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revans (OP)
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November 25, 2013, 11:52:37 PM |
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http://hackingdistributed.com/2013/11/25/block-propagation-speeds/Oh dear. Not only has it now be demonstrated that selfish mining is a feasible attack, but the rewards available are much greater than previously assumed. Still, not to worry, I'm sure the exchanges will keep pumping out false price data to keep the bubble going a bit longer before it is popped.
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It is a common myth that Bitcoin is ruled by a majority of miners. This is not true. Bitcoin miners "vote" on the ordering of transactions, but that's all they do. They can't vote to change the network rules.
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BittBurger
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November 25, 2013, 11:58:43 PM |
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http://hackingdistributed.com/2013/11/25/block-propagation-speeds/Oh dear. Not only has it now be demonstrated that selfish mining is a feasible attack, but the rewards available are much greater than previously assumed. Still, not to worry, I'm sure the exchanges will keep pumping out false price data to keep the bubble going a bit longer before it is popped. Nobody reply to this guy. He's an established Troll. |
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revans (OP)
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November 26, 2013, 12:00:40 AM |
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http://hackingdistributed.com/2013/11/25/block-propagation-speeds/Oh dear. Not only has it now be demonstrated that selfish mining is a feasible attack, but the rewards available are much greater than previously assumed. Still, not to worry, I'm sure the exchanges will keep pumping out false price data to keep the bubble going a bit longer before it is popped. Nobody reply to this guy. He's an established Troll. Off course here a troll is anyone who dares to suggest Bitcoin is anything less than perfect. |
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BittBurger
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November 26, 2013, 12:03:53 AM |
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no.
You're a troll because you make inflammatory posts to get a rise out of people.
Yo do it all over the forum. You get people riled up, you make absurd statements on purpose, and then you walk away giggling like a little bitch because you got people upset.
that is the definition of a forum troll.
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lindatess
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November 26, 2013, 12:06:27 AM |
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no.
You're a troll because you make inflammatory posts to get a rise out of people.
Yo do it all over the forum. You get people riled up, you make absurd statements on purpose, and then you walk away giggling like a little bitch because you got people upset.
that is the definition of a forum troll.
Jesus Bitcoiners, argue the paper not the person! |
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revans (OP)
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November 26, 2013, 12:07:29 AM |
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no.
You're a troll because you make inflammatory posts to get a rise out of people.
Yo do it all over the forum. You get people riled up, you make absurd statements on purpose, and then you walk away giggling like a little bitch because you got people upset.
that is the definition of a forum troll.
classic bitcoin cultist misdirection. Amazing how you've managed to avoid addressing the argument at hand. |
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Stinky_Pete
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November 26, 2013, 12:22:50 AM |
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"It takes 4.5 seconds for a block to reach 50% of the miners. That's approximately an eternity in computer terms. That's plenty of time for a selfish miner to push his own block and win some races, especially if he makes his block smaller than average."
But won't the 4.5 seconds apply equally to the selfish miner and honest miners?
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Kouye
Sr. Member
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Activity: 336
Merit: 250
Cuddling, censored, unicorn-shaped troll.
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November 26, 2013, 12:23:43 AM |
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classic bitcoin cultist misdirection. Amazing how you've managed to avoid addressing the argument at hand.
What's the point about discussing a dead and deceased currency? I really am curious about the motivation that keeps you coming back, sharing thoughts about an already buried shitty coin. Really. |
[OVER] RIDDLES 2nd edition --- this was claimed. Look out for 3rd edition! I won't ever ask for a loan nor offer any escrow service. If I do, please consider my account as hacked. |
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mootinator
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November 26, 2013, 12:27:21 AM |
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Why does winning a bunch of pointless races make any difference. Big pools control most of the hashrate and are only a handful of those nodes.
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No
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Melbustus
Legendary
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Activity: 1722
Merit: 1003
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November 26, 2013, 12:30:48 AM |
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The attack vectors described in these "studies" have been discussed in the bitcoin community for years. It's also worth noting that despite a market-cap in the billions, these attacks have not been performed to any measurable degree. Nevermind the perverse incentives (the authors treat incentivization very myopically). These attacks are interesting to theorize about and should ultimately be insulated against for the long-term, but they're of little practical relevance.
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Bitcoin is the first monetary system to credibly offer perfect information to all economic participants.
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MoonShadow
Legendary
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Activity: 1708
Merit: 1007
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November 26, 2013, 12:31:52 AM |
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"It takes 4.5 seconds for a block to reach 50% of the miners. That's approximately an eternity in computer terms. That's plenty of time for a selfish miner to push his own block and win some races, especially if he makes his block smaller than average."
