Block Eupter USB August batch update

[k9quaint]

Months ago I paid 1 BTC each for 2 miners and 1 BTC in shipping to my country (I live in a technological wasteland called Australia), my miners are so far from ROI I can't express it in words.

Don't worry, bcp19 says BTC will go to $1000 and you will get "ROI".

Actually, worry. A lot. 

That statement is a lot like your long con, until it happens, you can discount it and discount it and discount it.  Up until it becomes true.  Which will come true first?  The supposed long con or BTC=$1000?  I bet the latter.

Captured for posterity purposes since bcp19 has been ninja editing his posts.

[Trillium]

Months ago I paid 1 BTC each for 2 miners and 1 BTC in shipping to my country (I live in a technological wasteland called Australia), my miners are so far from ROI I can't express it in words.

Don't worry, bcp19 says BTC will go to $1000 and you will get "ROI".

Actually, worry. A lot.  

Yeah, to be clear I did not buy them with any expectation of making ROI or 'lots of easy money' (like a lot of newbs seem to... geez). I got them because they are cute and amusing, and replace my existing graphics card setup* (300 watts for a HD5970 or 5 watts for two AM USB's?!). I considered modding them as per the overclocking thread but instead I ended up just sticking the cleaned up PCB onto a huge copper heatsink, which keeps em very cool but offers no other benefit.

*I was mining terracoin (SHA-256) at the time, so it seemed like a good idea. Now, not so much 

[bcp19]

Months ago I paid 1 BTC each for 2 miners and 1 BTC in shipping to my country (I live in a technological wasteland called Australia), my miners are so far from ROI I can't express it in words.

Don't worry, bcp19 says BTC will go to $1000 and you will get "ROI".

Actually, worry. A lot. 

That statement is a lot like your long con, until it happens, you can discount it and discount it and discount it.  Up until it becomes true.  Which will come true first?  The supposed long con or BTC=$1000?  I bet the latter.

Captured for posterity purposes since bcp19 has been ninja editing his posts.

Wow, more lies!  I'm having trust issues with you now.

[Trillium]

instead I ended up just sticking the cleaned up PCB onto a huge copper heatsink, which keeps em very cool but offers no other benefit

You're doing it with how many eruptors?
I have a spare heatsink, I might try, but I'm not sure it would fit 2-3 eruptors.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=241652.msg2793903#msg2793903

[bystander]

Months ago I paid 1 BTC each for 2 miners and 1 BTC in shipping to my country (I live in a technological wasteland called Australia), my miners are so far from ROI I can't express it in words.

AAAARRRRGGGGHHHH?

  That sums it up for me as well.  I paid friedcat 199BTC (when it  was $120/BTC) for 100 miners back in late May.  Let's just say, it's been a tough 12 weeks.   

[k9quaint]

Months ago I paid 1 BTC each for 2 miners and 1 BTC in shipping to my country (I live in a technological wasteland called Australia), my miners are so far from ROI I can't express it in words.

Don't worry, bcp19 says BTC will go to $1000 and you will get "ROI".

Actually, worry. A lot. 

That statement is a lot like your long con, until it happens, you can discount it and discount it and discount it.  Up until it becomes true.  Which will come true first?  The supposed long con or BTC=$1000?  I bet the latter.

Captured for posterity purposes since bcp19 has been ninja editing his posts.

Wow, more lies!  I'm having trust issues with you now.

Also captured for posterity in case he gets caught ninja editing again.

PSA:
If you have ordered from ButterFly Labs and have not yet received your product, you are entitled to a refund whenever you request one (per FTC rules).
First ask ButterFly Labs for a refund, they will probably say no but you might get lucky.
If you ordered via PayPal you can file a complaint with them even if you are outside the 45 day window. Multiple customers have already gotten a refund from PayPal that was outside the 45 days.
If you ordered via Bitcoin or Bank wire, you can fill out a complaint with the FTC at  http://www.ftc.gov/complaint and they will advocate for you with ButterFly Labs to get your refund. You can also contact the office of the Kansas Attorney General and inform them that you have had your money taken with no product delivered for months, just more promises.
You can also do a paper filing with the DA here: http://da.jocogov.org/complaint-forms

There are also several threads on how to get a refund from ButterFly Labs, here are two:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=266945.0
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=272585.0

[bcp19]

Months ago I paid 1 BTC each for 2 miners and 1 BTC in shipping to my country (I live in a technological wasteland called Australia), my miners are so far from ROI I can't express it in words.

