[Poll] no-interest banks such as JAK

[imanikin]

Has anyone here ever dealt with JAK Bank?  

Here is a video about it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aW2pj109Cr8

Seems like a really cool way to bank, and Bitcoin would be useful to it...  

Would someone who knows Swedish please inquire regarding JAK's view on B?

Are there other such banks, besides the Islamic Banking institutions?

[1715256002]

1715256002

[1715256002]

1715256002

[hugolp]

If I remember correctly it has to have your money inmobilized for a while, which is equivalent to charging interest.

[imanikin]

...i emailed JAK. Unbelievably, their response was:

Hello!

I´m sorry to say but I have never heard about Bitcoin.

Vänliga hälsningar
***** *********
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
JAK Medlemsbank
Box 216
Vasagatan 14
541 25 Skövde
0500-46 45 43"

How funny! 

[imanikin]

...time to revisit this in the wake of the ECB VC paper.

Let's see what JAK says now... 

[Herodes]

I have dealt with many banks that has no interest in me being a customer. Does this help ?

[Serenata]

...time to revisit this in the wake of the ECB VC paper.

Let's see what JAK says now... 

Any response after you send them the ECB Virtual Currencies document?

[Herodes]

...i emailed JAK. Unbelievably, their response was:

Hello!

I´m sorry to say but I have never heard about Bitcoin.

Vänliga hälsningar
***** *********
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
JAK Medlemsbank
Box 216
Vasagatan 14
541 25 Skövde
0500-46 45 43"

How funny! 

When you get responses like that, you're sure to be dealing with customer service that couldn't even be arsed to google for a couple of minutes, admittedly it takes longer to understand what bitcoin is. Personally, if someone asked me about something, I'd certainly do a minimum amount of research before answering back. This only implies that they don't want your business very badly!

[imanikin]

Any response after you send them the ECB Virtual Currencies document?

No response at all from JAK this time. 

[imanikin]

Does this type of bank exist in your country?

[imanikin]

Has anyone had any bitcoin-related transactions through interest-free banks?

[PurpleTentacle]

I firmly believe that earning money just because you have more money, without contributing anything to society, is a crime against humanity. The interest you earn has to come from somewhere, typically from people who take loans. Who's taking the loans? People who can't afford to buy things they need. So the worlds poor end up paying more for stuff they need just because some rich cocksuckers have to get richer without actually doing anything at all.

[b!z]

There was an islamic bitcoin bank before that offered this but now they are closed i think

[PurpleTentacle]

I firmly believe that earning money just because you have more money, without contributing anything to society, is a crime against humanity. The interest you earn has to come from somewhere, typically from people who take loans. Who's taking the loans? People who can't afford to buy things they need. So the worlds poor end up paying more for stuff they need just because some rich cocksuckers have to get richer without actually doing anything at all.

Will you lend me some money?

It's not my job to lend you money, but interest free banks could lend you some according to your needs. Otoh, I wouldn't lend you money even with 100% interest as, after all, I don't know you and I don't trust you.

[PurpleTentacle]

I firmly believe that earning money just because you have more money, without contributing anything to society, is a crime against humanity. The interest you earn has to come from somewhere, typically from people who take loans. Who's taking the loans? People who can't afford to buy things they need. So the worlds poor end up paying more for stuff they need just because some rich cocksuckers have to get richer without actually doing anything at all.

Will you lend me some money?

It's not my job to lend you money, but interest free banks could lend you some according to your needs. Otoh, I wouldn't lend you money even with 100% interest as, after all, I don't know you and I don't trust you.

So, lending money is risky, huh? Seems almost like it wouldn't be unreasonable to get paid a bit for taking that risk.

I addressed this in my previous post, but you just had to ignore it, didn't you? I wouldn't lend you money because I don't trust you. Interest wouldn't change anything.

But I'd really like you to comment on the social implications of money with interest...

[Foxpup]

I firmly believe that earning money just because you have more money, without contributing anything to society, is a crime against humanity. The interest you earn has to come from somewhere, typically from people who take loans. Who's taking the loans? People who can't afford to buy things they need. So the worlds poor end up paying more for stuff they need just because some rich cocksuckers have to get richer without actually doing anything at all.

You don't lend money to people who can't afford things, at least not if you expect to be paid back. You lend money to people who can afford things, just not right now, and are willing to pay more money to be able to buy things now rather than later. If people didn't think it was more useful to be able to buy things now rather than later, they wouldn't be willing to pay more, and the lenders would be out of business. The lenders are providing a service that people want, just like everybody else who earns a living. Though whether borrowers can distinguish what they want from what they actually need is another matter altogether.

[PurpleTentacle]

I firmly believe that earning money just because you have more money, without contributing anything to society, is a crime against humanity. The interest you earn has to come from somewhere, typically from people who take loans. Who's taking the loans? People who can't afford to buy things they need. So the worlds poor end up paying more for stuff they need just because some rich cocksuckers have to get richer without actually doing anything at all.

You don't lend money to people who can't afford things, at least not if you expect to be paid back. You lend money to people who can afford things, just not right now, and are willing to pay more money to be able to buy things now rather than later. If people didn't think it was more useful to be able to buy things now rather than later, they wouldn't be willing to pay more, and the lenders would be out of business. The lenders are providing a service that people want, just like everybody else who earns a living. Though whether borrowers can distinguish what they want from what they actually need is another matter altogether.

