I don't trust deepbit, but how come so many trust it?

[nakowa]

Can anyone tell me why you prefer deepbit to others?


-------------------------------------

to summarize:

Deepbit is more stable; creates less stale; and the owner of deepbit somewhat has a reputation.

Sorry for the original title of "I don't trust deepbit", even though I still don't trust it.

Reason?

I cannot meet my calculation with that of deepbit, even though I take unstable network connection into account...

My decision?

I'll have to setup a pool for myself, let my rigs "solo" together.

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[silverchair]

Haven't tried that yet, no plans actually.

[tysat]

Can anyone tell me why you prefer deepbit to others?

Can you tell me why you don't?

[SgtSpike]

It's been reliable, consistent, and the interface shows exactly the information I'd like to see.  I've tried BTCGuild and BTCMine, neither of which impressed me, and both of which I trusted less than deepbit because the proper information was not shown.

Why do you not trust deepbit?

[MrWizard]

It's not that I don't trust them, I find their fees outrageous.

[SgtSpike]

It's not that I don't trust them, I find their fees outrageous.

Then why does your thread title say "I don't trust deepbit"  

I am willing to pay the fee for reliability and lack of downtime.  BTCMine and BTCGuild caused me to lose WAY more than 3% of my earnings just from downtime, and I am more than willing to pay deepbit 3% so my miners don't stop.

[tysat]

It's not that I don't trust them, I find their fees outrageous.

Then why does your thread title say "I don't trust deepbit"  

I am willing to pay the fee for reliability and lack of downtime.  BTCMine and BTCGuild caused me to lose WAY more than 3% of my earnings just from downtime, and I am more than willing to pay deepbit 3% so my miners don't stop.

^^^^ This!

I was mining with BTCGuild before, but got hit by some killer connection/downtime issues... haven't had problems since switching to deepbit.

[error]

I mine at multiple pools.

Though if I had 50 GPUs, I would be mining solo; being in someone else's pool wouldn't make sense.

[tysat]

I mine at multiple pools.

Though if I had 50 GPUs, I would be mining solo; being in someone else's pool wouldn't make sense.

How do you set up your own pool? I was curious about this because I'm very near setting up about 127 30mh/s cards (and later upgrading them as profit comes in). Is it as simple as just installing a single bitcoind on one of the computers? (Never done it, completely new to the background of bitcoin processes)

Pretty much what you said.  Though that's only 3810 mh/s, which I wouldn't go solo with...  I'm curious what cards you're using and how many per rig.

[relmeas]

They have transferred mined btc to me multiple times already. Why wouldn't I trust it?

if you mean the trust that they don't rip off their miners, well they don't have to since they are already the biggest pool and their fees are the largest. at least they are fair this way. other pools - you can't see the difference between being ripped off and a pool's bad luck streak. so that's where you HAVE to trust. with largest pool however, rewards are stable, hence there is no reason to doubt the pool.

[NetTecture]

I mine at multiple pools.

Though if I had 50 GPUs, I would be mining solo; being in someone else's pool wouldn't make sense.

How do you set up your own pool? I was curious about this because I'm very near setting up about 127 30mh/s cards (and later upgrading them as profit comes in). Is it as simple as just installing a single bitcoind on one of the computers? (Never done it, completely new to the background of bitcoin processes)

Pretty much what you said.  Though that's only 3810 mh/s, which I wouldn't go solo with...  I'm curious what cards you're using and how many per rig.

Here is what I will do. I jsut orderd 80 x 6970 to be delivered in slices over the nxt 4 weeks, as initial step.

* I will NOT use deepbit, too expensive.
* I will use a distributing proxy that distributes my load over 2-3 pools on a round robin fashion.

Why 2-3 pools? Because i like to reduce variance

Why not deepbit / pay per share? Because they charge me 10%. Why the heck would I dot that - thigns even out over 2-3 weeks anyway. I am in it for the money, not for paying 10% for smoothing my equity curve.

[relmeas]

with this amount of hash you should solo mine. makes no sense paying somebody else's bills when you can have it all for yourself.

