Bitcoin Banknotes

[badakjawa]

I agree with bitcoin ATM, a few months ago Singapore sold a lot of ATM bitcoin, and it was all run out. because the popularity of bitcoin is already high. then a stupid statement if anyone says that bitcoin will die.

but I do not agree if bitcoin has a physical shape, such as paper or coins. this is a bad innovation, bitcoin will lose its character. so bitcoin is not a digital currency again.

I think, they have a conspiracy to eliminate bitcoin in an interesting way.

[Ukaraki]

I do not think that Bitcoin can become a paper currency, many believe that the development of virtual currencies is uneven, and many social states are experiencing economic conflicts. The development of virtual currency such as Bitcoin meet.

[infofarmer]

The organization that issued them should guarantee their redemption at par value in the case of presentation for payment.

Tangem Notes are completely trustless and decentralized beyond the multi–party security audit — in fact more trustless than any other current way to store Bitcoin. The chip is a tiny standalone HSM designed entirely for mission critical security applications and is completely air–gapped with just a tiny API to access it. You don't need anyone to guarantee their redemption as you can redeem Tangem Notes yourself with an NFC phone using an open protocol — or our reference apps (iOS open–sourced, Android to be open–sourced).

If it requires an NFC connection to chech the current balance, why the banknote is different from a mobile wallet?

Tangem Notes compare to mobile wallets same way fiat banknotes compare to mobile banking apps. Except mobile banking actually has banks behind them, while mobile wallets are relatively insecure. For most people without a background in engineering and security Tangem Notes are by far the safest way to store Bitcoin right now.

You do a beta test with bitcoin and after you can start to work with national currencies?

We want entrepreneurs, financial organizations, and governments to use the base Tangem technology for thousands of different tokens, currencies, and applications. It looks like Bitcoin will be the flagship for at least a long while.

The problem I see with that is that they are selling them for $199 for a pack of 10 unloaded cards. So who is going to want to hand over a device worth $20 when they spend $100?

The price tag is just for a limited edition Pioneer Kit for people who want it now, while we're rolling out normal distribution channels around the world, which takes time. The Pioneer Kit also comes with additional features which makes it useful as a highly secure hardware wallet. For retailers the cost of a basic Tangem Note is designed to nicely fit within their margins.

what happens if I have this banknote (card) and by the time when I want to hand it over, the secure chip fails inside?

The chip and firmware inside every Tangem Note is designed to be secure not just against hacking, but against sporadic failures. The secure element should survive magnetic fields and pulses as well as cosmic rays better than most other electronics. It is rated for at least 40 years in operation, but is expected to last much longer than that. We apply extreme mechanical and RF testing, targeting CQM and other standards compliance.

In short, value stored on Tangem Notes should be orders of magnitude safer than that on exchanges, cloud wallets, hot wallets, cold wallets, or paper.

[TheQuin]

The price tag is just for a limited edition Pioneer Kit for people who want it now, while we're rolling out normal distribution channels around the world, which takes time. The Pioneer Kit also comes with additional features which makes it useful as a highly secure hardware wallet. For retailers the cost of a basic Tangem Note is designed to nicely fit within their margins.

Thanks for that explanation. Can you expand on what the additional features are and how the basic version will differ? Also what ballpark price range are you talking about, say per 1000 units?

[Kakmakr]

So in theory, the cards always represent the value of BTC stored on the card, but you can never use it for payment... if the value is lower or higher than the amount stored on the card. The bitcoins never leave the card, right? So this is more like a collectible than a currency and a store of value. < It can be a currency, but then you have to pay the exact amount, stored on the card?>

Or... Do you use it as a hardware wallet, where the coins are continuously funded and used as a currency, but the content of the card is accessed and changed via a NFC phone?

I am still trying to figure our how you going to use this.    <Can you make a little demo video?>

[bitcoinman93]

As the popularity and value of Bitcoin increases so do its adoption. Recently, about 4,000 new ATMs were introduced in Argentina. A drastic transformation in this sphere is being brought by Tangem that is trying to make the cash like transaction through cryptocurrencies a possibility for the users.

Tagem, a new smart banknote platform is launching the bitcoin banknotes in Singapore, which is known for its blockchain and crypto favorable regulatory measures. The notes will be on sale at the Megafash Suntec City store. The aim is to mass produce the physical notes of bitcoin in millions by the end of 2018.