Don't worry, bcp19 says BTC will go to $1000 and you will get "ROI".

Actually, worry. A lot. 

That statement is a lot like your long con, until it happens, you can discount it and discount it and discount it.  Up until it becomes true.  Which will come true first?  The supposed long con or BTC=$1000?  I bet the latter.

Captured for posterity purposes since bcp19 has been ninja editing his posts.

Wow, more lies!  I'm having trust issues with you now.

Also captured for posterity in case he gets caught ninja editing again.

Ther only edits I do is removing your cut and paste BS to try and clear up conversation.  I am beginning to think you are doing this on purpose to confuse people.  You cut and paste from 15 different threads, incoherently babble about things that have been patiently explained multiple times and downright obfuscate the remainder of your posts.  I'd ignore you if it wasn't so funny watching what you do next.

In addition, what am I supposed to have ninja edited? 

[k9quaint]

Months ago I paid 1 BTC each for 2 miners and 1 BTC in shipping to my country (I live in a technological wasteland called Australia), my miners are so far from ROI I can't express it in words.

Don't worry, bcp19 says BTC will go to $1000 and you will get "ROI".

Actually, worry. A lot. 

That statement is a lot like your long con, until it happens, you can discount it and discount it and discount it.  Up until it becomes true.  Which will come true first?  The supposed long con or BTC=$1000?  I bet the latter.

Captured for posterity purposes since bcp19 has been ninja editing his posts.

Wow, more lies!  I'm having trust issues with you now.

Also captured for posterity in case he gets caught ninja editing again.

Ther only edits I do is removing your cut and paste BS to try and clear up conversation.  I am beginning to think you are doing this on purpose to confuse people.  You cut and paste from 15 different threads, incoherently babble about things that have been patiently explained multiple times and downright obfuscate the remainder of your posts.  I'd ignore you if it wasn't so funny watching what you do next.

In addition, what am I supposed to have ninja edited? 

Also captured for posterity. Post contains no content except denials so:

If you have ordered from ButterFly Labs and have not yet received your product, you are entitled to a refund whenever you request one (per FTC rules).
First ask ButterFly Labs for a refund, they will probably say no but you might get lucky.
If you ordered via PayPal you can file a complaint with them even if you are outside the 45 day window. Multiple customers have already gotten a refund from PayPal that was outside the 45 days.
If you ordered via Bitcoin or Bank wire, you can fill out a complaint with the FTC at  http://www.ftc.gov/complaint and they will advocate for you with ButterFly Labs to get your refund. You can also contact the office of the Kansas Attorney General and inform them that you have had your money taken with no product delivered for months, just more promises.
You can also do a paper filing with the DA here: http://da.jocogov.org/complaint-forms

There are also several threads on how to get a refund from ButterFly Labs, here are two:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=266945.0
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=272585.0

[klondike_bar]

Also captured for posterity. Post contains no content except denials so:

If you have ordered from ButterFly Labs and have not yet received your product, you are entitled to a refund whenever you request one (per FTC rules).
First ask ButterFly Labs for a refund, they will probably say no but you might get lucky.
If you ordered via PayPal you can file a complaint with them even if you are outside the 45 day window. Multiple customers have already gotten a refund from PayPal that was outside the 45 days.
If you ordered via Bitcoin or Bank wire, you can fill out a complaint with the FTC at  http://www.ftc.gov/complaint and they will advocate for you with ButterFly Labs to get your refund. You can also contact the office of the Kansas Attorney General and inform them that you have had your money taken with no product delivered for months, just more promises.
You can also do a paper filing with the DA here: http://da.jocogov.org/complaint-forms

There are also several threads on how to get a refund from ButterFly Labs, here are two:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=266945.0
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=272585.0

cool down the threadjacking, BFL refunds are a totally different topic for one of 100 other threads

my 0.02btc : the new erupters look really cool, and i actually kind of want one   at least once they drop to 0.2BTC

[k9quaint]

Also captured for posterity. Post contains no content except denials so:

