Possible to get refund from BFL? (paid via Bitcoin)

[Amitabh S]

Swim made a BFL order sometime in Apr/May 2013 for a single. Will (s)he be able to get a refund from BFL now? If yes, whats the process.

[A Meteorite]

No, not if you paid with Bitcoin. Your only recourse is to complain loudly to the FTC and attorney general. Or sue them. Or maybe if you make a big enough stink in this forum, you'll get a forced refund.

[rammy2k2]

Nope, u cant

[baloo_kiev]

The correct complaint destination is Attorney General Consumer Protection of Wyoming, right? Or can I send it to Kansas as well?

[k9quaint]

The correct complaint destination is Attorney General Consumer Protection of Wyoming, right? Or can I send it to Kansas as well?

AG of Kansas (where BFL is located), the AG of the state you live in, and file a complaint with the FTC.
Magistrate Judge Amos L. Mazzant of the U.S. Federal District Court just ruled that Bitcoin is indeed money, so you won't have any problems along those lines.

[baloo_kiev]

The correct complaint destination is Attorney General Consumer Protection of Wyoming, right? Or can I send it to Kansas as well?

AG of Kansas (where BFL is located), the AG of the state you live in, and file a complaint with the FTC.
Magistrate Judge Amos L. Mazzant of the U.S. Federal District Court just ruled that Bitcoin is indeed money, so you won't have any problems along those lines.

I actually thought Wyoming because BFL is registered there: https://www.kansas.gov/bess/flow/main?execution=e1s5

Current Entity Name   Business Entity ID Number
BF LABS INC.               4651691

Current Mailing Address: 5830 EAST 2ND STREET, CASPER, WY 82609 
Business Entity Type: FOREIGN FOR PROFIT
Date of Formation in Kansas: 09/26/2012
State of Organization: WY
Current Status: ACTIVE AND IN GOOD STANDING

Also, I'm a foreigner.

[goxed]

Which kind of lawyer can help me draft these letters? For e.g. divorce lawyers would be a bad option    

[baloo_kiev]

Which kind of lawyer can help me draft these letters? For e.g. divorce lawyers would be a bad option    

I believe you don't need a lawyer to file a complaint. Just fill the online form: https://ag.ks.gov/about-the-office/contact-us/file-a-complaint/consumer-investigation-request

[erk]

Swim made a BFL order sometime in Apr/May 2013 for a single. Will (s)he be able to get a refund from BFL now? If yes, whats the process.

Not a chance, the product was priced in $USD not bitcoin. If you paid via bitcoin then you used a 3rd party like Bitpay that converted your BTC to $USD at a spot price to pay BFL.

That said, you should be able to get a refund from BFL in USD.

[Flying Hellfish]

That said, you should be able to get a refund from BFL in USD.

Huh??

[baloo_kiev]

Not a chance, the product was priced in $USD not bitcoin. If you paid via bitcoin then you used a 3rd party like Bitpay that converted your BTC to $USD at a spot price to pay BFL.

That said, you should be able to get a refund from BFL in USD.

At this point, the problem is getting any refund at all. Those Scammerfly Labs claim that "all sales are final".

[erk]

Not a chance, the product was priced in $USD not bitcoin. If you paid via bitcoin then you used a 3rd party like Bitpay that converted your BTC to $USD at a spot price to pay BFL.

That said, you should be able to get a refund from BFL in USD.

At this point, the problem is getting any refund at all. Those Scammerfly Labs claim that "all sales are final".

BFL are in Kansas, which has strong consumer laws regarding refunds, "the all sales are final" clause can be safely ignored providing you lodge your complaint in Kansas.

[Flying Hellfish]

Not a chance, the product was priced in $USD not bitcoin. If you paid via bitcoin then you used a 3rd party like Bitpay that converted your BTC to $USD at a spot price to pay BFL.

That said, you should be able to get a refund from BFL in USD.

At this point, the problem is getting any refund at all. Those Scammerfly Labs claim that "all sales are final".

BFL are in Kansas, which has strong consumer laws regarding refunds, "the all sales are final" clause can be safely ignored providing you lodge your complaint in Kansas.

BFL has publicly stated they are not providing refunds anymore.  The only refunds that appear to be going through anymore are forced ones through PP or CC.  So its FTC/government or a lawyer at this point if you paid BTC.

[baloo_kiev]

Not a chance, the product was priced in $USD not bitcoin. If you paid via bitcoin then you used a 3rd party like Bitpay that converted your BTC to $USD at a spot price to pay BFL.

That said, you should be able to get a refund from BFL in USD.

At this point, the problem is getting any refund at all. Those Scammerfly Labs claim that "all sales are final".

