Major Project set to test bitcoins true strengths on Sovereign Tribal Nation

[kimitsugroup]

Bitcoin Development Project Concept:
The Concept for this project is to test Bitcoins true market viability by introducing it to a economically impoverished area, and education the local community in regards to 3 elements,
1.) BTC Mining including ASIC hardware and development, software and control scripts
2.) BTC Exchanges and trading, understanding how market volatility works and  how it can be good for the overall industry.
3.) Payment Processing and merchant acceptance
The Target location is the Pine Ridge Indian reservation in western South Dakota, this location  was selected for two main reasons, one is it's long standing history of economic hardship and poverty. Also it's unique political status as a Sovereign nation, this would insulate it from outside federal regulations and the issues surrounding that. This will allow the Oglala Lakota Tribal nation to freely explore a BTC based market and can determine what, if any, regulations should be imposed in order to maintain a free market and consumer security at the same time
Our immediate goals are 25-50 BTC in order to purchase basic Mining gear to get started with Phase one of the project
For those interested in Donating we've set up 2 main Donation Accounts
BTC Donations: 15v9sS7KPPmBw4wgRDYVGrRiaMXNphCxdd
LTC Donations: LYADg8z4vFmmay3Fo35dh1FpGVxpU5p5sY
Also for those willing to Purchase/Donate Mining gear or with input and/or advice on this project email me Payu Harris BTC Oyate Project mgr   kimitsugroup@gmail.com

[1715385293]

1715385293

[1715385293]

1715385293

[Kouye]

Bitcoin Development Project Concept:
The Concept for this project is to test Bitcoins true market viability by introducing it to a economically impoverished area, and education the local community in regards to 3 elements,
1.) BTC Mining including ASIC hardware and development, software and control scripts
2.) BTC Exchanges and trading, understanding how market volatility works and  how it can be good for the overall industry.
3.) Payment Processing and merchant acceptance
The Target location is the Pine Ridge Indian reservation in western South Dakota, this location  was selected for two main reasons, one is it's long standing history of economic hardship and poverty. Also it's unique political status as a Sovereign nation, this would insulate it from outside federal regulations and the issues surrounding that. This will allow the Oglala Lakota Tribal nation to freely explore a BTC based market and can determine what, if any, regulations should be imposed in order to maintain a free market and consumer security at the same time
Our immediate goals are 25-50 BTC in order to purchase basic Mining gear to get started with Phase one of the project
For those interested in Donating we've set up 2 main Donation Accounts
BTC Donations: 15v9sS7KPPmBw4wgRDYVGrRiaMXNphCxdd
LTC Donations: LYADg8z4vFmmay3Fo35dh1FpGVxpU5p5sY
Also for those willing to Purchase/Donate Mining gear or with input and/or advice on this project email me Payu Harris BTC Oyate Project mgr   kimitsugroup@gmail.com

Just go there, explain what bitcoin is to them.
They'll take over.

[Desensitizer]

Bitcoin Development Project Concept:
The Concept for this project is to test Bitcoins true market viability by introducing it to a economically impoverished area, and education the local community in regards to 3 elements,
1.) BTC Mining including ASIC hardware and development, software and control scripts
2.) BTC Exchanges and trading, understanding how market volatility works and  how it can be good for the overall industry.
3.) Payment Processing and merchant acceptance
The Target location is the Pine Ridge Indian reservation in western South Dakota, this location  was selected for two main reasons, one is it's long standing history of economic hardship and poverty. Also it's unique political status as a Sovereign nation, this would insulate it from outside federal regulations and the issues surrounding that. This will allow the Oglala Lakota Tribal nation to freely explore a BTC based market and can determine what, if any, regulations should be imposed in order to maintain a free market and consumer security at the same time
Our immediate goals are 25-50 BTC in order to purchase basic Mining gear to get started with Phase one of the project
For those interested in Donating we've set up 2 main Donation Accounts
BTC Donations: 15v9sS7KPPmBw4wgRDYVGrRiaMXNphCxdd
LTC Donations: LYADg8z4vFmmay3Fo35dh1FpGVxpU5p5sY
Also for those willing to Purchase/Donate Mining gear or with input and/or advice on this project email me Payu Harris BTC Oyate Project mgr   kimitsugroup@gmail.com

Have you considered using other cryptocurrencys, or making your own in order to best suit your needs? 25-50 BTC is a lot of money, but the concepts which you are trying to prove (true market viability of cryptocurrency) could easily be established with a less expensive currency whose value could be independent from bitcoins and you could set.
Also, are you sure they are going to want to pay for the electricity to mine?

[franky1]

i smell a finshaggy sock

[kimitsugroup]

Yes I considered using LTC however with BTC being the main traded Currency I figured it would be better to use that over others...one interesting thing to note is seeing how the tribes Sovereign nation status will come into play in all this...I chose the 25-50 figure in order to beat market fluctuation...as BTC prices are falling currently I want to insure not having to seek another round of project financing...KAM has already offered .25 BTC. As for the Tribe they're interested in seeing exactly what crypto currencies could do for rebuilding a tribal economy. Im a tribal member and have close family ties on the reservation and have lived there and seen the poverty firsthand...I firmly believe BTC could be produce a stabilizing effect for the reservation. I know this Project is going to raise some eyebrows, I can see the Trolls already warming up...we always talk about what BTC could do if it was openly accepted by a government and supported...well here's our chance to see and find out...if successful Im planning to invite people to come and share their success stories with crypto currencies...According to the US Dept of Interior...they agree the tribe has the full right to regulate the use of Crypto Currencies on the reservation...or to openly accept them....so the question becomes...if the tribe opens a Native American Exchange how will that impact any US regulations outside of tribal lands?  
Also with the Electricity issue since it's a experimental developmental program the tribe would pick up power costs until the project was able to become self sustaining.