People are weak. They buy things now because they want them, not because they know they will be able to pay the loans back in the future. People want things now because they are being sold a fairy tale by the mass media and by advertisers. Be someone, buy a new tv, a new car. You don't have the money? So what? Get your stuff now and pay it back later. 32 months? 72 months? A lifetime? So what? Why worry? Enjoy your life!

That's why the whole world is suffocating under 51 goddamn trillions of debt. That's why students get hundreds of thousands $ worth of student loans just to struggle for decades to pay them back. It's an unfair system because people don't take rational decision and guess what? Banksters and advertisers know this and they make very good money on it.


Also, read this

[Foxpup]

People are weak. They buy things now because they want them, not because they know they will be able to pay the loans back in the future.

Which is why lenders take the effort to actually check whether the borrower can actually afford to pay off the loan.

People want things now because they are being sold a fairy tale by the mass media and by advertisers. Be someone, buy a new tv, a new car. You don't have the money? So what? Get your stuff now and pay it back later. 32 months? 72 months? A lifetime? So what? Why worry? Enjoy your life!

They can't be sold a fairy tale if they're not buying it. Obviously people do, in fact, enjoy owning these things that they're buying, or they wouldn't buy them. I fail to see the problem with charging people more money so they can get more enjoyment from their lives.

That's why the whole world is suffocating under 51 goddamn trillions of debt. That's why students get hundreds of thousands $ worth of student loans just to struggle for decades to pay them back. It's an unfair system because people don't take rational decision and guess what? Banksters and advertisers know this and they make very good money on it.

People who can't make rational decisions are going to end up struggling with or without debt. That's not unfair, that's just a fact of life.

Also, read this

The only way we can escape being net payers of interest is by having assets ourselves. But this forces us to exploit others, to compensate for, instead of ending, being exploited ourselves.

I stopped reading here. If you can't figure out how to acquire assets without exploiting others, you deserve a lot worse than what you're getting.

[imanikin]

Would someone from Sweden please check with JAK again, and find out what their view of cryptocurrencies is?

[blodyx]

I sent a email to the CEO. He will probably not answer today.

[MakeBelieve]

Never heard of Bitcoin? That's ridicuous.

[Gabi]

People who can't afford to buy things they need.

I didn't know buying the latest iphone and ipad was something "they need"

[Haidang1796]

Ive just studied about the development of the banking system in the US. Wish I was back then, when the bank was so stupid
Now they are much better. I feel we dont need to improve it anymore

[blodyx]

Hi Sammy

I wonder how Jak thinks about Bitcoin, and other crypto currencies, they are based on the same principles as Jak.

Sincerely,
blodyx

Hej,

 

Tack för din fråga. Det kan bli dags för en faq om det på webben. Rent generellt är vi positivt inställda till alternativa valutor, lokala såväl som digitala. Och så länge som de används i sitt syfte dvs att motsvara ett reellt bytesvärde och inte är spekulativa och är till för att tjäna pengar på pengar eller liknar någon form av pyramidspel. Tyvärr har vi idag inte möjligheter att i våra system hantera Bitcoin eller andra typer av valutor som betalningsmedel och inte resurserna att övervaka transaktionerna ur ett penningtvättsyfte som en sådan hantering skulle utgöra.

 

Vänliga hälsningar

Sammy Almedal, VD

­JAK Medlemsbank

A fast translation...

Hello,
Thanks for your question. It may be time for an FAQ about it on the web. In general, we favor alternative currencies, local as well as digital. And as long as they are used in its purpose ie to correspond to a real exchange value and are not speculative and are there to make money from money, or similar to some sort of pyramid scheme. Unfortunately, we currently have no opportunities to in our systems handle Bitcoin or other types of currencies as legal tender and not have the resources to monitor transactions from a money laundering purposes as such handling would be.

Sincerely
Sammy Almedal, VD
JAK Medlemsbank

[imanikin]

A fast translation...

Hello,
Thanks for your question. It may be time for an FAQ about it on the web. In general, we favor alternative currencies, local as well as digital. And as long as they are used in its purpose ie to correspond to a real exchange value and are not speculative and are there to make money from money, or similar to some sort of pyramid scheme. Unfortunately, we currently have no opportunities to in our systems handle Bitcoin or other types of currencies as legal tender and not have the resources to monitor transactions from a money laundering purposes as such handling would be.

Sincerely
Sammy Almedal, VD
JAK Medlemsbank

Thank you. It's amazing how even employees of a progressive bank don't seem to understand that the currency they use now is there to "make money from money" and "similar to some sort of a pyramid scheme", because of interest, debt-base, seigniorage and fractional reserve banking. Society in general is so well brainwashed into accepting the status quo that they don't even realize they are being scammed and robbed by the government and banks...

Anyhow, it's useful to know JAK's position, and a sign of progress that they need a FAQ about it. Doesn't sound promising for Bitcoin in interest-free banking, because barring a complete apocalypse of the current system, Bitcoin won't be legal tender, and anti banking privacy/spy on your customer laws aren't going away either. 

[Kluge]

AFAIK, the Islamic Bank of Bitcoin is still in existence. I don't often take loans anymore, but when I do occasionally snipe one or two from the lending section if I feel it's very safe, I won't charge interest or take collateral. Tips almost always exceed what I ask in everything, so I'm totally cool with freedom, and it helps along a "pay what you can" model I'm fond of -- some people don't tip, and that's fine. It just sucks for unestablished people... you work 10 hours a day, 6 days a week, you really don't have much time to be faffing about on Bitcointalk.

ETA: IBB link - http://www.ib-bitcoin.com/