If you have ordered from ButterFly Labs and have not yet received your product, you are entitled to a refund whenever you request one (per FTC rules).
First ask ButterFly Labs for a refund, they will probably say no but you might get lucky.
If you ordered via PayPal you can file a complaint with them even if you are outside the 45 day window. Multiple customers have already gotten a refund from PayPal that was outside the 45 days.
If you ordered via Bitcoin or Bank wire, you can fill out a complaint with the FTC at  http://www.ftc.gov/complaint and they will advocate for you with ButterFly Labs to get your refund. You can also contact the office of the Kansas Attorney General and inform them that you have had your money taken with no product delivered for months, just more promises.
You can also do a paper filing with the DA here: http://da.jocogov.org/complaint-forms

There are also several threads on how to get a refund from ButterFly Labs, here are two:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=266945.0
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=272585.0

cool down the threadjacking, BFL refunds are a totally different topic for one of 100 other threads

my 0.02btc : the new erupters look really cool, and i actually kind of want one   at least once they drop to 0.2BTC

Good point. They do look cool. I would buy at 0.20 BTC.

[Twilight_Sparkle]

Damn, those look really good, and very shiny. Maybe I'll get one as an expensive paperweight .

[vayvanne]

I initially purchased one, for 0.99BTC. Then price dropped to 0.5 and I got discounted one for 0.1BTC with 7 more without discount.
While waiting the shipping of these, price dropped again to 0.4BTC. No discount at this time.

[bcp19]

Also captured for posterity. Post contains no content except denials so:

If you have ordered from ButterFly Labs and have not yet received your product, you are entitled to a refund whenever you request one (per FTC rules).
First ask ButterFly Labs for a refund, they will probably say no but you might get lucky.
If you ordered via PayPal you can file a complaint with them even if you are outside the 45 day window. Multiple customers have already gotten a refund from PayPal that was outside the 45 days.
If you ordered via Bitcoin or Bank wire, you can fill out a complaint with the FTC at  http://www.ftc.gov/complaint and they will advocate for you with ButterFly Labs to get your refund. You can also contact the office of the Kansas Attorney General and inform them that you have had your money taken with no product delivered for months, just more promises.
You can also do a paper filing with the DA here: http://da.jocogov.org/complaint-forms

There are also several threads on how to get a refund from ButterFly Labs, here are two:
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=266945.0
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=272585.0

cool down the threadjacking, BFL refunds are a totally different topic for one of 100 other threads

my 0.02btc : the new erupters look really cool, and i actually kind of want one   at least once they drop to 0.2BTC

Good point. They do look cool. I would buy at 0.20 BTC.

You already said you'd never buy anything for BTC that would not mine that amount of BTC.  That'll never mine .2 BTC. 

[baloo_kiev]

Besides [...] gaining ROI [...]

In criminal law, fraud is intentional deception made for personal gain or to damage another individual.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fraud

Welcome to scammers club, friedcat!

[BitCsByBit]

Besides [...] gaining ROI [...]

In criminal law, fraud is intentional deception made for personal gain or to damage another individual.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fraud

Welcome to scammers club, friedcat!

I often see ROI mentioned here on the forum when it comes to the mining devices and the expected return from them.

People seem to confuse the Return on Investment (ROI) and the Break-Even point (BEP)

ROI could be positive or negative.



Break-Even is the point at which cost or expenses and revenue are equal.

ALL mining devices will ROI, but a lot of them won't Break-Even.  


EDIT: I will be ordering a bunch of these and use them as presents to friends. They will be a great way to break the ice and get my friends intrigued with the Bitcoin world.   

[MCM-Mike]

I often see ROI mentioned here on the forum when it comes to the mining devices and the expected return from them.

Very good explanation, hope people with remember it and apply the right terms  

[Biomech]

They are neat,but as stated,it will take quite awhile to earn your money back...just so you know 

A while

You mean NEVER ! ==>

http://mining.thegenesisblock.com/a/52ea56f127

I don't know why op mentions ROI when you can't get ROI on them..

Ok, I'm missing something. I see lots of people talking about "never" making ROI on miners varying from these little toys up to 400 GH/s ASIC array devices. What timeframe are you people looking at? The ONLY reason I didn't preorder a KNC mining device is I was unable to raise the cash in time. Extrapolated over a year, difficulty would have to rise to close to a billion for me NOT to make a positive ROI. Not saying that necessarily applies to the USB block eruptor, which seems to me more of a novelty item, but still!

