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Author Topic: CoinPal beta - Buying bitcoins with PayPal  (Read 144226 times)
trentzb
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May 18, 2011, 03:41:04 PM
 #361

Uh... you may not need their consent, but in the majority of states, you DO need to notify them that you are recording the phone call.  It is inadmissible as evidence if you do not follow your local laws regarding this.

Agreed. And record yourself telling them that.

Sorry, I misspoke. You do NOT need to notify them that you are recording the phone call. I just rang PayPal to double check at 1-402-935-2050 and verified. They give you their consent at the beginning of the call, no need to notify or ask for consent. Listen carefully to their consent and make your own determination whether it could be provided as evidence in court. I would have no hesitation recording a call (and have many times) and presenting it in court if necessary (no need as of yet).

You gave your consent by calling them, they gave their consent at the beginning of the call. This IMO satisfies 2-party consent.
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May 18, 2011, 03:47:38 PM
 #362

Uh... you may not need their consent, but in the majority of states, you DO need to notify them that you are recording the phone call.  It is inadmissible as evidence if you do not follow your local laws regarding this.

Agreed. And record yourself telling them that.

Sorry, I misspoke. You do NOT need to notify them that you are recording the phone call. I just rang PayPal to double check at 1-402-935-2050 and verified. They give you their consent at the beginning of the call, no need to notify or ask for consent. Listen carefully to their consent and make your own determination whether it could be provided as evidence in court. I would have no hesitation recording a call (and have many times) and presenting it in court if necessary (no need as of yet).

You gave your consent by calling them, they gave their consent at the beginning of the call. This IMO satisfies 2-party consent.
Ah, I didn't realize they gave consent before you even asked for it.  Tongue  I would agree then, you shouldn't have to notify them of call recording if they explicitly state that it is ok for you to record their calls.
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May 18, 2011, 06:30:42 PM
 #363

Not to alarm you, but some people also found some withdrawals from their Paypal-linked account/CC after receiving those calls.
Something like: PAYPAL 4029357733 SGP.

Rather keep an eye over your accounting for a while, just in case.

Paypal is really getting desperate with bitcoin, isn't it?
EvanR
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May 18, 2011, 06:50:53 PM
 #364

So it's a scam?

Or paypal is stealing peoples money??
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May 18, 2011, 07:42:16 PM
 #365

Withdrawing via Virwox/Second Life still seems to work ok.  I would imagine going the other way would be safe as well.  Paypal has been doing business with Second Life for a long time, so it is unlikely that you would raise any red flags going that route.

I think I will no longer do any sort of direct bitcoin <-> Paypal transactions though.  All of these accounts getting frozen is making me rather averse to the idea.
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May 18, 2011, 09:12:04 PM
 #366

So it's a scam?

Or paypal is stealing peoples money??

Actually, according to the reports, it seams it's Paypal itself doing it. For "verification" (ripoff) purposes, I guess.
dr-mosfet
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May 18, 2011, 09:53:59 PM
 #367

Hi, I have been tiring to buy bitcoin with paypal and came across your site, and send Paypal a Email, asking if they allow buying bitcoin. the reply:
*************
I can assure you that there is no policy against the purchase of
BitCoins, however it is possible that BitCoin simply do not accept
payment through PayPal.
*************
The reply might mean that the front line that replys to this E-mails has no ideal what Bitcoin is?
if enough people sends them E-mail asking for Bitcoins, they might give it some weight in future decision.
I will attempt inform them of what a Bitcoin is.

By the way, sorry if some one posted a similar reply, a lot of people have a lot to say about this, and i can't read it all.
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May 18, 2011, 10:01:09 PM
 #368

Hi, I have been tiring to buy bitcoin with paypal and came across your site, and send Paypal a Email, asking if they allow buying bitcoin. the reply:
*************
I can assure you that there is no policy against the purchase of
BitCoins, however it is possible that BitCoin simply do not accept
payment through PayPal.
*************
The reply might mean that the front line that replys to this E-mails has no ideal what Bitcoin is?
if enough people sends them E-mail asking for Bitcoins, they might give it some weight in future decision.
I will attempt inform them of what a Bitcoin is.

By the way, sorry if some one posted a similar reply, a lot of people have a lot to say about this, and i can't read it all.
Interesting.  Care to post the full email here?  Definitely update on any future replies they come back with...

Discrepancies in what their employees tell us may force Paypal to outright announce that Bitcoin transactions aren't allowed.  It'd be good publicity.  Smiley
darbsllim
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May 25, 2011, 09:56:09 AM
 #369

You shouldn't wait to get involved in bitcoin projects! You have a great mind for what's needed and what people like!

 
I'm still very interested in Bitcoin and plan to continue working on Bitcoin projects.  The Bitcoin ecosystem can change a lot in a few months.  When that time comes, I'll see what needs can be met and go from there.


If you still have that anti-fraud software available, I'd love to talk to you about licensing it for some of my bitcoin projects to save us some time on that end.

Send me a PM!

Brad

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Meni Rosenfeld
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May 25, 2011, 10:14:42 AM
 #370

If you still have that anti-fraud software available, I'd love to talk to you about licensing it for some of my bitcoin projects to save us some time on that end.

Send me a PM!

Brad
You'll probably get a faster response sending him an email, see http://ndrix.com/ .