Continue reading: https://coingape.com/bitcoin-banknotes-ready-to-replace-traditional-currency/

very good! this is exactly what is needed for cryptocurrencies to get closer to normal people. Get the services closer to them so they can get bitcoin and alts easily and get immersed in this cool tech

[TheQuin]

So in theory, the cards always represent the value of BTC stored on the card, but you can never use it for payment... if the value is lower or higher than the amount stored on the card. The bitcoins never leave the card, right? So this is more like a collectible than a currency and a store of value. < It can be a currency, but then you have to pay the exact amount, stored on the card?>

Or... Do you use it as a hardware wallet, where the coins are continuously funded and used as a currency, but the content of the card is accessed and changed via a NFC phone?

I am still trying to figure our how you going to use this.    <Can you make a little demo video?>

No, you can spend the value held on the card. You need an NFC able phone and the app can then verify the balance and spend it. They are reusable as you can top them up. Have a look at tangem.com they look pretty cool if the price becomes reasonable.

[Kakmakr]

So in theory, the cards always represent the value of BTC stored on the card, but you can never use it for payment... if the value is lower or higher than the amount stored on the card. The bitcoins never leave the card, right? So this is more like a collectible than a currency and a store of value. < It can be a currency, but then you have to pay the exact amount, stored on the card?>

Or... Do you use it as a hardware wallet, where the coins are continuously funded and used as a currency, but the content of the card is accessed and changed via a NFC phone?

I am still trying to figure our how you going to use this.    <Can you make a little demo video?>

No, you can spend the value held on the card. You need an NFC able phone and the app can then verify the balance and spend it. They are reusable as you can top them up. Have a look at tangem.com they look pretty cool if the price becomes reasonable.

Yes, I found a video on Youtube now, explaining it. <Not by them>

What I cannot understand is, if these cards are expensive... why would you want to discard them... once you used them? I cannot see on their site what the cost of the cards is. Is it supposed to be disposable or is this more like a cheap hardware wallet? If this is like a cheap hardware wallet, then I will buy some of them.... the hardware wallets are expensive and the firmware updates is a pain in the ass.

How will governments react towards this? Is this not like "printing" your own currency? <You not going to cross borders with physical cards>

[infofarmer]

Can you expand on what the additional features are and how the basic version will differ? Also what ballpark price range are you talking about, say per 1000 units?

We're working with distributors around the world to figure out the right feature set and volume pricing. Aspects of reusability can be restricted in the basic variants meant primarily for physical circulation and fixed denominations.

The ones in the Pioneer Kit are more like full featured hardware Bitcoin wallets, only more secure, simpler to use, and much cheaper.

[Nerman]

As the popularity and value of Bitcoin increases so do its adoption. Recently, about 4,000 new ATMs were introduced in Argentina. A drastic transformation in this sphere is being brought by Tangem that is trying to make the cash like transaction through cryptocurrencies a possibility for the users.

Tagem, a new smart banknote platform is launching the bitcoin banknotes in Singapore, which is known for its blockchain and crypto favorable regulatory measures. The notes will be on sale at the Megafash Suntec City store. The aim is to mass produce the physical notes of bitcoin in millions by the end of 2018.

Continue reading: https://coingape.com/bitcoin-banknotes-ready-to-replace-traditional-currency/

very good! this is exactly what is needed for cryptocurrencies to get closer to normal people. Get the services closer to them so they can get bitcoin and alts easily and get immersed in this cool tech

This will be very helpful not only to normal people but specially for people who have bitcoin and travel a lot. You will be able to convert your bitcoin to fiat easily.

This will be favorable to us.

Also perhaps other people would be curious on bitcoin because of the new technology.

[TheQuin]

What I cannot understand is, if these cards are expensive... why would you want to discard them... once you used them? I cannot see on their site what the cost of the cards is. Is it supposed to be disposable or is this more like a cheap hardware wallet? If this is like a cheap hardware wallet, then I will buy some of them.... the hardware wallets are expensive and the firmware updates is a pain in the ass.

They are selling a limited edition Pioneer Kit of 5x 0.05 and 5x 0.01 unfunded cards for $199. When I pointed out above that only makes them suitable as a hardware wallet I got this answer.

The price tag is just for a limited edition Pioneer Kit for people who want it now, while we're rolling out normal distribution channels around the world, which takes time. The Pioneer Kit also comes with additional features which makes it useful as a highly secure hardware wallet. For retailers the cost of a basic Tangem Note is designed to nicely fit within their margins.

