Asian films old and new: recommendations, discussion and appreciation

[FirstAscent]

Hlynur was going to start this thread, but I'll just go ahead and get it going. Off the top of my head, I can think of the following important film movements:

- The Golden Age of Japanese Cinema (the 1950s)
- The Japanese New Wave (the 1960s)
- The Taiwan New Wave (the late 1980s to about 2000)

Also, of course, is the distinction between mainland China films, Hong Kong films, and Taiwan films. Older films and contemporary films from the entire region should be discussed.

And finally, for those who aren't well versed in these films, please view the thread, ask questions, and so on, as some of the most famous films ever made came from Asia. The Asian film canon is rich and diverse.

[FirstAscent]

The first thing one must do is disabuse themselves of the idea that Asian cinema is solely the domain of samurais, kung fu masters and crime thrillers. With that said, where to start? Well, if you're a newbie, like Phinnaeus Gage, Kyle91, or faiza1990, and looking to expand your cinematic knowledge, a good place to start is modern Hong Kong cinema. And a good film to begin with is Wong Kar-Wai's Chungking Express: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bjd7PFf_TFw

[flagel8]

Well, I enjoyed 2046 a lot. So I'll put that one on the list!

But I strongly urge people to see Zhang Yimou's The Road Home. Very human, yet a work of transcendent beauty.

[niko]

The wayward cloud.

[FirstAscent]

Well, I enjoyed 2046 a lot. So I'll put that one on the list!

Wong Kar-Wai's 2046 is a masterpiece of love and longing, no doubt about it. For neophytes, I'd recommend starting with his Chungking Express, and then progressing into his more cerebral works, those of course being his trilogy Days of Being Wild, In the Mood for Love, and 2046.

Some people can't digest 2046. Others call it one of their favorite films of all time. I'm definitely the latter. Best to watch all three films in random order, and then repeat, in random order, and then again.

Flagel8, what are some of your favorite moments, shots, scenes from 2046?

[FirstAscent]

The Wayward Cloud.

That one's on my want to watch list. I haven't yet had a chance to explore the works of Tsai Ming-liang yet. Oh, but I want to!

- What Time is it There?
- Goodbye, Dragon Inn
- The Wayward Cloud
- The Hole
- Vive L'Amour

[Bakemono]

My suggestions:
Shichinin No Samurai ( unfortunately a remake is in progress scheduled for 2014, so go and see this now if you haven't already)
Rashomon
and of course Mononoke Hime  

[FirstAscent]

My suggestions:
Shichinin No Samurai ( unfortunately a remake is in progress scheduled for 2014, so go and see this now if you haven't already)
Rashomon
and of course Mononoke Hime  

Are Rashomon and Seven Samurai your favorite Kurosawa films? Which Kurosawa films have you seen? My favorites are actually Red Beard, Seven Samurai, No Regrets for our Youth, and the The Idiot. Have you watched any films from the other masters of Japan's golden age - i.e. Ozu, Naruse, Mizoguchi, Kobayashi, or Kinoshita?

[flagel8]

Well, I enjoyed 2046 a lot. So I'll put that one on the list!

...what are some of your favorite moments, shots, scenes from 2046?

Sorry, not one of my favorite films. I enjoyed it, but was initially drawn in by the Science Fictional elements. So I enjoyed it for the visuals. The sense of place, style, and especially time. I actually found it a bit cold, though. Are the characters in his other films easier to empathize with?

...and of course Mononoke Hime  

Miyazaki-sama! The opening sequence of Nausicaa of the Valley of the Wind is masterful, one of the best I've ever seen. The beauty of the cave in which she first sees the Ohmu's molted (?) shell is hypnotic. And of course, the flying scenes.

[niko]

Oh, oh - Woman in the Dunes.

By the way, my criterion for a good movie is simple: being memorable. Leaves that feeling behind that persists throughout years.

[FirstAscent]

Oh, oh - Woman in the Dunes.

A Teshigahara/Abe/Takemitsu collaboration from the Japanese New Wave. An existential exploration of identity. Have you seen Teshigahara's The Face of Another? I rank it even slightly higher than Woman in the Dunes, and that's saying a lot. It's pretty much in my top 20. The Face of Another is probably the second greatest science fiction film of all time, if you so choose to qualify it as science fiction.

[FirstAscent]

Well, I enjoyed 2046 a lot. So I'll put that one on the list!

...what are some of your favorite moments, shots, scenes from 2046?