[kimitsugroup]

One thing to note for everyone...yes explain it to them and they'll take over but seeing as im from Pine Ridge, I've lived there...I figure im a good person to oversee the Project and help train others...and thats why we're seeking enough BTC to get a 500 Ghs - 1 Ths miner because like I said the BTC generated will be used to help train prospective traders on CC trading and market basics...again...this project is designed to become 100 % self sufficient. 

[Pentax]

Interesting concept.   For purposes of discussion, I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and assume that you're trying to help people and not just trolling for dollars. Having tried to set up charitable organizations in the past I know it can be a serious PITA on many levels.

Maybe I'm missing something, but if it were me, which it is not, I'd be investigating setting up a BTC casino online, if that is allowed, and I'm not shitting around one bit.  It's something I've been thinking would be a great idea and it seems that you might have a leg up in this case, as it may or may not be easier to get a gaming license, although I'm admittedly ignorant of the laws that regulate those industries, so it may not be a possibility.

If it is, it is going to be simpler to get people to donate the cash for a startup, which is what this is in either scenario.  Write a business proposal/prospectus, put together a team of business people and programmers and either go to a bank for a loan or float stock options. 

But in either case absolutely do start with writing that business proposal, as it will help you think through the logistics and potential problems ahead of time.  Banks or investors won't take you seriously if you don't have your ducks in a row, so take the time to step back and do some of these preliminary things most often overlooked by people trying to get something off the ground.

[Phinnaeus Gage]

http://abcnews.go.com/US/story?id=95944

The plaque outside the Apache Gold Casino declares the $40 million hotel, golf and gambling resort has “helped enable the San Carlos Apache Tribe to give a better quality of life to its tribal members.”

But seven years after the casino opened — and four years after the debut of a glittering new complex — many Apache families still crowd in small apartments or mobile homes.

The reservation’s unemployment rate has climbed from 42 percent in 1991 to 58 percent in 1997, the latest year available. The number of tribal members receiving welfare has jumped 20 percent. And the tribal government still grants home sites without water and sewer connections.

“We get no help from the casino, no money, nothing,” said Pauline Randall, 75, a lifelong resident of San Carlos.

$8 Billion and Little Change

Similar complaints echo across the 1.8 million acre reservation in east Arizona, but they could just as easily be heard on many other Indian reservations across the country that have built casinos in the past decade.

Despite an explosion of Indian gambling revenues — from $100 million in 1988 to $8.26 billion a decade later — an Associated Press computer analysis of federal unemployment, poverty and public assistance records indicates the majority of American Indians have benefited little.

Whether it be Bitcoin, casinos or a the biggest automotive plant in the world, it would not help those truly in need and, at the end of the day, sadly, the tribe would probably be worse off.

[LiteCoinGuy]

do you have a website? a video? something more than just some sentences? remember: you want at least 25 BTC "for free" for that project 

[kimitsugroup]

I'm working on a website page for the project...and very true bringing in Casinos didn't impact Native american communities quite as planned...but thats also the idea this project was looking at...this is not just building a new casino or a bank or a specific business...it's deploying Bitcoin Technology and concept across the board Mining, Exchange trading and Merchant services. Also this will affect a entire Sovereign nation, small as it is...but we'll be able to see what happens when a country embraces the idea of Bitcoin as a national currency. Last weekend the Bitcoin Community Donated 22 BTC to a collage kid for holding up a sign with his QR address on it...which is great..it shows the willingness for the Crypto community to help one another and support one another...thats what Im hoping can happen here...the same type of community support but for a good cause that would make a positive impact for the industry...I do understand it looks like im just asking for free BTC...im open to alternate means of financing the mining aspect to start this project...if mining groups wanted to aim a day or two of their efforts towards the project I set up a specific worker on -o http://mint.bitminter.com:8332  -u kimitsu_btcoyate -p x   if a interested party wanted to Finance the mining unit and send it...that way they'd be sure of what their efforts were going to or even putting together a loan financing arrangement...like I said...the main Goal is to get the project started and see how the results turn out...that's why we're looking at the 500 Ghs - 1 Ths range for the Mining Phase...that should generate enough BTC to start the Exchange Trading aspect (taking into account the increased Diff rating if project funding takes awhile)
I have a detailed plan write up available if any Serious Supporter would like to look at it...PM or email me  kimitsugroup@gmail.com  I will be working on the Project webpage today and will post here when it's ready again  I appreciate the Comments and input good and bad...keep them coming   -Payu H arris-

[kimitsugroup]

Ok the Project info page can be found on www.kimitsuassetmanagement.com would like to ask people if they cant Donate please share the link to others that may be able to help with the project we're also now on https://www.coinfunder.com/project/view/id/118

[saddambitcoin]

i'd be interested in donating...but

pardon my ignorance on these issues, is it possible for someone to join your sovereign nation?