You want a good ROI in bitcoin? Start promoting it to folks who might use it as currency. The transactional end of things is sorely neglected at this juncture. In the long term, mining for bitcoins WILL CEASE. Then the only profits to be had from the network are transaction fees, and the coin itself rising in value against other currencies. THESE are the issues we should be focusing on, as if they are not addressed, Bitcoin will end when the last coin is mined.

If you're looking to make ROI in a day or two, you are better off going to vegas, where the odds are against you but the possibility exists. If you are interested in promoting the idea and ideology of Bitcoin, then a year or more to realize ROI is not egregious.

[Biomech]

They are neat,but as stated,it will take quite awhile to earn your money back...just so you know  

A while

You mean NEVER ! ==>

http://mining.thegenesisblock.com/a/52ea56f127

I don't know why op mentions ROI when you can't get ROI on them..

Ok, I'm missing something. I see lots of people talking about "never" making ROI on miners varying from these little toys up to 400 GH/s ASIC array devices. What timeframe are you people looking at? The ONLY reason I didn't preorder a KNC mining device is I was unable to raise the cash in time. Extrapolated over a year, difficulty would have to rise to close to a billion for me NOT to make a positive ROI. Not saying that necessarily applies to the USB block eruptor, which seems to me more of a novelty item, but still!

You want a good ROI in bitcoin? Start promoting it to folks who might use it as currency. The transactional end of things is sorely neglected at this juncture. In the long term, mining for bitcoins WILL CEASE. Then the only profits to be had from the network are transaction fees, and the coin itself rising in value against other currencies. THESE are the issues we should be focusing on, as if they are not addressed, Bitcoin will end when the last coin is mined.

If you're looking to make ROI in a day or two, you are better off going to vegas, where the odds are against you but the possibility exists. If you are interested in promoting the idea and ideology of Bitcoin, then a year or more to realize ROI is not egregious.

Good for you.

But for me IF you are in mining, the ROI is a part of the math.
Of course if you are just a hobbyst, an artist or a Blockchain protector (sic)...that's another story.

The problem here, is this device are overpriced.Clearly.No ROI.NEVER.Only for Friedcat.

When you say "Then the only profits to be had from the network are transaction fees"
Are you really thinking you will be still around in 2140 (source http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bitcoin) ? huu ?

Seems you can wait a little...



Learn about things before promoting them.

You missed my point. Or perhaps I wasn't explicit enough. I did kind of get sidetracked in that I feel quite strongly that too much emphasis is placed on mining and not enough on developing general acceptance of bitcoin as a viable transactional instrument.

What I am failing to understand is WHAT TIME FRAME are you (and the many others who are complaining) are you expecting to break even? I run calculations based on both optimistic and pessimistic numbers rather often, and it still seems that the bigger devices will break even in a few months on the worst end of the scale. That's pretty damn good. Better by orders of magnitude than you would expect from successful gold mining. What, if anything, am I missing? Or is this all just a quick scheme to get a quick buck to a lot of people? I tend to look at investments in the middle to long term, rather than tomorrow.

Oh, FWIW, I intend to live forever

EDIT: I failed to cover your other point. I agree fully that ASICMiner devices are vastly overpriced. They are not going to be the only game in town much longer, however. I view this particular device as a toy. I probably will buy one, if the price drops a bit more, just for the sake of the history of it. I wouldn't expect it to break even, but it's cool looking. The problem I'm seeing is people are saying the same thing about devices that very well should break even in a very reasonable amount of time even if difficulty increases by an order of magnitude or more.

[Lauda]

The shiny part is their only good attribute. 

[Biomech]

Yes i have your point Biomech.

For me...(and it's just a personnal vision) ROI around 6 month is okay.
6 more month to make some little profit.

Running at loss is a nonsense...better buying Coins directly.

But i agree with you...the "buy a ASIC = be rich" is over...quick ROI is over

Ok, six months I see as a reasonable time frame. On the low end of diff rise we are talking DAYS on some of the projected devices, so I failed to see the gripe. Six months is still pretty damn good. Thanks for clarifying that. My background is the restaurant business, where a positive ROI is often measured in decades, so this seemed a bit off to me.