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Author Topic: [2018-01-30] Samsung Enters `Mass Production` of ASIC Miners  (Read 546 times)
lotto-fan
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February 03, 2018, 02:57:29 AM
 #21

They finally realized it's a business for them, should they realize that a few years earlier, the market is all theirs.
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February 03, 2018, 05:03:42 AM
 #22

Dude, there is NO CORRELATION between price and difficulty period lol. Price got pumped last year due to hype and good news from media. That seems to have died down for now.

If there is a correlation, dash price needs to be 2-3 times higher than it is now due to the difficulty's phenominal rise. Antminer D3 will then make some significant profit instead of wat it is doing now.

Sorry to say that but you might be wrong here because there is some correlation between price and difficulty. It may indeed take some time to get established and revealed, especially when there are huge price swings in the short term. Nevertheless, if the price goes up in the long term, new miners will join the club, and the rise in difficulty will definitely follow after some adjustment period until profitability sets at some typical value.

On the other hand, when the price goes down, it becomes less profitable or just no longer profitable to mine for some or most miners, they fall off, and difficulty goes down too. Obviously, it is not as simple as it looks for there are a lot of factors at play here. Volatility is likely the most important one of them, which massively complicates the matter, but certainly not the only factor. Another likely factor is that miners may be mining at a loss for some time expecting the price to rise in the future.

Dude, there is no correlation. Tbat is just u thinking someone is looking out for u lol.

More miners = higher difficulty
Price has nothing to do with difficulty

And yes, while people are less likely to order when it is not profitable, bare in mind that miners are ordered 2-3 months in advance, no one calculates the total difficulty that all the miners will create, and the media sensationalizes mining which makes people juz buy...
So, more manufacturers means that every month, there are much more machines going online than when there were less manufacturers. And currently, it is already rising too fast.
Many D3 miners will probably never break even....

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mintedstone
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February 03, 2018, 06:31:24 AM
 #23

Samsung wants a quick cash in the domain, but I doubt how much market share they will get.

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Canis Majoris
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February 03, 2018, 08:35:04 AM
Last edit: February 03, 2018, 08:55:33 AM by Canis Majoris
Merited by bill gator (1)
 #24

Dude, there is NO CORRELATION between price and difficulty period lol. Price got pumped last year due to hype and good news from media. That seems to have died down for now.

If there is a correlation, dash price needs to be 2-3 times higher than it is now due to the difficulty's phenominal rise. Antminer D3 will then make some significant profit instead of wat it is doing now.

Sorry to say that but you might be wrong here because there is some correlation between price and difficulty. It may indeed take some time to get established and revealed, especially when there are huge price swings in the short term. Nevertheless, if the price goes up in the long term, new miners will join the club, and the rise in difficulty will definitely follow after some adjustment period until profitability sets at some typical value.

On the other hand, when the price goes down, it becomes less profitable or just no longer profitable to mine for some or most miners, they fall off, and difficulty goes down too. Obviously, it is not as simple as it looks for there are a lot of factors at play here. Volatility is likely the most important one of them, which massively complicates the matter, but certainly not the only factor. Another likely factor is that miners may be mining at a loss for some time expecting the price to rise in the future.

Dude, there is no correlation. Tbat is just u thinking someone is looking out for u lol.

More miners = higher difficulty
Price has nothing to do with difficulty

Price may have nothing to do with difficulty but difficulty definitely has everything to do with price. When will there be more miners - when the price rises or when the price falls long-term? Rising prices will undoubtedly increase profitability of mining at the current difficulty simply because the same number of coins mined will cost more, but if profits increase in some field or activity, they will invariably attract a lot of new players.

Therefore, the rise in Bitcoin prices will attract new miners and the rise in difficulty will follow as you say yourself. More miners means higher difficulty. Price is the cause and difficulty is the effect in this case but all causal relationships are necessarily statistically correlated, though the opposite is not always true, of course. It seems like you are looking at one side of the equation or in one direction only.
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February 03, 2018, 01:18:19 PM
 #25

Since it is profitable for miner, then we will expect more companies will enter this crypto space. More stable it will be for our txs.
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February 03, 2018, 03:21:34 PM
 #26

...we will expect more companies will enter this crypto space...
-snipped-

And here start the problems, more companies will get involved...more technology advancement...asic's 10th generation will see the light...in few years people will ask what's mean cpu/gpu mining?...
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February 03, 2018, 04:40:50 PM
 #27

I am really wondering why there is no so much competition on the manufacture of those mining equipment considering that the demand is so high. I am glad that Samsung is taking the Bitcoin industry seriously and is planning to be the number one supplier most especially to small miners worldwide. The bottomline is that with a healthy competition, we should expect the consumers or buyers to be greatly benefited. It is indeed about time that a big conglomerate enter into the Bitcoin mining scene dominated by you-know-who for a long time.