[kimitsugroup]

Well heres the thing...the tribes here hold a unique relationship with the American Govt...we are, as I said, a Sovereign nation however we have a ways to go before we're respected as such. Thats why this project is unique and important for both the Native American Community as well as  the Bitcoin community because it will show the world that we can re build our shattered economy through the use of Bitcoin technology and at the same time it can show the world that bitcoin CAN be deployed and used as a successful primary medium of exchange and commerce without having to resort to a fiat currency...now as for the question of "joining", it takes alot to become a tribal member...mostly through family lineage. However the tribe is always open to welcoming potential new citizens that can bring something to the table and help bring together a better future for our people. my recommendations would be travel here during the summer, see the area, meet some of the people and see what you think. Despite the outward poverty theres alot of opportunity there with new skills, products, goods and services to offer.   

[richo262]

So you plan to teach the joys of ASIC mining to a impoverish state.

Steps:
1) Get them to fork out $25,000 they don't have for an ASIC miner
2) Hope it arrives
3) If it arrives, or arrive on time, hope you can gather enough BTC to make an ROI
4) Pay the power bill
5) Be confused as to why they are no longer interested in BTC.

ASIC mining is not something you teach to beginners, it is for people with money to burn and risks to take.

[GigaCoin]

Bitcoin Development Project Concept:
The Concept for this project is to test Bitcoins true market viability by introducing it to a economically impoverished area, and education the local community in regards to 3 elements,
1.) BTC Mining including ASIC hardware and development, software and control scripts
2.) BTC Exchanges and trading, understanding how market volatility works and  how it can be good for the overall industry.
3.) Payment Processing and merchant acceptance
The Target location is the Pine Ridge Indian reservation in western South Dakota, this location  was selected for two main reasons, one is it's long standing history of economic hardship and poverty. Also it's unique political status as a Sovereign nation, this would insulate it from outside federal regulations and the issues surrounding that. This will allow the Oglala Lakota Tribal nation to freely explore a BTC based market and can determine what, if any, regulations should be imposed in order to maintain a free market and consumer security at the same time
Our immediate goals are 25-50 BTC in order to purchase basic Mining gear to get started with Phase one of the project
For those interested in Donating we've set up 2 main Donation Accounts
BTC Donations: 15v9sS7KPPmBw4wgRDYVGrRiaMXNphCxdd
LTC Donations: LYADg8z4vFmmay3Fo35dh1FpGVxpU5p5sY
Also for those willing to Purchase/Donate Mining gear or with input and/or advice on this project email me Payu Harris BTC Oyate Project mgr   kimitsugroup@gmail.com

Lot of Scam and Free Coins asker indicators:

1. No proper project plan, no project whitepaper, unfeasible mining plan
2. v Low posts, unknown to the community, came outta nowhere suddenly wants coins
3. Been done before so many times where someone thinks of a "legit" looking idea just to gain free coins

I would be careful with this.

[trout]

Hey OP, I see you want to do something,
but don't have a good idea what.

To make your people use BTC here's what you need to do:
- teach people how to transact in BTC
- make it easy for them to acquire BTC: set up at least one physical exchange point
- offer protection against market volatility.

The first 2 points require a lot of on-site work with people.

For the last point: you could offer to always buy back BTC for the same
price you sold them to that person. May be with some limits on the amount and/or time.
Here you can be losing money, so it makes sense to ask for donations/funding.

I don't see how mining can be useful at all.

[kimitsugroup]

Ok again for people just thinking this is ONLY mining look at the ENTIRE project overview...the Mining aspect is only a small part of it...the mining aspect not only teaches about ASIC technology hands on...but the coins generated are planned to be used to teach the basics of Exchange Trading, Market reaction, and other elements of the bitcoin exchange market. By using coins we've generated through mining it reduces the tribes exposure to having to buy bitcoins to train trading basics. you can find the main project page with www.kimitsuassetmanagement.com and as far as the amount we're looking for...currently BTC price is down 30% I dont want to set the project budget too low then be stuck trying to ask again to help get it started...if we can get it started with a lesser amount I'll post that we got it started...and yes this type of project has been done before but not at this level. We're talking about Bitcoin being embraced as a national currency of a sovereign nation, this will go along way towards proving out Bitcoins viability as a stable means of exchange. We are looking at a idea to work with my tribes Casino to develop a exchange service point where people can buy and exchange btc to usd. Again, this is where the mining element comes into play. This project takes into account ALL aspects of Bitcoin from Generation to exchange to merchant acceptance. I do appreciate the feedback and to the people saying im just looking for free btc...last weekend at the Auburn/Alabama game the bitcoin community gave a random guy in the stands 22 BTC just because he held up a sign saying "Send me Bitcoins" which is great...this project is designed to test bitcoins true viability and see whether or not it truly can come in and rescue a failing economy. If someone wants to help draw up a proper whitepaper I'd love the help. if anyone feels like stopping by South Dakota next summer to help with the project hands on that would be great too (assuming it's going).

[coins101]

1. Get a few local people to confirm the project using a simple video camera, phone, any handheld digital camera, tablet

2. Post it to youtube

[richo262]

Yeah, we don't think this is entirely mining, but your first point of three is directly about mining with specific and very expensive mining equipment.

Mining is still a bad idea.

The price of gear is still set assuming the price is $1100+, now BTC is about $700-800 and changes between daily, I doubt anybody that is seeking an ROI on their latest investment is feeling comfortable.

Getting a whole nation to places its resources into mining something so volatile would not be a safe bet.

As much as an advocate as I am for bitcoin and crypto currency generally, I wouldn't put all of my wealth into BTC, same reason i dont invest in mining. If an altcoin takes the mantle in a year or two, it is a rather risky investment. If I wouldn't put all my wealth into mining it, I certainly wouldnt encourage an entire community to do it either. You'll either make them stinking rich or dirt poor.

