Credit card firm cuts off nation's No. 1 gun store --- for selling guns

[markjamrobin]

People (foreigners) often don't realize how much gun control there already is in the US: background checks, CCW permits, other local and state restrictions/prohibitions...
Conversely, many don't know there were no gun laws in the UK before 1920 and it really wasn't an issue.

Even gun culture, which is significant, doesn't directly drive crime. In the West Indies (and much of South America) there is less of a gun culture, yet the murder rates are often much higher than in the US. (The US trend close to the global mean; source: Indexmundi)

The US have a homicide rate of about 5 per 100.000 persons annually. In some states, such as North Dakota, Vermont and Maine (places that often are full of guns and gun owners), it is much lower.
In Jamaica, it is 40 per 100.000 persons.
In Trinidad, it is 35 per 100.000 persons.
In St Lucia, it is 25 per 100.000 persons.
In Brazil, it is 21 per 100.000 persons.
In Honduras, it is 91 per 100.000 persons (!).

And so on. Why highlight the US for problems with human violence? It's global. And if people think white Eurasian types are less prone to homicide, while that can be true, it isn't always. In the Russian Federation the homicide rate is about 11 per 100.000 persons.

Now, back to the original topic. VISA and PayPal cut businesses off for less controversial things than selling guns. You can't even donate to Julian Assange through them, and last I checked, donations to Wikileaks aren't violent or dangerous.

Wikileaks has been branded as a criminal organization. Funding a criminal organization would not be a smart legal move for Visa, and the volume of donations serviced by Visa to WL, compared to the legal risk is negligible, in my opinion.

[1715216977]

1715216977

[skull88]

This is still surreal to me, buying guns online with credit card...

I don't believe you can have your guns shipped to you via FedEx. You need to go to the shop in person, with a background check done while you wait. That would take a few minutes. When you buy your gun online they ship it to the gun store nearest to you if they don't have the model you want in stock.

I am not a gun owner so I could be wrong.

Yeah, I guess it will depend on what state you are, but I'm from a country with tight gun control and the "every one can have a gun" it's pretty weird to me...

I thought the same for a long time, I live in a country where guns are illegal, and most people think it is a good thing they are, because else we would turn into the US where people shoot each other constantly.
...but are they? Or is that just an opinion they want us to believe?

If they give you a gun, would you start to shoot at people? Or would you only use it if your live depends on it, if you got to defend yourself? For me it would be the second, if I really would want guns to shoot someone for the most stupid reasons, I would have guns. Criminals have guns in countries with tight gun control, nutjobs have guns, the only people who don't have guns, are people like you and me, the ones that would never misuse them anyway.

The US is big and it's pretty normal we hear a lot about firearm incidents, but looking at my own little country, I can recall instantly 3 mass shooting accidents in which one guy was shooting and throwing grenades, another guy ran into a daycare center and started stabbing toddlers with a knife (no gun needed to harm a lot of people), one guy started shooting in a shopping street. If I look at the Netherlands one guy started shooting in a mall, Norway also had a shooting accident,etc...

Making guns legal wouldn't change much imo, we wouldn't turn into maniacal killers and the homicide rates would just stay the same, I don't have guns but I have so many objects in my house that I use daily that could be used as a weapon anytime. Why would a gun make so much difference?

[Spendulus]

....

Wikileaks has been branded as a criminal organization. Funding a criminal organization would not be a smart legal move for Visa, and the volume of donations serviced by Visa to WL, compared to the legal risk is negligible, in my opinion.

The problem with this kind of thinking, interjecting morality into payment streams, is who does the decisions?

You want to have the US's branding of Wikileaks shut it down?  Then what about the opinion of Nigeria?  Russia?  Somalia?

Who says the opinion of the US as to what should be allowed to transact is correct or optimum?  

I could continue, but you get the point.  Wikileaks was around long, long before Manning and nobody cared.

[Wilikon]

Should bitcoin be forbidden to be used by the gun stores? And by whom?

[Wilikon]

Should bitcoin be forbidden to be used by the gun stores? And by whom?

Does not compute.

Well.. it could be forbidden in the sense that some authority says, "No."

It could not be forbidden in the sense that some authority actually prevents it (unless total police state).

Yep. that's the reality of maths Vs the reality of this threads where everyone believes in bitcoin, yet not so much in total freedom (even when people follow the rules).

[Spendulus]

No one will reply to facts regarding the credit card  abuse mentioned and the drug abuse before you. As long as something goes withing their own agenda anyone even bitcoin lover bunch will move toward the ones with their own agenda.
It is human nature....

***Bitpay don't miss this opportunity. Bitcoin, The Can't Be Stopped Money!***

If I understand what you are saying, it is that people push agendas rather than look for actual causes and discuss them.

Not so sure about that.  Awareness of the impact of the psychoactive prescribed medications and their implication in mass killings has slowly came into the mainstream.

I'd certainly like to believe that a large number of people seriously interested in improving the world would take heed of actual causes and effects.

[Wilikon]

No one will reply to facts regarding the credit card  abuse mentioned and the drug abuse before you. As long as something goes withing their own agenda anyone even bitcoin lover bunch will move toward the ones with their own agenda.
It is human nature....

***Bitpay don't miss this opportunity. Bitcoin, The Can't Be Stopped Money!***

If I understand what you are saying, it is that people push agendas rather than look for actual causes and discuss them.

Not so sure about that.  Awareness of the impact of the psychoactive prescribed medications and their implication in mass killings has slowly came into the mainstream.

I'd certainly like to believe that a large number of people seriously interested in improving the world would take heed of actual causes and effects.

What I am saying is I wish people, no matter if I agree with their political views or not would apply their belief no matter what, not just when they feel they are in the "opposition views". A simple example are all those clowns dressed up in orange jump suits with a black bag over their heads many times a year reminding people about Gitmo. Just don't become invisible when you man is in power. What you believe should transcend ANY man. Keep at it until the reality you inspire happens or die for it.
The same about people being afraid of an over-prescribed over-medicated society (not just in the USA, by the way, check out the level of anti depressant in France and other EU countries). How come when it is public record the sandy hook school assassin was under prescription, no one cares to do a basic journalist research about that? Why is it so important to get rid of the 2nd Amendment fast, but it is OK to not say anything on the side effects of some drugs on psychopaths? Why no social networked mobilization? What ever happen to kony 2012 by the way? That was massive and VERY IMPORTANT NOW! But a mobilization of that nature and the money behind it to ask the question about chemicals some could take is not social network emergency.

That is my point regarding a company that does its business openly for so long and comparing it with the Bitcoin network: the weak link is not the equation but the human being distorting the laws they swear to uphold or the contract they signed to respect.

[fattypig]

I don't understand what it has to do with credit card? People don't have money so they swipe credit card and rob people?

[Wilikon]

I don't understand what it has to do with credit card? People don't have money so they swipe credit card and rob people?

If you don't skip every post you will have a window into the mind of how people feel, from both end of the spectrum regarding: guns, state control and lobbies, political donation, respect of contracts, online social mobilization, flow of money without the use of a credit card service, capitalism and bitcoin.

Of course I am not implying you did skip the whole thread