If that means they eventually end up being a few cents each then they could be used like bank notes and people would just hand them over. If they end up being more expensive then they'll be a handy credit card sized hardware wallet you can just stick in your wallet with your cash and cards.

Can you expand on what the additional features are and how the basic version will differ? Also what ballpark price range are you talking about, say per 1000 units?

We're working with distributors around the world to figure out the right feature set and volume pricing. Aspects of reusability can be restricted in the basic variants meant primarily for physical circulation and fixed denominations.

The ones in the Pioneer Kit are more like full featured hardware Bitcoin wallets, only more secure, simpler to use, and much cheaper.

OK, very interesting. I'll keep watching to see what they end up being. 

[Kakmakr]

What I cannot understand is, if these cards are expensive... why would you want to discard them... once you used them? I cannot see on their site what the cost of the cards is. Is it supposed to be disposable or is this more like a cheap hardware wallet? If this is like a cheap hardware wallet, then I will buy some of them.... the hardware wallets are expensive and the firmware updates is a pain in the ass.

They are selling a limited edition Pioneer Kit of 5x 0.05 and 5x 0.01 unfunded cards for $199. When I pointed out above that only makes them suitable as a hardware wallet I got this answer.

The price tag is just for a limited edition Pioneer Kit for people who want it now, while we're rolling out normal distribution channels around the world, which takes time. The Pioneer Kit also comes with additional features which makes it useful as a highly secure hardware wallet. For retailers the cost of a basic Tangem Note is designed to nicely fit within their margins.

If that means they eventually end up being a few cents each then they could be used like bank notes and people would just hand them over. If they end up being more expensive then they'll be a handy credit card sized hardware wallet you can just stick in your wallet with your cash and cards.

Can you expand on what the additional features are and how the basic version will differ? Also what ballpark price range are you talking about, say per 1000 units?

We're working with distributors around the world to figure out the right feature set and volume pricing. Aspects of reusability can be restricted in the basic variants meant primarily for physical circulation and fixed denominations.

The ones in the Pioneer Kit are more like full featured hardware Bitcoin wallets, only more secure, simpler to use, and much cheaper.

OK, very interesting. I'll keep watching to see what they end up being. 

Well, this spells nothing good for other expensive hardware wallets, like Ledger and Trezor.    <Though these wallets still have the advantage over these Bank notes that they support multiple Crypto currencies> On their website <side demo> it shows something that says, "Remaining Signatures : 999" ....so they have a limited use.

The $20 per card is still cheaper than most of the hardware wallets out there, but very expensive for people in 3rd world countries. <Which I had hoped that this was targeted to> 

[TheQuin]

Well, this spells nothing good for other expensive hardware wallets, like Ledger and Trezor.    <Though these wallets still have the advantage over these Bank notes that they support multiple Crypto currencies> On their website <side demo> it shows something that says, "Remaining Signatures : 999" ....so they have a limited use.

The $20 per card is still cheaper than most of the hardware wallets out there, but very expensive for people in 3rd world countries. <Which I had hoped that this was targeted to> 

The $20 is for the special limited edition set. It says "Fully reusable, unlimited times". So that is good value compared to Ledger and Trezor even as a one coin wallet.

Like I said if the limited use ones end up being a few cents each then that'll really work as a banknote substitute.

[Hell-raiser]

As the popularity and value of Bitcoin increases so do its adoption. Recently, about 4,000 new ATMs were introduced in Argentina. A drastic transformation in this sphere is being brought by Tangem that is trying to make the cash like transaction through cryptocurrencies a possibility for the users.

Tagem, a new smart banknote platform is launching the bitcoin banknotes in Singapore, which is known for its blockchain and crypto favorable regulatory measures. The notes will be on sale at the Megafash Suntec City store. The aim is to mass produce the physical notes of bitcoin in millions by the end of 2018.

Continue reading: https://coingape.com/bitcoin-banknotes-ready-to-replace-traditional-currency/

There is nothing new in this idea. If my mind serves me right, a few years ago there was a start-up called BitNotes (or something to that line). I don't know what's become of them but their idea was pretty much the same. They went for issuing paper bitcoins, so-called bitnotes, which were expected to facilitate the exchange of goods and services with Bitcoin. As much as this idea of creating paper bitcoins is loathed and hated by almost everyone in the community (because it effectively turns Bitcoin into a fiat currency), there is some rationale behind it. Technically, as long as paper bitcoins are backed up by the real ones which exist on the blockchain and there is a way to check every paper bitcoin for its blockchain counterpart, I see no big deal in that, especially if it could actually contribute to Bitcoin adoption in the real world.

