Alydian Announces 5/10TH Systems w/ 65nm Chip

[webjoe]

Curious to hear what you guys think about this recent announcement:

http://alydian.co/news/CoinLab-Announces-First-Incubator-Company

ALYDIAN IS FIRST LARGE-SCALE U.S. BITCOIN MINING COMPANY
August 7, 2013, PORTLAND, OR—CoinLab, the first venture-backed Bitcoin company in the U.S., officially launched its newest portfolio company, Alydian.  Alydian is the first to deliver turnkey at-scale Bitcoin mining solutions to customers.

“We are part of a transformation of Bitcoin mining,” said Hans Olsen, CEO of Alydian.  “Alydian has developed an enterprise-scale Bitcoin mining system over the past year and we are excited to announce our capabilities today. The system, based on our first generation 65 nm custom ASIC technology will enable non-technical customers to participate in terahash and petahash-scale Bitcoin mining without worry or technical expertise.  Alydian will begin at-scale operation and hosting in late August.”

Olsen, an industry semiconductor veteran and former CEO of Pixelworks, joins the CoinLab family, led by CEO, Peter Vessenes.  The two comprise a team of other accomplished and respected tech start-up experts drawn to CoinLab’s newest venture.  Alydian will serve as the first of multiple Bitcoin businesses developed internally at CoinLab.

“I am thrilled to have Hans here leading our newest venture,” said Peter Vessenes, CEO of CoinLab.  “Alydian is unique in the Bitcoin mining industry -- it was designed from the beginning to provide turnkey massive scale to customers. We’ve combined proven leadership, visionary strategy and great technologists. It’s going to be a great ride!”

Bitcoin mining turns silicon into money.  Bitcoins are algorithm-based mathematical constructs aggregated into blocks and traded on open global markets.  In order to successfully mine a block, which contains 25 bitcoins, one needs specialized computer setups constantly running the mining algorithm, a protocol designed to protect and secure the Bitcoin network.  Currently, there are roughly 11.5 bitcoins in circulation, 25 more are mined every 10 minutes, and there will be a total of 21 million bitcoins issued.  At time of press, Bitcoin traded around $105.

Alydian’s launch-day pricing was $65,000 per Terahash, a technical unit of capacity for Bitcoin miners. At time of press, each Terahash returned approximately $2,800 per day in earnings.

About Alydian
Alydian is a portfolio company of CoinLab, the first venture-backed Bitcoin company in the U.S. Alydian delivers enterprise-scale turnkey Bitcoin mining installations for qualified customers.

Send an E-Mail with ToutAlydian is hiring in our Portland office: jobs@alydian.co

About CoinLab
CoinLab, the first venture-funded Bitcoin company, is a Bitcoin business incubator that builds businesses that provide fundamental infrastructure for Bitcoin. Partnerships with top-tier industry executives in the fields of hardware, finance, payments and insurance make CoinLab a global leader in revitalizing existing industries. Join the Bitcoin Revolution.

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[Tsukene]

It's like $70 a GHs

[superduh]

confusing press release.
confusing "incubator" that offers no money or mentoring.
i should start such an incubator

[Loredo]

Once, just once, it would be nice to have someone come and not say to us:  "We're the biggest thing since sliced bread, and we'll be kicking it all off, in just two {weeks, months, shakes of lambs tail} or so."

Say and think what you want about Bill Gates, but when they rolled out Windows 95, he had the Rolling Stones there to sing "Start It Up," they clicked the button in the corner, and it did.

Maybe, someday soon...

[Bitcoinorama]

Once, just once, it would be nice to have someone come and not say to us:  "We're the biggest thing since sliced bread, and we'll be kicking it all off, in just two {weeks, months, shakes of lambs tail} or so."

Say and think what you want about Bill Gates, but when they rolled out Windows 95, he had the Rolling Stones there to sing "Start It Up," they clicked the button in the corner, and it did.

Maybe, someday soon...

I'm not being funny, but these days you'd definitely have to pre-order for the Rolling Stones!!

They do not come cheap.

[cypherdoc]

65 nm   

[Sitarow]

Once, just once, it would be nice to have someone come and not say to us:  "We're the biggest thing since sliced bread, and we'll be kicking it all off, in just two {weeks, months, shakes of lambs tail} or so."

Say and think what you want about Bill Gates, but when they rolled out Windows 95, he had the Rolling Stones there to sing "Start It Up," they clicked the button in the corner, and it did.

Maybe, someday soon...

