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Author Topic: PayPal really needs to be shut down and replaced immediately  (Read 2761 times)
shamoons (OP)
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November 30, 2013, 02:48:15 PM
 #1

I recently sold a bitcoin related domain name that I own on sedo.com and the transaction was completed via PayPal. Since the transaction was large, PayPal asked for more information (first problem - what does it matter how large the transaction is??). So I told them that I sold a domain name and provided a sedo-issued receipt. Now, I get this e-mail:

Code:
We have reviewed your PayPal account and found that you are operating as an
e-currency dealer/exchanger including the sale of electronic media of
exchange (such as electronic money or digital currency). Per our current
Acceptable Use Policy for Money Service Businesses, PayPal may not be used
to operate a currency exchange, bureau de change or check cashing business
including the sale of Bit Coins.

To continue using your PayPal account, we need some additional information
from you. Please provide us with the following:

  • A brief affidavit stating that you understand and will comply with
PayPal's terms and conditions.
  • A listing of the products and services you offer.
  • A detailed explanation of your business model.
  • A list of all URLs or websites that will be used to receive payments.
  • The type of payments you will send and receive, including the type of
goods or services you will accept payments for.

Below you will find suggested affidavit language. Please make sure that the
requested affidavit is signed and notarized.

I the undersigned do affirm that I understand and will comply with PayPal's
policy regarding the use of PayPal Accounts to operate an e-currency
exchange business. I understand that PayPal may not be used to operate a
currency exchange, bureau de change or check cashing business. I further
affirm that any further detected violation of the policy may result in the
immediate closure of, or restriction to access to the account.

Please log in to your account and go to the Resolution Center to find out
what you need to do. Your account will remain limited until the issue is
resolved.

We look forward to hearing from you and thank you for choosing PayPal as
your business partner.

Sincerely,
Nan
PayPal Compliance Department
PayPal, an eBay Company

So there you have it - selling bitcoin related domain names now qualifies me as a currency exchange of "Bit Coins." Now, I do operate Crypto Street, but obviously, I don't use PayPal there.
mu
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November 30, 2013, 04:53:07 PM
 #2

Banks where I'm located are shutting down any accounts being used for local bitcoin selling. PayPal is a 1990s web dinosaur, and I look at it on the same level as I do a massive bank. They need to play it safe because of how large they've grown, and I get that, but yeah their policies are incredibly lame. Their fees are just as ridiculous as a bank's, too. No wonder Elon Musk moved onto better, more innovative things long ago.

On the plus side, PayPal is already in the process of being replaced...by bitcoin!
bitcoinminer
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November 30, 2013, 04:56:22 PM
 #3

Should have used an escrow service for a domain name sale.

Be fearful when others are greedy, and greedy when others are fearful.

-Warren Buffett
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November 30, 2013, 05:16:16 PM
 #4

Not to worry, Bitcoin's already biting their ankles: http://www.coinometrics.com/bitcoin/btix

Vires in numeris
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November 30, 2013, 05:24:24 PM
 #5

So , Paypal it's evil , but you used it.
Why haven't you used bitcoins to sell the domains?

This reminds me of all the people , paypal must die , must be closed and the next post... why can't it buy bitcoins with paypal ?

Irony at it's finest


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November 30, 2013, 05:25:53 PM
 #6

Yep, paypal sucks alot Lips sealed

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November 30, 2013, 05:26:53 PM
 #7

Banks where I'm located are shutting down any accounts being used for local bitcoin selling. PayPal is a 1990s web dinosaur, and I look at it on the same level as I do a massive bank. They need to play it safe because of how large they've grown, and I get that, but yeah their policies are incredibly lame. Their fees are just as ridiculous as a bank's, too. No wonder Elon Musk moved onto better, more innovative things long ago.

On the plus side, PayPal is already in the process of being replaced...by bitcoin!

