Bitcoin Forum
December 04, 2016, 02:34:28 PM *
News: Latest stable version of Bitcoin Core: 0.13.1  [Torrent].
 
   Home   Help Search Donate Login Register  
Pages: [1] 2 »  All
  Print  
Author Topic: Whats so important to moving a decimal?  (Read 3127 times)
teflone
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 770


You're fat, because you dont have any pics on FB


View Profile
July 04, 2011, 07:36:23 PM
 #1

Why does everyone bitch and whine about moving it ?

I have NOT put much thought into it, but personally, who the f cares ?

Why would it help ? or hinder ?  or even matter?

For Canadians by Canadians: Canada's Bitcoin Community - https://www.coinforum.ca/
1480862068
Hero Member
*
Offline Offline

Posts: 1480862068

View Profile Personal Message (Offline)

Ignore
1480862068
Reply with quote  #2

1480862068
Report to moderator
Advertised sites are not endorsed by the Bitcoin Forum. They may be unsafe, untrustworthy, or illegal in your jurisdiction. Advertise here.
qwk
Donator
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1316


Bitcoin Foundation Member


View Profile WWW
July 04, 2011, 07:37:18 PM
 #2

I guess the guys with 10 BTC want to see 1000 BTC on their accounts.

Yeah, well... I'm gonna go build my own blockchain, with blackjack and hookers. In fact, forget the blockchain!
peach
Jr. Member
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 42


An intermediary stage in the breakdown of stars


View Profile
July 04, 2011, 07:38:05 PM
 #3

It's my suspicion that having 'one' Bitcoin in the same range as the USD, esp. when it is 1.5 to 1 usd, it will be more approachable to the common man. Of course decimal placement doesn't matter mathematically, but we're talking about psychology here.

DO IT
1ENhnpoUohq58A2xu5LxKejAeet9PxzrCg
teflone
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 770


You're fat, because you dont have any pics on FB


View Profile
July 04, 2011, 07:42:08 PM
 #4

It's my suspicion that having 'one' Bitcoin in the same range as the USD, esp. when it is 1.5 to 1 usd, it will be more approachable to the common man. Of course decimal placement doesn't matter mathematically, but we're talking about psychology here.

Now thats a good answer, and the only real reason I see for it..  or that remotely makes any sense

So its more about gain then ?  about  moving a decimal for existing coins on hand..  well that sounds greedy..

Hmmm

For Canadians by Canadians: Canada's Bitcoin Community - https://www.coinforum.ca/
peach
Jr. Member
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 42


An intermediary stage in the breakdown of stars


View Profile
July 04, 2011, 07:44:11 PM
 #5


So its more about gain then ?  about  moving a decimal for existing coins on hand..  well that sounds greedy..

Hmmm

 Roll Eyes

DO IT
1ENhnpoUohq58A2xu5LxKejAeet9PxzrCg
evoorhees
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 994


Democracy is the original 51% attack


View Profile
July 04, 2011, 07:49:16 PM
 #6

The point is simply this: as the value of btc climbs, there is a psychological (not rational) barrier to buying at "high prices." It's purely an irrational thing, but my guess is that we all suffer from it a bit. Something called a bitcoin that costs $50 sounds expensive. Something called a bitcoin that costs $5 sounds less so. I suppose there is also a somewhat rational argument that "common goods and services" priced around $1-$10 USD should be purchasable with single units of bitcoins, as opposed to fractions which are awkward for people.

So those people who advocate for this decimal shift are simply trying to minimize the psychological barrier to entry and the validity of that can be argued back and forth. I think it will be reasonable to move the decimal at some stage, but now is not the time. Stability and confidence are important now - no need to move decimals around when most people still think such a thing is inflation (it's not).



koin
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 874


View Profile
July 04, 2011, 08:36:55 PM
 #7

Why would it help ? or hinder ?  or even matter?

the numbers underneath should never change.

the presentation can change as needed.  you might want your client to display as millibitcoins, for instance, if that is what you are more comfortable with.

but at the protocol level, when you send 275 millibitcoins, i'm still getting 0.275 BTC.
just_someguy
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Activity: 125


View Profile
July 04, 2011, 09:04:51 PM
 #8

From a consumer psychology perspective the push to move the decimal confuses me.

People would much rather pay 0.017 for something than 1.70 even if the underlying value is the same.

Retailers go to great lengths to make prices appear small for a reason.
Sukrim
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1848


View Profile
July 04, 2011, 11:48:19 PM
 #9

People in the market section of this forum seem to (even with ~15 USD/BTC) stick to "even" prices, like 2 BTC or 1.50 BTC, even though it would make more sense to sometimes charge 1.869 or 1.507 BTC. Because of this I would also support the move to millibitcoins as used currency (21 million "full" BTC is an absurdely low number anyways to begin with and nearly every FAQ states that BTC can and will be divided in the future!). The future is now, let's move forward and move to mBitcoins to make sure prices are more accurate again.


