I believe the price has nowhere to go but down and here's why I think so.

[cheesylard]

You see all these people saying how every year since its inception we have seen a 10 fold increase in Bitcoins price compared to USD.

The event during March of this year has pushed it into the media's spotlight, and now everybody and their grandmother knows about it. It's mainstream now. So why would it go up again? What other demographic could find out about bitcoin to create another spike?

Unless if western democracy collapses as we know it, the price of Bitcoin will steadily continue to go down, similarly to how Litcoins price spikes up and steadily goes down after every Mt. Gox rumor. It's happened before and it will happen again.

The other thing that could get bitcoin's price to go up is an actual, real, update to Bitcoin's software, like the scalability issues or shorter confirmations (none of this Litecoin bullshit where it's 4x as fast for a confirmation but 4x less secure). But we haven't seen a real update since its conception, and due to the nature of Bitcoin (decentralized) it's becoming harder and harder to update its software.

I honestly believe someone else is going to come up with a better crypto than BTC, the current infrastructure won't last.

I hope I'm wrong, though.

[1714851788]

1714851788

[1714851788]

1714851788

[1714851788]

1714851788

[01BTC10]

99.9% of my entourage and random street people don't know what is Bitcoin. We are far from mainstream.

[cheesylard]

99.9% of my entourage and random street people don't know what is Bitcoin. We are far from mainstream.

Have you literally walked down the street and asked random people if they knew what Bitcoin was and kept a tally?

[01BTC10]

99.9% of my entourage and random street people don't know what is Bitcoin. We are far from mainstream.

Have you literally walked down the street and asked random people if they knew what Bitcoin was and kept a tally?

I meet random people almost everyday and most of them have no idea what Bitcoin is.

[DeathAndTaxes]

99.9% of my entourage and random street people don't know what is Bitcoin. We are far from mainstream.

Have you literally walked down the street and asked random people if they knew what Bitcoin was and kept a tally?

I wear have had a t-shirt with the Bitcoin BTC on it (actually says "BTC or GTFO") .  I have been asked at least a couple dozen times "what is that?" and only had one person recognize it.  At least 50:1 if not more.  Not scientific but if you think Bitcoin is mainstream well you obviously have already made up your mind so facts don't really matter.  Bitcoin may be many thing and it may go down or it may even crash and burn but the idea that it is already mainstream is just silly.

[cheesylard]

I meet random people almost everyday and most of them have no idea what Bitcoin is.

Hm. Okay. It might have to do with the fact I live in the Silicon Valley, then. Almost everyone here knows what Bitcoin is

[CMMPro]

Everyone I know literally thinks I'm speaking a foreign language when I talk about bitcoin...I would say we are still the very early adopters.
I can't imagine what future lies in store for us if it ever goes "mainstream".  

[DeathAndTaxes]

I meet random people almost everyday and most of them have no idea what Bitcoin is.

Hm. Okay. It might have to do with the fact I live in the Silicon Valley, then. Almost everyone here knows what Bitcoin is

Almost everyone?  Bus driver, taxi cab driver, the waiter at Olive Garden, UPS guy, etc?  Or is "everyone" techno-nerds?

[01BTC10]

I meet random people almost everyday and most of them have no idea what Bitcoin is.

Hm. Okay. It might have to do with the fact I live in the Silicon Valley, then. I'm dumb.

Bitcoin got more attention from US media than Canadian one. Yesterday I spoke with 3 IT professional and none knew about Bitcoin.   

[cheesylard]

Almost everyone?  Bus driver, taxi cab driver, the waiter at Olive Garden, UPS guy, etc?  Or is "everyone" techno-nerds?

To be honest I asked younger people, mostly. Not necessarily techno nerds. It was at about 25%.

[ElectricMucus]

We're out of suckers.

[superduh]

Lol, did you think before you wrote all that

[XXthetimeisnowXX]

99.9% of my entourage and random street people don't know what is Bitcoin. We are far from mainstream.

Have you literally walked down the street and asked random people if they knew what Bitcoin was and kept a tally?

I wear have had a t-shirt with the Bitcoin BTC on it (actually says "BTC or GTFO") .  I have been asked at least a couple dozen times "what is that?" and only had one person recognize it.  At least 50:1 if not more.  Not scientific but if you think Bitcoin is mainstream well you obviously have already made up your mind so facts don't really matter.  Bitcoin may be many thing and it may go down or it may even crash and burn but the idea that it is already mainstream is just silly.

+1 haha me and my friend was having this discussion the other day...if BTC was mainstream or not. i said ok at the next big gathering we will ask. so me and him are at this party... i hate talking in front of large groups but i was drinking liquid courage so it was ok...I said "Ladies and gentlemen, can I please have your attention? I've just been handed an urgent and horrifying news story. I need all of you to stop what you're doing and listen. cannonba".... no wait i said "hi by a show of hands can i see who has herd of bitcoins?" or "BTC? for short?" or "altcoins" or "cybermoney" anybody? only my girl and his girl and him raised there hands....everyone else about 45 people were like what? what are you talking about? I said its money. they are like huh like what country? I told them no country but every country. its the currency of the future.

these people were not old farts they were not young tweens me and my friends are 25-33 the prime age for bitcoins. some own homes some are married. some own businesses and are quite successful. when i told them about it they were very impressed with how it was worth more than the dollar. one guy said ya when its more then the value of the USD then ill listen i told him it was worth about a hundred usd. hahaha. and once it was worth 2.50 when i bout them. and how i was buying them at 230. (yes i got lucky and not so lucky)

if your point is that they are on the downtrend do to saturation in the market your are a fool! if everyone in America purchased one bitcoin we would all be rich rich rich. that is why i think the Chinese government did not hush up that news report about bitcoins. if there people bout in low (now) and in a year or five when they do take off they will have gained some very rich people in there country due to others making them rich. ie the Americans because we did not buy in when they were so much lower. but that is another story.  

[cheesylard]

Lol, did you think before you wrote all that

I didn't even think while I was writing it, either.

[MoreFun]

99.9% of my entourage and random street people don't know what is Bitcoin. We are far from mainstream.

Have you literally walked down the street and asked random people if they knew what Bitcoin was and kept a tally?

I wear have had a t-shirt with the Bitcoin BTC on it (actually says "BTC or GTFO") .  I have been asked at least a couple dozen times "what is that?" and only had one person recognize it.  At least 50:1 if not more.  Not scientific but if you think Bitcoin is mainstream well you obviously have already made up your mind so facts don't really matter.  Bitcoin may be many thing and it may go down or it may even crash and burn but the idea that it is already mainstream is just silly.

if everyone in America purchased one bitcoin we would all be rich rich rich.

Can't and won't happen   300M > 21M

[codesuela]

i hope people finally give up their false hopes and the final capitulation happens so that we can move on. i can't take the permabulls anymore.

[solex]

i hope people finally give up their false hopes and the final capitulation happens so that we can move on. i can't take the permabulls anymore.