But won't the 4.5 seconds apply equally to the selfish miner and honest miners?
Normally, yes. However any mining pool acting in a 'selfish' manner can be identifed by predictable effects. Once the offending pool is identified, honest miners who desire to punish the selfish pool may do so, by adding a delay to the propogation of any of their published blocks, or simply refusing to forward them at all. There is nothing in the protocol that requires peers to treat each other equally. |
"The powers of financial capitalism had another far-reaching aim, nothing less than to create a world system of financial control in private hands able to dominate the political system of each country and the economy of the world as a whole. This system was to be controlled in a feudalist fashion by the central banks of the world acting in concert, by secret agreements arrived at in frequent meetings and conferences. The apex of the systems was to be the Bank for International Settlements in Basel, Switzerland, a private bank owned and controlled by the world's central banks which were themselves private corporations. Each central bank...sought to dominate its government by its ability to control Treasury loans, to manipulate foreign exchanges, to influence the level of economic activity in the country, and to influence cooperative politicians by subsequent economic rewards in the business world."
- Carroll Quigley, CFR member, mentor to Bill Clinton, from 'Tragedy And Hope'
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revans (OP)
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November 26, 2013, 12:33:38 AM |
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The attack vectors described in these "studies" have been discussed in the bitcoin community for years. It's also worth noting that despite a market-cap in the billions, these attacks have not been performed to any measurable degree. Nevermind the perverse incentives (the authors treat incentivization very myopically). These attacks are interesting to theorize about and should ultimately be insulated against for the long-term, but they're of little practical relevance.
You don't think the fact that Bitcoin is definitely not incentive compatible is an issue? |
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p2pbucks
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November 26, 2013, 12:35:37 AM |
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no worries , troll or not , i believe bitcoin community will mend this flaw
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BittBurger
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November 26, 2013, 12:39:08 AM |
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classic bitcoin cultist misdirection. Amazing how you've managed to avoid addressing the argument at hand.
What's the point about discussing a dead and deceased currency? I really am curious about the motivation that keeps you coming back, sharing thoughts about an already buried shitty coin. Really. Because, as previously mentioned, he's a troll. He's not here for actual discussion. He's here to agitate. I'd be happy to argue the paper not the person, if the person was here to actually argue the paper. |
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Syke
Legendary
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Activity: 3878
Merit: 1193
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November 26, 2013, 01:03:42 AM |
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"It takes 4.5 seconds for a block to reach 50% of the miners. That's approximately an eternity in computer terms. That's plenty of time for a selfish miner to push his own block and win some races, especially if he makes his block smaller than average."
But won't the 4.5 seconds apply equally to the selfish miner and honest miners?
Not all nodes are created equal. It doesn't matter if you reach 50% of the miners, if those 50% only have 1% of the hashrate. |
Buy & Hold
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MGUK
Member
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Activity: 83
Merit: 10
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November 26, 2013, 03:53:30 PM |
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The attack vectors described in these "studies" have been discussed in the bitcoin community for years. It's also worth noting that despite a market-cap in the billions, these attacks have not been performed to any measurable degree. Nevermind the perverse incentives (the authors treat incentivization very myopically). These attacks are interesting to theorize about and should ultimately be insulated against for the long-term, but they're of little practical relevance.
You don't think the fact that Bitcoin is definitely not incentive compatible is an issue? An incentive is a reward, and rewards are subjective. We can argue all day about if miners make enough money or who gets the new coins and fees. None of that changes the fact that there will always be people out there who see things such as helping verify payments, having a fun hobby to play around with and generally contributing back to the web as an adequate incentive. Even if you ignore all those things, and argue that there is absolutely no incentive, the conclusion of that is that it would be irrational to mine. There will always be people who behave irrationally. |
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Lauda
Legendary
Offline
Activity: 2674
Merit: 2965
Terminated.
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November 26, 2013, 04:04:09 PM |
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The article is a bunch of nonsense. Support the ignore button of OP.
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"The Times 03/Jan/2009 Chancellor on brink of second bailout for banks" 😼 Bitcoin Core ( onion) |
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revans (OP)
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November 26, 2013, 04:33:55 PM |
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The article is a bunch of nonsense. Support the ignore button of OP.
Explain why it is nonsense |
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Lauda
Legendary
Offline
Activity: 2674
Merit: 2965
Terminated.
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November 26, 2013, 04:37:24 PM |
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The article is a bunch of nonsense. Support the ignore button of OP.
Explain why it is nonsense Explain why your ignore button is in color. |
"The Times 03/Jan/2009 Chancellor on brink of second bailout for banks" 😼 Bitcoin Core ( onion) |
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