Opinion on the US

[dank]

Where is OWHH?

[tvbcof]

In some sense I see things organizing much like Orwell predicted in his 1984 with Oceania, Eurasia and Eastasia, but Western Europe ended up being part of Oceania (aka, 'the West'.)

no, that's still gonna play out. Anti-US sentiment at governmental level here is rising with the recent NSA revelations, they have even been talking about an "European Internet" (not that they have any clue, but just to show the tendencies).

Ya, I sometimes muse about the most likely way for Orwell's prediction to complete.  One must define such an entity by the makeup of it's 'inner party', and I think that it is as true in Europe as it is in the US that individuals of the 'inner party' and those who comprise the government are not particularly the same set.  My best scenario is if we went through a global economic collapse period where value was defined by gold, and the US simply flat out appropriated Germany's (which is pretty much certain to happen.)  At that point, coupled with Russia's energy supplies and favorable geography to gain control of energy transport routes, I could imagine Germany simply switching sides.  Being such a powerhouse, I've little doubt that the rest of Europe would follow (sans GB of course.)

Ultimately I suspect that the PNAC folk were right in that there is room for one more period of hegemony in a multi-polar world before a single entity takes over completely.  Even if they are right it does not mean that such a structure could not fragment but it might be difficult to provoke.  Anyway we are looking out several centuries for this stuff.  I personally, for whatever reason, find myself more comfortable and preferring a plethora of smaller states who jealously guard their independence and do the right thing as much as possible.

[galbros]

I am beginning to think China is a country with more democracy then the US. I can't wait when China is the most powerful country in the world, and knock US off the rank.

You may get your wish, but the recent experience of countries like the Philippines gives a preview of how much fun it is to deal with an ascendant China.

There is no doubt that US power is eroding and the NSA spying is horrible but there is still a lot of idealism in the US and its problems are on the front page for everyone to see.  Many other countries try and hide and cover up their problems often attempting to deflect blame somehow to the US.  

[dragonkid]

I am beginning to think China is a country with more democracy then the US. I can't wait when China is the most powerful country in the world, and knock US off the rank.

You may get your wish, but the recent experience of countries like the Philippines gives a preview of how much fun it is to deal with an ascendant China.

There is no doubt that US power is eroding and the NSA spying is horrible but there is still a lot of idealism in the US and its problems are on the front page for everyone to see.  Many other countries try and hide and cover up their problems often attempting to deflect blame somehow to the US.  

Actually according to the history lesson, China explore the entire world in 1405. They were peaceful and just do trading and visiting different countries. http://www.economist.com/node/5381851

Whereas, when the Westerner explore around the world in 1492. They went around conquering different countries and killing other native people to steal from them.

If China become the most powerful country in the world. There will be no more war. Unlike the US, which love war. If you look at all the history, how many countries have they ruin? Just recent years; Vietnam, Iraq, Afghanistan, and they are targeting Iran next. How many war has China started in the recent years?

I do believe the world will be a much more peaceful place to live in. 

[MerchantMiner]

I am beginning to think China is a country with more democracy then the US. I can't wait when China is the most powerful country in the world, and knock US off the rank.

You may get your wish, but the recent experience of countries like the Philippines gives a preview of how much fun it is to deal with an ascendant China.

There is no doubt that US power is eroding and the NSA spying is horrible but there is still a lot of idealism in the US and its problems are on the front page for everyone to see.  Many other countries try and hide and cover up their problems often attempting to deflect blame somehow to the US.  

Actually according to the history lesson, China explore the entire world in 1405. They were peaceful and just do trading and visiting different countries. http://www.economist.com/node/5381851

Whereas, when the Westerner explore around the world in 1492. They went around conquering different countries and killing other native people to steal from them.

If China become the most powerful country in the world. There will be no more war. Unlike the US, which love war. If you look at all the history, how many countries have they ruin? Just recent years; Vietnam, Iraq, Afghanistan, and they are targeting Iran next. How many war has China started in the recent years?

I do believe the world will be a much more peaceful place to live in. 

your crazy man ..............so the Chinese didn't brutally murder the monks in Tibet shutting down all the monastery and crushing there religion!!!!!!!!!!!!!  that the Chinese didn't kill 100,000,s of there own people when they decided to rise up against them. im sorry but your a fucking idiot to post that , go read a book on Chinese history man   

[dragonkid]

I am beginning to think China is a country with more democracy then the US. I can't wait when China is the most powerful country in the world, and knock US off the rank.

You may get your wish, but the recent experience of countries like the Philippines gives a preview of how much fun it is to deal with an ascendant China.

There is no doubt that US power is eroding and the NSA spying is horrible but there is still a lot of idealism in the US and its problems are on the front page for everyone to see.  Many other countries try and hide and cover up their problems often attempting to deflect blame somehow to the US.   

Actually according to the history lesson, China explore the entire world in 1405. They were peaceful and just do trading and visiting different countries. http://www.economist.com/node/5381851

Whereas, when the Westerner explore around the world in 1492. They went around conquering different countries and killing other native people to steal from them.

