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Author Topic: No mining hardware is worth buying  (Read 14840 times)
Xian01
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October 16, 2013, 11:38:20 PM
#61



 < curls up into fetal position and rocks back-and-forth, mumbling under breath incoherently >
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October 17, 2013, 02:45:10 AM
#62

I'm still sitting on my thought that the difficulty will be 1.8 billion by april 2014.  That's according to what the hardware manufacturers have promised.

Lsst time I ran the numbers, 0.18 BTC/gigahash would make ROI by april. Now, I think it's ~0.13/gigahash...
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October 17, 2013, 03:55:33 AM
#63

I'm still sitting on my thought that the difficulty will be 1.8 billion by april 2014.  That's according to what the hardware manufacturers have promised.

Lsst time I ran the numbers, 0.18 BTC/gigahash would make ROI by april. Now, I think it's ~0.13/gigahash...

How much difficulty increment did you use in your calculation?

peonminer
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October 17, 2013, 04:14:17 AM
#64

Wat is this cex.io dividend you are mentioning?
hulk
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October 17, 2013, 04:59:19 AM
#65

Wat is this cex.io dividend you are mentioning?

Well, I can answer your question, the hash you buy from cex.io is mining continuously and thus giving you some Bitcoin. You can call it instant pure mining.

newguy05
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October 17, 2013, 05:13:09 AM
#66

Bitfury August delivery is definitely positive.
bitfury august was >2x the current price, 400GH at $18k (or was it 19k dont remember exactly), they took delivery at the very end of august.

Not factor in the bitcoin/usd price increase as you never should for roi calculations,  please enlighten on that hardware is "definitely positive"

Ok, let me try that: I don't have any of this Bitfury full-kit 400GHs units so can't testify first hand (if someone has them please confirm or deny), but let's say they started mining Sept. 1st to be on the safe side, although some did few days earlier. According to reverse mining calculations it already earned close to 80 BTC, maybe few BTC more or less. 400GHs will mine around around 35-40BTC more before network difficulty reduces mining income to satoshies, so it will return around 120 BTC mining in profitable conditions. Bitfury is energy efficient, so it will continue to grind over electricity costs even in double-digit PHs conditions. Don't need to calculate that in fiat, although they were paid in fiat and not in BTC, but it looks to me that whoever invested in that at the beginning of July is looking at his wallet and smiling to the current ASIC buyers.

sorry but that still doesnt make any sense to me. 

1) Let's use your 120 BTC return (even though i think it's very optimistic)
2) Hardware cost $18000
3) BTC/USD price at time of purchase $100  (it was below 100 but lets just use 100 for simplicity sake)

4) $18000 would yielded 180 BTC if purchased direct btc instead of mining hardware.
5) Factoring in today's $150 price, 120 BTC mined * $150 = $18000 = break even not factoring in any electricity cost etc..

So i still dont understand how the people who took delivery at end of august is profitable or making money, at best they will breakeven after months more, if difficulty continue to go up the way they do now, they will not make that 120 BTC but less and lose money.

Cannot compute...


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newguy05
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October 17, 2013, 05:13:53 AM
#67


 cex.io -  i am not clear exactly what happens in the background, when you buy 1 GH who physically holds this 1 GH of hardware and mines for you?  

can someone please answer this? thanks

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jamie10511
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October 17, 2013, 02:46:30 PM
#68

YOU ARE ALL WRONG

ALL ASICS MAKE PERFECT ROI

YOU JUST HAVE TO KNOW HOW TO DO IT

FOR SOME REASON THE INSTRUCTIONS SAID TURN IT ON AND HASH AND MAKE LOADZZZ OF MONEY

WELL THE INSTRUCTIONS CAME FROM THE CHINESE MANUFACTURERS who can't write english well

THE CORRECT INSTRUCTIONS WERE BUY AND SELL TO OTHER PEOPLE ON EBAY FOR AS MUCH AS POSSIBLE

IF YOU HAD FOLLOWED THE CORRECT INSTRUCTIONS YOU WOULD HAVE MADE LOADZZ OF FREE MONEY

AND PLENTY OF ROI

JUST MY 0.02BTC
klondike_bar
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October 17, 2013, 03:24:50 PM
#69

