Politics

[dirtyfilthy]

Not a fan of the chart at all.

+1

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[Garrett Burgwardt]

Again, chart. Anarchist is the extreme of the Conservative Libertarian side. Minarchist is almost there. The US Republican Party is in that direction, but closer to center.

No. Anarchists oppose hierarchy. Therefore, they oppose both the state and capitalism. I would guess that conservative libertarians support capitalism.

Not a fan of the chart at all.

In your opinion, anarchists do. In many other's opinions, you're incorrect.

[FatherMcGruder]

In your opinion, anarchists do. In many other's opinions, you're incorrect.

We agree that anarchists oppose authority. Why then, should they support capitalism, an institution which allows for the likes of slavery, that allows employer masters to treat human beings like expenses instead of partners? Capitalism thrives on authority. Therefore, anarchists oppose capitalism.

[Garrett Burgwardt]

In your opinion, anarchists do. In many other's opinions, you're incorrect.

We agree that anarchists oppose authority. Why then, should they support capitalism, an institution which allows for the likes of slavery, that allows employer masters to treat human beings like expenses instead of partners? Capitalism thrives on authority. Therefore, anarchists oppose capitalism.

We've been over this in another thread, but essentially I don't oppose authority unless it is monopolistic.

[Quip]

*bump*

This thread got off the a rocky start. I've edited the poll to be more clear. Give it another shot?

[grondilu]

I answered rightist libertarian, which to me is just the true form of any libertarian.

[kiba]

What does "rightist" and leftist" libertarian mean?

[Quip]

Leftist is Liberal (more freedom), Rightist is Conservative (more government).

[FatherMcGruder]

What does "rightist" and leftist" libertarian mean?

For left libertarianism, think Noam Chomsky.

[FatherMcGruder]

We've been over this in another thread, but essentially I don't oppose authority unless it is monopolistic.

And thus we have the difference between anarcho-capitalism and anarchism. Anarchy means no authority, with no monopolistic qualifier.

[Garrett Burgwardt]

We've been over this in another thread, but essentially I don't oppose authority unless it is monopolistic.

And thus we have the difference between anarcho-capitalism and anarchism. Anarchy means no authority, with no monopolistic qualifier.

Your definition of anarchy, sure. I disagree with your definition (and all anarcho-communist definitions, I would bet).

But that's okay, because I'm a voluntaryist. As long as you're not coercive you can call your politics whatever and do whatever you want.

[grondilu]

Leftist is Liberal (more freedom), Rightist is Conservative (more government).

That's not how I see things.

To me left/right is the capitalism/communism antagonism.  So basically it deals with economic freedom.

Conservatism/liberal deals with moral issues.  Basically all social stuffs, i.e. everything which is not related to commercial activity: mariage, divorce, education, crime, drugs, free speech, suicide, guns, religion, ...

[Quip]

I'm not making up these definitions. Up-Down is politics, and Left-Right is economics.

• Liberalism is the belief in the importance of liberty and equal rights.
• Conservatism is a political and social philosophy that promotes the maintenance of traditional institutions.
• Libertarianism is the advocacy of individual liberty, especially freedom of expression and action.
• Statism is a political philosophy either emphasising the role of the state.

[grondilu]

I'm not making up these definitions. Up-Down is politics, and Left-Right is economics.

With this I agree more or less.  But not with what you wrote above:

Leftist is Liberal (more freedom), Rightist is Conservative (more government).

[kiba]

I'm not making up these definitions. Up-Down is politics, and Left-Right is economics.

• Liberalism is the belief in the importance of liberty and equal rights.
• Conservatism is a political and social philosophy that promotes the maintenance of traditional institutions.
• Libertarianism is the advocacy of individual liberty, especially freedom of expression and action.
• Statism is a political philosophy either emphasising the role of the state.

What is equal rights? I believe in liberty. I don't believe in the promotion of traditional institutions. I am a libertarian, not a statist.

Is free market considered a conservative institution?

[Quip]

Yes, wikipedia's definitions are a little vague. I will now make some up:

• Liberalism is socialism or progress towards it.
• Conservatism is free market capitalism.
• Libertarianism is personal and social freedom.
• Statism is essentially Authoritarianism.
  

The confusion with these definitions is the whole reason why we use a chart.

[grondilu]

Yes, wikipedia's definitions are a little vague. I will now make some up:

• Liberalism is socialism or progress towards it.
• Conservatism is free market capitalism.
• Libertarianism is personal and social freedom.
• Statism is essentially Authoritarianism.
  

I think you got all mixed up.

I like the idea of a chart with economic freedom on the horizontal axis and moral issues on the vertical axes.  But I don't like your labelling.


To me it would be pretty much more like this:


                libertarianism
                    ^
                    |
communism <-                 -> liberalism
                    |
                    v
                conservatism

[ribuck]

Leftist is more personal freedoms but fewer economic freedoms.
Rightist is more economic freedoms but fewer personal freedoms.

[ribuck]

This thread got off the a rocky start. I've edited the poll to be more clear. Give it another shot?

The poll is effectively a question about what kind of state people prefer, and as such it fails to represent many of the people here. Can you at least add "Voluntarist" to the list?

[grondilu]

For some time I've been considering whether it could be possible to create some kind of a "mind fingerprint", using a decent number of Yes/No questions.

Results could be printed as a box in the above area.

As I see it, it would consist in something like 100 yes/no questions, and as a result you'll see where you are on a political map.


Questions would deal with death penalty, divorce, capitalism, freedom of speech, abortion, minimal wage, retirement, gun control, and so on...