Translation: "I discovered Bitcoin when it was at $266 and desperately want it back down at $2.66 so I can fill my boots with them, and then miraculously it must go back to $266 without further delay."

[BitChick]

99.9% of my entourage and random street people don't know what is Bitcoin. We are far from mainstream.

Have you literally walked down the street and asked random people if they knew what Bitcoin was and kept a tally?

I wear have had a t-shirt with the Bitcoin BTC on it (actually says "BTC or GTFO") .  I have been asked at least a couple dozen times "what is that?" and only had one person recognize it.  At least 50:1 if not more.  Not scientific but if you think Bitcoin is mainstream well you obviously have already made up your mind so facts don't really matter.  Bitcoin may be many thing and it may go down or it may even crash and burn but the idea that it is already mainstream is just silly.

if everyone in America purchased one bitcoin we would all be rich rich rich.

Can't and won't happen   300M > 21M

YES.  This is true. Everyone in America Can't have one BTC, hence why the price has nowhere to go but UP.    (of course there may be bumps in the road on the journey upwards.)

[BitChick]

I meet random people almost everyday and most of them have no idea what Bitcoin is.

Hm. Okay. It might have to do with the fact I live in the Silicon Valley, then. Almost everyone here knows what Bitcoin is

Silicon Valley is probably a little more technical than some places.

Here is Southern California, which is pretty high-tech compared to many places in the world I would think, there is NO press in the papers, and NO ONE talks about it at all.  Thankfully my husband is an avid reader of Slashdot or we would still be in the dark about it.  None of my friends or family had ever heard of Bitcoin until I told them about it and none of them are that interested in buying any yet. They think it is "too risky."  Oh well.  If it does take off I will just have to hold my tongue.  Perhaps it would be wrong to say, "Well I told you to buy when it was $99."  That might be painful if and when the price goes up to $1000 or more!

[CMMPro]

i hope people finally give up their false hopes and the final capitulation happens so that we can move on. i can't take the permabulls anymore.

Translation: "I discovered Bitcoin when it was at $266 and desperately want it back down at $2.66 so I can fill my boots with them, and then miraculously it must go back to $266 without further delay."

Ok, that was funny. Still snickering to myself.

[notme]

99.9% of my entourage and random street people don't know what is Bitcoin. We are far from mainstream.

Have you literally walked down the street and asked random people if they knew what Bitcoin was and kept a tally?

I wear have had a t-shirt with the Bitcoin BTC on it (actually says "BTC or GTFO") .  I have been asked at least a couple dozen times "what is that?" and only had one person recognize it.  At least 50:1 if not more.  Not scientific but if you think Bitcoin is mainstream well you obviously have already made up your mind so facts don't really matter.  Bitcoin may be many thing and it may go down or it may even crash and burn but the idea that it is already mainstream is just silly.

if everyone in America purchased one bitcoin we would all be rich rich rich.

Can't and won't happen   300M > 21M

YES.  This is true. Everyone in America Can't have one BTC, hence why the price has nowhere to go but UP.    (of course there may be bumps in the road on the journey upwards.)

Can happen.  They can't all have one at once, but every American could purchase one bitcoin.  Money can circulate.

[BitPirate]

99.9% of my entourage and random street people don't know what is Bitcoin. We are far from mainstream.

Have you literally walked down the street and asked random people if they knew what Bitcoin was and kept a tally?

There was actually a survey a month or so ago. I think it was on Wired.... Do a search. The conclusion was that the majority do not know about Bitcoin. And that's just in the US.

[vokain]

99.9% of my entourage and random street people don't know what is Bitcoin. We are far from mainstream.

Have you literally walked down the street and asked random people if they knew what Bitcoin was and kept a tally?

There was actually a survey a month or so ago. I think it was on Wired.... Do a search. The conclusion was that the majority do not know about Bitcoin. And that's just in the US.

and we're purportedly the country with the greatest number of Bitcoin users, and I think Finland is by capita

[Anenome5]

Unless if western democracy collapses as we know it

I can only assume you haven't been paying attention We are in the death-throes / birth-pangs now. Look at Europe. Look at the '08 crash. Crises will begin to hit with increasing frequency until what stability remains fails. The dollar losing reserve currency status will happen at one point and be the likely coup de grace, and China will probably engineer it.

When the dollar crashes you know what will happen? People will flee into hard assets, just like the people in  Argentina are doing now.

And one of the most desirable hard assets at that point will be bitcoin.

Ever bought a house for one or a few bitcoin? There's a good chance you'll be able to do so within your lifetime if the US face fiscal crisis of dollar-crashing magnitude.

[Coinseeker]

Unless if western democracy collapses as we know it

I can only assume you haven't been paying attention We are in the death-throes / birth-pangs now. Look at Europe. Look at the '08 crash. Crises will begin to hit with increasing frequency until what stability remains fails. The dollar losing reserve currency status will happen at one point and be the likely coup de grace, and China will probably engineer it.

When the dollar crashes you know what will happen? People will flee into hard assets, just like the people in  Argentina are doing now.

And one of the most desirable hard assets at that point will be bitcoin.

Ever bought a house for one or a few bitcoin? There's a good chance you'll be able to do so within your lifetime if the US face fiscal crisis of dollar-crashing magnitude.

Absolutely delusional.  Please...exit all blogs, back away from the computer and go outside and get some sun.  

[Melbustus]

...
when i told them about it they were very impressed with how it was worth more than the dollar. one guy said ya when its more then the value of the USD ...

It's NOT worth more than the dollar. Total value of all dollars is many orders of magnitude greater than total value of all bitcoins (hopefully we'll close the gap).

People need to get it through their heads that "1 Bitcoin" is just an arbitrary grouping of 100,000,000 satoshis, or said another way, a name for the arbitrarily selected 0.000004762% of all bitcoin-money that will exist. If it'd been selected that the phrase "1 bitcoin" meant 100,000 satoshis in the initial codebase, then one dollar would buy 9 "full bitcoins" right now, but the total value of all bitcoins would be the same. It's JUST a naming convention.

By the same token that your weak-minded friend was impressed that "a bitcoin" is "worth more than the dollar", we have idiots on CNBC saying things like "it's crazy that people are actually willing to pay $100 for just one of these bitcoin things". WTF!! Why can't people understand divisibility and percentages?

Don't be part of the problem!

[Wagner2014]

...
when i told them about it they were very impressed with how it was worth more than the dollar. one guy said ya when its more then the value of the USD ...

It's NOT worth more than the dollar. Total value of all dollars is many orders of magnitude greater than total value of all bitcoins (hopefully we'll close the gap).

People need to get it through their heads that "1 Bitcoin" is just an arbitrary grouping of 100,000,000 satoshis, or said another way, a name for the arbitrarily selected 0.000004762% of all bitcoin-money that will exist. If it'd been selected that the phrase "1 bitcoin" meant 100,000 satoshis in the initial codebase, then one dollar would buy 9 "full bitcoins" right now, but the total value of all bitcoins would be the same. It's JUST a naming convention.