YOU ARE ALL WRONG

ALL ASICS MAKE PERFECT ROI

YOU JUST HAVE TO KNOW HOW TO DO IT

FOR SOME REASON THE INSTRUCTIONS SAID TURN IT ON AND HASH AND MAKE LOADZZZ OF MONEY

WELL THE INSTRUCTIONS CAME FROM THE CHINESE MANUFACTURERS who can't write english well

THE CORRECT INSTRUCTIONS WERE BUY AND SELL TO OTHER PEOPLE ON EBAY FOR AS MUCH AS POSSIBLE

IF YOU HAD FOLLOWED THE CORRECT INSTRUCTIONS YOU WOULD HAVE MADE LOADZZ OF FREE MONEY

AND PLENTY OF ROI

JUST MY 0.02BTC

you might be right, but with all the bolded shouting and spelling errors its hard to tell if you are smart or on crack

24" PCI-E cables with 16AWG wires and stripped ends - great for server PSU mods, best prices https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=563461 also selling 6" M-F-M PCIe splitters and PCIe-PCIe
No longer a wannabe - now an ASIC owner!
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October 17, 2013, 03:50:03 PM
#70

I'm still sitting on my thought that the difficulty will be 1.8 billion by april 2014.  That's according to what the hardware manufacturers have promised.

Lsst time I ran the numbers, 0.18 BTC/gigahash would make ROI by april. Now, I think it's ~0.13/gigahash...

How much difficulty increment did you use in your calculation?

I use the btcinvest calculator.  I think it was 30% with 8% less per jump gets you to 1.8 billion. 25% with 5% less also did it...

Go to the calculator, say you have 1 gigahash, and play with different difficulty changes that give 1.8 billion in april.  Then you can see how much BTC you generate.

But remember, this 1.8 billion in april assumes that all hardware manufacturers sell out, (or mine themselves with what they don't sell...) and that they deliver on time.

ALSO, there may be unpublicized hardware incoming too.
jamie10511
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October 17, 2013, 07:06:16 PM
#71

YOU ARE ALL WRONG

ALL ASICS MAKE PERFECT ROI

YOU JUST HAVE TO KNOW HOW TO DO IT

FOR SOME REASON THE INSTRUCTIONS SAID TURN IT ON AND HASH AND MAKE LOADZZZ OF MONEY

WELL THE INSTRUCTIONS CAME FROM THE CHINESE MANUFACTURERS who can't write english well

THE CORRECT INSTRUCTIONS WERE BUY AND SELL TO OTHER PEOPLE ON EBAY FOR AS MUCH AS POSSIBLE

IF YOU HAD FOLLOWED THE CORRECT INSTRUCTIONS YOU WOULD HAVE MADE LOADZZ OF FREE MONEY

AND PLENTY OF ROI

JUST MY 0.02BTC

you might be right, but with all the bolded shouting and spelling errors its hard to tell if you are smart or on crack

i am smart and i am whispering
there are loadzz of spelling errors  ha ha
the real smiley ☺ not the fake one  Smiley
tinus42
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October 17, 2013, 07:12:59 PM
#72

YOU ARE ALL WRONG

ALL ASICS MAKE PERFECT ROI

YOU JUST HAVE TO KNOW HOW TO DO IT

FOR SOME REASON THE INSTRUCTIONS SAID TURN IT ON AND HASH AND MAKE LOADZZZ OF MONEY

WELL THE INSTRUCTIONS CAME FROM THE CHINESE MANUFACTURERS who can't write english well

THE CORRECT INSTRUCTIONS WERE BUY AND SELL TO OTHER PEOPLE ON EBAY FOR AS MUCH AS POSSIBLE

IF YOU HAD FOLLOWED THE CORRECT INSTRUCTIONS YOU WOULD HAVE MADE LOADZZ OF FREE MONEY

AND PLENTY OF ROI

JUST MY 0.02BTC


Jamie Dimon is that you? Grin
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October 17, 2013, 10:43:09 PM
#73

There is no incentive to smile at anyone. The only satisfaction which is left is that the miners are the peons who make this industry work and without their sacrifice, bitcoin may not succeed. As such, giving up opportunity gains (loss of potential profit) when mining may be a small price to pay in the grand scheme of things.
Wow, this was beautifully stated. Almost poetic and definitely the truth of the matter. Thank you for that. 