I'm not being funny, but these days you'd definitely have to pre-order for the Rolling Stones!!

They do not come cheap.

I posted this in this thread.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=267552.msg2885140#msg2885140

The question is would it not be prudent to purchase BTC rather then use this service at this price?



The details below is for the advertised 10TH Aug option.

The following spreadsheet projects the network difficulty increase is constant at 20% or every 12 days and BTC value stays at $100USD each BTC.

That translates to less then 470BTC for the product "profitability".

[WastedLTC]

"
August Availability:

- 5TH/s: $350k
- 10TH/s: $650k
"

Well, won't have to wait long to see if this is true, but prices are out of control.   It should be cheaper per GH when purchasing this much juice but these prices are higher than most ASICs out there today.    

I don't understand, but we will see.

[Dalkore]

I am not sure if you picked up it but it looks like they just purchase a batch of Avalon or BFL Chips and are re-packaging them into a solution.  I am leaning towards Avalon.    If you buy a Avalon batch then you get 3 Th per batch.   Nothing suggests that this is there own chip. 

Thoughts?

[Korbman]

Alydian’s launch-day pricing was $65,000 per Terahash [...]

I wonder if they've gotten the memo that most other mining companies get around $10k (or less) per 1TH/s...or I could just buy from Bitfury or KnC and pay a fraction of what they're asking for the same speed.

I am not sure if you picked up it but it looks like they just purchase a batch of Avalon or BFL Chips and are re-packaging them into a solution.  I am leaning towards Avalon.    If you buy a Avalon batch then you get 3 Th per batch.   Nothing suggests that this is there own chip. 

Thoughts?

Could certainly be the case, and would also help explain their exorbitant pricing model. I'll have to give it another look and edit later.

[Dalkore]

Alydian’s launch-day pricing was $65,000 per Terahash [...]

I wonder if they've gotten the memo that most other mining companies get around $10k (or less) per 1TH/s...or I could just buy from Bitfury or KnC and pay a fraction of what they're asking for the same speed.

I am not sure if you picked up it but it looks like they just purchase a batch of Avalon or BFL Chips and are re-packaging them into a solution.  I am leaning towards Avalon.    If you buy a Avalon batch then you get 3 Th per batch.   Nothing suggests that this is there own chip. 

Thoughts?

Could certainly be the case, and would also help explain their exorbitant pricing model. I'll have to give it another look and edit later.

Yeah, it is funny that kind of stuff stands out to us so quickly.  How have you been Korbman?  You should add me to Skype so we can catch up.   

[CoinHoarder]

Everyone seems to be forgetting that they host the equipment for no extra costs. This saves a lot of $$$ on HVAC, power costs, and time spent. HVAC/power costs would cost a small fortune for a farm in the range of 5-10Th (especially if these are built on Avalon's power hungry chip design.)

Is 8% APY really that bad? I think it's quite nice considering they do all the work for you.

[Dalkore]

Everyone seems to be forgetting that they host the equipment for no extra costs. This saves a lot of $$$ on HVAC, power costs, and time spent. HVAC/power costs would cost a small fortune for a farm in the range of 5-10Th (especially if these are built on Avalon's power hungry chip design.)

Is 8% APY really that bad? I think it's quite nice considering they do all the work for you.

That is what I charge for hosting that includes all that as well.  CoinHoarder is absolutely correct about that.   I know what it takes to cool and power 5-10 Thash.   What I am saying is that what they are offering is just a nice package of existing ASIC options.  Nothing ground-breaking in the arena of their own chip.

[WastedLTC]

Everyone seems to be forgetting that they host the equipment for no extra costs. This saves a lot of $$$ on HVAC, power costs, and time spent. HVAC/power costs would cost a small fortune for a farm in the range of 5-10Th (especially if these are built on Avalon's power hungry chip design.)

Is 8% APY really that bad? I think it's quite nice considering they do all the work for you.

That is what I charge for hosting that includes all that as well.  CoinHoarder is absolutely correct about that.   I know what it takes to cool and power 5-10 Thash.   What I am saying is that what they are offering is just a nice package of existing ASIC options.  Nothing ground-breaking in the arena of their own chip.

That would make more sense (in regards to pricing) but on the flip side-- why would CoinLab fund that type of project right now.  Possible the deal has been in the works for months and was just a gamble.   It is clearly a bad decision to make today but not 6 months ago.