By the same token that your weak-minded friend was impressed that "a bitcoin" is "worth more than the dollar", we have idiots on CNBC saying things like "it's crazy that people are actually willing to pay $100 for just one of these bitcoin things". WTF!! Why can't people understand divisibility and percentages?

Don't be part of the problem!

[Anenome5]

Unless if western democracy collapses as we know it

I can only assume you haven't been paying attention We are in the death-throes / birth-pangs now. Look at Europe. Look at the '08 crash. Crises will begin to hit with increasing frequency until what stability remains fails. The dollar losing reserve currency status will happen at one point and be the likely coup de grace, and China will probably engineer it.

When the dollar crashes you know what will happen? People will flee into hard assets, just like the people in  Argentina are doing now.

And one of the most desirable hard assets at that point will be bitcoin.

Ever bought a house for one or a few bitcoin? There's a good chance you'll be able to do so within your lifetime if the US face fiscal crisis of dollar-crashing magnitude.

Absolutely delusional.  Please...exit all blogs, back away from the computer and go outside and get some sun.  

This is what a car-crash looks like when it's on the scale of an economy and political system the size of the US, it takes years, precipitates as various unforeseen crises. And what always results in the final crash is when the leadership in charge at the time of the crash seeks to alleviate a problem with a fix that either makes the problem worse (ie: the don't understand what caused the problem in the first place) or makes one of the other existing problems worse, resulting in systemic crisis and ultimately crash.

You look at someone like Bernanke and he's at least partially aware of the game. Even still he's inflating to all hell under political pressure and due to his Keynesian beliefs, without realizing that it is fiscal pumping that creates the very bubbles he's trying to avoid the down-sides of.

There is no avoiding the down-sides, only pushing them out further in time until they are unavoidable. The market is addicted to easy money, and when that policy ends, as it must, things will get very, very ugly.

QE cannot become the new normal, as some are saying it will be. QE99? It's a dream, peeps.

[ElectricMucus]

By the same token that your weak-minded friend was impressed that "a bitcoin" is "worth more than the dollar", we have idiots on CNBC saying things like "it's crazy that people are actually willing to pay $100 for just one of these bitcoin things". WTF!! Why can't people understand divisibility and percentages?

Don't be part of the problem!

Actually its more like why pay 100 Dollars for something that someone payed 1 Cent for three years ago?

Or worse why pay someone 100 Dollars for something that they bought for 1 Cent three years ago?
Of course that does only makes sense if you think there is someone who will pay you 10,000 Dollars in another three years.

Don't you be part of the problem.

[Melbustus]

By the same token that your weak-minded friend was impressed that "a bitcoin" is "worth more than the dollar", we have idiots on CNBC saying things like "it's crazy that people are actually willing to pay $100 for just one of these bitcoin things". WTF!! Why can't people understand divisibility and percentages?

Don't be part of the problem!

Actually its more like why pay 100 Dollars for something that someone payed 1 Cent for three years ago?

Or worse why pay someone 100 Dollars for something that they bought for 1 Cent three years ago?
Of course that does only makes sense if you think there is someone who will pay you 10,000 Dollars in another three years.

Don't you be part of the problem.

You again... You do KNOW you're wrong or that your points are irrelevant, right? Just in it for the argument? If so, that's cool. We should all be able to defend our points in detail and you do help people with that.

BUT - I feel like I shouldn't have to say the following:
What someone paid for an asset previously doesn't matter. Do you begrudge early Google employees who were issued stock when the company's valuation was in the low millions? Now that Google is 20,000x bigger, does the fact that someone, at some point in the past, paid a tiny fraction of current valuation impact the value that the buyer/holder is getting currently in any way? No. This is basic stuff and you know it.

[mnyonpa]

By the same token that your weak-minded friend was impressed that "a bitcoin" is "worth more than the dollar", we have idiots on CNBC saying things like "it's crazy that people are actually willing to pay $100 for just one of these bitcoin things". WTF!! Why can't people understand divisibility and percentages?

Don't be part of the problem!

Thank you, sir!

Also, here go LTC supporters with their “Look! LTC has more coins! How cool is that!”

[highcoin]

Out of the around 40 people I brought Bitcoin up to, only two people had seen something about it in the news, and I've only convinced one person to invest in Bitcoins. I brought it up in a community college class this week and not one person new what Bitcoin was. I explained what it was, they looked at me like I was crazy and it was awkward... So nowhere near what I'd call mainstream.

[Coinseeker]

Unless if western democracy collapses as we know it

I can only assume you haven't been paying attention We are in the death-throes / birth-pangs now. Look at Europe. Look at the '08 crash. Crises will begin to hit with increasing frequency until what stability remains fails. The dollar losing reserve currency status will happen at one point and be the likely coup de grace, and China will probably engineer it.

When the dollar crashes you know what will happen? People will flee into hard assets, just like the people in  Argentina are doing now.

And one of the most desirable hard assets at that point will be bitcoin.

Ever bought a house for one or a few bitcoin? There's a good chance you'll be able to do so within your lifetime if the US face fiscal crisis of dollar-crashing magnitude.

Absolutely delusional.  Please...exit all blogs, back away from the computer and go outside and get some sun.  

This is what a car-crash looks like when it's on the scale of an economy and political system the size of the US, it takes years, precipitates as various unforeseen crises. And what always results in the final crash is when the leadership in charge at the time of the crash seeks to alleviate a problem with a fix that either makes the problem worse (ie: the don't understand what caused the problem in the first place) or makes one of the other existing problems worse, resulting in systemic crisis and ultimately crash.

You look at someone like Bernanke and he's at least partially aware of the game. Even still he's inflating to all hell under political pressure and due to his Keynesian beliefs, without realizing that it is fiscal pumping that creates the very bubbles he's trying to avoid the down-sides of.

There is no avoiding the down-sides, only pushing them out further in time until they are unavoidable. The market is addicted to easy money, and when that policy ends, as it must, things will get very, very ugly.

QE cannot become the new normal, as some are saying it will be. QE99? It's a dream, peeps.

I see you failed to take my advice.   

[ElectricMucus]

By the same token that your weak-minded friend was impressed that "a bitcoin" is "worth more than the dollar", we have idiots on CNBC saying things like "it's crazy that people are actually willing to pay $100 for just one of these bitcoin things". WTF!! Why can't people understand divisibility and percentages?

Don't be part of the problem!

Actually its more like why pay 100 Dollars for something that someone payed 1 Cent for three years ago?

Or worse why pay someone 100 Dollars for something that they bought for 1 Cent three years ago?
Of course that does only makes sense if you think there is someone who will pay you 10,000 Dollars in another three years.

Don't you be part of the problem.

You again... You do KNOW you're wrong or that your points are irrelevant, right? Just in it for the argument? If so, that's cool. We should all be able to defend our points in detail and you do help people with that.

BUT - I feel like I shouldn't have to say the following:
What someone paid for an asset previously doesn't matter. Do you begrudge early Google employees who were issued stock when the company's valuation was in the low millions? Now that Google is 20,000x bigger, does the fact that someone, at some point in the past, paid a tiny fraction of current valuation impact the value that the buyer/holder is getting currently in any way? No. This is basic stuff and you know it.