[mik3]

It's NVIDIA GFORCE G210s at first, and when the balance of profit comes to the price of an ATI Radeon 5850, I plan on upgrading. Total turnaround (depending on market and electricity costs) should be 9 months for it I think. At that time I'll be bringing in $9,000 a month?

What about the difficulty that keeps going up? 2 months ago we were mining 2x what we are mining now.



Also regarding this topic, I have mined on btc guild and deepbit, and tried doing 50/50 with my GPUs, for some reason I ALWAYS made more money with deepbit, and by more money I mean a lot more than the 3% that they take, upwards of 10% more some days. So even with deepbits fee, their servers and luck is much better for me.

[Jack of Diamonds]

Deepbit is now my only fallback pool because it has the lowest variance.

At this difficulty level I can't take the ridiculous 200-1000% swings some smaller pools have in their daily luck. That's too much lost money, and before you know it the difficulty has risen already.

With deepbit, the 3% fee is nothing compared to the fact luck stays nearly always at 5-10% of the target and on many days is positive.

I'm into mining for the long term, but I can't have 50 BTC one week and 12.5 the next, then 32.2, then 15 etc...
I'd much rather take the consistent 49, 49, 49, 49 because I have real electricity bills and rent to pay for the mining farm.

[Sukrim]

with this amount of hash you should solo mine. makes no sense paying somebody else's bills when you can have it all for yourself.

All you gain from solo mining compared to a 0% pool are transaction fees. Also maybe less stale/invalid shares. you have a LOT of variance added though.

The lowest (possible!) variance is on Eligius and arsbitcoin btw, not on deepbit or any other big pool.

[relmeas]

with this amount of hash you should solo mine. makes no sense paying somebody else's bills when you can have it all for yourself.

All you gain from solo mining compared to a 0% pool are transaction fees. Also maybe less stale/invalid shares. you have a LOT of variance added though.

only if you blindly trust the pool owner. there is currently no way to check that what you mine is being reported as pool profit. unless of course you write your own miner and having huge hashing power, do check every block you found to see if its being reported.

[phungus]

Just some open source intelligence to report, though I'm not pasting all of the IPs... I currently mine using DeepBit as my backup. I thought DeepBit was based in Germany for some reason but Tycho appears to be in Russia. I don't personally care but some might.


09:37 -!- [Tycho] [~Tycho@77.41.xxx.xxx] has joined #bitcoin
09:37 < phungus> good morning Tycho
09:41 -!- [Tycho] [~Tycho@77.41.xxx.xxx] has quit [Changing host]
09:41 -!- [Tycho] [~Tycho@unaffiliated/tycho/x-5664265] has joined #bitcoin

~$ host 77.41.xxx.xxx
xxx.xxx.41.77.in-addr.arpa domain name pointer host-77-41-xxx-xxx.qwerty.ru.

~$ whois qwerty.ru
% By submitting a query to RIPN's Whois Service
% you agree to abide by the following terms of use:
% http://www.ripn.net/about/servpol.html#3.2 (in Russian)
% http://www.ripn.net/about/en/servpol.html#3.2 (in English).

domain:     QWERTY.RU
nserver:    ns1.qwerty.ru. 87.240.1.1
nserver:    ns2.qwerty.ru. 87.240.1.2
state:      REGISTERED, DELEGATED, VERIFIED
org:        Central telegraph JSC
phone:      +7 495 5043838
fax-no:     +7 495 5044446
e-mail:     nsmaster@cnt.ru
e-mail:     vvss@cnt.ru
registrar:  RU-CENTER-REG-RIPN
created:    1998.07.30
paid-till:  2012.08.01
source:     TCI


http://forums.overclockers.ru/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=395932&start=580

[error]

Here is what I will do. I jsut orderd 80 x 6970 to be delivered in slices over the nxt 4 weeks, as initial step.

* I will NOT use deepbit, too expensive.
* I will use a distributing proxy that distributes my load over 2-3 pools on a round robin fashion.