[Loredo]

Everyone seems to be forgetting that they host the equipment for no extra costs. This saves a lot of $$$ on HVAC, power costs, and time spent. HVAC/power costs would cost a small fortune for a farm in the range of 5-10Th (especially if these are built on Avalon's power hungry chip design.)

Is 8% APY really that bad? I think it's quite nice considering they do all the work for you.

Depends on your view of the flowback profile earned by 920GHps net power in a 300T-then-4-then-5-then... network compared to the 620 BTC you spend today for that turnkey solution, doesn't it?

[Paladin69]

That is retarded expensive.

[Ytterbium]

I am not sure if you picked up it but it looks like they just purchase a batch of Avalon or BFL Chips and are re-packaging them into a solution.  I am leaning towards Avalon.    If you buy a Avalon batch then you get 3 Th per batch.   Nothing suggests that this is there own chip. 

Thoughts?

They say they have a 65nm chip. Which would mean BFL.

Either way, their prices are totally fucking insane. If their hashing comes online immediately it might be a good deal, but $350k is a pretty huge investment.

If they already have their units online, they may simply be charging whatever it is they think will make them more profit over self-mining.  People are selling Avalon units for $100Btc.   If you have chips on hand, it only makes sense to sell them for more then what you'll get if you self-mine over the next few months.

[Korbman]

They say they have a 65nm chip. Which would mean BFL.

Either way, their prices are totally fucking insane. If their hashing comes online immediately it might be a good deal, but $350k is a pretty huge investment.

If they already have their units online, they may simply be charging whatever it is they think will make them more profit over self-mining.  People are selling Avalon units for $100Btc.   If you have chips on hand, it only makes sense to sell them for more then what you'll get if you self-mine over the next few months.

If they did end up getting a boatload of chips from BFL, the pricing starts to make sense...kinda...

Tying into CoinHoarder's post above:

Everyone seems to be forgetting that they host the equipment for no extra costs. This saves a lot of $$$ on HVAC, power costs, and time spent. HVAC/power costs would cost a small fortune for a farm in the range of 5-10Th (especially if these are built on Avalon's power hungry chip design.)

So let's say they bought BFL chips and didn't get any sort of bulk discount. To get up to 1TH/s, they'd need 250 chips, costing them $18,750 (not including shipping).

With that as a base cost, they'd still need to get the boards, custom casing (presumably), and cooling in place, which all that alone could double their cost. I have no idea how much these sort of things could cost since it's largely space / efficiency oriented, but let's call it $20k.
 
On top of that, the chips get 3.2 watts per GH/s...3200w for the 1TH/s. Let's shoot for a normal-(ish) $0.15 per kWh price (which would probably be quite high for a datacenter), which would put the cost per month at $345, or $4147 a year.

With that in mind, we're sitting on a cost of $42,897 per terahash per year as it is, not including labor/maintenance, insurance, etc. Throw in a 10% profit margin and I can see how we'd start to approach the $65,000 mark.

I wonder though...do they still charge you $65k per 1TH/s if you wanted to continue mining for another year? If so, then that's just massive profits for them.

[astutiumRob]

At time of press, each Terahash returned approximately $2,800 per day in earnings.

Kindergarden math would suggest that's wildly inaccurate....

1 block/10mins @ 25coins/block = 3600 coins/day
Network hashrate (now) = 343Th/s

So 1 Th/s (if existing not *adding* to the network) would expect to get 1/343 of 3600 coins/day = about 10 coins/day = about 1000$/day _right now_ with an ever decreasing amount as others add to the network

Some days are better than others (but it all evens out in the end) - a real example - 370Gh/s on 1/August received 4.13 coins, so scaling that to 1TH/s would have been 11.16 coins

[reactor]

But at the same time any estimation still relies on BTC price staying around $100USD as well as the difficulty increase going at a stable rate.  At latest count we have Cointerra, Hash Fast, Fash Hash, BFL, Avalon, AsicMiner, Labcoin, KNC, and Bitfury all shipping/going to be shipping before the end of the year. 

To place a $350k "bet" that this hosted mining will remain profitable is almost obscene, let alone reasonable.  If BTC value drops to $75 for the next year you'll never profit. 

This also poses some interesting questions as BTC can become a venue for pure investment, no interest in the network, technology, community, or possibilities at all, but another place for VC to dump money.  And if you remember the term "vulture capitalist" that became popular during the last US election season, the type of VC this could attract is that friendly one that dumps money into [industry], maximizes profits for a short period of time, then pulls out entirely and leaves a wasteland behind them, walking off with the profits.