Except GOOG did rise 700% not 1,000,000%. Is that your defense?
Because isn't not even wrong, it doesn't even make sense. You better get used to the argument, because it will be there till the end. If that does make you angry go push that orange button!

[Tzupy]

During the last month, every time the volume was so low, the price trend was slowly downwards, ending with a significant drop.
Maybe this time it will be different, but I doubt that. So I placed my buy order at 80.xx and am waiting.

[solex]

During the last month, every time the volume was so low, the price trend was slowly downwards, ending with a significant drop.
Maybe this time it will be different, but I doubt that. So I placed my buy order at 80.xx and am waiting.

Did you remember to buy when it was 70 a couple of weeks ago?

[Inedible]

By the same token that your weak-minded friend was impressed that "a bitcoin" is "worth more than the dollar", we have idiots on CNBC saying things like "it's crazy that people are actually willing to pay $100 for just one of these bitcoin things". WTF!! Why can't people understand divisibility and percentages?

Don't be part of the problem!

Actually its more like why pay 100 Dollars for something that someone payed 1 Cent for three years ago?

Or worse why pay someone 100 Dollars for something that they bought for 1 Cent three years ago?
Of course that does only makes sense if you think there is someone who will pay you 10,000 Dollars in another three years.

Don't you be part of the problem.

You're right - my aunt was telling me how houses used to cost around £3000 where she lived. These days the same ones are worth around £500,000.

I'll wait till houses go back down to £3000 before I buy again.

Thanks for the tip.

[Spider]

Of course it will go down. When all I see is people talking about buying Bitcoins, selling Bitcoins, getting rich...it'll only drain energy from this project. One should seek for ideas to use it the way it was designed for.

[phoenix1]

You're right - my aunt was telling me how houses used to cost around £3000 where she lived. These days the same ones are worth around £500,000.

I hope you told your aunt to mortgage her house and buy BTC. What could possibly go wrong 

[Inedible]

You're right - my aunt was telling me how houses used to cost around £3000 where she lived. These days the same ones are worth around £500,000.

I hope you told your aunt to mortgage her house and buy BTC. What could possibly go wrong 

No - I've told her to just wait until the price of Bitcoin goes back down to 1 cent.

Shouldn't be long now.

[phoenix1]

You're right - my aunt was telling me how houses used to cost around £3000 where she lived. These days the same ones are worth around £500,000.

I hope you told your aunt to mortgage her house and buy BTC. What could possibly go wrong 

No - I've told her to just wait until the price of Bitcoin goes back down to 1 cent.

Shouldn't be long now.

Lol 

[ElectricMucus]

By the same token that your weak-minded friend was impressed that "a bitcoin" is "worth more than the dollar", we have idiots on CNBC saying things like "it's crazy that people are actually willing to pay $100 for just one of these bitcoin things". WTF!! Why can't people understand divisibility and percentages?

Don't be part of the problem!

Actually its more like why pay 100 Dollars for something that someone payed 1 Cent for three years ago?

Or worse why pay someone 100 Dollars for something that they bought for 1 Cent three years ago?
Of course that does only makes sense if you think there is someone who will pay you 10,000 Dollars in another three years.

Don't you be part of the problem.

You're right - my aunt was telling me how houses used to cost around £3000 where she lived. These days the same ones are worth around £500,000.

I'll wait till houses go back down to £3000 before I buy again.

Thanks for the tip.

Are you seriously comparing inflation over decades resulting in 16 fold increase to the 3 years of Bitcoin evangelism resulting in a 1000 fold increase?

[Peter Lambert]

We're out of suckers.

We don't need suckers, just people who understand the benefits of using bitcoins.

By the same token that your weak-minded friend was impressed that "a bitcoin" is "worth more than the dollar", we have idiots on CNBC saying things like "it's crazy that people are actually willing to pay $100 for just one of these bitcoin things". WTF!! Why can't people understand divisibility and percentages?

Don't be part of the problem!

Actually its more like why pay 100 Dollars for something that someone payed 1 Cent for three years ago?

Or worse why pay someone 100 Dollars for something that they bought for 1 Cent three years ago?
Of course that does only makes sense if you think there is someone who will pay you 10,000 Dollars in another three years.

Don't you be part of the problem.

It doesn't matter what things cost in the past, just what they will cost in the future. Past performance does not gurantee future results.

[ElectricMucus]

We're out of suckers.

We don't need suckers, just people who understand the benefits of using bitcoins.

Those benefits are actually different than the Bitcoin gospel claims. And it has nothing to do with owning them, investing in them or anything by that matter.

[crumbs]

It doesn't matter what things cost in the past, just what they will cost in the future. Past performance does not gurantee future results.

Then why all the talk about Bitcoin's past performance?  No one is arguing that investing in Bitcoin turned out well for people in the past.  As you correctly pointed out, that doesn't begin to begin to imply that investing in Bitcoin is smart *now*.

[Peter Lambert]

It doesn't matter what things cost in the past, just what they will cost in the future. Past performance does not gurantee future results.

Then why all the talk about Bitcoin's past performance?  No one is arguing that investing in Bitcoin turned out well for people in the past.  As you correctly pointed out, that doesn't begin to begin to imply that investing in Bitcoin is smart *now*.

If you make an estimate of what the future price of bitcoin will be, then it might still make sense to buy bitcoins. Saying "They went up 10x every year in the past" is not a valid argument. Saying "They will be about the current price later" makes them a valid savings instrument, saying "They will grow another 10x because of such and such reasoning" makes them a valid investment instrument.

[ElectricMucus]

Here is a reason for you of why it won't happen:
In order to reach those levels it would require so much money that the only people who could bring it there are those who controlbenefit from the monetary system in the first place.
For Bitcoin the Winklevoss are the end of the road. Any more wealthy than that and they would stand more to lose than they can win.

[crumbs]

It doesn't matter what things cost in the past, just what they will cost in the future. Past performance does not gurantee future results.

Then why all the talk about Bitcoin's past performance?  No one is arguing that investing in Bitcoin turned out well for people in the past.  As you correctly pointed out, that doesn't begin to begin to imply that investing in Bitcoin is smart *now*.

If you make an estimate of what the future price of bitcoin will be, then it might still make sense to buy bitcoins. Saying "They went up 10x every year in the past" is not a valid argument. Saying "They will be about the current price later" makes them a valid savings instrument, saying "They will grow another 10x because of such and such reasoning" makes them a valid investment instrument.

Oh, in that case i agree.  If you posit that the price will remain the same as fiat_of_choice, then Bitcoin is just as good as that fiat from investor's perspective, and if a sound case could be made for Bitcoin value rising relative fiat_of_choice, it is a valid investment instrument.  Both pretty much by definition.  I think i misinterpreted what you were trying to say.

