How can alts grow independent of btc?

[DikkieD]

I am having a hard time understanding the real connection between bitcoin and the alts.

I understand btc (and also eth & ltc) have the upper hand being fiat trading pairs, so conversions go through those first.

But how can altcoins grow independently from btc in the future? What needs to change for alts to exist without the bond with bitcoin? It is merely market share (flippening?) or are there other factors in play?

And is it realistic to think alts should grow in value, when token holders are actually not investing in the token (merely speculating, since you can make tons with even the worse coins)?

Let's say I refer only to actual projects with real value and real products. How will these grow in value even if btc would stay hovering between 5k/10k? Is this even possible? Or can alts only increase in value if btc increases in value. So for a new altcoin to reach a much higher value, btc has to at least reach ath again?

[Yuuto]

I am having a hard time understanding the real connection between bitcoin and the alts.

I understand btc (and also eth & ltc) have the upper hand being fiat trading pairs, so conversions go through those first.

But how can altcoins grow independently from btc in the future? What needs to change for alts to exist without the bond with bitcoin? It is merely market share (flippening?) or are there other factors in play?

And is it realistic to think alts should grow in value, when token holders are actually not investing in the token (merely speculating, since you can make tons with even the worse coins)?

Let's say I refer only to actual projects with real value and real products. How will these grow in value even if btc would stay hovering between 5k/10k? Is this even possible? Or can alts only increase in value if btc increases in value. So for a new altcoin to reach a much higher value, btc has to at least reach ath again?

In general, there will always be a much better chance for alts to go up as bitcoin goes up.

We're already seeing some alts being directly paired to USD which potentially could weaken the ties between alts and BTC. But BTC is still going to be the main indicator of a bearish or bullish crypto market, which includes the rest of the alts.

If you invest in real projects with real values, then you should be fine. Long term these projects will stand out and make its mark on the market while going up in value. Don't worry about it.

[tung06081989]

alts can grow independent of btc? it is impossible,because today market capitalization of btc is so big with the rest of market,btc is still  the leader of market

[Jimmy palumbo]

I think it will be very hard, because when the bitcoin have a sharp decline, and most investors will choose to sell various encryption currency, so will lead to all sorts of altcoin a drop in prices.

[St4yInTh3D4rk]

Until the growth of altcoins depends on the bitcoin because bitcoin got trust from the investors so other people are investing on the altcoins due to the success for the first crypto the bitcoin.But there is no connection between the price of bitcoin and altcoin but indirectly connected by people's mindset.So only chance to grow altcoins when we can grow bitcoin.

[Piskeante]

that is impossible because 99% of the coins outthere are only valuable due to the possibility to exchange them to BTC.

Since BTC requires a heavily expensive hardware to be mined and it's almost impossible to get one, everybody that wants BTC, can mine alt-coins and then trade them to BTC, with a big positive thing: Alt coins with low difficulty mining rate are very desirable for miners, because they get a lot of that coin.

So, can alts grow independent of BTC the big and great answer is NO!!!!!!

[Ix]

Alts can separate by having substantially different monetary schemes. Any that have pyramid-like distribution schemes (virtually all of them right now) are all going to wax and wane roughly the same as money enters and leaves the market since there is very little that actually distinguishes them from one another.

[kevoh]

I am having a hard time understanding the real connection between bitcoin and the alts.

I understand btc (and also eth & ltc) have the upper hand being fiat trading pairs, so conversions go through those first.

But how can altcoins grow independently from btc in the future? What needs to change for alts to exist without the bond with bitcoin? It is merely market share (flippening?) or are there other factors in play?

And is it realistic to think alts should grow in value, when token holders are actually not investing in the token (merely speculating, since you can make tons with even the worse coins)?

Let's say I refer only to actual projects with real value and real products. How will these grow in value even if btc would stay hovering between 5k/10k? Is this even possible? Or can alts only increase in value if btc increases in value. So for a new altcoin to reach a much higher value, btc has to at least reach ath again?

Altcoins will need to be pegged against another strong and dominant coin for it to exist without the bond with bitcoin or over time (probably in the future) when everyone begin to recognize and use altcoins as a different entity from bitcoin before they will be an independence.

[DikkieD]

In general, there will always be a much better chance for alts to go up as bitcoin goes up.

We're already seeing some alts being directly paired to USD which potentially could weaken the ties between alts and BTC. But BTC is still going to be the main indicator of a bearish or bullish crypto market, which includes the rest of the alts.

If you invest in real projects with real values, then you should be fine. Long term these projects will stand out and make its mark on the market while going up in value. Don't worry about it.

Ok. A positive stance towards lesser ties. So it could mostly be a matter of the current pairing of btc to usd? I am invested in pretty good alts, but I still find it hard to believe people could abandon those projects so easily when btc drops

alts can grow independent of btc? it is impossible,because today market capitalization of btc is so big with the rest of market,btc is still  the leader of market

Yes, today it is. But will it stay this way. Will people keep accepting this bond, while it doesn't stand for real blockchain innovation anymore (to many)?

I think it will be very hard, because when the bitcoin have a sharp decline, and most investors will choose to sell various encryption currency, so will lead to all sorts of altcoin a drop in prices.

So it is the opportunistic nature of people in crypto. They see a fall of BTC as a chance to get more $$$ (or of course more BTC) in the end. But how does this rhyme with actually believing in certain alt projects being capable of making a genuine difference. Is this less important than the value of each individual's PF? You're perfectly right.....if BTC drops even a little many alts - even those with great prospects - will go down the drain faster than light. Of course all recover pretty fast usually, but still...

Until the growth of altcoins depends on the bitcoin because bitcoin got trust from the investors so other people are investing on the altcoins due to the success for the first crypto the bitcoin.But there is no connection between the price of bitcoin and altcoin but indirectly connected by people's mindset.So only chance to grow altcoins when we can grow bitcoin.

