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Author Topic: It is NOT secure to use hardware wallets (and it never was)  (Read 1698 times)
btcdevil
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April 29, 2018, 07:48:10 AM
 #141

From starting i was also against Hardware wallet, i am always referring to use electrum or mycelium desktop wallet as it dont need to backup the full node, just download the software and install it and backup the seed key and start using your bitcoin wallet. Only thing to secure is the seed key through which you can install the software anywhere and use your wallet.

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April 29, 2018, 09:34:32 AM
 #142

After 8 pages of debate, I'm still not sure what my takeaway is...

For someone who's not serious in crypto, just playing around in the exchanges with little money, is a hardware wallet worth it?

The questions becomes considerably more significant with larger amounts of money involved, for sure. But some of the solutions seem to just be facsimiles of banks and fiat monies - paper wallets, storing in safes, multiple layers of authenticities. Does this mean in the end, when there are clearer standards that we just revert to "banking systems" that are slightly more customer friendly?

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April 29, 2018, 10:06:57 AM
 #143

From starting i was also against Hardware wallet, i am always referring to use electrum or mycelium desktop wallet as it dont need to backup the full node, just download the software and install it and backup the seed key and start using your bitcoin wallet. Only thing to secure is the seed key through which you can install the software anywhere and use your wallet.

Everyone has the right to their own opinion and it is true that even hardware wallets are not perfect,but in terms of security hardware wallets are undoubtedly above desktop wallets.If you ask why,there is very simple answer-how many cases you know that hardware wallet is hacked and user is lost his coins(excluded wallets bought on E-bay/Amazon...)?And how many cases you can find that users lost coins in desktop wallets?You can find it very easily in hundreds of examples,fake desktop wallets are responsible for millions $ of stolen coins.

There is no 100% safe way to store coins,but every serious user should seek for best solution.

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April 29, 2018, 01:37:43 PM
 #144

Everyone has the right to their own opinion and it is true that even hardware wallets are not perfect,but in terms of security hardware wallets are undoubtedly above desktop wallets.If you ask why,there is very simple answer-how many cases you know that hardware wallet is hacked and user is lost his coins(excluded wallets bought on E-bay/Amazon...)?And how many cases you can find that users lost coins in desktop wallets?You can find it very easily in hundreds of examples,fake desktop wallets are responsible for millions $ of stolen coins.

There is no 100% safe way to store coins,but every serious user should seek for best solution.

Yeah, this topic title is a bit misleading. Hardware wallets are much safer than any desktop wallet. Hardware wallets are safe to use even on a computer that is infected with a malware. Hardware wallets are an airgapped enviroment on your desktop.

In the problem related to hardwallets mentioned above the hacker had physical access to the hardwallet.

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April 29, 2018, 02:06:58 PM
 #145

After 8 pages of debate, I'm still not sure what my takeaway is...

For someone who's not serious in crypto, just playing around in the exchanges with little money, is a hardware wallet worth it?

The questions becomes considerably more significant with larger amounts of money involved, for sure. But some of the solutions seem to just be facsimiles of banks and fiat monies - paper wallets, storing in safes, multiple layers of authenticities. Does this mean in the end, when there are clearer standards that we just revert to "banking systems" that are slightly more customer friendly?

A hardware wallet's worth to you might depend on how much crypto you own. If you won't lose sleep losing whatever you own in those exchanges, then you might not need a hardware wallet after all since it costs a considerable amount of money.
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April 29, 2018, 02:26:18 PM
 #146

I only use paper wallets, they do the job just as efficiently if not more.
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April 29, 2018, 10:46:02 PM
 #147

From starting i was also against Hardware wallet, i am always referring to use electrum or mycelium desktop wallet as it dont need to backup the full node, just download the software and install it and backup the seed key and start using your bitcoin wallet. Only thing to secure is the seed key through which you can install the software anywhere and use your wallet.
Until now, I didn't use a hardware wallet to save my bitcoin, I didn't like this idea because it's still risky to damage your wallet or to lose it. I agree that it's very good for security and save your BTC carefully without any worriying to lose them, but I don't like that. I just want to save my bitcoin in an online wallet or in a desktop wallet like Electrum wallet. It's too easy to manage and had a good secuirty.
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April 30, 2018, 09:11:36 AM
 #148

I have been warning people about hardware wallets for years. Bitcoin is the most personal store of value. Don't break it by using untrusted third party soft/hardware:

https://krebsonsecurity.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/03/ledgerattack.pdf

Worth mentioning, that the guy who found this exploit is 15 ys young.
Damn, my nano ledger is worthless then? Shocked
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April 30, 2018, 01:37:32 PM
 #149

I have been warning people about hardware wallets for years. Bitcoin is the most personal store of value. Don't break it by using untrusted third party soft/hardware:

https://krebsonsecurity.com/wp-content/uploads/2018/03/ledgerattack.pdf

Worth mentioning, that the guy who found this exploit is 15 ys young.
Damn, my nano ledger is worthless then? Shocked

Still secure enough for day today use, but I wouldn't trust it with big money.

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May 01, 2018, 05:12:26 AM
 #150

Damn, my nano ledger is worthless then? Shocked
No, the exploit has been patched as of firmware v1.4.1... (Note: current firmware is v1.4.2 which helps remove a couple of other theoretical attack vectors by forcing random starting numbers when entering PIN etc)

As far as I'm aware... there have been no known instances of this exploit "in the wild"... it was merely a "proof of concept" that was responsibly reported by the "15yr old kid" and was subsequently patched by Ledger.

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