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Author Topic: why bitcoin isnt illegal and will not be made illegal  (Read 1074 times)
Anon136
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October 17, 2013, 03:57:45 PM
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If governments were to make bitcoin illegal than that would stop people from using it about as well as making cannabis illegal has stopped people from smoking pot. The only real effect of making it illegal would be to drive legitimate markets underground. we would see websites like the silk road where you could buy shaving creme, bath tissue, or those little coolaid packs. This would back them into a position where it would be politically untenable crack down on markets that are so apparently benign while at the same time people participating in this economy would be building an infrastructure that was parallel to the white economy but entirely disconnected from it. in short they would be inviting agorism, they would be creating a situation where it was in the economic interest of normal non activists to unwittingly become agorists purely out of self interest and this would reduce peoples perceived and real dependance on the state.

this is why we have the feds cracking down on silk road and opening their arms to white market bitcoin businesses. they want to pull this thing into the white markets. of course if you think through the logic its apparent that this is still not a good thing for their money printing monopoly so of course they would like to just make bitcoin not exist if that was possible. the only reason they are trying to pull it into the white markets is because they know they cant kill it, the learned this from napster and bittorrent, they are simply choosing the option that is to them less damning.

what does this mean for us? well its a good thing for the future wealth of early adopters, its probably a bad thing for the future health of the species as a whole. here i think for the same reasons that it would be on net bad for them from their perspective to make bitcoin illegal, it would be on net good for the world. unfortunately they missed their own feet this time.

Rep Thread: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=381041
If one can not confer upon another a right which he does not himself first possess, by what means does the state derive the right to engage in behaviors from which the public is prohibited?
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October 17, 2013, 04:55:15 PM
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in short they would be inviting agorism, they would be creating a situation where it was in the economic interest of normal non activists to unwittingly become agorists purely out of self interest and this would reduce peoples perceived and real dependance on the state.
Considering the lack of a real economy backed by bitcoin -- it is by and large speculation at this point -- what makes you think this? At this point, it could conceivably be "nipped in the bud." Most use bitcoin as an investment vehicle, and no significant VC money has entered the bitcoin sector, so I think we would see adoption and exchange rate plummet if this were to happen anytime in the remotely near future.

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October 17, 2013, 05:13:27 PM
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i know that if the government outlawed bitcoin and bitmit moved to the darknets i would participate. i suspect many many others in the libertarian community would also. granted we would need some network effects before the dark nets could offer lower prices than walmart. but in time they probably would because there would be little to no taxation or regulation in the supply chain. goods would be produced in the freest jurisdiction and imported with out duities the distributed by grey market actors. early on these economies would be built up by activists and it wouldn't be in the interest of ordinary people to become agorists out of self interest, that is something that would have to come with time.

Rep Thread: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=381041
If one can not confer upon another a right which he does not himself first possess, by what means does the state derive the right to engage in behaviors from which the public is prohibited?
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October 17, 2013, 06:09:44 PM
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i know that if the government outlawed bitcoin and bitmit moved to the darknets i would participate. i suspect many many others in the libertarian community would also.
That's my point. Still just a small niche. Bitcoin, I think, must be adopted far more widely for any difference to be made in this regard.

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October 17, 2013, 06:59:15 PM
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I don't give a shit if it's legal or not, I will continue to use it anyway.

No signature ad here, because their conditions have become annoying.
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October 17, 2013, 07:19:57 PM
 #6

It will never be made illegal because it's a governments dream come true. It will be a step by step process until every move u make is fully traceable, forever. The full extent cant be implemented limitedly as there would be revolt.
Cash on the other hand is always 100% anonymous and will be made illegal as soon as practical possible. If i pay someone without tax i dont have to worry much using cash, but with bitcoin it could come back and bite my years later.
Also its Government compromised anyway as DPR found out the hard way.
Alt coins dont have this problem as everything is 100 % transparent, including who made it.
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October 17, 2013, 07:25:16 PM
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It will never be made illegal because it's a governments dream come true. It will be a step by step process until every move u make is fully traceable, forever. The full extent cant be implemented limitedly as there would be revolt.
Cash on the other hand is always 100% anonymous and will be made illegal as soon as practical possible. If i pay someone without tax i dont have to worry much using cash, but with bitcoin it could come back and bite my years later.
Also its Government compromised anyway as DPR found out the hard way.
Alt coins dont have this problem as everything is 100 % transparent, including who made it.