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February 03, 2018, 06:20:36 PM
 #28

Dude, there is NO CORRELATION between price and difficulty period lol. Price got pumped last year due to hype and good news from media. That seems to have died down for now.

If there is a correlation, dash price needs to be 2-3 times higher than it is now due to the difficulty's phenominal rise. Antminer D3 will then make some significant profit instead of wat it is doing now.

Sorry to say that but you might be wrong here because there is some correlation between price and difficulty. It may indeed take some time to get established and revealed, especially when there are huge price swings in the short term. Nevertheless, if the price goes up in the long term, new miners will join the club, and the rise in difficulty will definitely follow after some adjustment period until profitability sets at some typical value.

On the other hand, when the price goes down, it becomes less profitable or just no longer profitable to mine for some or most miners, they fall off, and difficulty goes down too. Obviously, it is not as simple as it looks for there are a lot of factors at play here. Volatility is likely the most important one of them, which massively complicates the matter, but certainly not the only factor. Another likely factor is that miners may be mining at a loss for some time expecting the price to rise in the future.

Dude, there is no correlation. Tbat is just u thinking someone is looking out for u lol.

More miners = higher difficulty
Price has nothing to do with difficulty

Price may have nothing to do with difficulty but difficulty definitely has everything to do with price. When will there be more miners - when the price rises or when the price falls long-term? Rising prices will undoubtedly increase profitability of mining at the current difficulty simply because the same number of coins mined will cost more, but if profits increase in some field or activity, they will invariably attract a lot of new players.

Therefore, the rise in Bitcoin prices will attract new miners and the rise in difficulty will follow as you say yourself. More miners means higher difficulty. Price is the cause and difficulty is the effect in this case but all causal relationships are necessarily statistically correlated, though the opposite is not always true, of course. It seems like you are looking at one side of the equation or in one direction only.

Dude, u are dead wrong. There is no relationship besides people checking mining profitability before a purchase. That doesnt affect much and is made alot WORSE when there are more manufacturers.

Look at dash mining. So many people using the antminer D3 will not break even. Bitmain is nice enough to give us coupons to help some. The most efficient dash miner via innosilicon is also a bad investment because it takes too long to break even for the cost. Dash price has risen about 100% in last 3 months and 200% in last 6 months and Bitmain has stopped selling the D3 and yet, it is bad. This is because there are TOO MANY miners since then.

Everyone looks at the profitability of the coin and orders the miners. The miners come 2 months later from 2 different manufacturers. The difficulty skyrockets when all the miners are online (2 months later) and people realize it will take many months to break even. The problem is that new more efficient miners appear before they can break even and thus, their miner is obsolete.

That is made worse when instead of ordering from 2 manufacturers, miners can now order from 3 manufacturers ....there will be MORE miners that suddenly appear after the 2 month delivery time because there are now MORE manufacturers selling more amounts of machines....




And as someone pointed out that while we buy miners at 1300-2300 USD, the manufacturers can create it at a fraction of the cost, under 1000 USD. There is nothing stopping them from just making more machines and mining it for themselves. Their breakeven is alot faster than any buyer. It is even possible that in future, only asic miner manufactures may be miners. At the moment, it looks unlikely though.

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February 04, 2018, 04:59:23 AM
 #29

I really think these are good news, because it king of shows that the interest in bitcoin is very much alive. Mining is a huge industry right now, and it's important to bitcoin. Good ASICS are usually made by the same dominant miners, so it's always good for a healthy competition. A lot of people complain about mining being centralized, so maybe this will open doors to new miners entering the market because maybe ASICs prices will drop, and it will be more profitable to mine bitcoin.

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Canis Majoris
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February 04, 2018, 01:19:08 PM
Last edit: February 04, 2018, 03:09:47 PM by Canis Majoris
Merited by bill gator (1)
 #30

Dude, there is NO CORRELATION between price and difficulty period lol. Price got pumped last year due to hype and good news from media. That seems to have died down for now.

If there is a correlation, dash price needs to be 2-3 times higher than it is now due to the difficulty's phenominal rise. Antminer D3 will then make some significant profit instead of wat it is doing now.

Sorry to say that but you might be wrong here because there is some correlation between price and difficulty. It may indeed take some time to get established and revealed, especially when there are huge price swings in the short term. Nevertheless, if the price goes up in the long term, new miners will join the club, and the rise in difficulty will definitely follow after some adjustment period until profitability sets at some typical value.