By all means teach them BTC and all things crypto. I do suggest you listen to some concerns by others on this thread about the mining aspect. It's high risk for an individual and currently unlikely to have an ROI unless price goes back up.

[kimitsugroup]

Ahhh ok well maybe one thing I need help with is someone that can help with writing this more effectively...this project is merely meant to be a starting point for the tribe to take a more active role in bitcoin development in the future...I have the mining aspect in there because mining is how bitcoins are generated...also as part of that phase of the project I would hope to see perhaps the Tribal College, Sinte Gleska, or OLC take a interest and perhaps develop a course around chipset designs, SHA and SCRYPT Algorithms, Opensource Mining application development, etc.  I feel this would be productive because of Bitcoins inherent Open source platform which would allow a smaller college to develop a course structure around Bitcoin and Crypto technology Bit still the question will come up...How are bitcoins made? and where do they come from? The Mining aspect isn't meant to be a big income producer...it's meant simply to generate enough btc so that the second phase will have a greater chance of success...that being exchange trading. Exchange trading opens the door to market study, how Crypto currency exchanges work and how to exchange Crypto to Fiat and back. this part of the project also seeks to address the Sovereignty question and how tribal Sovereignty can be used to safeguard bitcoin technology and foster it's future growth. look at start ups like Bitinstant, Bitfloor and other exchanges and services that had good services, good aspirations, and good people behind the wheel...but were stopped due to federal regulations and state interference because of misinformation and pressure from the Fiat based banking community. Had a start up like Bitfloor partnered with a Native american tribe, the tribe could have hosted their servers or even helped run a brick and mortar exchange under Tribal Unified Commercial Codes and insulated them from crippling federal regulations...kinda like how places like costa rica host Online Poker sites due to it's international Sovereignty...only in this case you can drive to South Dakota. But there again..the bitcoins need to come from somewhere...and I wont lie there is a amount of risk involved in this project...but rather then asking for people to blindly donate BTC/LTC for us to experiment with...we're looking to fund a way to generate them ourselves we're also look for people who could come out after the project is started and give talks, guidance, advice and more to people here that want to learn. Im not a expert in mining gear...but there are some of you out there that are...that have designed your own units...I know there are people out there that are more experienced with setting up exchanges and how they run...if we get this project started even at a minimal level...how many would be willing to come out to SD and work hands on with the project to help develop it ? if people are leery of donating used gear or BTC how many of you would be willing to donate your time?

[cr1776]

What kind of mining gear do you want donated? Block eruptor blade? Or only bigger ASIC stuff now?

[kimitsugroup]

Right now we're interested in any and all equipment that parties would consider donating, Block erupters, ASIC units, we've even had a few people offer the lil mini 334 Mhs usb units...those are all fine..like I said...it's about introducing the basic concepts of Algorithm based mining. People on the reservation have a better time understanding something thats running right in front of them then just reading white papers and a tech sheet online. I spoke with a person with the it dept of Oglala Lakota College and they were very intrigued by the idea of being possibly the first college in America to offer a course around Bitcoin technology. if we received the target goal of even 25 BTC we were planning to purchase a KNC Neptune Unit which would allow us to generate enough BTC quickly so we could self fund the second phase involving exchange trading. Now alot of us are speculating on what Congress and federal regulations are in store for the future of bitcoin. This Project gives is a chance to demonstrate a working model which can prove out whether or not Bitcoin can really be a primary source of exchange and commercial trading, and I know people will say we're already doing that with E commerce and Coffee shops in various locations but we have along way to go still...remember the couple that spent their first 90 days on BTC? anyone keep up on the challenges they had in the beginning?  Well this project is working on doing the same thing...only on a wider scale...lets see what happens if a sovereign nation embraces it as their national currency. We're sifting through ALOT of emails with very valid points, comments, and suggestions... I'll share a couple...Crypto Currency Banking...will the project look into a safe and effective Crypto Banking system?  Yes we're looking into that actually, using bitcoin and litecoin checks basicly cold storage notes that could be traded like fiat notes. or even as investment instruments like Crypto CD's of sorts. What about your tribes Casino operations how could BTC impact that market?  We're looking at various ways Bitcoin could increase marketability for our tribal casino...Including Bitcoin/Litecoin Exchange services to possibly working with the Native american gaming device industry to prototype a gaming device that would accept a variety of crypto currencies. So theres alot of potential...

But to answer the main question  what type of gear...Anything   what would we LIKE to obtain in time a KnC Neptune or possibly a BFL 300-600 Ghs ASIC miner...the goal is to develop the mining side up to 1 Ths whether that happens in a week, a month, or 6 months no one knows...
and again...as I've stated a  few times before...as the nay sayers shout that im just looking for free BTC...remember  the Bitcoin community gave a random fan at a football game 22 BTC in donations. Am I looking for the same? yes I am...whats the difference? the results...now I dont know what he did with his...but I KNOW what Im planning to do with 22 BTC if we raise that much...the rest is up to the community...again please keep the Emails coming, questions and advice coming...and feel free to check out out Coinfunder initiative and if you dont feel like donating thats cool   just please share it with others that might feel like supporting the project   https://www.coinfunder.com/project/view/id/118

[codeneis]

There are cases of using local non-official currencies to help poor communities. Or, better saying, there are cases of poor communities helping themselves using local non-official currencies. How this currency would work depends of the reality of the community and can change from place do place.

