the Fractional Reserve system that exists now, where by new Legal Tender is "Loaned" into preexistence. - Debts will not be Assets, only the interest derived.    



price stability has nothing to do with it , that's the market , also who said this would just be Bitcoin ?

It would be any digital currency the market will want to store there , well at least that's what the free market would decide.

basically if :

1. it has Value .
2. people have enough quantity to care about that value.

they will

3. happily pay a small fee for the piece of mind to keep them there, and access them safely for spending transactions.


**
don't get me wrong this is the Future , not the present you are seeing - this is after the "West" has learned the lesson that it can not control the world and all its information , not least with "financial Assets" - the energy that is being drained is less and less every day as users Opt out of the system, this causes a "short" in the system if you like and it doesn't seem to take long before the whole entity stops conducting .

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July 10, 2013, 04:18:22 PM
 #17

Maybe the trust of a bitcoin bank lies in price stability too and for now i can't imagine people loaning bitcoins from a bank. So why keep them at a bank when you can keep them on a usb stick or 5 to make sure you still got them if 1 fails.    

the "Bank" does nothing more than the Ancient principal of a "Bank" , it protects the digital savings, but in a more advanced manner -


there is no loaning , well not in this conception , but in fact i couldn't see why there couldn't be.. , but there certainly couldn't be a Fractional reserve system, so a Loan would be at the "Banks" own risk.

then again - the market would determine that risk as well.



this is where a supportive government would come into play, as they would regulate policy that Loans could not be derived from savings as such and should be "At the risk" of the "Bank" itself, - if the Opt in user wishes to gain "interest" then they can "Opt in" to an access system which makes available say a % of the saving for loan at risk, and gain a modest amount of interest, this would likely offset some or all of the fees, but the main pricipal of the "Bank" would be to simply protect the Savings, there would be no "Big" "Money" like the Fractional Reserve system that exists now, where by new Legal Tender is "Loaned" into preexistence. - Debts will not be Assets, only the interest derived.    



price stability has nothing to do with it , that's the market , also who said this would just be Bitcoin ?

It would be any digital currency the market will want to store there , well at least that's what the free market would decide.

basically if :

1. it has Value .
2. people have enough quantity to care about that value.

they will

3. happily pay a small fee for the piece of mind to keep them there, and access them safely for spending transactions.


**
don't get me wrong this is the Future , not the present you are seeing - this is after the "West" has learned the lesson that it can not control the world and all its information , not least with "financial Assets" - the energy that is being drained is less and less every day as users Opt out of the system, this causes a "short" in the system if you like and it doesn't seem to take long before the whole entity stops conducting .
the price has to do everything. how can you loan 10 btc at 100$ and pay back 10 btc at 60$? it makes no sense Smiley why keep it at a bank? when you can keep it on a stick in a vault or something? what if something goes wrong and it happens like Greece? the goverment just says no to withdrawals? in the future this may happen but stiil there are even more issues that will arrise like anonimity. i must keep them at a bank where people know who i am so Bitcoin takes one straight in the face cause it suppose to support anonimity. corect me if i am wrong.

void
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July 10, 2013, 04:30:05 PM
Last edit: July 10, 2013, 04:42:48 PM by digitalindustry
 #18


 the price has to do everything. how can you loan 10 btc at 100$ and pay back 10 btc at 60$? it makes no sense Smiley why keep it at a bank? when you can keep it on a stick in a vault or something? what if something goes wrong and it happens like Greece? the goverment just says no to withdrawals? in the future this may happen but stiil there are even more issues that will arrise like anonimity. i must keep them at a bank where people know who i am so Bitcoin takes one straight in the face cause it suppose to support anonimity. corect me if i am wrong.

Look i know there is a lot of text there , but you should really read some of it if you are going to comment on the subject ?

