Low-Volume Bitcoin Exchange

[idev]

You working With LR ?

To be honest I have no idea what you're talking about.

LR - Liberty Reserve www.libertyreserve.com

I am now considering adding support for Liberty Reserve, as they have a similar API to PayPal and charge lower fees. Would anyone be interested in that?

Yes i would be interested, let us know when you have this ready.

[Quip]

Mtgox can do LR transactions easily so it doesn't make sense (getting to LR requires a significant amount of money to be cost effective).

You should also add details of the amount of bitcoins you have and your fees to the main page.

I am still unsure about Liberty Reserve for that reason.

I'll try to add balance and pricing to the front page in the next couple of days. For now you can see that info at http://dylanw.dyndns.tv:8331/lvbx/info.php.

[idev]

Mtgox can do LR transactions easily so it doesn't make sense (getting to LR requires a significant amount of money to be cost effective).

You should also add details of the amount of bitcoins you have and your fees to the main page.

I am still unsure about Liberty Reserve for that reason.

I'll try to add balance and pricing to the front page in the next couple of days. For now you can see that info at http://dylanw.dyndns.tv:8331/lvbx/info.php.

Well MTgox has a min coin purchase of 100,
so anyone who can offer small amounts with via Liberty Reserve,
would be very useful.

[Quip]

Thanks for clearing that up. I'll do my best to implement LR payment this weekend.

[BitterTea]

You might want to evaluate the contents of this thread before you do so.

Note, I have never used LR (though I did sign up, and considered it at one point), and have not followed the situation at all. That said, MadHatter appears to know what he's talking about, and I find his concerns very valid.

[Quip]

Thanks for that. The decision is now back in Limbo.

Unrelated: I just realized that paypal charges a $0.30 fee for each transaction, which I am currently absorbing. Would anyone object if I shunted this to the buyer? It would raise the cost of all purchases by $0.30, regardless of the number of bitcoins purchased, so I am hesitant.

[nanaimogold]

People already can automatically swap BTC in or out of LR  with low fees and no minimum, auction style at Mt. Gox or instantly at NG. That functionality has been in use for over a year already.

Bank wires have to be large enough to overcome the hefty flat fee. LR works fine for small spends, even for micropayments.

[Quip]

That settles it then, I'm not adding LR support.

[nanaimogold]

Why not?

I don't understand your logic.

[Quip]

If you can convert paypal to LR for free and then buy bitcoins using LR at mt. gox with no minimum quantity, then how am I supposed to compete?

[nanaimogold]

If you can convert paypal to LR for free and then buy bitcoins using LR at mt. gox with no minimum quantity, then how am I supposed to compete?

You can't convert Paypal for anything resembling cash. Not for anything remotely liquid.

Trading bitcoin in and out of LR is easy, cheap and quick.

Read again post I made above.

[Quip]

http://exchangezone.com/en/Welcome claims to do free conversion of paypal to LR. Your service claims free conversion of LR to bitcoins. Am I misunderstanding something?

EDIT:

EUREKA! It works! I have one more bitcoin!
...
Good luck and best wishes.

I just noticed your earlier post. Thank you!

[andrew]

The defense against Paypal chargebacks is to not use Paypal at all.

Paypal only works when the receiver trusts the spender.

As a consumer protection feature, Paypal allows buyers to back out of trade and charge back their purchase. Users might cry that they did not get what they paid for, or they may claim their account was cracked or phished. Paypal will take the money back from the receiver.

As a seller, it's easy to trust someone who is buying a service that can't easily be resold, such as a subscription. 

With something liquid, the classic example being the mail order laptop, it's harder to trust the spender. What is to stop him from charging back after the hardware is shipped?

In the case of trading Paypal for cash money, like bitcoin, it's very hard to trust the spender. Nothing is more liquid than digital currency. It belongs to the bearer, as does cash. It's easily traded into anything you can imagine. It's liquidity is very attractive to phishers and scammers.

I suggest you read the Paypal rules which state that consumer protection is only for Tangible goods. As a paypal buyer you can't back out of such a trade for the situation you just described.

[barwench]

Unrelated: I just realized that paypal charges a $0.30 fee for each transaction, which I am currently absorbing. Would anyone object if I shunted this to the buyer? It would raise the cost of all purchases by $0.30, regardless of the number of bitcoins purchased, so I am hesitant.

You can put a receiving paypal account into micropayment mode (google paypal micropayment) - then you're charged 5% and 5c per transaction instead of 30c + a smaller percentage.

if you expect your market to be small transactions rather than large transactions maybe that makes sense

[breandan81]

.30 cents isn't much, I know I wouldn't mind if you shunted the cost to me

[Quip]

You have to make a new account to utilize micropayments.

I may do that, or I may just add a checkbox (checked by default) that allows customers to optionally contribute an additional $0.30 USD.

[Quip]

You are now charged an extra 30 cents per transaction unless you opt-out. I'll see how that goes for now.

[Quip]

I've made several big changes to the site today:

• My current balance and pricing are now displayed on the homepage.
• The $0.30 USD PayPal fee is now mandatory
• You can now optionally leave me a tip, default 5%
• There is now significantly better fraud detection, which may result in a temporary delay on purchases made using unverified accounts.

[Quip]

I rewrote the bulk of the way transactions are processed to better prevent fraud while simultaneously ensuring faster delivery. I also have 40 BTC available.

[granrojo]

Bitcoin for Paypal! Too good an opportunity to refuse.

Sorry but I just bought all your bitcoins  Left a tip though.

Site works perfectly, very quick and easy.