If China become the most powerful country in the world. There will be no more war. Unlike the US, which love war. If you look at all the history, how many countries have they ruin? Just recent years; Vietnam, Iraq, Afghanistan, and they are targeting Iran next. How many war has China started in the recent years?

I do believe the world will be a much more peaceful place to live in. 

your crazy man ..............so the Chinese didn't brutally murder the monks in Tibet shutting down all the monastery and crushing there religion!!!!!!!!!!!!!  that the Chinese didn't kill 100,000,s of there own people when they decided to rise up against them. im sorry but your a fucking idiot to post that , go read a book on Chinese history man   

How many people and countries have the American destroy, including their own soldiers who goes to war? How many people have the American killed? Compare that to the Chinese, I think the US killed more people. Also fire work was invented by the Chinese to do celebration. The western countries reinvented the gun power to kill. How many people have been killed by the weapons sold by the US? Count all that then tell me, isn't China more peaceful? If you talk about religion US is attacking all the Islam countries. China only attacked Tibet. You said China had kill 100,000s of their own people. How many Native American Indian was killed by the American? How many people was kill in the civil war? 

[MerchantMiner]

I am beginning to think China is a country with more democracy then the US. I can't wait when China is the most powerful country in the world, and knock US off the rank.

You may get your wish, but the recent experience of countries like the Philippines gives a preview of how much fun it is to deal with an ascendant China.

There is no doubt that US power is eroding and the NSA spying is horrible but there is still a lot of idealism in the US and its problems are on the front page for everyone to see.  Many other countries try and hide and cover up their problems often attempting to deflect blame somehow to the US.   

Actually according to the history lesson, China explore the entire world in 1405. They were peaceful and just do trading and visiting different countries. http://www.economist.com/node/5381851

Whereas, when the Westerner explore around the world in 1492. They went around conquering different countries and killing other native people to steal from them.

If China become the most powerful country in the world. There will be no more war. Unlike the US, which love war. If you look at all the history, how many countries have they ruin? Just recent years; Vietnam, Iraq, Afghanistan, and they are targeting Iran next. How many war has China started in the recent years?

I do believe the world will be a much more peaceful place to live in. 

your crazy man ..............so the Chinese didn't brutally murder the monks in Tibet shutting down all the monastery and crushing there religion!!!!!!!!!!!!!  that the Chinese didn't kill 100,000,s of there own people when they decided to rise up against them. im sorry but your a fucking idiot to post that , go read a book on Chinese history man   

How many people and countries have the American destroy, including their own soldiers who goes to war? How many people have the American killed? Compare that to the Chinese, I think the US killed more people. Also fire work was invented by the Chinese to do celebration. The western countries reinvented the gun power to kill. How many people have been killed by the weapons sold by the US? Count all that then tell me, isn't China more peaceful? If you talk about religion US is attacking all the Islam countries. China only attacked Tibet. You said China had kill 100,000s of their own people. How many Native American Indian was killed by the American? How many people was kill in the civil war? 

your a twat............... did i support the US NO, did i defend the US NO....... what the fuck you talking about!!!!! dosnt matter how many people one people killed they still killed people your an R-Tard!! the chinese are taking over the planet and that alone will lead to war and the deaths of millions of people , your such a massive fucking stupid fucking twat cunt fuck face prick cunt . people like you make me fucking sick with your short sighted opinion i hate WAR i hate the need for the killing of people for resources of the greedy oligarchs of this world . your comment was ANTI American and ANTI HUMANITY i seek peace for all mankind and advocate war to the mentally ILL people like you.

Dose anyone talk about the Spanish killing millions of people in the south Americas NO THEY DONT
Dose anyone talk about the Millions Killed By Ghengas Khan NO THEY DONT
Dose anyone talk about the 6 Million Horses Killed in world war 2 NO THEY DONT
Dose anyone talk about the Millions Killed by Man Made Virus's that are produced by multiple country's NO THEY DONT 

you are a fuck-tard go fuck your own face

To all other members of this forum im sorry for my rage at this person

[dragonkid]

your a fucking idiot to post that , go read a book on Chinese history man  

your a twat...............  what the fuck you talking about!!!!!  your an R-Tard!!
your such a massive fucking stupid fucking twat cunt fuck face prick cunt . people like you make me fucking sick with your short sighted opinion

Dose anyone talk about the Spanish killing millions of people in the south Americas NO THEY DONT
Dose anyone talk about the Millions Killed By Ghengas Khan NO THEY DONT
Dose anyone talk about the 6 Million Horses Killed in world war 2 NO THEY DONT
Dose anyone talk about the Millions Killed by Man Made Virus's that are produced by multiple country's NO THEY DONT  

you are a fuck-tard go fuck your own face

To all other members of this forum im sorry for my rage at this person

I do think you are over reacting, mate. Why all the insult? Did I call you any names? The topic of this discussion is about "Opinion on the US". So of course I only focus on the US!!

You should calm down, I have my right to my opinion. All those insults are uncalled for.  

Also shouldn't you be saying sorry to me, instead of to all the other members of this forum, which you didn't insult to? 

