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Author Topic: Short sell bitcoins  (Read 936 times)
fastandfurious
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August 04, 2011, 04:53:36 PM
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If I want to short sell Bitcoins, is there any service that provides this? It shouldn't be something hard to get to work. The first exchange that starts with this will get a lot of new traders.

For example miners that want to take profits at specific levels. Because they know that they are going to create the coins in the end.

I would like to sell all the coins I will be making by mining in the next 100 days on this levels. But I can't.
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August 04, 2011, 05:04:01 PM
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I suppose the only reason this hasn't been created yet is that the techie people who could create it all love bitcoin and know that this would just accelerate the collapse.  I'm all for pouring gasoline on the fire, though.

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August 04, 2011, 05:13:24 PM
 #3

you can short sell on campbx, but the volume is low
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August 04, 2011, 05:14:52 PM
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I suppose the only reason this hasn't been created yet is that the techie people who could create it all love bitcoin and know that this would just accelerate the collapse.  I'm all for pouring gasoline on the fire, though.

This does make sense, remember they wanted to stop short selling in the financial markets during that big downturn. However, this may be harder to implement then you think. I remember there was some user who went on about how they can do short selling and actually make sure that he is guaranteed his money.

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fastandfurious
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August 04, 2011, 05:28:04 PM
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you can short sell on campbx, but the volume is low

No you can't. Under trading. https://campbx.com/faq.php
fastandfurious
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August 04, 2011, 05:48:49 PM
 #6

First, there must be someone willing to rent-out their Bitcoin...

Yeah, nobody is willing to do that.

I'm willing to pay 10 % interest on the loan, that is really good numbers for sometihng that has zero % interest.
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August 04, 2011, 05:54:42 PM
 #7

First, there must be someone willing to rent-out their Bitcoin...

Yeah, nobody is willing to do that.

I'm willing to pay 10 % interest on the loan, that is really good numbers for sometihng that has has zero % interest.
I would probably just lend you an amount of Bitcoins if I could trust you.

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fastandfurious
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August 04, 2011, 05:59:43 PM
 #8

First, there must be someone willing to rent-out their Bitcoin...

Yeah, nobody is willing to do that.

I'm willing to pay 10 % interest on the loan, that is really good numbers for sometihng that has has zero % interest.
I would probably just lend you an amount of Bitcoins if I could trust you.

Exactly, that's why we need a exchange to do this. Strange that no one has already implemented this.
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August 04, 2011, 06:05:30 PM
 #9

I suppose the only reason this hasn't been created yet is that the techie people who could create it all love bitcoin and know that this would just accelerate the collapse.  I'm all for pouring gasoline on the fire, though.

There is strong evidence that short selling actually smooths declines and not accelerate. Short selling provides liquidity and ultimately also buying power since short sellers MUST COVER and BUY BACK. Normal sellers do not have to.

But financial journalists and politicians have no clue about the markets and are happy to find a scapegoat and this is short selling

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August 04, 2011, 06:13:14 PM
 #10

If I want to short sell Bitcoins, is there any service that provides this? It shouldn't be something hard to get to work. The first exchange that starts with this will get a lot of new traders.

For example miners that want to take profits at specific levels. Because they know that they are going to create the coins in the end.

I would like to sell all the coins I will be making by mining in the next 100 days on this levels. But I can't.

What would you use as collateral?

Afterall if someone is going to extend you credit so that you can short-sell, they will need collateral that they can margin-call against, won't they?

How far down do you think bitcoins will go in the next 100 days?

Would you be willing to split the difference, that is, for example if you think it will go down 10%, settle for only realising half that: 5%?

Do you have enough collateral, such as bitcoins you have already mined, to secure against margin calls?

How much collateral would that actually take?

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fastandfurious
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August 04, 2011, 06:27:51 PM
 #11

If I want to short sell Bitcoins, is there any service that provides this? It shouldn't be something hard to get to work. The first exchange that starts with this will get a lot of new traders.

For example miners that want to take profits at specific levels. Because they know that they are going to create the coins in the end.

I would like to sell all the coins I will be making by mining in the next 100 days on this levels. But I can't.

What would you use as collateral?

Afterall if someone is going to extend you credit so that you can short-sell, they will need collateral that they can margin-call against, won't they?

How far down do you think bitcoins will go in the next 100 days?

Would you be willing to split the difference, that is, for example if you think it will go down 10%, settle for only realising half that: 5%?

Do you have enough collateral, such as bitcoins you have already mined, to secure against margin calls?

How much collateral would that actually take

-MarkM-


Good questions. The normal way this work is that I have collateral in the exchanges in USD or other fiat currency, this is what I believe would and should happen at the exchanges if they implement this. If I want to short 1000 bitcoins I should have an equal amount of that in USD (at the exchange price) at the time I am borrowing the coins. That gives the exchange 100 % margin until they have to close my position. Of course they and the speculator can do this with leverage, but the math is very similar to going long with borrowed money.
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August 04, 2011, 06:40:39 PM
 #12

Only way I know of is to use your own Bitcoins Tongue

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