On the other hand, when the price goes down, it becomes less profitable or just no longer profitable to mine for some or most miners, they fall off, and difficulty goes down too. Obviously, it is not as simple as it looks for there are a lot of factors at play here. Volatility is likely the most important one of them, which massively complicates the matter, but certainly not the only factor. Another likely factor is that miners may be mining at a loss for some time expecting the price to rise in the future.

Dude, there is no correlation. Tbat is just u thinking someone is looking out for u lol.

More miners = higher difficulty
Price has nothing to do with difficulty

Price may have nothing to do with difficulty but difficulty definitely has everything to do with price. When will there be more miners - when the price rises or when the price falls long-term? Rising prices will undoubtedly increase profitability of mining at the current difficulty simply because the same number of coins mined will cost more, but if profits increase in some field or activity, they will invariably attract a lot of new players.

Therefore, the rise in Bitcoin prices will attract new miners and the rise in difficulty will follow as you say yourself. More miners means higher difficulty. Price is the cause and difficulty is the effect in this case but all causal relationships are necessarily statistically correlated, though the opposite is not always true, of course. It seems like you are looking at one side of the equation or in one direction only.

Dude, u are dead wrong. There is no relationship besides people checking mining profitability before a purchase. That doesnt affect much and is made alot WORSE when there are more manufacturers.

People checking mining profitability before a purchase is exactly how this correlation get established in practice. When they see that mining is profitable, they will buy mining equipment. But profitable is synonymous here with rising prices because the coins which miners receive simply start to cost more. So the higher the profitability the greater number of would-be miners are going to buy ASICs. But as you correctly pointed out yourself, more miners leads to higher difficulty. Thus the correlation between the price and mining difficulty is established.
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February 04, 2018, 02:09:33 PM
 #31

This can be a significant problem for those who use mining GPU. Network complexity will increase significantly and will make this method ineffective. The production capacity of Samsung is very great. They can significantly increase sales volumes of ASIC. This will cause a significant reduction in the profitability of mining. I think it's bad news.

Do you mean Samsung will build miners based on GPU, not ASIC?
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February 05, 2018, 08:29:43 PM
 #32

The best thing about this news being that these processors save up to 35% of the energy then conventional mining systems, which is great considering energy used by mining will increase as bitcoin price increases. Bitcoin computing is designed as such that computing becomes more difficult and consequently uses more power as traffic increases. This traffic will only increase as bitcoin price increases so a more wholesome solution has to be in pce other than this but for now this is okay.
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February 06, 2018, 05:59:55 AM
 #33

Samsung always invests too little in the Quality and Testing stage of the product development, so there is no guarantee their chips or miners will not be as buggy as their smartphones and laptops.
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February 06, 2018, 06:34:00 AM
 #34

They finally realized it's a business for them, should they realize that a few years earlier, the market is all theirs.

The timing? were they waiting for BTC to crash, the way it has now.?
With all their resources, and this is the best they can do.
Do they know something we don't.
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February 06, 2018, 02:09:35 PM
 #35

Quote
The timing? were they waiting for BTC to crash, the way it has now.?
With all their resources, and this is the best they can do.
Do they know something we don't.

omg you are too dramatic about this news clue to btc price correction, most investors consider it a short term correction and opprotunity to buy btc and alts at very low prices, but not a crash..
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February 07, 2018, 04:51:09 AM
 #36

Dude, there is NO CORRELATION between price and difficulty period lol. Price got pumped last year due to hype and good news from media. That seems to have died down for now.

If there is a correlation, dash price needs to be 2-3 times higher than it is now due to the difficulty's phenominal rise. Antminer D3 will then make some significant profit instead of wat it is doing now.

Sorry to say that but you might be wrong here because there is some correlation between price and difficulty. It may indeed take some time to get established and revealed, especially when there are huge price swings in the short term. Nevertheless, if the price goes up in the long term, new miners will join the club, and the rise in difficulty will definitely follow after some adjustment period until profitability sets at some typical value.

On the other hand, when the price goes down, it becomes less profitable or just no longer profitable to mine for some or most miners, they fall off, and difficulty goes down too. Obviously, it is not as simple as it looks for there are a lot of factors at play here. Volatility is likely the most important one of them, which massively complicates the matter, but certainly not the only factor. Another likely factor is that miners may be mining at a loss for some time expecting the price to rise in the future.

Dude, there is no correlation. Tbat is just u thinking someone is looking out for u lol.