[Tzupy]

I see a buildup of buy orders as I write this, but the price is kind of stationary yet.
There is one guy with a 1,000 BTC buy order, he places it then withdraws it, with no chance to really buy.
Now he firmly placed it at 91.8 where he should be able to buy.
At this moment, a 10k dump would drive the price down to 88. Juicy target...
PS. this is on MtGox.
PS2. I am not interested in long term, I know that we are on the deflating side of a bubble.
But on short term, price can still go up, if someone really wants to buy now (for reasons I don't understand).

[Peter Lambert]

I see a buildup up buy orders as I write this, but the price is kind of stationary yet.
There is one guy with a 1,000 BTC buy order, he places it then withdraws it, with no chance to really buy.
Now he firmly placed it at 91.8 where he should be able to buy.
At this moment, a 10k dump would drive the price down to 88. Juicy target...

which exchange are you looking at? Does this type of analysis have any meaning for longer term price movements?

[smscotten]

I meet random people almost everyday and most of them have no idea what Bitcoin is.

Hm. Okay. It might have to do with the fact I live in the Silicon Valley, then. Almost everyone here knows what Bitcoin is

Might have something to do with the Bitcoin billboard on 880.

[NeedChangeNow]

99.9% of my entourage and random street people don't know what is Bitcoin. We are far from mainstream.

Have you literally walked down the street and asked random people if they knew what Bitcoin was and kept a tally?

I meet random people almost everyday and most of them have no idea what Bitcoin is.

Exactly. I ask every new person I meet if they've heard of bitcoin and so far, globally, there have only been TWO that heard of it before I told them... These two people had only heard of it and that's it. Beyond hearing of it, they knew nothing about it. This comes from someone who meets a lot of intelligent people from around the world on a regular basis.  

Although bitcoin has definitely risen in popularity, it is FAR from mainstream.

[BitPirate]

Here is a reason for you of why it won't happen:
In order to reach those levels it would require so much money that the only people who could bring it there are those who controlbenefit from the monetary system in the first place.
For Bitcoin the Winklevoss are the end of the road. Any more wealthy than that and they would stand more to lose than they can win.

This is utter tosh, even for you Mucus. Bitcoin success and traditional investment wealth are not mutually exclusive.

Failure of the traditional monetary system may spur success of Bitcoin, but the corollary is not true.

[BitChick]

Out of the around 40 people I brought Bitcoin up to, only two people had seen something about it in the news, and I've only convinced one person to invest in Bitcoins. I brought it up in a community college class this week and not one person new what Bitcoin was. I explained what it was, they looked at me like I was crazy and it was awkward... So nowhere near what I'd call mainstream.

I told my sister one BTC could perhaps be worth $10,000 or more and she was suddenly interested.    I think it is how we introduce it. Of course, I told her that they could be worth nothing someday too but that it was really a great think to gamble on.  The odds are that it could really take off.  I have had the awkward looks too. I really do not tell many people about BTC because of that.

Of course there will be people that think we are crazy but they will be the same ones that are telling everyone to buy them when they are over $1000 each. 

[XXthetimeisnowXX]

By the same token that your weak-minded friend was impressed that "a bitcoin" is "worth more than the dollar", we have idiots on CNBC saying things like "it's crazy that people are actually willing to pay $100 for just one of these bitcoin things". WTF!! Why can't people understand divisibility and percentages?

Don't be part of the problem!

Actually its more like why pay 100 Dollars for something that someone payed 1 Cent for three years ago?

Or worse why pay someone 100 Dollars for something that they bought for 1 Cent three years ago?
Of course that does only makes sense if you think there is someone who will pay you 10,000 Dollars in another three years.

Don't you be part of the problem.

You're right - my aunt was telling me how houses used to cost around £3000 where she lived. These days the same ones are worth around £500,000.

I'll wait till houses go back down to £3000 before I buy again.

Thanks for the tip.

bahahahahaha omg yes!!!! +1 +1 +1 +1 you know my dad bought a loaf of bread if the 50s for a quarter and so i think i will just starve to death till it goes down in value. I will not get ripped off!!!!!

oh man you guys don't be part of the problem.
 fools!!!!

[XXthetimeisnowXX]

are you guys being part of the problem. (nose in the air) im better than all of you and you are all part of the problem. if everyone would just see it MY way then everyone else would not be crazy.

hey you are you being part of the problem? no? good!!! cuz that would not be good!!! now I just need a badge and an official sounding name. lol

[pwi]

99.9% of my entourage and random street people don't know what is Bitcoin. We are far from mainstream.

Have you literally walked down the street and asked random people if they knew what Bitcoin was and kept a tally?

I have. We are far from mainstream. Despite all the cute ways to describe Bitcoin, the concept remains lost on most. Bitcoin has a great deal of potential; but outside of speculation, specialty marketplaces, and techy/nerdy/hardcore libertarians, Bitcoin is far from mainstream. My techie friends employed at places like Citrix, Microsoft, et al are relatively unfamiliar with Bitcoin. Your average would be user gets only the information espoused by the search engines - often related to black market trade. This turns many would be users off.

[superduh]

EM is the official daily King Troll

[ArticMine]

We are very far from mainstream, so far it is not even funny. Here is a simple calculation. Take the world M1 money supply approximately 20 Trillion in 2013 USD. Now take the percentage of GNU/Linux users on the desktop 1.28%. 1.28% of 20 Trillion is 256 Billion or 22379 USD per BTC. We have a very long way to go in order to reach the market penetration of GNU/Linux on the desktop.

Now realistically GNU/Linux on the desktop is itself very far from a mainstream operating system.

[XXthetimeisnowXX]

EM is the official daily King Troll

for some reason i can not read any of his posts....hum........ wonder why that is???







simple solution

[ElectricMucus]

EM is the official daily King Troll

Accusing me of trolling while ignoring the arguments I present still seems to be a popular tactic.

Here is a reason for you of why it won't happen:
In order to reach those levels it would require so much money that the only people who could bring it there are those who controlbenefit from the monetary system in the first place.
For Bitcoin the Winklevoss are the end of the road. Any more wealthy than that and they would stand more to lose than they can win.

This is utter tosh, even for you Mucus. Bitcoin success and traditional investment wealth are not mutually exclusive.

Failure of the traditional monetary system may spur success of Bitcoin, but the corollary is not true.

Interesting terminology, I've read it a couple of time and still don't get it.
Please elaborate.

If you are confused with my terminology as I am with yours:
My point is that people further down the line after the Winklevoss would have a smaller piece of the Pie than they had before since the rest of the cake has already been eaten.