Here is a case in Brazil:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Banco_Palmas

There are many other cases around the world (like Spain, because of the crisis).

The thing about free-market community based solutions is that they don't need external currencies. Maybe a new currency, not necessarily crypto, would work better.

But it is just my opinion. I hope your project works and your community gets out of poverty :]

[bitpop]

Why teach asic, mining ends in a couple years

[virtualmaster]

Yeah. We need some fearless warriors for the Bitcoin network.

[Pentax]

Is this you?

http://www.forbes.com/sites/jasperhamill/2013/12/19/native-american-activist-wants-to-swap-the-dollar-for-bitcoin/

If so, damn fine work.

[bitpop]

Damn boy, we doubted you

[gortonc]

As a newbie, I have been lurking around here for a while, but am still hesitant to jump into the fray.  I do not pretend to know much about Bitcoin, but it seems that the biggest threat to the success of BC is opposition from nation-states and central banksters.  While it seems the underlying tech can survive their attacks, one is wise to never underestimate their enemy.  

I had to laugh when I read a post by someone who said "Bitcoin is bigger than China." Implying that China could not stop the infiltration of BC or slow its growth. In an ultimate sense that may be true, but it misses the point and does not address the problem.

It can be demonstrated that when push comes to shove, and survival is on the line, few if any states are unwilling to violate their own laws. Central banks survive despite their parasitic nature because they have made the survival of of governments (not states) dependent on their existence.

Here is a sovereign (albeit conquered) nation that is looking to BC and its community for help.  It seems to me that there is tremendous potential for a symbiotic relationship. Servers set up on tribal land could be of great service to the BC community.  Ultimately the Feds may decide to step in and attack them, but this would be a PR nightmare for them.

I do not know enough about the specifics of either the tribal treaties, or Bitcoin to make specific recommendations. However, I hope that those who do will recognize the potential here and step up to the plate.

I suspect there's gold Bitcoin in them thar hills!

[waxwing]

The concept of using Bitcoin for a small quasi-sovereign state is an excellent one, but I had to sigh with disappointment when I saw that the fundamental plan was to implement mining.

This not only misses the real point, but continues to cement in people's heads the idea that they cannot use Bitcoin unless they can mine it.

Mining bitcoin has become an extremely difficult, capital intensive and sophisticated business. Don't get into it unless you consider yourself already expert in some key aspect of it, like electrical engineering, or have some very good connections and strong background in a related trade/business.

The great idea here is that a somewhat autonomous community can use Bitcoin as a currency without interference from those who print money to everyone else's detriment. The fund that you're intending to use to buy mining equipment, but BTC instead, and set up some kind of organization to help people trade in and out of USD-BTC. Maybe it isn't practical right now, but it's at least an idea worth pursuing.

[gortonc]

Maxwing, I agree--mining is not something that is in their favor.  Nonetheless, as one who is ignorant of much (but learning as fast as I can) I think the intrinsic idea has merit.  Their plea for help has the ring of truth (IMHO) and I think they would be open to help and redirection, both in development and implementation of a plan.

I would think that creating a safe zone for exchanges and maybe even their own, would be a place to to start.  Based on the interview I heard with Coinbase's founder I would think they should at least open an office (embassy;-)) there, and even employ some locals and train them. Political as well as geographic diversity should be pursued.

[cypherdoc]

the 2 most important and highest bang for the buck projects they could do in order of most importance would be:

1.  a Bitcoin exchange.
2.  a Bitcoin bank.

[kimitsugroup]

Bitcoin Oyate Project in Forbes  http://www.forbes.com/sites/jasperhamill/2013/12/19/native-american-activist-wants-to-swap-the-dollar-for-bitcoin/

[kimitsugroup]

Maxwing...while yes Mining is a first step in this project is is only one aspect...and designed to be more of a hands on study element for it. Mining IS a fact of this industry so it's important that we look at how bitcoins are generated. It also goes towards Algo research, mining unit design, chipset design, and other parts of that element. the bitcoins generated go towards teaching how the exchanges work and how to trade on them. I think alot of people are seeing this as just a mining project, it's not...it's a fully comprehensive plan where we generate the coins locally, exchange them locally and use them locally. But they have to come from somewhere. 

[waxwing]

But they have to come from somewhere. 

Indeed they do. Please carefully evaluate the economic tradeoff of buying BTC directly vs mining them. There is a VERY high likelihood that the former is a better decision.
I'm not going to try to convince you further. The evidence is there if you choose to pay attention.

[skovbitcoin]

the 2 most important and highest bang for the buck projects they could do in order of most importance would be:

1.  a Bitcoin exchange.
2.  a Bitcoin bank.

I completely agree, not only would this type of business be potentially much much more lucrative, it actually can teach a wide range of transferable skills. Web development, finance, law, risk, customer support, sales and marketing. All of those skills would be extremely useful to enrich such a community. Surely this is the way to go rather than trying to teach the nuts and bolts of ASIC mining? This would engage people with many different interests.

[crazy_rabbit]

the 2 most important and highest bang for the buck projects they could do in order of most importance would be:

1.  a Bitcoin exchange.
2.  a Bitcoin bank.

Really- they are the same thing.

[kimitsugroup]

well true that the mining aspect may be less profitable then buying from a exchange...but this isn't meant to solely be a profit venture. I feel the mining aspect needs to be there to be fully comprehensive. but exchange buying will be covered in the Financial part of the project...already in talks with Oglala Lakota College here to look into a course on Crypto Algorithms,  Dynamic Cryptography, etc.