But those investors you refer to are a tiny % of whales that almost own every btc? So aren't we all being played when buying altcoins, even when the projects are real (or they are not, which doens't really matter from a speculative stance).

[Ini35]

Altcoin is sometimes linked with Bitcoin in trading, where Altcoin is traded against Bitcoins but mainly because it is considered as the most stable. So in a way, Altcoin value may seem pegged to Bitcoin value but you can trade Altcoin with each other entirely independent of Bitcoin. Altcoin can follow and adjust the price due to changes in the price of Bitcoin.
Nontheless, if altcoins that follow the trend of being paired with other currencies. There will be some forms of independencies.

[DikkieD]

Altcoins will need to be pegged against another strong and dominant coin for it to exist without the bond with bitcoin.

Hmmm...but in that case btc will simply be replaced by the next btc . I was hoping a situation is possible where all coins in existance have their own tie to each other coin, call it a decentralized value

[DikkieD]

Altcoin is sometimes linked with Bitcoin in trading, where Altcoin is traded against Bitcoins but mainly because it is considered as the most stable. So in a way, Altcoin value may seem pegged to Bitcoin value but you can trade Altcoin with each other entirely independent of Bitcoin. Altcoin can follow and adjust the price due to changes in the price of Bitcoin.
Nontheless, if altcoins that follow the trend of being paired with other currencies. There will be some forms of independencies.

But who decides the pairs? Exchanges do, so in a way they keep this tight bond intact. They apparently do not want a decentralized solution, they need btc being this important.....their main source of income depends on it....

[Manc89]

I am having a hard time understanding the real connection between bitcoin and the alts.

I understand btc (and also eth & ltc) have the upper hand being fiat trading pairs, so conversions go through those first.

But how can altcoins grow independently from btc in the future? What needs to change for alts to exist without the bond with bitcoin? It is merely market share (flippening?) or are there other factors in play?

And is it realistic to think alts should grow in value, when token holders are actually not investing in the token (merely speculating, since you can make tons with even the worse coins)?

Let's say I refer only to actual projects with real value and real products. How will these grow in value even if btc would stay hovering between 5k/10k? Is this even possible? Or can alts only increase in value if btc increases in value. So for a new altcoin to reach a much higher value, btc has to at least reach ath again?

This is good question and need good analysis to answer.
Though i am not doing good research about this but i can say something about this.
Some exchange have fiat pair to altcoin which is not depend on bitcoin and etherium.
They can still grow compare to fiat though bitcoin stuck in its price.

[DikkieD]

I am having a hard time understanding the real connection between bitcoin and the alts.

I understand btc (and also eth & ltc) have the upper hand being fiat trading pairs, so conversions go through those first.

But how can altcoins grow independently from btc in the future? What needs to change for alts to exist without the bond with bitcoin? It is merely market share (flippening?) or are there other factors in play?

And is it realistic to think alts should grow in value, when token holders are actually not investing in the token (merely speculating, since you can make tons with even the worse coins)?

Let's say I refer only to actual projects with real value and real products. How will these grow in value even if btc would stay hovering between 5k/10k? Is this even possible? Or can alts only increase in value if btc increases in value. So for a new altcoin to reach a much higher value, btc has to at least reach ath again?

This is good question and need good analysis to answer.
Though i am not doing good research about this but i can say something about this.
Some exchange have fiat pair to altcoin which is not depend on bitcoin and etherium.
They can still grow compare to fiat though bitcoin stuck in its price.

Lol. Very subtle

Anyways. I know there's quite a few progress being made in terms of new exchanges. But will they solve the btc (or single coin) dominance?

[piterpie]

I am having a hard time understanding the real connection between bitcoin and the alts.

I understand btc (and also eth & ltc) have the upper hand being fiat trading pairs, so conversions go through those first.

But how can altcoins grow independently from btc in the future? What needs to change for alts to exist without the bond with bitcoin? It is merely market share (flippening?) or are there other factors in play?

And is it realistic to think alts should grow in value, when token holders are actually not investing in the token (merely speculating, since you can make tons with even the worse coins)?

Let's say I refer only to actual projects with real value and real products. How will these grow in value even if btc would stay hovering between 5k/10k? Is this even possible? Or can alts only increase in value if btc increases in value. So for a new altcoin to reach a much higher value, btc has to at least reach ath again?

The currencies now have their distinct development platforms, no money is needed for support elsewhere, in my country, all virtual currencies like Bitcoin or Ethereum are government bonds. But there are still many people who invest and make a profit. I think Alts is a future currency.

[Sandeepmanwall]

Altcoin can follow and adjust the price due to changes in the price of Bitcoin.I think that it will be very hard, because when the bitcoin have a sharp decline, and most investors will choose to sell various encryption currency, so will lead to all sorts of altcoin a drop in prices.where altcoin is traded against bitcoin but mainly because it is considered as the most stable.

[DikkieD]

Altcoin can follow and adjust the price due to changes in the price of Bitcoin.I think that it will be very hard, because when the bitcoin have a sharp decline, and most investors will choose to sell various encryption currency, so will lead to all sorts of altcoin a drop in prices.where altcoin is traded against bitcoin but mainly because it is considered as the most stable.

Most stable? I think it is mostly because whales can make the easiest money from it...

[yugyug]

If we compare it to forex Bitcoin is like a US dollar for foreign exchange currency, all forex are relativley dependent to dollar so as to alts where they are relatively dependent to bitcoin as it the latter is the dominance of cryptocurrency. Moreover if there are new crypto king arise just the the contender the Ethereum, soon alts dependency to bitcoin will be divided.