More miners = higher difficulty
Price has nothing to do with difficulty

Price may have nothing to do with difficulty but difficulty definitely has everything to do with price. When will there be more miners - when the price rises or when the price falls long-term? Rising prices will undoubtedly increase profitability of mining at the current difficulty simply because the same number of coins mined will cost more, but if profits increase in some field or activity, they will invariably attract a lot of new players.

Therefore, the rise in Bitcoin prices will attract new miners and the rise in difficulty will follow as you say yourself. More miners means higher difficulty. Price is the cause and difficulty is the effect in this case but all causal relationships are necessarily statistically correlated, though the opposite is not always true, of course. It seems like you are looking at one side of the equation or in one direction only.

Dude, u are dead wrong. There is no relationship besides people checking mining profitability before a purchase. That doesnt affect much and is made alot WORSE when there are more manufacturers.

People checking mining profitability before a purchase is exactly how this correlation get established in practice. When they see that mining is profitable, they will buy mining equipment. But profitable is synonymous here with rising prices because the coins which miners receive simply start to cost more. So the higher the profitability the greater number of would-be miners are going to buy ASICs. But as you correctly pointed out yourself, more miners leads to higher difficulty. Thus the correlation between the price and mining difficulty is established.

That isnt anywhere near good enough to be called correlation because we dont know how many miners get shipped and there is a 2 month window before the machines arrive. Furthermore, there will be alottt more machines shipped when there are more manufacturers. Samsung may very well make a loss here but it isnt a big deal to them since they are huge.

For example many new miners ordered units 1-2 months back when profits were farrr higher, around 5-8 times higher and now, when they get their machine, the proditability is a hell lot lower. Thus, there is no real correlation considering how huge the difference is....

And seeing how btc price went down unexpectedly, dont expect last year 10x price increase to surely occur juz because it did last year. That kept mining alive last year. Btc is very unlikely to shoot up that much this year lol

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February 07, 2018, 04:54:57 AM
 #37

This can be a significant problem for those who use mining GPU. Network complexity will increase significantly and will make this method ineffective. The production capacity of Samsung is very great. They can significantly increase sales volumes of ASIC. This will cause a significant reduction in the profitability of mining. I think it's bad news.

Do you mean Samsung will build miners based on GPU, not ASIC?

I dont know but chances are, it will be asic.

I dont know if quality will be good. One of their note phones did explode after all lol

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February 07, 2018, 11:19:56 AM
 #38

Samsung enters bitcoin mining industry with new mining hardware. It is targeting the lucrative chinese market with its ASIC chips.
https://www.cointarot.com/general-news/samsung-enters-bitcoin-mining-industry/
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February 07, 2018, 12:34:00 PM
 #39

This cant be bad news for bitcoin, the more competition on creating mining hardware should be always good for all. Forget about all those problems that i'm reading in this thread about mining difficulty etc etc, there will be always similar problems for all, you should focus on the fact that bitcoin is growing up, that's all.

...And here start the problems, more companies will get involved...more technology advancement...asic's 10th generation will see the light...in few years people will ask what's mean cpu/gpu mining?...

keep in mind that nobody can not stop it, so let's hope that "problem" bring us good things at all... Wink
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February 07, 2018, 03:57:50 PM
Merited by bill gator (1)
 #40

People checking mining profitability before a purchase is exactly how this correlation get established in practice. When they see that mining is profitable, they will buy mining equipment. But profitable is synonymous here with rising prices because the coins which miners receive simply start to cost more. So the higher the profitability the greater number of would-be miners are going to buy ASICs. But as you correctly pointed out yourself, more miners leads to higher difficulty. Thus the correlation between the price and mining difficulty is established.

That isnt anywhere near good enough to be called correlation because we dont know how many miners get shipped and there is a 2 month window before the machines arrive. Furthermore, there will be alottt more machines shipped when there are more manufacturers. Samsung may very well make a loss here but it isnt a big deal to them since they are huge.

For example many new miners ordered units 1-2 months back when profits were farrr higher, around 5-8 times higher and now, when they get their machine, the proditability is a hell lot lower. Thus, there is no real correlation considering how huge the difference is....

A 2 month window explains why difficulty is lagging behind the price. Anyway, you can see on the chart below that difficulty has been following the price pretty close:



Now that Bitcoin has gone down dramatically, we can see that difficulty still rises. This can be because miners are still adding mining rigs as there is definitely some lapse between buying a mining rig and actually receiving it, which you correctly pointed out. If the price doesn't rebound and flatlines from now on or even goes down further, we should see the mining difficulty go down too. If it continues to rise despite Bitcoin going down, then you would be right. So let's wait and see what happens in the next few months.
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