[bitpop]

Every time you mention mining you make us cringe
Why start with a guaranteed loss?

[skovbitcoin]

well true that the mining aspect may be less profitable then buying from a exchange...but this isn't meant to solely be a profit venture. I feel the mining aspect needs to be there to be fully comprehensive. but exchange buying will be covered in the Financial part of the project...already in talks with Oglala Lakota College here to look into a course on Crypto Algorithms,  Dynamic Cryptography, etc.

I don't mean to sound rude, but are you sure you are not in danger of pushing your own interests onto the community, rather than focussing on the community needs? I was more trying to point out that something like an exchange or broker framework allows for a much wider spread of interest groups.

[FCTaiChi]

1. Get a few local people to confirm the project using a simple video camera, phone, any handheld digital camera, tablet

2. Post it to youtube

Good idea, interview some local merchants that are into the idea

[bitpop]

Video or it didn't happen

[Barek]

Overall, the project is a great idea.

Regarding the mining. Consider that if you spend 25 BTC on mining equipment now, it is unclear if it will ever mine 25 BTC. You don't need expensive equipment to experience the mining process. A Block Erupter will give you the same understanding as a Neptune.

The beauty of Bitcoin is that it takes only a small investment to get started using it. Once people are comfortable using it, they will find ways to make use of it.

[jbreher]

Your project sounds interesting on its surface. But I'd need a lot more info before donating or investing.

Maybe I've missed it, but I don't recall you posting anything about discussions you've had with your tribal governing body. I would think that buy-in from that organization would be indispensable in getting BTC accepted as the national currency.

What can you tell us about such discussions?

[cr1776]

Overall, the project is a great idea.

Regarding the mining. Consider that if you spend 25 BTC on mining equipment now, it is unclear if it will ever mine 25 BTC. You don't need expensive equipment to experience the mining process. A Block Erupter will give you the same understanding as a Neptune.

The beauty of Bitcoin is that it takes only a small investment to get started using it. Once people are comfortable using it, they will find ways to make use of it.

This is a good point - a few pieces of inexpensive hardware will let everyone learn, while you are not worried about ROI.

[kimitsugroup]

Video interview talking about the project is here
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TGR3in8iOoc BTC Oyate Program Interview
Project Donations:  14YenT76QSnHwC3pPzXLwb9J6ajvD1ek4A


Merry Christmas everyone

Payu

[kellrobinson]

tribal Sovereignty can be used to safeguard bitcoin technology and foster it's future growth. look at start ups like Bitinstant, Bitfloor and other exchanges and services that had good services, good aspirations, and good people behind the wheel...but were stopped due to federal regulations and state interference because of misinformation and pressure from the Fiat based banking community. Had a start up like Bitfloor partnered with a Native american tribe, the tribe could have hosted their servers or even helped run a brick and mortar exchange under Tribal Unified Commercial Codes and insulated them from crippling federal regulations...kinda like how places like costa rica host Online Poker sites due to it's international Sovereignty...only in this case you can drive to South Dakota.

The problem isn't federal regulators.  It's State regulators.  All but two or three of the fifty States have money-transmission regulations, and then there's DC, plus maybe a territory or two.  It adds up to about fifty different regulatory agencies, not counting the feds, just to do business in the U.S.  

Coinapult moved to Panama.  Bitinstant had to close down.  Now, many millions of dollars later, bitinstant's just getting underway again.
I would rejoice if the Indian Nations could provide a way for American companies to stay on American soil (the American Continent, not the United States).  There might be a bitcoin startup out there which could find shelter under the umbrella of Lakota sovereignty.

[LAMarcellus]

Is there an item or something your ummm tribe/people produce that you can sell for Bitcoin?

If you decided to mint a silver coin, a sovereign money that is scarce, fungible, durable, divisible, and portable like BTC is,
Would the focus of your project be "mining for metals" or "learning to smelt" or "how to operate a "mint"?

Others here have said it already so I won't repeat it. But I will say that I will not give you a single satoshi so you can mine.
However, let me know what good or service your people sells and I will buy one with Bitcoin. After all that is the point of money.
Yeah we all wish we were the sole gold miner in the world and we could buy booze and pussy and lambos and all the stuff EVERYONE ELSE produces with the gold that we alone bring out of the ground. But that is a fools errand at this point. Forget that idea.
Or to prove how much of a fools errand it is,   go buy a pick axe and shovel and start looking for gold in the ground. It would be a comparable ROI.

How about producing an educational video and a lecture series on using/securing bitcoin? Have it translated into world languages and make it available thru your website. Someone needs to sell this product to the world, it might as well be your people. Do they have the time to do this? Or are your people busy producing another good or service?
How about building trust and reputation and storing private keys in a unique format (local language= an additional layer of encryption so to speak) on sovereign lands?

I gotta say it,
The fact that you want to raise funds for a mining operation at all suggests you heart is in the right place but you head is not.
The point is not to "make free money".
The point is to use a money that doesn't have the trappings and failings of the Federal Reserve Note as a medium of exchange for the goods and services we produce and trade mutually.

Get off the mining. Create a good or service and charge BTC. That's all I'm willing to donate at this time.

Best of luck to you with this project.

[kellrobinson]

When I was at university studying electrical engineering, the institution devoted a lot of resources to the labs we used.  Those labs were not there to make money, they were for education.
I'm not going to try to tell Payu what he can and cannot do.  A mining operation might be just what a bunch of idle kids on the rez need.  It will give them something interesting to do. 

