User705 sold me a broken video card.

[El Cabron]

User705 sold me a broken video card. He sold me a 7970 for 1.33 BTC.

He told me this card worked fine but it does not run correctly. It will have small artifacts when doing basic things and will completely crash when trying to run full HD video.

He sent the card first. I then paid him the 1.33 BTC but I told him the card was not fully tested and that it was making small artifacts. I thought that might have just been because of the drivers on the new Linux OS I was running. I told him I was going to be traveling for a while and was not going to be able to test it in the near future. I told him that I hoped he would give me back the BTC if the card did not work.

After testing the card on more than one box and more than one OS I am 100% sure it is the card.

User705 thinks he does not have to give me a refund as there was no warranty but my point is that he sold me a broken GPU as fully functional. This is a scam.



If you would like to buy the card please find it here in the auction section.

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=332474.0


This thread was made so I could use it as a reference for his trust feedback.

Thank you.

[1713255201]

1713255201

[1713255201]

1713255201

[User705]

A few facts omitted here so feel free to make your own determinations.  The original listing is here
https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=274515.0
Notice is says "Sold As Is but guaranteed against DOA."  Goat contacted me and stated he wanted escrow.  I told him that he seems trustworthy and I would gladly trust him with it if he paid for just shipping 1st and then after he received it and inspected it he can pay me or send it back.  In the thread I also state "I'm not very technical." and that the card was mined on.  Goat received the card.  Then he PM'd me about stickers on it and to clarify what was specifically said regarding condition and warranty.  I don't have those PMs any more but he found them and it clearly is stated by me that I provide no warranty for this card.  At that point he didn't want to return it but paid for it.  He currently claims that because he stated that he is paying but not testing it further that somehow obligates me to extend the "guaranteed against DOA." warranty for an indefinite and indeterminate time period.  No such condition was agreed to by me nor would I agree to that because what if he decided to test it a year from now?  He admits so above when stating "I told him that I hoped he would give me back the BTC if the card did not work."  He was short .1BTC on the payment and four days after paying for the card he paid that as well.  So four days later he still presumable was satisfied with it.  Again the logical thing here is that a person would check on something that is sold AS IS before payment and if they paid that concludes the deal.  Yesterday he contacted me saying the card isn't working properly and then today after a few back and forth PMs he wanted me to take it back.  This is two weeks after that final payment and a month from the original deal.  Also not in any of those PMs he mentions the fact that BTC is double what it was at the time of payment.  Presumably he is expecting a full BTC refund.  For those reasons it appears at least to me that this is nothing more then a case of buyers remorse.
Do I feel he is using his default trust rating to call something a scam when it isn't and thereby exact some sort of childish revenge?  Possibly and the usual thing here on the forum is I guess for me to leave him a negative trust but he hasn't scammed me so I'm not going to do so.  Everyone can make their own determination if this is a case of buyer remorse or an actual scam.

[Tomatocage]

Goat, don't be a douche. You can eat the cost of the card no problem with the coins that you have. If he was out to scam you, he would have taken payment and not sent you anything. What you could do is drop negative Trust with one of your alt accounts so it doesn't affect the color of his score at least.

[User705]

...
Am I demanding you pay me back for the broken card?  Nope. I never even asked you to take it back like you claim. I'm selling it. But I am pointing out you sold me a broken card.
...

Now I'm confused.  What did you want me to do and what didn't you want me to do?  Your PMs are below.

it is the card. it is creating artifacts and it is bad esp in full hd playback.

how do you want to deal with this?

I paid you with out testing it. I told you that. I asked for you to send back if broken. You now wont.

Thats fine.

Ill make a thread about it.

Peace.