You know what bitcoin is? It's a currency. (well , supposed to be)
Paypal can easily adopt bitcoins , hmm just like bitpay , or based on the inputs.io (without the scam) model.

Don't sing their death song so easily.



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November 30, 2013, 05:27:13 PM
 #8

Why haven't you used bitcoins to sell the domains?

^ This.

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November 30, 2013, 07:03:07 PM
Last edit: November 30, 2013, 08:00:12 PM by LostDutchman
 #9

Virtually any credit card or payment processor is very dangerous to use in connection with cryptocurrencies.  It's not only Paypal.

Cyrpto poses a serious threat to the monies extorted by payment processors through merchant fees, interst and late charges.

You realy don't think they are going to sit still for this do you?

I will accept Paypal for ony very few things now but anything to do with crypto is not included in those things.

My $.02.

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November 30, 2013, 07:14:21 PM
 #10



Sorry to hear that. Paypal are absolute twatwaffles for doing this kind of shit.

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November 30, 2013, 07:17:30 PM
 #11

Paypal has been needing a replacement for a long time!

Lucky we got perfect money etc....
Or we would be screwed

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November 30, 2013, 07:40:11 PM
 #12

Banks where I'm located are shutting down any accounts being used for local bitcoin selling. PayPal is a 1990s web dinosaur, and I look at it on the same level as I do a massive bank. They need to play it safe because of how large they've grown, and I get that, but yeah their policies are incredibly lame. Their fees are just as ridiculous as a bank's, too. No wonder Elon Musk moved onto better, more innovative things long ago.

On the plus side, PayPal is already in the process of being replaced...by bitcoin!

Where you from? In The Netherlands the Rabobank is blocking Bitcoin transactions because the Ethical board decided that it's not ethic. I don't know if you know that Rabobank was the biggest player in the Libor scandal? Articles to back me up: http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/10/29/us-rabobank-libor-idUSBRE99S0L520131029

I mean, that's ethical right?
TheFootMan
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November 30, 2013, 07:58:45 PM
 #13

I mean, that's ethical right?

Everything the banks do is ethical (according to themselves). Then they can cherrypick anything else that they think is not ethical.

To OP:

I understand perfectly well what you're doing, and what you're not doing - I would've reviewed your account, and immediately cleared it. However, most people working on support are drones who only see things dangling in front of them, if somebody went past such a drone wearing a bitcoin t-shirt, the drone would've flagged the current account he's investigating at the same very moment as a bitcoin related account immediately, and dispatched the same e-mail, just to be on the safe side.

Precise, accurate and logic, I've never really experienced that from anyone working 1st line support anywhere. It's a reason they have such low end jobs. The bright and sharp people are usually higher up in the organization.

The only way to go forward with this, is to play it according to Paypal's rules. Then when the money has cleared, shut down your account and clearly state to them why you're closing down your account, and if you want to make more fuzz about it, make a blog post about it or something.

The 'notarized' part of the affidavit really cracked me up. But if that's their game, that's what you have to do. Use bitcoin in the future.
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November 30, 2013, 08:00:31 PM
 #14

Where you from? In The Netherlands the Rabobank is blocking Bitcoin transactions because the Ethical board decided that it's not ethic. I don't know if you know that Rabobank was the biggest player in the Libor scandal? Articles to back me up: http://www.reuters.com/article/2013/10/29/us-rabobank-libor-idUSBRE99S0L520131029

I mean, that's ethical right?

Therein lies the trouble with objective morality Cheesy

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November 30, 2013, 08:19:24 PM
 #15

Keep in mind most PayPal employees are just average joes making close to minimum wage to copy/paste generic answers from a guidebook. They used to offer dedicated support for high volume clients but got rid of it months ago because I guess they decided customer support wasn't important.

Should've had the guy pay you in bitcoin.
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November 30, 2013, 08:52:31 PM
 #16

One thing everyone here seems to forget or perhaps it is something that many here did not know in the fisrt place.