I'm sorry for my writing manner , i wouldn't say I'm the most literate person in the world .

lets be clear:

  • The Banks primary purpose is not lending. sorry for calling it a "Bank" but that is the correct Latin derived English word
  • "on a Stick somewhere in a vault" - is too hard for 80% of the population, if you need to understand this point , do this , go to your Mother and explain the principals of Cryptocurrency now tell her to back up the wallet and Encrypt it.  
  • "something goes wrong and it happens like Greece" - seriously? these are free market institutions im talking about , i'm not explaining why Greece or Cyprus happened , but it can't happen with a Block Chain ok, just understand that .
ok hopefully I've corrected you .

yes you are basically "wrong" not wrong but misunderstood the writing.

**
anonymity is not the reality ok don't trust me , trust what the NSA say themselves , of course , come on we've all known this for years right? , you type here , you have no anonymity who cares , what? its Stasi land next , so what ? people stop crying about anonymity.

the world is heading and has been for about 15 20 years towards open source intelligence system  , when you know you are being monitored the monitoring becomes useless yes , you see? you understand?

because of course now , you might start a conversation with your NSA and Local country analyst, {i bet a lot of this has been happening of late} {i've been talking to my guys/guys girls for a long time} Hi : D

you might say stupid meaningless things that create noise and disrupt the process, you might joke and win them over with common sense  , because they KNOW its stupid.

you have to understand that trying to be Anon  to a Government that you are scared of is silly , stop being scared , they are silly, the worst they can do it kill you in a violent way. - that happened already. it didn't work then and its not going to in the future .

all it will do is accelerate the downward spiral of the society - because the globe has information relevant competitive force, everything you see happening is this downward spiral.

but just like a "Black" hole its a positive as well.

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July 10, 2013, 04:38:48 PM
 #19


 the price has to do everything. how can you loan 10 btc at 100$ and pay back 10 btc at 60$? it makes no sense Smiley why keep it at a bank? when you can keep it on a stick in a vault or something? what if something goes wrong and it happens like Greece? the goverment just says no to withdrawals? in the future this may happen but stiil there are even more issues that will arrise like anonimity. i must keep them at a bank where people know who i am so Bitcoin takes one straight in the face cause it suppose to support anonimity. corect me if i am wrong.

Look i know there is a lot of text there , but you should really read some of it if you are going to comment on the subject ?

I'm sorry for my writing manner , i wouldn't say I'm the most literate person in the world .

lets be clear:

  • The Banks primary purpose is not lending. sorry for calling it a "Bank" but that is the correct Latin derived English word
  • "on a Stick somewhere in a vault" - is too hard for 80% of the population, if you need to understand this point , do this , go to your Mother and explain the principals of Cryptocurrency now tell her to back up the wallet and Encrypt it.  
  • "something goes wrong and it happens like Greece" - seriously? these are free market institutions im talking about , i'm not explaining why Greece or Cyprus happened , but it can't happen with a Block Chain ok, just understand that .
ok maybe i`m not understanding your writing(i`m not nativ english) but how do you want to keep them. in wallet.dat with acces to a computer an external drive or? ...

ok hopefully I've corrected you .

yes you are basically "wrong" not wrong but misunderstood the writing.

void
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July 10, 2013, 05:04:31 PM
 #20

"ok maybe i`m not understanding your writing(i`m not nativ english) but how do you want to keep them. in wallet.dat with acces to a computer an external drive or? ..."


Device one

The "Vault" is device one , this device is inside the Bank , you have to have verification to Get in there etc.

The happy smiling assistants help you with this process - you bring in your  "On a stick somewhere" and you run it though the basic Mal-ware checks that have to occur - all of which are off line.

you access your  "Vault" with assistance if needed - but this "Vault" a Custom open source OS and very secure with in built protection , and is permanently offline .

you deposit Valuable savings here and know they are safe , whitout the worry of losing or having to back up Hard-drives or encrypt USB disks to lose -



ok



Device Two

While you are there you take the opportunity to recharge your "Wallet" another device essentially running a Custom OS with password encryption etc.  just like your key card. - you have a pin its that simple .

this is the thing you walk around with , and make purchases with - if cryptocurrency is fairly valuable in the future you will not need to keep a lot of currency on this device , enough for you to be comfortable with , but enough say for a 1 month or 2 months of spending etc.


. seeing it yet?   

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