Can't tell is seriously unaware of how bitcoin works, or just trying to be funny...

manfred
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October 18, 2013, 08:33:20 AM
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Lets summarise some known facts:

2009-01-03 18:15:05 Historic moment Genesis block created
2009-01-13 18:20:08 50 coins where mined
2009-01-16 19:18:35 those 50 coins where sent to address 12higDjoCCNXSA95xZMWUdPvXNmkAduhWv
a total of 77,624 BTC  where received at this address until 2011-06-04 then cashed out
http://bitcoin-otc.com/viewgpg.php?nick=I}ruid
http://bitcoin-otc.com/viewratingdetail.php?nick=I}ruid&sign=ANY&type=RECV

Quote from: franky1 on October 16, 2013, 02:50:53 AM
|}ruid is Dustin trammell

Dustin D. Trammell
 I am both I)ruid and I}ruid.  I)ruid is the correct spelling.  I use the alternate I}ruid spelling on IRC due to the IRC protocol not allowing the close-parenthesis character ")" to be used in nicknames.
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?action=profile;u=23696,  yes VIP status with a registration date of June 2011

HD Moore,  Dustin D. Trammell and Tod Beardsley,  all co-founded AHA! (the Austin Hackers Association) many years ago.  All three still attend monthly meetings.
AHA is a white had hacker group that is Government friendly (Cahoots) and a hack against the hacker.

HD Moore: Information security researcher and programmer, Moore developed security software utilities for the United States Department of Defense.
Dustin D. Trammell:  Entrepreneur, Security Researcher performing research within the fields of vulnerability exploitation, network protocols, steganography and covert communications, and Internet telephony
Tod Beardsley:  Technical Lead for the Metasploit Framework and Metasploit Pro, Founded Austin Hackers Anonymous  August 2006

Moore, who today is one of the best known names in security research, had just returned to high school after dropping out for two years. He was getting some hands-on experience in security by auditing, consulting, and setting up collocation servers. Moore didn't have the proper classified security clearance at DOD, but his job description was written so that his then-rare skills could still be applied to some classified DOD work. He developed some exploits and wrote "something that captures traffic based on a set of rules" (essentially a sniffer) for DOD   Straight talk a US Government Snitch

Now depending of your view point you could ask is it a surprise that DPR is where he is?  Was SR past its use-by date and has served its purpose. Have you still got faith in the blockchain and that it is good for you? To Alt's look attractive with 100% knowlede from the start who is behind it and is truly decentralized.
With this known affiliated friendliness to the DOD Bitcoin is tainted to say the leased. Worst case scenario (tin had foil scenario) government has majority control if "need be" or has had it right from the word go, take your pick, one way or another it does leave a bitter taste in the mouth.
If HD is Satoshi or not does not really matter as the bulk of the coins is concentrated to a dozen or so individuals (whatever many members AHA has). How much combined hashing power it has or total combined stack, I leave it up to your imagination.  If you understand how bitcoin works you know the implications.
I only say it as it is dont let truth get in the way.
Now after all this i am still leaning toward a Dutch national being Satoshi (I have my reasons).



As for myself, just an ordinary user, brought the first bitcoin on the 21.06.2011, 20:37:20  at £11.39 from a London private banker and only registered with the forum because the known Polish low-life "M4v3R" also known as "Bitalo_Maciej" misused some of my coins (110.9 to be exact) with the Bitmarket.eu exchange. Prior to that i just followed from the side line.
adamas
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October 18, 2013, 08:55:35 AM
 #9

I don't give a shit if it's legal or not, I will continue to use it anyway.
If Bitcoin once gets outlawed, lets call it Bacon. If cryptocurrency gets outlawed, lets call it "units of account" (uoa). Want some bacon units?   Wink

"Es ist kein Zeichen geistiger Gesundheit, gut angepasst an eine kranke Gesellschaft zu sein."
fattypig
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October 18, 2013, 01:23:54 PM
 #10

Lets just treat Bitcoin like gold, thats why its legal Smiley

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