Sorry, not one of my favorite films. I enjoyed it, but was initially drawn in by the Science Fictional elements. So I enjoyed it for the visuals. The sense of place, style, and especially time. I actually found it a bit cold, though. Are the characters in his other films easier to empathize with?

Well, you just said you enjoyed it a lot. Is that the only Wong Kar-Wai film you've seen? There's a saying: "The more you put into a Wong Kar-Wai film, the more you get out of it." No way around it. 2046 is a masterpiece of allegory, stories within stories, an exploration of unrequited love and longing. And Zhang Ziyi's performance is nothing short of stunning. As one reviewer said: "She expresses bottomless agony with a single teardrop."

So much is being said in this wordless scene: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cRfPF3tLIGQ

[flagel8]

Well, I enjoyed 2046 a lot. So I'll put that one on the list!

...what are some of your favorite moments, shots, scenes from 2046?

Sorry, not one of my favorite films. I enjoyed it, but was initially drawn in by the Science Fictional elements. So I enjoyed it for the visuals. The sense of place, style, and especially time. I actually found it a bit cold, though. Are the characters in his other films easier to empathize with?

Well, you just said you enjoyed it a lot. Is that the only Wong Kar-Wai film you've seen? There's a saying: "The more you put into a Wong Kar-Wai film, the more you get out of it." No way around it. 2046 is a masterpiece of allegory, stories within stories, an exploration of unrequited love and longing. And Zhang Ziyi's performance is nothing short of stunning. As one reviewer said: "She expresses bottomless agony with a single teardrop."

So much is being said in this wordless scene: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cRfPF3tLIGQ

Yeah, but I enjoy a lot of stuff, some of which I acknowledge is not of the highest quality, for whatever unfathomable reasons. Guilty pleasures, if you will. I can tell that the film is of high quality, but it didn't move me.

And it  IS the only Wong Kar-Wai film I have seen, and Zhang Ziyi's character is the one I most liked in that film. But in The Road Home, I LOVED her character, both young and old, such is the power of her performance.

[FirstAscent]

Well, I enjoyed 2046 a lot. So I'll put that one on the list!

...what are some of your favorite moments, shots, scenes from 2046?

Sorry, not one of my favorite films. I enjoyed it, but was initially drawn in by the Science Fictional elements. So I enjoyed it for the visuals. The sense of place, style, and especially time. I actually found it a bit cold, though. Are the characters in his other films easier to empathize with?

Well, you just said you enjoyed it a lot. Is that the only Wong Kar-Wai film you've seen? There's a saying: "The more you put into a Wong Kar-Wai film, the more you get out of it." No way around it. 2046 is a masterpiece of allegory, stories within stories, an exploration of unrequited love and longing. And Zhang Ziyi's performance is nothing short of stunning. As one reviewer said: "She expresses bottomless agony with a single teardrop."

So much is being said in this wordless scene: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cRfPF3tLIGQ

Yeah, but I enjoy a lot of stuff, some of which I acknowledge is not of the highest quality, for whatever unfathomable reasons. Guilty pleasures, if you will. I can tell that the film is of high quality, but it didn't move me.

And it  IS the only Wong Kar-Wai film I have seen, and Zhang Ziyi's character is the one I most liked in that film. But in The Road Home, I LOVED her character, both young and old, such is the power of her performance.

Well, consider:

1. I assume you've watched the film only once.
2. You haven't seen the other two films, which play a role in appreciating 2046.
3. You had expectations of a science fiction film, so you weren't getting exactly what you expected.

The film is layered. Mr. Chow is portrayed as he is, due to prior events. And in fact, there is a point where he realizes why things are the way they are. The other women, played by Faye Wong, Gong Li, Carina Lau, and Zhang Ziyi, all have their stories, and one can relate to them.

Here's a key: consider the moments of reflection the characters play as they ponder things on the hotel rooftop. Those are important moments.

[FirstAscent]

flagel8,

This seven minute clip is monumentally important to the film, and stunningly beautiful, from beginning to end. Its combination of music, revelation to the main character, and final goodbye to Faye Wong's character, are just stunning: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-rg1QB_h6mY

And the whole damn movie is like that, it seems. Just a breathtakingly gorgeous confluence of emotion, realization, and heartbreak.

[flagel8]

...Well, consider:

1. I assume you've watched the film only once.
2. You haven't seen the other two films, which play a role in appreciating 2046.
3. You had expectations of a science fiction film, so you weren't getting exactly what you expected.
...