Some other examples:
Nintendo Points
Microsoft xBox Points
Linden"Dollars"
WoW Gold (not actually sold by Blizzard, but anyways...)
and a multitude of other "internet/online/virtual" currencies are all worth (far) less than 1 USD for exactly this reason. A lot of them are not even splittable and have to be spent in the 100s to get a game or buy some virtual something.

For most of it's time, bitcoin was the same (the 10.000 BTC pizza was overpaid at it's time!) now it's no longer for just 2-3 months. Time to move the decimal back 3 or even 6 places (there would still be 2 places left for µBTC-cents in the current spec then, probably exactly for this reason!) and call the total amount of Bitcoin 21 Billion or Trillion.

https://bitfinex.com <-- leveraged trading of BTCUSD, LTCUSD and LTCBTC (long and short) - 10% discount on fees for the first 30 days with this refcode: x5K9YtL3Zb
Mail me at Bitmessage: BM-BbiHiVv5qh858ULsyRDtpRrG9WjXN3xf
sunyag
Jr. Member
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 30


View Profile
July 05, 2011, 01:50:30 AM
 #10

People in the market section of this forum seem to (even with ~15 USD/BTC) stick to "even" prices, like 2 BTC or 1.50 BTC, even though it would make more sense to sometimes charge 1.869 or 1.507 BTC. Because of this I would also support the move to millibitcoins as used currency (21 million "full" BTC is an absurdely low number anyways to begin with and nearly every FAQ states that BTC can and will be divided in the future!). The future is now, let's move forward and move to mBitcoins to make sure prices are more accurate again.


Some other examples:
Nintendo Points
Microsoft xBox Points
Linden"Dollars"
WoW Gold (not actually sold by Blizzard, but anyways...)
and a multitude of other "internet/online/virtual" currencies are all worth (far) less than 1 USD for exactly this reason. A lot of them are not even splittable and have to be spent in the 100s to get a game or buy some virtual something.

For most of it's time, bitcoin was the same (the 10.000 BTC pizza was overpaid at it's time!) now it's no longer for just 2-3 months. Time to move the decimal back 3 or even 6 places (there would still be 2 places left for µBTC-cents in the current spec then, probably exactly for this reason!) and call the total amount of Bitcoin 21 Billion or Trillion.


I quite agree Sukrim.

Personally, I think that no movement of the decimal makes Bitcoin look too expensive and a movement too far back makes it look ridiculous. This is very much psychology/perception that we are dealing with - and that is extremely important.

I believe, at this juncture, 3 decimal places makes the most sense. It suggests a very psychologically affordable buy-in for the average person. And it also reduces the angst for those who may feel threatened by a currency that has become "too powerful".

Bitcoin needs this time to breath and grow stronger. A three decimal place shift will facilitate more popular interest while (hopefully) dropping back down to a 'DEFCON 4 or 5' on the gubberments radar.


 




CNMOH
Jr. Member
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 56



View Profile
July 05, 2011, 01:53:05 AM
 #11

It's my suspicion that having 'one' Bitcoin in the same range as the USD, esp. when it is 1.5 to 1 usd, it will be more approachable to the common man. Of course decimal placement doesn't matter mathematically, but we're talking about psychology here.
Yes, because the "common man" is American!

bitsalame
Donator
Hero Member
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 616


Preaching the gospel of Satoshi


View Profile
July 05, 2011, 03:33:16 AM
 #12

It's my suspicion that having 'one' Bitcoin in the same range as the USD, esp. when it is 1.5 to 1 usd, it will be more approachable to the common man. Of course decimal placement doesn't matter mathematically, but we're talking about psychology here.
Yes, because the "common man" is American!

Of course! That's why aliens keep attacking the US and UFO's only crash in America.
CNMOH
Jr. Member
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 56



View Profile
July 05, 2011, 03:35:11 AM
 #13

It's my suspicion that having 'one' Bitcoin in the same range as the USD, esp. when it is 1.5 to 1 usd, it will be more approachable to the common man. Of course decimal placement doesn't matter mathematically, but we're talking about psychology here.
Yes, because the "common man" is American!

Of course! That's why aliens keep attacking the US and UFO's only crash in America.
Yeah, I feel so left out. I wanna get in on some of that probing action I hear all you Americans talking about.

sadpandatech
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 504



View Profile
July 05, 2011, 03:48:42 AM
 #14

Yeah, I feel so left out. I wanna get in on some of that probing action I hear all you Americans talking about.

Lol, I so want to make that my sig.. No probe for U!