Again your claim of me scamming you hinges on the fact that your statement that you are paying me without testing it obligates me to extend the warranty against DOA forever or at least until you decide.  I do not.  That's called a disagreement not a scam but obviously I'm biased.     In your listing selling it you state   

...
Assuming he is honest he did not know the card was broken for normal video card us it might be fine to mine with. Assuming he is a scammer the card might not even mine. I don't know. The card is sold as is and might be broken.
...

that you don't know if I knew the card was broken before so you can't be calling me a scammer for that.  So what specific act you are calling me a scammer for?

[User705]

Goat, don't be a douche. You can eat the cost of the card no problem with the coins that you have. If he was out to scam you, he would have taken payment and not sent you anything. What you could do is drop negative Trust with one of your alt accounts so it doesn't affect the color of his score at least.

Thank you but I'd rather have the red.  As I stated in another thread the more BS red is handed out the less meaning it carries.  I'm fine with it.

[WEB slicer]

goat is a VERY IMPORTANT PERSON. we must all bend over for him and his VIP status or he will leave you bad trust in an attempt to assassinate your character.

[User705]

  So what specific act you are calling me a scammer for?

Your selling me a video card that will not function as a normal GPU. You even admitted you did not test it for that.


I have no idea if it will mine or not but that is not the point. I did not buy the card to mine with. I just needed a GPU and wanted to pay with BTC.

That's why I sold the card As Is and gave you plenty of opportunity to test it because I wasn't sure of it's condition.  If you chose to not do that that's not a scam by me.  If anything it is you who is trying to get one over on me by wanting coins back that are worth twice as much for a card that isn't working right now.  We both have no way of knowing if it ever did during the time I was ok with taking it back.  The issue is you think your words obligate me to something I didn't agree to and I don't think so.  I might not be nice or whatever other word you think applies to someone not looking to give back twice more then he got when the other party disregarded all normal conventions when it comes to sale of used As Is items but to call this a scam is well ...  Let everyone else decide for themselves.

[Tomatocage]

Goat, don't be a douche. You can eat the cost of the card no problem with the coins that you have. If he was out to scam you, he would have taken payment and not sent you anything. What you could do is drop negative Trust with one of your alt accounts so it doesn't affect the color of his score at least.

I didn't know that your wealth dictates when you can and can't call out someone, on a bad trade. WOW

You don't know the circumstances behind that statement, so let's just agree that you didn't know. For all the Goat knows, the GPU could have been functioning fine in User705's system. I've had cards that mined flawlessly, but would artifact in MW3, but then work perfectly in CounterStrike. How much testing does one expect the seller to do? Within the context of where you're sourcing a used GPU from, it's reasonable to assume that a GPU could be called "good" if it mines, and if it plays games too, awesome.

And again, if User705 was out to scam, he would have sent a box of rocks or maybe nothing at all.

[Tomatocage]

No kidding, but look at his left feedback!

He has left more neg feedback than anyone I have ever seen!  And he is saying I am out of place! WOW

The difference is that I leave negative feedback based on certain criteria that are often indicative of a scammer -- you know, to maybe help prevent people from being scammed. You've left feedback based purely on retaliation and/or malice, and that's not what the Trust system is for.

[Tomatocage]

Fair enough. Just please keep in mind that since you are in some level of the DefaultTrust tiers, your ratings carry a lot more weight than the average users, and IMHO I don't think User705 intentionally set out to scam you.

[User705]

Technicalities are only ok if it's in Goat favor.    

...

If you think you are fine because of that technicality then fine. I hope others look at this before they trade with you so they know what type of person you are.

...

I wasn't sure of it's condition.

See that is just it. You did not tell me that you did not know, you told me it worked!


But it did not!




I don't want the coins back, I just want people to know you should not be trusted.

[WEB slicer]

i find it amusing it wasnt enough to leave bad trust once you left bad trust 3 times and basically shit all over this guys trust profile. thats the same thing you did to me. you left me 4 bad trust. i dont know if i should be angry or sorry for you. you say you have a life outside of bitcointalk but im starting to think you have nothing better to do than go around and spread shit on peoples posts and profile.