[superduh]

Nice original thread here.  I think BTC will go higher.  It's likely some event will occur that makes BTC more widely known and from that point it can spread by word of mouth.  If someone's telling you about Bitcoin but everyone else you know has never heard of it youre likely to ignore it.  When it gets to the point where 1/15 people or more have heard of it, it can start to take off, everyone will want at least 1 whole Bitcoin which isn't going to happen, but can for the very early adopters or very wealthy.

by the time 1/15 people know about 1 btc would likely cost more than $10,000+

[Coinseeker]

Nice original thread here.  I think BTC will go higher.  It's likely some event will occur that makes BTC more widely known and from that point it can spread by word of mouth.  If someone's telling you about Bitcoin but everyone else you know has never heard of it youre likely to ignore it.  When it gets to the point where 1/15 people or more have heard of it, it can start to take off, everyone will want at least 1 whole Bitcoin which isn't going to happen, but can for the very early adopters or very wealthy.

by the time 1/15 people know about 1 btc would likely cost more than $10,000+

Seeing these $10.000+ comments never gets old.  On what planet are people going to pay $10,000/BTC.  Matter of fact, who's going to buy it all the way up to $10,000?  

To the thread title, I agree bitcoin is headed back down to the 50's but it can always go up just the same.  There's positive news in Africa, which could be huge and Argentina (as I was recently arguing about) is using BTC as a means to USD but we can't ignore that does increase exposure.  So to say there's nowhere to go but down, I think is fundamentally flawed based on the continued resilience of Bitcoin.  $10k? Dreaming...

[BitChick]

Nice original thread here.  I think BTC will go higher.  It's likely some event will occur that makes BTC more widely known and from that point it can spread by word of mouth.  If someone's telling you about Bitcoin but everyone else you know has never heard of it youre likely to ignore it.  When it gets to the point where 1/15 people or more have heard of it, it can start to take off, everyone will want at least 1 whole Bitcoin which isn't going to happen, but can for the very early adopters or very wealthy.

by the time 1/15 people know about 1 btc would likely cost more than $10,000+

Seeing these $10.000+ comments never gets old.  On what planet are people going to pay $10,000/BTC.  Matter of fact, who's going to buy it all the way up to $10,000?  

To the thread title, I agree bitcoin is headed back down to the 50's but it can always go up just the same.  There's positive news in Africa, which could be huge and Argentina (as I was recently arguing about) is using BTC as a means to USD but we can't ignore that does increase exposure.  So to say there's nowhere to go but down, I think is fundamentally flawed based on the continued resilience of Bitcoin.  $10k? Dreaming...

People will certainly not want to pay $10,000 for 1 BTC.  When the price approaches $1,000 BTC we will start to see BTC listed and sold in much smaller increments on trading platforms.  People will feel like they are purchasing 100 BTC but they will actually be purchasing 100ubtc or 100mbtc and they will be perfectly content to do so, especially if the price continues to rise.

[Walsoraj]

Coinseeker:

If I can push the price over 10,000$ by end of July, would you kindly lick my salty balls?

-Wals, ultranode^tm

[Coinseeker]

Nice original thread here.  I think BTC will go higher.  It's likely some event will occur that makes BTC more widely known and from that point it can spread by word of mouth.  If someone's telling you about Bitcoin but everyone else you know has never heard of it youre likely to ignore it.  When it gets to the point where 1/15 people or more have heard of it, it can start to take off, everyone will want at least 1 whole Bitcoin which isn't going to happen, but can for the very early adopters or very wealthy.

by the time 1/15 people know about 1 btc would likely cost more than $10,000+

Seeing these $10.000+ comments never gets old.  On what planet are people going to pay $10,000/BTC.  Matter of fact, who's going to buy it all the way up to $10,000?  

To the thread title, I agree bitcoin is headed back down to the 50's but it can always go up just the same.  There's positive news in Africa, which could be huge and Argentina (as I was recently arguing about) is using BTC as a means to USD but we can't ignore that does increase exposure.  So to say there's nowhere to go but down, I think is fundamentally flawed based on the continued resilience of Bitcoin.  $10k? Dreaming...

People will certainly not want to pay $10,000 for 1 BTC.  When the price approaches $1,000 BTC we will start to see BTC listed and sold in much smaller increments on trading platforms.  People will feel like they are purchasing 100 BTC but they will actually be purchasing 100ubtc or 100mbtc and they will be perfectly content to do so, especially if the price continues to rise.

That's a pipe dream.  People have been talking about BTC in mBTC and other variations for a long time and there is no consensus on the matter.  There is no reason to think that just because BTC hits $1000 that all of a sudden, there will be consensus. There are going to be those that want it and those that don't and with a stale mate, nothing will change.  Anything is possible of course, but I see no indication that such an agreement would manifest.  So assuming that is true, the question stands, how will BTC ever reach $10k?  Who is going to buy it up to $10k?  If there is no consensus, is it fair to say that it's very unlikely it will ever hit anything close to $10k?

[superduh]

Nice original thread here.  I think BTC will go higher.  It's likely some event will occur that makes BTC more widely known and from that point it can spread by word of mouth.  If someone's telling you about Bitcoin but everyone else you know has never heard of it youre likely to ignore it.  When it gets to the point where 1/15 people or more have heard of it, it can start to take off, everyone will want at least 1 whole Bitcoin which isn't going to happen, but can for the very early adopters or very wealthy.

by the time 1/15 people know about 1 btc would likely cost more than $10,000+

Seeing these $10.000+ comments never gets old.  On what planet are people going to pay $10,000/BTC.  Matter of fact, who's going to buy it all the way up to $10,000?  

To the thread title, I agree bitcoin is headed back down to the 50's but it can always go up just the same.  There's positive news in Africa, which could be huge and Argentina (as I was recently arguing about) is using BTC as a means to USD but we can't ignore that does increase exposure.  So to say there's nowhere to go but down, I think is fundamentally flawed based on the continued resilience of Bitcoin.  $10k? Dreaming...

baby troll (tm) - can you do basic math and 2+2 kind of problems?

[Anenome5]

So assuming that is true, the question stands, how will BTC ever reach $10k?  Who is going to buy it up to $10k?  If there is no consensus, is it fair to say that it's very unlikely it will ever hit anything close to $10k?

For btc to hit $10k there would have to be either sustained or immediate high demand. Which means something drastic in the world would have to change that was irreversible.

Btc won't hit $10k any time soon unless the ordinary financial systems continue to stumble. As long as the dollar and other fiats are 'good enough,' people won't feel the need to pay the cost of both learning a new system--a very alien system--and buying into the currency in the first place.

It's crisis that drove the creation of bitcoin and will drive adoption of bitcoin.

So really, all we have to do is wait, because fiat is always headed into crisis continually, and eventually crisis cannot be forestalled anymore.

All fiat currencies historically have eventually inflated to destruction. Don't think the US dollar will be any different. When social security started, something like 20 workers supported one retiree. Now that number is 3 workers to 1 retiree. And now they want to add obamacare to the load.

Because retiree benefits are hard-coded and the value of the dollar is not, the way you circumvent the requirement is to devalue the dollar.

They will borrow to make it happen, and when interest rates come up they'll be paying nearly $1 trillion a year just in debt service. And they'll borrow to pay the debt service. That's unsustainable.

The likely response to such a crisis will be to devalue the dollar further. They will imagine that because they've avoided raging inflation for the last 5 years now that they will always be able to avoid inflation no matter how much money they print. When this illusion comes down on their head then it may be the final crisis for the dollar.