BFL are in Kansas, which has strong consumer laws regarding refunds, "the all sales are final" clause can be safely ignored providing you lodge your complaint in Kansas.

Thank you.
I've requested a refund today and told them I am going to file a complaint to Attorney General if they start their "sales final" bullshit. Waiting for their reply.

[erk]

Not a chance, the product was priced in $USD not bitcoin. If you paid via bitcoin then you used a 3rd party like Bitpay that converted your BTC to $USD at a spot price to pay BFL.

That said, you should be able to get a refund from BFL in USD.

At this point, the problem is getting any refund at all. Those Scammerfly Labs claim that "all sales are final".

BFL are in Kansas, which has strong consumer laws regarding refunds, "the all sales are final" clause can be safely ignored providing you lodge your complaint in Kansas.

Thank you.
I've requested a refund today and told them I am going to file a complaint to Attorney General if they start their "sales final" bullshit. Waiting for their reply.

Make sure you explain that you haven't received the goods, as the status of refunds changes to a returns scenario once you receive the goods, which pretty much only covers defects.

[Phinnaeus Gage]

The correct complaint destination is Attorney General Consumer Protection of Wyoming, right? Or can I send it to Kansas as well?

AG of Kansas (where BFL is located), the AG of the state you live in, and file a complaint with the FTC.
Magistrate Judge Amos L. Mazzant of the U.S. Federal District Court just ruled that Bitcoin is indeed money, so you won't have any problems along those lines.

I actually thought Wyoming because BFL is registered there: https://www.kansas.gov/bess/flow/main?execution=e1s5

Current Entity Name   Business Entity ID Number
BF LABS INC.               4651691

Current Mailing Address: 5830 EAST 2ND STREET, CASPER, WY 82609 
Business Entity Type: FOREIGN FOR PROFIT
Date of Formation in Kansas: 09/26/2012
State of Organization: WY
Current Status: ACTIVE AND IN GOOD STANDING

Also, I'm a foreigner.

BF Labs Inc. is registered in Missouri: https://www.sos.mo.gov/BusinessEntity/soskb/Corp.asp?3402461

And in Kansas: https://www.kansas.gov/bess/flow/main?execution=e1s5

http://www.sos.ks.gov/CM_ServiceWM/displaydocuments.aspx?DocID=03331329

[Loredo]

Also, I'm a foreigner.

From your nick, I'm presuming you are a Ukrainian citizen.  The concept of "federation" you are familiar with -the present Russian Federation- for example, are at the same time much looser and much more rigid than the United States' federation.

Why the paradox? 

First, the states of the United States cannot leave the Federation.  The reason Abraham Lincoln is on Mount Rushmore, and on the US 1-cent coin is that he defined the doctrine that a state may not secede from the Union, and any attempt will be suppressed with the full force of the Union.  There are people who pertend and posture otherwise - as happened after Obama was re-elected, but that is the true fact.

Second, there is no distinction between the states in terms of application of federal law.  There is absolutely no restriction on movement of goods, services, or individuals, between states; no papers are required; borders are marked only with large billboards which say "Welcome to ___" (and spend money while you are here).   The only exceptions are, in some places, inspection of live animals, fruits or vegetables to reduce the chances of the spread of diseases.

What there is, however, is differences in business climate, state taxes on corporation and individuals between the states.  This means that both people and corporations will often choose "nominal" home states, and do business in other states.  That's what the Wyoming incorporation is about.

[jdebunt]

it's perfectly possible to get a BTC refund

Just contact their support asking to cancel your order, you'll get the refund within 3-4 days (or it was so for me atleast)

[baloo_kiev]

it's perfectly possible to get a BTC refund

Just contact their support asking to cancel your order, you'll get the refund within 3-4 days (or it was so for me atleast)

What were your payment and refund dates? Did they refund you with BTC or PayPal?

No reply for 3 days now.

[baloo_kiev]

www.ag.ks.gov/about-the-office/contact-us/success

Success!

Your Consumer Investigation Request Form has been submitted! A copy of the form has been sent to the email address given.

Thank you for filing with our office. Once your request is received, it will be processed by our office and reviewed by attorneys to determine how we can assist you. A case number and Investigator will be assigned. The Investigator will contact you and provided you with your case number in approximately 2 weeks from receiving your complaint. Also, please be aware that the business you are filing against will be contacted and given a chance to respond. Normal initial processing time is between 2-3 weeks, but an investigation could take several months. If you need assistance sooner, you may want to contact a private attorney.

And from BBB:

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Thank you for submitting your complaint to us.

The BBB that will process your complaint is:

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You will hear from this BBB soon regarding your complaint.