All three points are correct! I saw this at a dinner party about 10 years ago. A friend who was notoriously secretive, so secretive that none of us knew where he lived suggested that we have a picnic. I was in the car following his car. He stopped by a park, and got out, telling us to wait right there, and walked into the park. We were mystified. He drove off, and we wondered just what the hell was going on. Ten minutes later he came running out of the park, hopped in the car, and said," Drive."

He guided us to a nondescript bungalow on the other side of the park and said, "Let's have the picnic here. In my house." We were flummoxed. So we had the picnic in his living room, and watched a bootleg copy of the as yet unreleased 2046. I really enjoyed it, but maybe it wasn't exactly the movie that was so enjoyable!

[FirstAscent]

...Well, consider:

1. I assume you've watched the film only once.
2. You haven't seen the other two films, which play a role in appreciating 2046.
3. You had expectations of a science fiction film, so you weren't getting exactly what you expected.
...

All three points are correct! I saw this at a dinner party about 10 years ago. A friend who was notoriously secretive, so secretive that none of us knew where he lived suggested that we have a picnic. I was in the car following his car. He stopped by a park, and got out, telling us to wait right there, and walked into the park. We were mystified. He drove off, and we wondered just what the hell was going on. Ten minutes later he came running out of the park, hopped in the car, and said," Drive."

He guided us to a nondescript bungalow on the other side of the park and said, "Let's have the picnic here. In my house." We were flummoxed. So we had the picnic in his living room, and watched a bootleg copy of the as yet unreleased 2046. I really enjoyed it, but maybe it wasn't exactly the movie that was so enjoyable!

You do realize that you might not have watched the correct cut of 2046? Wong Kar-Wai's films go through a development stage during release. Ten years ago was at the time of release.

You seriously need to rethink your take on the film. And the clip I just shared with you? I could go through some key points on it. But first, you should agree to watch it all the way through. Some points:

1. It's Christmas Eve.
2. He takes Wang out to dinner. He is in love with her.
3. Wang is in love with a Japanese man.
4. Wang says some things during dinner which are kind of rude and heartbreaking to him.
5. He offers a means for her to call her boyfriend.
6. He realizes how good he feels for doing this.
7. At 4:04, his eyes look downward, wistfully, and reflects.
8. He's going to tell you the conclusions he has come to.
9. That is a culmination of his prior failed relationships, and the big one, from the earlier film.
10. We see the character from the story he's writing walk away in the train.
11. That character is actually the Japanese Man Wang loves in real life.
12. That character has been rejected by the android in the story Mr. Chow is writing.
13. The android represents Wang
14. The Japanese Man in the story represents Mr. Chow.
15. So the character, and Mr. Chow simultaneously have a revelation.
16. And on the hotel rooftop, we see a still photo of Mr. Chow.
17. This is akin to a nostalgic moment.
18. We see the android look wistfully out the window of the train.
19. She's longing for the man she loves, which in the story is someone else.
20. But in real life, it's analogous to Wang's longing for the Japanese man.
21. And the opera music plays.
22. Wang's father is the fan of opera music, and so the opera music is like Wang's theme.
23. Other characters have different themes for music.
24. And so Mr. Chow reveals to himself that love is all a matter of timing.
25. Wang turns towards the camera, and it's her effective goodbye.
26. This final scene is an echo of Rebecca Pan's goodbye in Days of Being Wild.

[FirstAscent]

Oh, and Mr. Chow mentions (on Christmas Eve) that the sections 1224 and 1225 on the train lack heating, and are very cold. And that is symbolic of the coldness he feels on this Christmas Eve, being alone.

Finally, watching a bootleg copy of 2046, probably with botched subtitles, possibly not Wong Kar-Wai's final cut, with a bunch of guys is not the proper way to watch a Wong Kar-Wai film, ever. You watch it alone, or with a girlfriend who appreciates that kind of film.

[flagel8]

...
Finally, watching a bootleg copy of 2046, probably with botched subtitles, possibly not Wong Kar-Wai's final cut, with a bunch of guys is not the proper way to watch a Wong Kar-Wai film, ever. You watch it alone, or with a girlfriend who appreciates that kind of film.

Hey! There were girls there! One of them drove his car to the house! LOL, what kind of geek do you think I am! Heh!

Anyway, I'll put it on the list, since your OTHER picks seem likely to be good!

[flagel8]

And did you ever see Kurosawa's No Regrets for our Youth? It's one of my favorite Kurosawa films. See the tribute here: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hUGhS7t903c

Just got a copy today!

Awesome! Watch When a Woman Ascends the Stairs and No Regrets for our Youth.

But after these!