Why 2-3 pools? Because i like to reduce variance

Why not deepbit / pay per share? Because they charge me 10%. Why the heck would I dot that - thigns even out over 2-3 weeks anyway. I am in it for the money, not for paying 10% for smoothing my equity curve.

With that size of farm, there's little reason to mine in someone else's pool. You'll be bringing in 50 BTC blocks often enough that you won't really notice any variance.

[FlipPro]

Deepbit pays me the fastest, and the most. Period.

[BitPorium]

Here is what I will do. I jsut orderd 80 x 6970 to be delivered in slices over the nxt 4 weeks, as initial step.

* I will NOT use deepbit, too expensive.
* I will use a distributing proxy that distributes my load over 2-3 pools on a round robin fashion.

Why 2-3 pools? Because i like to reduce variance

Why not deepbit / pay per share? Because they charge me 10%. Why the heck would I dot that - thigns even out over 2-3 weeks anyway. I am in it for the money, not for paying 10% for smoothing my equity curve.

With that size of farm, there's little reason to mine in someone else's pool. You'll be bringing in 50 BTC blocks often enough that you won't really notice any variance.

32Ghashes wont be bringing in blocks often at all.
To. OP, try Eligius, they are great, Youd be about 10% of the pool,

[error]

32Ghashes wont be bringing in blocks often at all.
To. OP, try Eligius, they are great, Youd be about 10% of the pool,

Check your math? That'll average almost 3 blocks a week at current difficulty. If that's "not often," then you have a very unusual definition of "often."

[Grouver (BtcBalance)]

I find it funny that the majority of miners prolly think... oh, I join the pool with the most power then I get more money.
Except the above I do not see any other reason why people would join or stay at deepbit with the current difficulty level.

[error]

I find it funny that the majority of miners prolly think... oh, I join the pool with the most power then I get more money.
Except the above I do not see any other reason why people would join and stay at deepbit with the current difficulty level?

Quite so. Consider this very common view:

Deepbit pays me the fastest, and the most. Period.

Deepbit certainly has instant payout (without having to wait for the 100 block confirmations) but they charge the highest fees of any pool I've seen recently. Perhaps the highest anywhere. Why people continue to think they're making more money on Deepbit than on other pools is a mystery to me.

[Mousepotato]

Deepbit certainly has instant payout (without having to wait for the 100 block confirmations) but they charge the highest fees of any pool I've seen recently. Perhaps the highest anywhere. Why people continue to think they're making more money on Deepbit than on other pools is a mystery to me.

People don't like variance (unless it works in their favor of course, but who doesn't like that?).  For many it's worth a small commission to be able to watch their BTC count tick up every hour on the hour.

[error]

Deepbit certainly has instant payout (without having to wait for the 100 block confirmations) but they charge the highest fees of any pool I've seen recently. Perhaps the highest anywhere. Why people continue to think they're making more money on Deepbit than on other pools is a mystery to me.

People don't like variance (unless it works in their favor of course, but who doesn't like that?).  For many it's worth a small commission to be able to watch their BTC count tick up every hour on the hour.

Sure, I understand that well, but that doesn't address why some people think they're making more on Deepbit than other pools, when in reality they're making the least?

[SgtSpike]

Deepbit certainly has instant payout (without having to wait for the 100 block confirmations) but they charge the highest fees of any pool I've seen recently. Perhaps the highest anywhere. Why people continue to think they're making more money on Deepbit than on other pools is a mystery to me.

People don't like variance (unless it works in their favor of course, but who doesn't like that?).  For many it's worth a small commission to be able to watch their BTC count tick up every hour on the hour.

Sure, I understand that well, but that doesn't address why some people think they're making more on Deepbit than other pools, when in reality they're making the least?

I'm making more, because the other pools I tried were unreliable, so I had significant downtime.

*shrug*

[static]

deepbit has consistent numbers.

i've tried bitclockers and btc guild - both had weird numbers.

they just didn't seem legit.

[triforcelink]

deepbit just works. during the time i was trying out btcguild, i had some connection problems, the main site was down on a regular basis (this is important for someone like me who checks their bitcoin balance on an hourly basis!)