Payu may have made a mistake when he proposed mining as a viable way to generate bitcoin for funding an exchange.  But that doesn't mean mining is a mistake.  Mining could have tremendous value for the young Indians on the reservation.  Can you imagine a more effective way to educate them about bitcoin?

The value of bitcoin for the Indians will play out over many years, perhaps generations.  It needs to start now.  A few thousand dollars  for a mining operation on Pine Ridge looks like a very good investment, to me.  For some eight-year-old Indian kid who loves computers, it could be the path to a very, very bright future.

[FCTaiChi]

Good point Kell.  I was thinking that there would be a lot to learn from donated items, though.  I imagine each student would benefit from getting a unit hashing on the network.  That would allow them to save donations for projects down the line.

[FCTaiChi]

Just found this..
http://m.youtube.com/watch?v=JnoW9Nt5xfo&desktop_uri=%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DJnoW9Nt5xfo

[kimitsugroup]

Ok well in response to the question of speaking with tribal governing bodies,  I have already had meetings with our He Sapa Oyate Council and they gave me the go ahead as long it will help the community.  I know several elders there that are excited about t he program and looking forward to it's development. As far as the Mining aspect we Do have some donated gear coming in which people are looking forward to seeing the basics of how things start out. Alot of people mentioned just buying BTC instead of mining...the problem with that is unemployment still hovers around 83.5% average  income is around $7,000 a year...people struggle to get the basics....where would they get the income to buy BTC for training purposes?  not trying to be a smart ass...just saying. Thats the main purpose for the Mining element...is to generate enough to A:) Show the Viability of a major tribal Mining cluster and B:) to generate enough BTC for young people to train on with exchange trading that they can learn effective trading strategies. The Commercial Businesses can accept it pretty easy so thats a no brainer but it's getting our people started in learning how the tech works and how to use it...without keeping it on a HD and later finding out you just dumped $6.7M in the landfill...LOL

-Payu-

[donkeykong9000]

Why not start off mining some alt coins? The barrier to entry is much, much lower. You could probably get a few people to donate some old cards or even 1 BTC would be enough for an ultra budget mining rig (maybe a couple of 7850s plus mobo/CPU/RAM/PSU). In the mean time, you could get some donations for using BTC or whatever alt coin in your community.

[ProfMac]

3.) Payment Processing and merchant acceptance

I spent most of today trying to envision a way to introduce bitcoin to the merchants and area on "the drag" near the University of Texas, Austin.  I think I had some good insights that i will try to develop a little more.

There was some spin-off idea from that thinking that may apply to Pine Ridge.  Am I correct that there is some regular payments made by the BIA to either the band, or to individuals?
If so, would they, the BIA, be willing to pay in bitcoin to individual addresses?

[cr1776]

Hi,
My own two cents are to use the strengths of the tribe and the independent nation status that make you unique.  
1. Mining is great if it is primarily for teaching and learning for those people who have a technical interest.  It is important to have a group who understand these aspects.
2. There is also the advantage of location where heat dissipation isn't as large a concern in winter.  :-)
3. The big competitive advantage though is the unique legal structure being an independent nation offers.  I think it is clear the US government recognizes it in respect to casinos, so should with other things too. So the question is how to leverage the competitive advantages that you have and that is by offering services to the world that might be difficult or impossible elsewhere. This probably includes online gambling (with IP blocks no doubt for some countries-which is somewhat meaningless for bitcoin obviously), exchanges (which since you are a nation provides different rules versus the rules in each US state), and banks to help the exchange.  (There may be things like a Silk Road replacement that are possible, but they would attract the wrong kind of attention in my opinion).

There are probably many other things that you can provide that give you a competitive advantage under your legal status and I think that could be of great benefit to the tribe and to bitcoin itself. The key is what is the advantage you have and it isn't in mining except as a learning tool because the mining ROI is difficult for everyone.

If you intend to set up an exchange etc once you have people up to speed you could no doubt get investors because there you have a great advantage over many others. Again given the nation status, getting investors could be much different than what is required outside the reservation.  Services like this will provide a good recurring income stream and a lot of valuable technical education to many people that is not just applicable to bitcoin.  

You'd want to go through whatever legal reviews are available (if any, if needed) before doing this, but this sentence encapsulates the advantage you have over many others, a much freer environment to do business. And that is worth a lot.

Ok well in response to the question of speaking with tribal governing bodies,  I have already had meetings with our He Sapa Oyate Council and they gave me the go ahead as long it will help the community.  I know several elders there that are excited about t he program and looking forward to it's development. As far as the Mining aspect we Do have some donated gear coming in which people are looking forward to seeing the basics of how things start out. Alot of people mentioned just buying BTC instead of mining...the problem with that is unemployment still hovers around 83.5% average  income is around $7,000 a year...people struggle to get the basics....where would they get the income to buy BTC for training purposes?  not trying to be a smart ass...just saying. Thats the main purpose for the Mining element...is to generate enough to A:) Show the Viability of a major tribal Mining cluster and B:) to generate enough BTC for young people to train on with exchange trading that they can learn effective trading strategies. The Commercial Businesses can accept it pretty easy so thats a no brainer but it's getting our people started in learning how the tech works and how to use it...without keeping it on a HD and later finding out you just dumped $6.7M in the landfill...LOL

-Payu-

[FCTaiChi]

Payu, despite the way the numbers may look mining is a risky venture that doesn't even pay off much of the time, much less give a steady enough income to fund the types of projects you mention.  I think that taking donations could fund everything you need in the short term, giving a huge advantage in the long term as the price goes up. 