1MoBi1eNbqh8QMuvtZjYzQGV8NEckJJYcT rep|GnuPG <3 CLAM <3
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October 22, 2013, 03:43:24 PM
#74

Who cares of ROI... My rigs are bought with cash... From poker. Now I have good money. Poker is illigal in my country. BTC is not. So my pokerwinnings are now good. I am happy to pay tax...
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October 22, 2013, 06:47:27 PM
#75

Who cares of ROI... My rigs are bought with cash... From poker. Now I have good money. Poker is illigal in my country. BTC is not. So my pokerwinnings are now good. I am happy to pay tax...

So what you're saying is that you're okay with mining at a loss because it enables you to launder your illegal gambling winnings.  Got it.
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October 23, 2013, 04:59:27 AM
#76

Who cares of ROI... My rigs are bought with cash... From poker. Now I have good money. Poker is illigal in my country. BTC is not. So my pokerwinnings are now good. I am happy to pay tax...

So what you're saying is that you're okay with mining at a loss because it enables you to launder your illegal gambling winnings.  Got it.

Or you could say I have no real loss, since I do not think of my pokerwinnings as real money. I know its stupid, but for me it works. I also have free power, so even next year my TH/s is stil going to make me money. I think mining supports the Bitcoin better then hoarding and speculation. Transactionfees, and so on. All hardware investments into bitcoin is a risk. I think ppl should only invest what they can afford to loose.... I do not play poker any more, since I hated the idiots doing it. Greed and machobullshit...but the winnings made me able to buy miningrigs, and I do not have to think about R.O.I
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October 23, 2013, 10:38:37 AM
#77

resell on ebay for a profit...hah I'd like to see that one....it only worked between the months of June and August...that shit doesn't work anymore because casual folks can understand that hardware is overpriced in terms of difficulty....also the genesis block calculator really put people's calclations in check to where they realize that you don't make thousands upon thousands of dollars  instantly from bitcoin like you could have back in april with a 50 GH miner like I hoped I would have.

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October 23, 2013, 05:14:50 PM
#78

Who cares of ROI... My rigs are bought with cash... From poker. Now I have good money. Poker is illigal in my country. BTC is not. So my pokerwinnings are now good. I am happy to pay tax...

oh, it's banned in norway?  online poker isn't banned in the USA, just funding it is. 

i thought USA + Australia were the only two countries with restrictions...

norway is member of WTO since 1995, same as US.  were they forced to pay up millions in concessions to antigua as well?

Dacentec, best deals for US dedicated servers. They regularly restock $20-$25 Opterons with 8-16GB RAM & 2x1-2TB HDD's (ofc, usually lots of other good stuff to choose from).  I did a Serverbear benchmark of one of my $20/mo Opteron (June last year), it's here.  Have had about a half dozen different servers with Dacentec, & none have failed to sustain at least 40MB/s (burst higher). My favorite is a 12-month rent-to-own ZT Systems 2XL5520 16GB 2x2TB SATA for $40/month (got lucky with the 'off-brand', haven't seen a RTO 2xL5520 for under $50/mo since -- at least for monthly contracts).  wholesaleinternet.com has some ancient 2-core intel CPUs @ $10/mo sometimes (I got an Intel Core 2 6300 @ 1.86GHz, with a 250GB HDD with 46000 hours on it, LOL. $20 @ Dacentec is much better, if you can grab one). joesdatacenter.com (same location as Wholesale Internet) also occasionally has specials (or if you don't want to wait, it has an AMD Opteron 170 @ $16/mo).
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October 25, 2013, 07:18:55 AM
#79

According to genesis calculator - no minor is worth buying anymore - there are no returns on investments unless bitcoin price goes up to match the increase in difficulty. Like 300, 500, or 1000 price levels.

I'm going to stick to cloud mining for now.  I'm cancelling all my miner orders.
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October 25, 2013, 10:20:34 AM
#80

According to genesis calculator - no minor is worth buying anymore - there are no returns on investments unless bitcoin price goes up to match the increase in difficulty. Like 300, 500, or 1000 price levels.

I'm going to stick to cloud mining for now.  I'm cancelling all my miner orders.

Even cloud mining isn't profitable Smiley
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