But the problem is that there is no reliable and verifiable way to establish this connection, and whoever comes up with this idea and carries it out in practice, they will be tempted to issue more bitnotes than there are actual bitcoins. It had happened before with gold depositary receipts issued by the American banks in the 19th century as with the US dollars issued by the Fed after WWII (surprise, surprise), and is likely going to happen again with Bitcoin all over again.

[sumanto]

yes you are right bank notes currently no longer need to be used when you use bitcoin you can include notes in bitcoin transactions, not only that all bitcoin transcations are also recorded in big snagat notes and open all can see it.

[TheQuin]

There is nothing new in this idea. If my mind serves me right, a few years ago there was a start-up called like BitNotes. I don't know what's become of them but their idea was essentially the same. They went for issuing paper bitcoins, so-called bitnotes, which were to facilitate the exchange of good and services via Bitcoin. As much as this idea of creating paper bitcoins is loathed and hated by almost everyone in the community (because it effectively turns Bitcoin into a fiat currency), there is some rationale behind it. Technically, as long as paper bitcoins are backed up be real ones which exist on the blockchain and there is a way to check every paper bitcoin for its real counterpart, I see no big deal in that, especially if it could actually contribute to Bitcoin real life adoption.

The problem is there is no reliable way to establish this connection, and whoever comes up with this idea and employs it in practice, they will be tempted to issue more bitnotes than there are actual bitcoins. It had happened before with gold depositary receipts with North American banks in the 19th century, with the US dollar after WWII (surprise, surprise), and is likely going to happen again with Bitcoin.

If you had read the thread you would have known that these are actually more like hardware wallets and you can verify that they are funded using NFC and a smartphone app. So it is not possible to issue more and there is no comparison with fiat.

[brickafterbrickwalldpt]

For me, it doesn't look good. Why would we even need banknotes when we have smartphones in our pockets which can store our bitcoins securely? There are many well coded wallets for Android and iOS which are fairly easy to use. I understand that some people might have problems with using Bitcoin, but it's not that difficult at all if you are not interested in coin control for example. The number of available bitcoins on the banknote won't change so someone will have to scan it with NFC anyway. It's not really convenient.

[Virtual miner]

https://news.bitcoin.com/bitcoin-smart-banknotes/

I read it just now through some other thread sharing the same information. So it is damn true that this is a great move and the concept is truly innovative. Likewise there is much more to it than just being the simple currency notes.

For me, it doesn't look good. Why would we even need banknotes when we have smartphones in our pockets which can store our bitcoins securely? There are many well coded wallets for Android and iOS which are fairly easy to use. I understand that some people might have problems with using Bitcoin, but it's not that difficult at all if you are not interested in coin control for example. The number of available bitcoins on the banknote won't change so someone will have to scan it with NFC anyway. It's not really convenient.

But you see that now you will not have to wait for hours to transfer and the transaction fees is also NIL. What I think every new change that is introduced has its own pros n cons. But if you see the advantages outweighing the disadvantages, then definitely the change must be appreciated.

[Hell-raiser]

For me, it doesn't look good. Why would we even need banknotes when we have smartphones in our pockets which can store our bitcoins securely? There are many well coded wallets for Android and iOS which are fairly easy to use. I understand that some people might have problems with using Bitcoin, but it's not that difficult at all if you are not interested in coin control for example. The number of available bitcoins on the banknote won't change so someone will have to scan it with NFC anyway. It's not really convenient.

There are OpenDime devices on the market already, and they recently seem to have developed a new version of their disposable wallet. One of the use cases stated is a truly anonymous transfer of large amounts of bitcoins totally avoiding any traces that regular transfers leave on the blockchain. For example, you want to buy something expensive and don't want anyone to know about that. You privately exchange this hardware wallet with your bitcoins in it for the thing you are looking for, and that's pretty much all there's to it. If you feel interested, you can search for a thread about these devices somewhere around here started by their developer and read about possible use cases in greater detail there.

[Dark_raven007]

It looks more like bonds. Well done first in the market in its form as bitcoin in due time. on the one hand it's good: they lie quietly in your pocket and you will not be taken away by any hacker.