Now, clearly understand that I am NOT coming to the defence of Paypal as such, so don't blow a gasket on me here.

It has ALWAYS been against the Terms of Service of Paypal,  ALL credit card processors and the  TOS of the credit card companies to use such services for any kind of currency conversions; gift cards being the notable exception.

Since about three days after the first credit card was introduced is how long such bans have been in force.

This is nothing new; it is just the first time that the profitability of operating merchant services and credit card compannies has been seriously threated by any kind of alternative processing.

If cryptocurrncies are being targetted by the CC people it is because of the danger to their profits that crypto poses.

There are ways to avoid being screwed by the processors and still do crypto transactions but you have to be realoy smart about it and digusise the transactions for what they are but there are inherent risks there also.

The solution?

Wire transfers.

Crypto transfers.

Western Union.

Moneygram.

My $.02.

Wink

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November 30, 2013, 08:54:50 PM
 #17

regarding the OP

PP is great, it is the best thing that ever happened to bitcoin, the longer that corrupt, antiquated piece of shit staggers on the better bitcoin looks

This is not some pseudoeconomic post-modern Libertarian cult, it's an un-led, crowd-sourced mega startup organized around mutual self-interest where problems, whether of the theoretical or purely practical variety, are treated as temporary and, ultimately, solvable.
Censorship of e-gold was easy. Censorship of Bitcoin will be… entertaining.
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December 01, 2013, 03:58:37 AM
 #18

One thing everyone here seems to forget or perhaps it is something that many here did not know in the fisrt place.

Now, clearly understand that I am NOT coming to the defence of Paypal as such, so don't blow a gasket on me here.

It has ALWAYS been against the Terms of Service of Paypal,  ALL credit card processors and the  TOS of the credit card companies to use such services for any kind of currency conversions; gift cards being the notable exception.

Since about three days after the first credit card was introduced is how long such bans have been in force.

This is nothing new; it is just the first time that the profitability of operating merchant services and credit card compannies has been seriously threated by any kind of alternative processing.

If cryptocurrncies are being targetted by the CC people it is because of the danger to their profits that crypto poses.

There are ways to avoid being screwed by the processors and still do crypto transactions but you have to be realoy smart about it and digusise the transactions for what they are but there are inherent risks there also.

The solution?

Wire transfers.

Crypto transfers.

Western Union.

Moneygram.

My $.02.

Wink

Right you are - except I wasn't using PayPal for crypto transactions. I sold a domain name.
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December 01, 2013, 04:06:06 AM
 #19

Paypal is a bunch of pussies.


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LostDutchman
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December 01, 2013, 04:30:22 AM
 #20

One thing everyone here seems to forget or perhaps it is something that many here did not know in the fisrt place.

Now, clearly understand that I am NOT coming to the defence of Paypal as such, so don't blow a gasket on me here.

It has ALWAYS been against the Terms of Service of Paypal,  ALL credit card processors and the  TOS of the credit card companies to use such services for any kind of currency conversions; gift cards being the notable exception.

Since about three days after the first credit card was introduced is how long such bans have been in force.

This is nothing new; it is just the first time that the profitability of operating merchant services and credit card compannies has been seriously threated by any kind of alternative processing.

If cryptocurrncies are being targetted by the CC people it is because of the danger to their profits that crypto poses.

There are ways to avoid being screwed by the processors and still do crypto transactions but you have to be realoy smart about it and digusise the transactions for what they are but there are inherent risks there also.

The solution?

Wire transfers.

Crypto transfers.

Western Union.

Moneygram.

My $.02.

Wink

Right you are - except I wasn't using PayPal for crypto transactions. I sold a domain name.

"I recently sold a bitcoin related domain name that I own on sedo.com and the transaction was completed via PayPal."

I know.

Everyone should distance themselves as far as possible from all conventional merchant processing for anything connected with crypto!

My $.02.

Wink

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