On topic, why not this,
1 BitCoin = BTC = 1

1 Bitcent = BTc = .01  (to .99)

1 microBitCoin = mBTC = .0001 (to .0099)

1 microBitcent = mBTc = .000001 (to .000099)


Milli sounds so smalllll

If you're not excited by the idea of being an early adopter 'now', then you should come back in three or four years and either tell us "Told you it'd never work!" or join what should, by then, be a much more stable and easier-to-use system. - GA
It is being worked on by smart people. -DamienBlack
CNMOH
Jr. Member
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 56



View Profile
July 05, 2011, 03:49:57 AM
 #15

Lol, I so want to make that my sig.. No prob for U!
Go right ahead Cheesy

adamstgBit
Legendary
*
Offline Offline

Activity: 1904


Trusted Bitcoiner


View Profile WWW
July 05, 2011, 04:34:18 AM
 #16

I guess the guys with 10 BTC want to see 1000 BTC on their accounts.



i have currently 26.05 BTC in 10 years i hope my btc balance looks like
26.049998761
Tongue

Alex Beckenham
Full Member
***
Offline Offline

Activity: 154


View Profile
July 09, 2011, 02:57:40 AM
 #17

1 microBitCoin = mBTC = .0001 (to .0099)

1 mBTC = 0.001 (1/1000th)

sadpandatech
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 504



View Profile
July 09, 2011, 05:17:25 AM
 #18

1 microBitCoin = mBTC = .0001 (to .0099)

1 mBTC = 0.001 (1/1000th)



  lol, truely I know what a 1/1000th is.  But spanx you very much for making me think I went retarded for longer than I usually do whenever I attempt to think.  Grin
I went and edited my post only to remember there is a reason that I did it the way that I did.  I probably should have explained how I had come to those numbers but truely didn't think anyone would care to read it at the time.  My intention and the way I'd assume most people are used to spending their money is to where each divisible denomination has 100 of its lesser counterpart to make up a whole one. So we have 100 bitcents in a bitcoin, 100 microbitcoins in a bitcent and 100 microbitcents in a microbitcoin.  

  I know it seems corny now but when bitcoin does work and will have a much higher dollar value per bitcoin goods and services will be bought and sold for much smaller amounts of bitcoins. At which time it will be a much prettier format for a merchant to say they are selling some fuzzy, pink socks for 12mBTC instead of .0012 BTC.  At which time it is also safe to assume average Joe will not have to go to his client to type in or copy/paste some weird address and then type in .0012 either, since I know thats your next thought. He will likely have the payment address and amount from his shopping cart sent directly to his client for him to confirm. There the client will parse the decimals as well on the gui side to display 12mBTC or 12mBTC(.0012) for ease of Joe's processing it as accurate.  The exact formating of which could be played with I'm sure but I'll leave that to the marketing guys. While .0012 might not be too hard to comprehend and type into a client for every Joe I'd bet that as you had more 0's in between the decimal and the number it grows increasingly likely that some Joes would screw it up. Whereas Joe can definetly understand that 100 bitcents would make 1 whole bitcoin, etc etc.

Cheers




If you're not excited by the idea of being an early adopter 'now', then you should come back in three or four years and either tell us "Told you it'd never work!" or join what should, by then, be a much more stable and easier-to-use system. - GA
It is being worked on by smart people. -DamienBlack
Sannyasi
Sr. Member
****
Offline Offline

Activity: 455



View Profile WWW
July 09, 2011, 05:24:04 AM
 #19

it's relative- value won't change and neither would anything other than where the dot is- this applies to any currency, any argument on where the dot should be is ignorance

1DxP5iL6hN5Gd3cwmDz9uFSntW8ALBQaGK

http://gamerkeys.net/common/home.htm <- the best place to get games!

my portfoio: http://windowsofamind.com
BkkCoins
Hero Member
*****
Offline Offline

Activity: 784


firstbits:1MinerQ


View Profile WWW
July 09, 2011, 08:47:48 AM
 #20

Moving the decimal is just the same as a "stock split" in the stock market. Of course all people would own the same value but it would be represented differently. The idea being that psychologically it allows more agreeable pricing.

If you went back to early Microsoft days and counted the number of splits you would see that original shares would now be trading for huge sums, even far higher than Berkshire Hathaway does today. In the case of BitCoins the effect would be almost entirely irrational since there isn't the same 100 share block size that on the stock market limits small investor entry significantly.

(btw according to my quick check if no splits MSFT would be trading at $7747/share instead of $26.9 today - now say that wouldn't be a mental barrier to buying shares...)

When BitCoins end up trading at $1500 each I think people may prefer to trade in more round amounts than 0.00002143 BTC. for daily small trades. Moving the decimal reduces the friction to reaching such a trading price.

Pages: [1] 2 »  All
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Sponsored by , a Bitcoin-accepting VPN.
Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.19 | SMF © 2006-2009, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!