Because when you devalue the dollar you aren't just stealing from American holders of dollars. You're also pissing off China, Japan, and Germany whom hold vast quantities of debt in dollars. And they may at some point decide to dump the dollar as reserve currency.

Oh yes, at some point inflation, and lots of it, is coming to the US, and gold will be largely unavailable, though people will try. Bitcoin will be one of the more available things and probably start to blow up.

If and when we see $10k plus, it'll be around then, when everyone is looking for an inflation hedge and everyone holding bitcoin knows they shouldn't be selling. Then it will take a lot of money to bring out the greed in a bitcoin holder, and then you'll see $10k and mainstream adoption.

It'll be years, but I'm confident we'll see it in our lifetime.

[kingcrimson]

Right now 111 bitcoins is worth $10,000 ... that is amazing. you can say, who would ever pay $10,000 for 111 bitcoins?
But it is happening right now every single day.
It is likely with the limited supply of bitcoin that the demand will skyrocket

[Peter Lambert]

Right now 111 bitcoins is worth $10,000 ... that is amazing. you can say, who would ever pay $10,000 for 111 bitcoins?
But it is happening right now every single day.
It is likely with the limited supply of bitcoin that the demand will skyrocket

+1

Ask "Who would pay $10 for 1 mB?" and the answer will be anybody who wants to buy a bit of bitcoin when the price is 10`000 USD per XBT on all the official foreign exchange platforms.

And saying that the price has to bought up by using millions of dollars is incorrect. If the consensus is that bitcoins should be priced at $10`000, then all the asks will move north of that number and just a few dollars will move the price up to there.

[Coinseeker]

<For btc to hit $10k there would have to be....snip>

There is so much fundamentally wrong with this post, I hardly know where to start...

First, crisis didn't drive Bitcoin, paranoia based in economic ignorance did,yet most of it was just simple greed.  

Second, if the USD collapses, and thats a big IF, the thought that people would run into Bitcoin to pay up to $10,000, defies logic. Why? If the dollar is collapsed, it's not worth anything.  You going to trade Bitcoins for a currency that's not worth anything?     I guess maybe someone would, because Bitcoin would likely be worth nothing as well.  Without fiat, there is no purpose for Bitcoin because people have no value to send to anyone.  

Things like food, cloths, shelter, deodorant, gasoline, chewing gum, etc...will ilkely be more valuable than some "internet play money".  It's amazing that people really think that the world economies will collapse but yet everyone will just continue on with thier lives, except they'll run and buy Bitcoin with all their fiat that's not worth anything, so they can send zero value back and forth to each other anonymously, because the prying eyes of a goverment that no longer exists, will want to regulate and tax the massive amounts of zero value transactions taking place.    

Third, ObamaCare reduces healthcare costs...might be a good idea to do some actual research instead of just regurgitating 4 year old talking points and supporting the greedy health insurance providers, by pushing their flawed and repeatedly disproven rhetoric.

Four, SSI does not contribute to the debt in any meaningful way, so yet another old and tired, false Fox news talking point.  In fact, if government would stop "borrowing" from it, given that it continues to run in surplus, you likely wouldn't even have this talking point.  Which was created to simply distract the simpletons from realizing the government has been stealing from the SSI surplus for years and they don't want to pay that money back so they try to convince everyone it's "unsustainable", "Better just get rid of it."

So, back to the original question.  Does anyone have any justification as to how Bitcoin is going to reach $10,000?  And I mean, something based in reality, not "internet libertarian" fantasy.

[xavier]

We've seen the speculators get flushed out, when the price moved down to $60

Now it's only strong hands holding bitcoin.

I don't see any downwards movements in the near future, unless there is a fundamental cause - ie. a problem with the blockchain or protocol, or a serious competitor

[desired_username]

We've seen the speculators get flushed out, when the price moved down to $60

Now it's only strong hands holding bitcoin.

I don't see any downwards movements in the near future, unless there is a fundamental cause - ie. a problem with the blockchain or protocol, or a serious competitor

Speculators will move in full swing when there's a significant drop.

[crumbs]

We've seen the speculators get flushed out, when the price moved down to $60

The smart/lucky ones bought in at the bottom, waiting to dump at a decent high/depth.  That's what speculators do -- buy low, sell high

Now it's only strong hands holding bitcoin.

You mean to say unlucky/lazy hands.  People invest to make, not lose money.

I don't see any downwards movements in the near future, unless there is a fundamental cause - ie. a problem with the blockchain or protocol, or a serious competitor

... or the thing responsible for crashes in the past -- *nothing*.

[semaforo]

   It does look like potential buyers are sitting back and waiting to see what happens. Perhaps there will be the capitulation some are talking about, perhaps Kipochi-Argentina-Iceland will take off.
   
   As for the $1 millibit, all we need to wait for to see it is the end of the petrodollar.

  The US is trying to get in the best possible position for when this happens. Swamped in dollar denominated debt and with the ability to devalue the dollar, what would you do? Make that debt cheaper.

   By issuing more debt internationally and buying up debt domestically, political support is secured at home and bond holders are left holding the short end of the stick. There is no intention to repay this debt. As with all sovereign defaults, it will be renegotiated at a hefty discount. Wars usually accompany these re-negotiations, with deal struck depending on the outcome of the war.

   Read about it in a book called "This time is different: 800 years of financial folly" written by some US treasury officials.

[Inedible]

By the same token that your weak-minded friend was impressed that "a bitcoin" is "worth more than the dollar", we have idiots on CNBC saying things like "it's crazy that people are actually willing to pay $100 for just one of these bitcoin things". WTF!! Why can't people understand divisibility and percentages?

Don't be part of the problem!

Actually its more like why pay 100 Dollars for something that someone payed 1 Cent for three years ago?

Or worse why pay someone 100 Dollars for something that they bought for 1 Cent three years ago?
Of course that does only makes sense if you think there is someone who will pay you 10,000 Dollars in another three years.

Don't you be part of the problem.

You're right - my aunt was telling me how houses used to cost around £3000 where she lived. These days the same ones are worth around £500,000.

I'll wait till houses go back down to £3000 before I buy again.

Thanks for the tip.

Are you seriously comparing inflation over decades resulting in 16 fold increase to the 3 years of Bitcoin evangelism resulting in a 1000 fold increase?

Are you saying the principle isn't the same?

[codesuela]

the blind optimism in this thread is sad and childish. bitcoin will never be worth 10000 usd. it is a pipe dream and you better let it go. bitcoin is supposed to be a currency not your personal lottery ticket. sadly beliefs like this are probably the reason why we are still close to the tripple digits as it keeps holders of big amounts of bitcoins from cashing out. the price of bitcoin is just reflects the current sentiment towards this pipe dream. Coinseeker is being called a troll and ignored for bringing a little bit of realism to bitcoin wonderland. if crypto currency will succeed bitcoin will be surpassed by something better. best case scenario is that there will be a perpetual stream of cryptocurrencies that never really break out into the mainstream similar to the centralized grey area currencies like perfect money, liqpay and liberty reserve. in any case i bet my left nut that 10k for one coin will never happen and it never should because value fluctuations are poison for a currency. but it is still early and bitcoin has been widely successful but we need people actually using it instead of the get rich quick crowd that hopes that bitcoin will enable them to comfortably retire in the near future.