[WEB slicer]

oops i meant to post on dave111223 thread. seems like you are posting fud on everybody's profile.

[WEB slicer]

 

[WEB slicer]

its like when a banker has a losing deal. people dont feel as bad as if it was a little old lady. it may not be politically correct but if you got it you can take a hit without crying and blowing up the other end like he's an asshole thats out to get you.

[Maged]

Also not in any of those PMs he mentions the fact that BTC is double what it was at the time of payment.  Presumably he is expecting a full BTC refund.

The general agreement around here is that unless it's explicitly stated that the refund amount would be in bitcoins at the time of sale, the refund amount would be denominated in USD based on the price of bitcoin at the time of sale.

Goat, please at least try to work with User705. Maybe you could come to an agreement such as he would owe you the USD difference between what you paid and what you sell the video card for minus the costs involved in reselling the card.

[bitcoinwheel]

I just have to say GOAT is a bitch! fuck off bud and go buy yourself 1000 video cards fucking cry baby

/end rant

[moderate]

I just have to say GOAT is a bitch! fuck off bud and go buy yourself 1000 video cards fucking cry baby

/end rant

Going to guess you are a scammer who I caught and you had to make a new account. Should I tag you as a scammer now just to be safe?

Spot on actually, good job.

He is trying very hard to sell some script, then when he gets questioned he locks the topic and opens another one. The latest one is self-moderated. Started here https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=332845, then https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=332788, and some other threads that I hope got removed, and is now at https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=333233

[User705]

Also not in any of those PMs he mentions the fact that BTC is double what it was at the time of payment.  Presumably he is expecting a full BTC refund.

The general agreement around here is that unless it's explicitly stated that the refund amount would be in bitcoins at the time of sale, the refund amount would be denominated in USD based on the price of bitcoin at the time of sale.

Goat, please at least try to work with User705. Maybe you could come to an agreement such as he would owe you the USD difference between what you paid and what you sell the video card for minus the costs involved in reselling the card.

We never talked about price if I returned the card. He just refused taking the card back before I mentioned anything. This is up to him. I never asked for him to take the card back, just told him it was broken. He then refused to take it back with out my suggesting it. We did not talk about currency types.



Also if you look at the trade, we agreed to 1.33 BTC and I paid 1.33 BTC despite BTC going up significantly by the time it was due for me to pay. He did not ask for the fiat amount. I even accidentally shorted him .1 BTC and when he told me about it I paid. This was despite the fact that I had way over paid looking at fiat.

I would have thought about taking USD if he wanted to do this but he was pretty clear he was not going to take the card back so it was moot.


edit: Maged, assuming as fact what the other side "presumes" is not really helpful in this case :/    This is on him. He can work it out if he wants but I left honest feedback, he sold me a broken card and I said as much.

To address the 1.33BTC payment.  The issue was you wanted escrow and I simply trusted you with self escrow so to speak.  There wouldn't be any difference if you paid the 1.33BTC right away to escrow.  Would there?  Not sure why again you are stating you never asked me to take it back.  I erased the PMs now but the one posted before certainly made me think so but I could be wrong.  All of this again hinges on small wordplay.  Like before where you say I'm still a scammer regardless of the "technicality" of you paying without inspecting but when I state that I knew the card to be working but sold it As Is because I couldn't know 100% that "technicality" is applicable and you go see "he admits it".  The bottom line is the reason I wasn't offering anything is because you stated you believe this to be a "scam".  I don't have the PM but I believe you said specifically "This is a scam in my book".  I didn't think so but after that there wasn't anything else to discuss.  If you are willing to discuss settlement then this can't be a "scam" otherwise I simply scammed a smaller amount from you.  Unless I am misunderstanding you this isn't something that's up to me. 

[WEB slicer]

this guy shipped first. you inspected the card and paid for it. then you turn around and call him a scammer. your such a dipshit goat. scammers dont ship first.