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cloud9
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May 30, 2011, 11:48:33 PM
 #371

mndrix: 

When selling BTC, you could maybe pursue becoming a merchant accepting Credit Card payments for BTC digital cryptographic key rights, and not process your credit card customer's purchases through Paypal. 

Then when you buy BTC digital cryptographic key rights, you could maybe still pay your sellers with paypal because of your good reputation with your BTC sellers - that you will not reverse any paypal payments.

BTC being anonymous is open to discussion, BTC being an e-currency and not maybe just plain digital cryptographic key rights is open to discussion.

Disclaimer:  Postings of Cloud9 are only individual views of opinion and/or musings and/or hypothesisses.  On a non-authoritative, peer-to-peer public forum, you do not need permission from Cloud9 to derive your own conclusions or opinions, so please do.  Calculations and assumptions to be verified.
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May 31, 2011, 02:05:41 AM
 #372

Pardon my ignorance, what exactly is a "BTC digital cryptographic key rights"?

(I dont always get new reply notifications, pls send a pm when you think it has happened)

Wanna gimme some BTC for any or no reason? 1FmvtS66LFh6ycrXDwKRQTexGJw4UWiqDX Smiley

The more you believe in Bitcoin, and the more you show you do to other people, the faster the real value will soar!

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May 31, 2011, 04:28:30 AM
 #373

Pardon my ignorance, what exactly is a "BTC digital cryptographic key rights"?

Rights to numbers in wallets as opposed to the value.

Proposal: http://forum.bitcoin.org/index.php?topic=11541.msg162881#msg162881
Inception: https://github.com/bitcoin/bitcoin/issues/296
Goal: http://forum.bitcoin.org/index.php?topic=12536.0
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May 31, 2011, 04:48:09 AM
 #374

you mean the private keys?

(I dont always get new reply notifications, pls send a pm when you think it has happened)

Wanna gimme some BTC for any or no reason? 1FmvtS66LFh6ycrXDwKRQTexGJw4UWiqDX Smiley

The more you believe in Bitcoin, and the more you show you do to other people, the faster the real value will soar!

Do you like mmmBananas?!
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May 31, 2011, 02:45:46 PM
 #375


This whole situation has reminded me once again why distributed, resilient systems like Bitcoin and OTC are so important.


I love this statement.

What name would you give to the smallest unit of bitcoin (0.00000001)? sat. What name would you give to 100 sats? bit. 1 bit = 1 uBTC. 1,000,000 bits = 1 BTC. It's bits
mndrix
Michael Hendricks
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October 27, 2011, 03:14:53 PM
 #376

PayPal thawed my account today (after 6 months).  My full PayPal balance is being transferred to my bank account.  I received two small chargebacks shortly after the freeze and none for the following 5.5 months.  Those chargebacks didn't materially affect the fraud rates I mentioned in April.

My plan is to bring back CoinCard within the next month or so (minus PayPal plus a couple other payment methods).  Once that's running smoothly again, I'll start implementing credit card payments on CoinPal.  I don't have a timeline, but I think my anti-fraud systems are up to the task.  I've kind of missed swimming with the sharks :-)
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October 27, 2011, 03:17:30 PM
 #377

I do believe AccessCoin beat you to the punch on the creditcard idea. Sad

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Meni Rosenfeld
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October 27, 2011, 03:59:02 PM
 #378

PayPal thawed my account today (after 6 months).  My full PayPal balance is being transferred to my bank account.  I received two small chargebacks shortly after the freeze and none for the following 5.5 months.  Those chargebacks didn't materially affect the fraud rates I mentioned in April.

My plan is to bring back CoinCard within the next month or so (minus PayPal plus a couple other payment methods).  Once that's running smoothly again, I'll start implementing credit card payments on CoinPal.  I don't have a timeline, but I think my anti-fraud systems are up to the task.  I've kind of missed swimming with the sharks :-)
Great news!

I do believe AccessCoin beat you to the punch on the creditcard idea. Sad
A service that charges 20% extra doesn't count.

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Michael Hendricks
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October 27, 2011, 06:04:40 PM
 #379

I do believe AccessCoin beat you to the punch on the creditcard idea. Sad
A service that charges 20% extra doesn't count.

MemoryDealers beat me too it also (via physical delivery).  As I understand it, AccessCoin uses Google Checkout whose ToS prohibit currency exchange.  I'm sure Google will be friendlier than PayPal was, so I wish AccessCoin the best of luck.

I don't want to promise a specific fee at this point, but I'll be disappointed with myself if it's above 10%.  High fees tend to discourage honest customers, leaving only the fraudulent ones using the service.
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October 27, 2011, 06:08:53 PM
 #380

I do believe AccessCoin beat you to the punch on the creditcard idea. Sad
A service that charges 20% extra doesn't count.

MemoryDealers beat me too it also (via physical delivery).  As I understand it, AccessCoin uses Google Checkout whose ToS prohibit currency exchange.  I'm sure Google will be friendlier than PayPal was, so I wish AccessCoin the best of luck.

I don't want to promise a specific fee at this point, but I'll be disappointed with myself if it's above 10%.  High fees tend to discourage honest customers, leaving only the fraudulent ones using the service.
I thought Google Checkout was friendly to digital currency?

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