[ElectricMucus]

By the same token that your weak-minded friend was impressed that "a bitcoin" is "worth more than the dollar", we have idiots on CNBC saying things like "it's crazy that people are actually willing to pay $100 for just one of these bitcoin things". WTF!! Why can't people understand divisibility and percentages?

Don't be part of the problem!

Actually its more like why pay 100 Dollars for something that someone payed 1 Cent for three years ago?

Or worse why pay someone 100 Dollars for something that they bought for 1 Cent three years ago?
Of course that does only makes sense if you think there is someone who will pay you 10,000 Dollars in another three years.

Don't you be part of the problem.

You're right - my aunt was telling me how houses used to cost around £3000 where she lived. These days the same ones are worth around £500,000.

I'll wait till houses go back down to £3000 before I buy again.

Thanks for the tip.

Are you seriously comparing inflation over decades resulting in 16 fold increase to the 3 years of Bitcoin evangelism resulting in a 1000 fold increase?

Are you saying the principle isn't the same?

Only if Scientology would have taken over the housing market.

Who knows was your aunt by chance living in Hubbarts neighborhood?

[smscotten]

The real value does not have to do with speculation. Speculation is about predicting the future real value. The real value has to do with it being used as a currency for goods, services, and savings.

Just taking the US into account (to make the numbers easier) if one of every hundred people in the US put one percent of their savings into Bitcoin—not counting any other uses—the exchange rate would have to be roughly $1000 per Bitcoin. We're a long way from that level of adoption but I think it shows that there is a long way up. In a utopian "Bitcoin becomes the one world currency" scenario, we'd have to add about eight more decimal places because one satoshi would be more than an upper-middle-class family earns in a year.

DISCLAIMER: all maths leading to these conclusions were done off the top of my head, and could be wrong by several orders of magnitude. Do the numbers yourself before repeating any such figures.

DISCLAIMER 2: I'm not claiming that these conditions will happen, I'm just saying that there is a lot of room for the value of BTC to increase. If those conditions don't come to pass (if large numbers of people don't start using Bitcoin for something other than speculation) Bitcoin could drop back below a dollar in a few years. There's no question that BTC is in a large speculative bubble—the question is whether the speculators are right and the actual trading value of BTC will eventually be tied to goods and services rather than speculators and fiat currency.

[smscotten]

a hundred dollars from 1930 have the buying power of 1000-7000 usd today. that is a 10-70x increase. of a currency that is used by the BIGGEST ECONOMY OF THE WORLD, world reserve currency etc. etc. issued by a country that went from underdog to world leader and superpower.
still not the roughly 110x increase deluded people hope for.

That's actually a 10-70x decrease in currency value. Invalid comparison. Just saying.

[freethink2013]

unless someone does something about making it easy for normal non-techy people to get bitcoin I agree with the doom in the op.

I can buy just about anything online with a credit card or paypal but try to buy bitcoin and it's suddenly a spanish inquisition and hoop after hoop to jump through.

[codesuela]

That's actually a 10-70x decrease in currency value. Invalid comparison. Just saying.

duh
you are totally right hence i withdraw that part of my argument...derp

[Anenome5]

Third, ObamaCare reduces healthcare costs...

You had me going until just then, lol. Such naivete.

[Coinseeker]

Third, ObamaCare reduces healthcare costs...

You had me going until just then, lol. Such naivete.

Such ignorance.  Wake up!

[smscotten]

Third, ObamaCare reduces healthcare costs...

You had me going until just then, lol. Such naivete.

Such ignorance.  Wake up!

Oh, now I get it. You hold stock in insurance and pharma, right? Yeah. ACA will be awesome for you.

[semaforo]

Third, ObamaCare reduces healthcare costs...

You had me going until just then, lol. Such naivete.

Such ignorance.  Wake up!

   I live in Europe and I would like an option to opt out of socialized medicine.

[semaforo]

the blind optimism in this thread is sad and childish. bitcoin will never be worth 10000 usd. it is a pipe dream and you better let it go. bitcoin is supposed to be a currency not your personal lottery ticket. sadly beliefs like this are probably the reason why we are still close to the tripple digits as it keeps holders of big amounts of bitcoins from cashing out. the price of bitcoin is just reflects the current sentiment towards this pipe dream. Coinseeker is being called a troll and ignored for bringing a little bit of realism to bitcoin wonderland. if crypto currency will succeed bitcoin will be surpassed by something better. best case scenario is that there will be a perpetual stream of cryptocurrencies that never really break out into the mainstream similar to the centralized grey area currencies like perfect money, liqpay and liberty reserve. in any case i bet my left nut that 10k for one coin will never happen and it never should because value fluctuations are poison for a currency. but it is still early and bitcoin has been widely successful but we need people actually using it instead of the get rich quick crowd that hopes that bitcoin will enable them to comfortably retire in the near future.

    There are thousands, if not millions, of absolutely plausible scenarios that could happen within the next decade which could drive the price for one bitcoin well above 10,000 USD. Admittedly, in many of these scenarios, the buying power of USD would be greatly decreased. In other words, we could see 10,000 USD bitcoin, but by that time 10,000 USD might be what a set of new tires costs.

      I do think that bitcoin reaching 10,000 dollars a coin and the buying power of the USD remianing steady is unlikely- if bitcoin starts to go mainstream fast it will only be because of widespread hyperinflation, which would lead to a flight out of dollars and devaluation. If bitcoin goes mainstream slow, it will be because of advantages as a payment system, and we won't see such a radical increase in terms of real purchasing power.

      I consistently hear people claiming that new and improved versions of bitcoin will come out. Why hasn't a better store of value than gold been found in thousands of years?

   A lot of people compare bitcoin's growth to the growth of the internet. They compare bitcoin to Netscape, saying it is the first, but better will come out. I say no way José, bitcoin is TCP/IP. After all, bitcoin is a protocol, not a program.

     Just adding to the diversity of opinions.

[crumbs]

... A lot of people compare bitcoin's growth to the growth of the internet. They compare bitcoin to Netscape, saying it is the first, but better will come out. I say no way José, bitcoin is TCP/IP. After all, bitcoin is a protocol, not a program.

Bitcoin or any bitcoin fork/alt, you mean

[ElectricMucus]

Bitcoin isn't a protocol, it's a prototype.

[Coinseeker]

Bitcoin isn't a protocol, it's a prototype.

+1

[semaforo]

Bitcoin isn't a protocol, it's a prototype.

   Please explain. A protocol is a set of rules. In the case, a procedure for sharing information. Value is information. If you use the blockchain, you adhere to the rules. Otherwise you are on your own blockchain. I will agree with you, bitcoin is also a prototype. So was/is tcp/ip.

     I am not a human. I am a composite of organic and inorganic materials. It's okay to dream, people.