Why do I keep hearing mining is unprofitable?

[pontiacg5]

Why do you keep hearing mining is unprofitable?
Because, mining really is unprofitable, when you take electricity costs and increasing difficulty into consideration.

Another sockpuppet that doesn't understand math...

Perhaps you could use your condescending tone to enlighten us as to the profitability of it?

With the expected spike in difficulty, and the shipping time of the ASICs out there, how is one to make a profit?

Also an answer comprised of more than 1 line would be great.

Are you dense or just dumb? Nobody is going to be able to explain it, because it if was explained so easily everyone would do it, difficulty would skyrocket and everyone would get less.

You have to do research on your own, get electricity at a better rate, buy miners cheap and now, never pre-order like a fool. Whatever the hell it is you can do to give you an advantage over everyone else. Only that will make you money mining, and only you are going to be able to figure that out. If you find that too hard, just buy coins.

[Damnsammit]

Why do you keep hearing mining is unprofitable?
Because, mining really is unprofitable, when you take electricity costs and increasing difficulty into consideration.

Another sockpuppet that doesn't understand math...

Perhaps you could use your condescending tone to enlighten us as to the profitability of it?

With the expected spike in difficulty, and the shipping time of the ASICs out there, how is one to make a profit?

Also an answer comprised of more than 1 line would be great.

Sorry for the condescending tone, but I have already explained this in several threads many times over.  I'll copy and paste from a previous post I made a few days ago.  I am planning on making a website explaining this information because it seems too many people are misinformed.

Also, Scrypt mining is now directly related to Bitcoin as sites like middlecoin.com exist where you hash Scrypt directly for Bitcoin and not some shit alt-coin.

I will probably buy 3 Used amd 7950 for around 200$ each in Sweden new 7950 cost around 400$ so it's tio much i already got à CPU ram etc i Will only need to buy a motherboard and some cables
I got totally free electricity how
Much should I expect to get in 1 month and when does Asics
come to scrypt

1) You can use this information to find the hashrate for your cards that you want to use:

https://litecoin.info/Mining_hardware_comparison

As you can see you should expect 600-700kH/s with those cards... if you get 3 then you can expect 1.8-2.1MH/s.  Then go to a calculator like this one:

https://www.litecoinpool.org/calc?hashrate=2000&difficulty=1964.83427079&power=&energycost=0.10&currency=USD

And you can plug in the numbers.  You should get right around 1LTC a day which is worth about $40 right now.

2) ASICs will never come to Scrypt.  Something new will come along before someone takes the time and money to properly develop a Scrypt ASIC.  Of course, I hope I am wrong on that.

It is not so easy, If you want GPU mine, check your electricity rates and use mining calculator before buying GPUs

That is an understatement.  GPU mining can be very tedious, time consuming, and frustrating.  It can take several trips to electronics stores to find parts, and then wait times on ordering supplies like risers, PSU cables, etc.  But it can also be quite fun and definitely profitable.  I don't know anywhere in the world that the electricity rates would be so high as to you not turn a profit if you don't factor in the cost of the GPU.  And I don't factor that in because most of the GPUs still retain their value through resale.  The 5850 I bought in April for $60 will still sell for about $60 today.

3x5850 = 1MH/s hashrate and supplied on 850W PSU, if 850W is used 24/7 for a month, the profit expected is:

.491 LTC a day * 30 days = 14.73 LTC = $534 at current price

Total kilowatt hours used during the month = 30(days) x 24(hours) x .850 (kilowatts per hour) = 612 KW hours*
*it will be lower than this since I don't think it's possible for a 850W PSU to constantly draw 850W from the wall, but we will just say that it does anyways

For a mining rig of this nature to be unprofitable then your electricity would have to be $0.87/KW hour or higher.  In comparison, the typical high average that I have seen is $0.15-0.25 which would mean you are turning electricity into 300-600% of the cost of straight up buying the coins.

I see absolutely no reason why anyone would have idle miners at this time, and cannot for the life of me understand why so many people can blindly say "mining is not profitable anymore"

[PenAndPaper]

People are so idiot that they just want a magic machine that can create money out of thin air. They just want that and they don't care if they can do better with buying bitcoins instead.

[itayl2]

Why do you keep hearing mining is unprofitable?
Because, mining really is unprofitable, when you take electricity costs and increasing difficulty into consideration.

Another sockpuppet that doesn't understand math...