[ctoon6]

are there any pools that don't charge transaction fees? Id like to mine for them instead, and in addition, there was a small amount of evidence that one pool was ddosing bitcoinpool. I can not confirm or deny it, but the staff of bitcoinpool, which i place some trust in said it was likely. so trust them if you want, but the only reason I would ever mine would be to provide 100% free transactions.

[pennytrader]

deepbit has the lowest stale rate

[TiagoTiago]

Didn't [Tycho] (the guy that runs Deepbit) paid back from his own pocket more than a hundred BTC when someone had their accounts there compromised and lost the money they hadn't withdrawn yet,or somthing along those lines?

[Sannyasi]

i use bitcoin for reliability, that's worth the fees to me.

[SgtSpike]

Didn't [Tycho] (the guy that runs Deepbit) paid back from his own pocket more than a hundred BTC when someone had their accounts there compromised and lost the money they hadn't withdrawn yet,or somthing along those lines?

Yes, he did.  He also reimbursed another member for a smaller amount due to a similar problem.  I respect him and his pool greatly for that.  Seems that greed gets the best of many bitcoin-website holders around here, who pretty much say "sorry, tough luck."

[Hook^]

Here is what I will do. I jsut orderd 80 x 6970 to be delivered in slices over the nxt 4 weeks, as initial step.

6970's are not anywhere near the best hashrate per $.  Trust me, I have some so I know.

Right now the best hashrate/$ is the 5830's at newegg.  286 MH/S for $130.  Around 2.2 MH/S per $.  6970's do around 380 MH/S for $320, so they are only 1.19 MH/S per $.  Of course, you have to consider the price of the motherboard, power supply, etc because you will need more of them per MH on account of the lower powered 5830's.

Check out https://en.bitcoin.it/wiki/Mining_hardware_comparison  The price/MH column is wrong because people don't update it when they update the card prices, so you have to calculate on your own.

Anyway, as I have said in other threads, right now the ROI on mining is the lowest it has ever been, less than $.01/MH/S/Day.  If diff increases grow at less than 1% a day, you may be able to get more bitcoins over the course of a year than just purchasing them outright now.  But based on historical data, you will get more bitcoins from simply purchasing from the market.

Good luck.

[Hook^]

32Ghashes wont be bringing in blocks often at all.
To. OP, try Eligius, they are great, Youd be about 10% of the pool,

Check your math? That'll average almost 3 blocks a week at current difficulty. If that's "not often," then you have a very unusual definition of "often."

I think his problem is that some weeks nothing will come in, other weeks, 6 blocks will come in.
The variance freaks some people out.

Plus with difficulty increases, variance actually costs you because you sometimes don't get anything before the next diff increase.  Over a long period this doesn't matter, but in the short term, it can decrease your earnings.

[Jack of Diamonds]

32Ghashes wont be bringing in blocks often at all.
To. OP, try Eligius, they are great, Youd be about 10% of the pool,

Check your math? That'll average almost 3 blocks a week at current difficulty. If that's "not often," then you have a very unusual definition of "often."

I think his problem is that some weeks nothing will come in, other weeks, 6 blocks will come in.
The variance freaks some people out.

Plus with difficulty increases, variance actually costs you because you sometimes don't get anything before the next diff increase.  Over a long period this doesn't matter, but in the short term, it can decrease your earnings.

Finally someone gets it..

What good is it if a slow pool's variance evens out in the next two months, if the current difficulty level only lasts 2 weeks or less?

You'll still be making less & less if you run into just a few unlucky streaks, because diff. is going up all the time.

With low variance pools that have massive hash rates, you are almost guaranteed to get 95-100% (or more if the pool is lucky) of your expected earnings.

[Fireball]

deepbit just works.

and because deepbit owner is an honest person, which is so rare nowadays.

[Bitcoin_Silver_Supply]

I find my mhash average is always clocked in higher on Deepbit than it should be and I'm never sure entirely why. I have two 5830s running at about 305 each right now and my "average speed in the last 10 minutes" frequently comes in at over 700. I'm not sure if this is common or not but it would be nice if true