[tvbcof]

@dragonkid

As I see it, China has some significant problems.  Overpopulation and poor land for agraculture for one.  China spends more on internal security than external defence because, like most nations, the most salient threat is from it's own people.  We'd be the same except that we spend such a huge amount to support our far flung empire.

China also is getting reamed by the US since we've parked in the Middle East and control access to energy at the moment.

By militarizing heavily for external conflict and eventually engaging, China would kill a bunch of birds with one stone.  Rally people around the flag so they forget their domestic problems, reduce their population and re-adjust the gender gap, end up parked in the Middle East and in control of land-based energy routes, control farm land in Africa, etc.  China could lose 10-to-1 against the US and still win (Most people achieve a 1 to 10 body count ratio against us, but then we normally fight on foreign soil and count women, children, pigs, etc.)

Anyway, I hope for everyone's sake that China's leaders don't take up my ideas, but I suspect that eventually the solution will turn out to be to sweet to pass up.  Particularly if they are looking at a revolution and loss of power anyway.

[Swordsoffreedom]

I kind of laughed when I voted for fat people and saw it was the most voted choice

And to both
China had evil US Had evil
Superpowers tend to do evil XD

[dancupid]

@dragonkid

As I see it, China has some significant problems.  Overpopulation and poor land for agraculture for one.  

Minor point about overpopulation - China has about half the population density of the UK and is much less than many western European countries. Spain and France are lower.
ie China doesn't have a population problem.

China will not put resources into an international conflict - if they do they will open up possibilities internally for revolution (that's how Mao came to power in the first place).
The Chinese do not want another revolution - they just want to get rich.

[fattypig]

I vote for Fat People, everyone is eating too much McDonald.

[dragonkid]

@dragonkid

As I see it, China has some significant problems.  Overpopulation and poor land for agraculture for one.  

Minor point about overpopulation - China has about half the population density of the UK and is much less than many western European countries. Spain and France are lower.
ie China doesn't have a population problem.

China will not put resources into an international conflict - if they do they will open up possibilities internally for revolution (that's how Mao came to power in the first place).
The Chinese do not want another revolution - they just want to get rich.

That is my perspective why if China is the most powerful country in the world. The world will be a more peaceful place.

Imagine, when that happens US or UK, want to start a war on some random country. Then they will ask for China's approval, China will just tell them, forget about fighting and just make money.

Whereas in the present moment, anything happens in the world, when US see they can get gain from it. They just go to war without consent from even the UN.

So when China is the big brother in the world stage, they probably will still monitor their own people. But they can also declare it as terrorism, when NSA or GCHQ want to spy on the world.

By the way, I am British. In case anyone is wondering. So I am neutral in this discussion.

[tvbcof]

That is my perspective why if China is the most powerful country in the world. The world will be a more peaceful place.

Imagine, when that happens US or UK, want to start a war on some random country. Then they will ask for China's approval, China will just tell them, forget about fighting and just make money.

...

A guy can only make so much money supplying tennis shoes to the world.  At some point it occurs to folks that money is simply a means to something more...usually this occurs after making a lot of money.  To a decent person, what comes after money is happiness, and that comes from doing decent things.  To a not so decent person, it is raw power.  Unfortunately those in a leadership position tend to favor the latter (which is related to why they seeked out a leadership position in the first place most likely.)

I suspect that it is foolish to suppose that whoever can gain control of 1x10^9 Chinese would be notably more benevolent as rulers of planet earth than any other individual or group.

Commoners rarely want to fight their peers in other nations absent a pretty robust engineering effort by their leaders.  To me the best hope is to empower common individuals to make decisions about geopolitical direction.  Wars of conquest would then be quite unlikely I believe as people would tend to be focused on, as you say, making money.

[Oldgamer]

I would like to know the general opinion of my country.
Nobody seems to like it, I don't really like it and it has this weird dollar thing.

Why you just don't leave your country then?
Nobody will miss you probably

[knight22]

I would like to know the general opinion of my country.
Nobody seems to like it, I don't really like it and it has this weird dollar thing.

Why you just don't leave your country then?
Nobody will miss you probably

Typical answer from a purist American 

[Oldgamer]

For some communists "purist American" sounds same as evil.

[knight22]

USA is now one of the biggest communist country of the world. A country ruled by a government sponsored by big monopolies and backed by a private entity called the FED.

The problem with american people is that they are having a hard time to face that new reality. They prefer lies rather the ugly truth.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5fbvquHSPJU

[knight22]

BTW that system is not very different for most of occidental countries. America is just leading the way.

[Oldgamer]

USA is now one of the biggest communist country of the world. A country ruled by a government sponsored by big monopolies and backed by a private entity called the FED.

The problem with american people is that they are having a hard time to face that new reality. They prefer lies rather the ugly truth.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5fbvquHSPJU

I can agree that thanks to all very popular now pro communist views USA is not a country as it was before.
In 1929 US made more goods than all other world in total. Now we do not produce even t-shits. Thanks to welfare and other social programs we create a class of people who just suck that system generation by generation.
Sure they will vote for any moron who will promise them more freebies. And a lot of politicians just rely on this group of people which became the biggest one. Now private business can not even fire the employee without asking union first. This is a shame.