Perhaps you could use your condescending tone to enlighten us as to the profitability of it?

With the expected spike in difficulty, and the shipping time of the ASICs out there, how is one to make a profit?

Also an answer comprised of more than 1 line would be great.

Sorry for the condescending tone, but I have already explained this in several threads many times over.  I'll copy and paste from a previous post I made a few days ago.  I am planning on making a website explaining this information because it seems too many people are misinformed.

Also, Scrypt mining is now directly related to Bitcoin as sites like middlecoin.com exist where you hash Scrypt directly for Bitcoin and not some shit alt-coin.

I will probably buy 3 Used amd 7950 for around 200$ each in Sweden new 7950 cost around 400$ so it's tio much i already got à CPU ram etc i Will only need to buy a motherboard and some cables
I got totally free electricity how
Much should I expect to get in 1 month and when does Asics
come to scrypt

1) You can use this information to find the hashrate for your cards that you want to use:

https://litecoin.info/Mining_hardware_comparison

As you can see you should expect 600-700kH/s with those cards... if you get 3 then you can expect 1.8-2.1MH/s.  Then go to a calculator like this one:

https://www.litecoinpool.org/calc?hashrate=2000&difficulty=1964.83427079&power=&energycost=0.10&currency=USD

And you can plug in the numbers.  You should get right around 1LTC a day which is worth about $40 right now.

2) ASICs will never come to Scrypt.  Something new will come along before someone takes the time and money to properly develop a Scrypt ASIC.  Of course, I hope I am wrong on that.

It is not so easy, If you want GPU mine, check your electricity rates and use mining calculator before buying GPUs

That is an understatement.  GPU mining can be very tedious, time consuming, and frustrating.  It can take several trips to electronics stores to find parts, and then wait times on ordering supplies like risers, PSU cables, etc.  But it can also be quite fun and definitely profitable.  I don't know anywhere in the world that the electricity rates would be so high as to you not turn a profit if you don't factor in the cost of the GPU.  And I don't factor that in because most of the GPUs still retain their value through resale.  The 5850 I bought in April for $60 will still sell for about $60 today.

3x5850 = 1MH/s hashrate and supplied on 850W PSU, if 850W is used 24/7 for a month, the profit expected is:

.491 LTC a day * 30 days = 14.73 LTC = $534 at current price

Total kilowatt hours used during the month = 30(days) x 24(hours) x .850 (kilowatts per hour) = 612 KW hours*
*it will be lower than this since I don't think it's possible for a 850W PSU to constantly draw 850W from the wall, but we will just say that it does anyways

For a mining rig of this nature to be unprofitable then your electricity would have to be $0.87/KW hour or higher.  In comparison, the typical high average that I have seen is $0.15-0.25 which would mean you are turning electricity into 300-600% of the cost of straight up buying the coins.

I see absolutely no reason why anyone would have idle miners at this time, and cannot for the life of me understand why so many people can blindly say "mining is not profitable anymore"

Thanks a bunch for the detailed reply.
Mining LTC is definitely profitable, I know that. I was referring to Bitcoin.. Anything I'm missing there?
increase in difficulty in Jan + Feb combined with shipping dates = sucks to be btc miners?

[itayl2]

Why do you keep hearing mining is unprofitable?
Because, mining really is unprofitable, when you take electricity costs and increasing difficulty into consideration.

Another sockpuppet that doesn't understand math...

Perhaps you could use your condescending tone to enlighten us as to the profitability of it?

With the expected spike in difficulty, and the shipping time of the ASICs out there, how is one to make a profit?

Also an answer comprised of more than 1 line would be great.

Are you dense or just dumb? Nobody is going to be able to explain it, because it if was explained so easily everyone would do it, difficulty would skyrocket and everyone would get less.

You have to do research on your own, get electricity at a better rate, buy miners cheap and now, never pre-order like a fool. Whatever the hell it is you can do to give you an advantage over everyone else. Only that will make you money mining, and only you are going to be able to figure that out. If you find that too hard, just buy coins.

Web hostility is always useful. Thank you.

I've been looking for miners available immediately, and could only find really low gh/s miners. The only powerful ones I could find (say 500gh/s and above) will ship Jan 2014 minimum... except for one, not sure about that.

Increase in difficulty in Jan and Feb, combined with the shipping times, render it useless for someone who doesn't already have a miner.

Also, this is FORUM. If you don't want to take place in it, don't. Thanks for playing.

[naphto]

1) difficulty change
2) price change


You will never get any ROI.

[Damnsammit]

1) difficulty change
2) price change


You will never get any ROI.

Disagree.

The Cube will give you a positive return on investment.  I'll even document the proof when mine arrives next week.  I paid 1BTC for it and at 38GH/s it should mine over 1BTC in approximately 45-60 days.

Scrypt mining is wildly profitable now, but I don't have the hard numbers on it.  I'm working on a few things, but I am trying to hash (no pun intended) out all of the details on the outline, but hopefully I will have a more informative site available in the near future that puts these silly rumors to rest.

Some devices can be profitable, some never will be.  Others will require you to buy it, mine with it, and then sell it and hope to get a profit that way.  But it's possible with all of them, it just takes research and initiative.

[Damnsammit]

Thanks a bunch for the detailed reply.
Mining LTC is definitely profitable, I know that. I was referring to Bitcoin.. Anything I'm missing there?
increase in difficulty in Jan + Feb combined with shipping dates = sucks to be btc miners?

I am not exactly sure that the ASIC production is at the point where the difficulty will continue going up 40%+ much longer.

Difficulty gains of 40%+ are very rare, but they just happened twice in October.  In November they went back down to 16-25% and if they stay in this range, then it actually doesn't suck to be a BTC miner depending on what the $/GH cost is... no idea what the golden ratio would be right now, but I am going to be doing some research on this when I have more free time after Christmas.

[cp1]

Disagree.

The Cube will give you a positive return on investment.  I'll even document the proof when mine arrives next week.  I paid 1BTC for it and at 38GH/s it should mine over 1BTC in approximately 45-60 days.

If difficulty increase is limited to 25% per jump then you'll break even in 75 days.  Higher than that and it doesn't look good.

[Damnsammit]

Disagree.

The Cube will give you a positive return on investment.  I'll even document the proof when mine arrives next week.  I paid 1BTC for it and at 38GH/s it should mine over 1BTC in approximately 45-60 days.

If difficulty increase is limited to 25% per jump then you'll break even in 75 days.  Higher than that and it doesn't look good.

Do you have the numbers on that?  I think I have numbers that prove otherwise, but they are on my work computer and I won't have access to them until Monday.

Thanks

[cp1]

Date/Difficulty/BTC earned

Code:

12/7/2013	12/10/2013	12/22/2013	1/3/2014	1/15/2014	1/27/2014	2/8/2014
707408283.1	884260353.8	1105325442	1381656803	1727071004	2158838754	2698548443
0.067537869	0.259345418	0.207476334	0.165981067	0.132784854	0.106227883	0.084982306

[simonce2]

Date/Difficulty/BTC earned

Code:

12/7/2013	12/10/2013	12/22/2013	1/3/2014	1/15/2014	1/27/2014	2/8/2014
707408283.1	884260353.8	1105325442	1381656803	1727071004	2158838754	2698548443
0.067537869	0.259345418	0.207476334	0.165981067	0.132784854	0.106227883	0.084982306

Where do you get that expected future difficulty?
PS. Never mind, find that you just plug 25% in each increase.

[PenAndPaper]

Thanks a bunch for the detailed reply.
Mining LTC is definitely profitable, I know that. I was referring to Bitcoin.. Anything I'm missing there?
increase in difficulty in Jan + Feb combined with shipping dates = sucks to be btc miners?

I am not exactly sure that the ASIC production is at the point where the difficulty will continue going up 40%+ much longer.

Difficulty gains of 40%+ are very rare, but they just happened twice in October.  In November they went back down to 16-25% and if they stay in this range, then it actually doesn't suck to be a BTC miner depending on what the $/GH cost is... no idea what the golden ratio would be right now, but I am going to be doing some research on this when I have more free time after Christmas.

Just wait to see how rare the 40% jumps are going to be after february...

[PenAndPaper]

BitCoin Mining Hardware takes so long to arrive and by the time I got it its already out of date.  If I order the new mining hardware I'm stuck in the same circle all over again.  I'm tired of waiting for outdated mining equipment so I mine here - Instant BitCoin Mining - https://cex.io/r/0/Strider/0/

I find this much more efficient and my electric bill went way down!

Cloud Mining Works

Yes cloud mining is a good way not to wait for outdated hardware but in a way to buy outdated hardware right away.
Also stop posting referrals