This is my favorite bitcoin project idea, and I wish only success for you.  I'll help if I can.  It seems that the community will jump in more and more as you get started.  Put a good plan together, and keep taking videos.  If you can find someone to start training and interview them about what they've learned, how they feel about the future of this...  Do a lot of media promotions.  I'll tweet, or retweet from you.  (Have a Twitter account?).  And write an article on my page soon.

I'd also like to stop by in a couple months if that is possible.  I should be driving somewhat close to where you are.  I'd love to do an in depth interview.  Anything that shows people that you are really doing what you say, and are committed will help bring funding. 

[kimitsugroup]

Ok well time for a Update...the phase 1 mining aspect has been funded thanks to donations of some older Mining gear as well as a tech gift commitment from Visionman-btc.com. we're still planning to grow that part of the project but I wanted to thank everyone for their input and begin focusing on the phase 2 part of the project. Exchanges, and Services So Now I'll ask this...what types of services do you guys think would be good for the community..not just the tech savvy community...but the average person just getting into bitcoin....any thoughts?

-Payu-
14YenT76QSnHwC3pPzXLwb9J6ajvD1ek4A

[ProfMac]

Ok well time for a Update...the phase 1 mining aspect has been funded thanks to donations of some older Mining gear as well as a tech gift commitment from Visionman-btc.com. we're still planning to grow that part of the project but I wanted to thank everyone for their input and begin focusing on the phase 2 part of the project. Exchanges, and Services So Now I'll ask this...what types of services do you guys think would be good for the community..not just the tech savvy community...but the average person just getting into bitcoin....any thoughts?

-Payu-
14YenT76QSnHwC3pPzXLwb9J6ajvD1ek4A

There has to be a way to acquire bitcoins.
    Set up an exchange.  I assume that AML/KYC guidelines are a good thing to follow. 
    Start small, enrolled & descendants within 25 miles only.  Parallel with the rules used for things like license plates.
    Defer larger exchange operations until operations are smooth with the 'small and friendly' group.
    If there is a casino, see if they are willing to pay wages in bitcoin.
    If the RTC distributes cash, see if they are willing to payout as bitcoin.

There has to be a way to buy goods & services with bitcoins.
    The gas station or grocery store comes to mind.
    This should be something universal and visible.

There has to be a closed loop
    E.g.,
        1.  RTC distributes funds as bitcoin --->
        2.  Gas station accepts bitcoin --->
        3.  RTC buys bitcoin from gas station.

There has to be a good point of sale (POS) mechanism:
In close communities, 6-confirms are not important.  For example, I eat at a restaurant that is walking distance from the house.  When, inevitably, in the future, I forget my wallet, I will just walk home, get it, and return.  perhaps the next day.  In that environment, if I launch a payment I can walk out the door and everyone is happy.

If there is public internet access at a gas station or food store, that would be a good place to start with the existing bitcoin infrastructure.  Set people up with a blockchain.info wallet, restrict that wallet to that IP address, they can pay there, the clerk can view the payment transaction, everyone is happy, and bystanders can get get interested, educated, involved.

[codyave]

this part of the project also seeks to address the Sovereignty question and how tribal Sovereignty can be used to safeguard bitcoin technology and foster it's future growth. look at start ups like Bitinstant, Bitfloor and other exchanges and services that had good services, good aspirations, and good people behind the wheel...but were stopped due to federal regulations and state interference because of misinformation and pressure from the Fiat based banking community. Had a start up like Bitfloor partnered with a Native american tribe, the tribe could have hosted their servers or even helped run a brick and mortar exchange under Tribal Unified Commercial Codes and insulated them from crippling federal regulations...kinda like how places like costa rica host Online Poker sites due to it's international Sovereignty...only in this case you can drive to South Dakota.

Regarding a sovereign nation operating a bitcoin exchange in the U.S.:

1. Is a sovereign nation required to follow AML/KYC regulations?
2. Is a sovereign nation required to apply for an MSB license for each state?
3. Any other legal hurdles I haven't thought of?

I'm Lakota like Payu, and I want to see a bitcoin exchange operating on sovereign territory ASAP.

edit: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v7ukocsQo7Q#t=11m50s

can we crowdfund a plane ticket to get a tribal official to the max keiser show? (go to 11min50sec)

[ProfMac]

What is the relationship between this project and Mazacoin?

[minermick]

Good question profmac, I saw mazacoin in the news and remembered this project, after a bit of digging I believe it is the same project! Payu is quoted in an independent article about maza http://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/gadgets-and-tech/mazacoin-native-american-tribe-adopts-bitcoin-derivative-as-national-currency-9165314.html

There is a chance that they have just used him as an expert to comment on another project but I think it's too similiar, either way they have done a fantastic job media wise and it will be great to follow the story.

[minermick]

A bit more digging and it is the same project, he talks about it on this Keiser report, they changed from bitcoin after advice that they could be challenged by the government because it wasn't owned by them. Maza is premined but Payu seems like an honest guy, nice to see something that started and was funded by us get so much coverage and possibly be the first community to adopt a crypto as it's primary currency.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Tyb0LVgW8q8

[kimitsugroup]

The Mazacoin project developed initially as a side project of the BTC Oyate initiative in order to develop a truly sovereign crypto currency it has since had it's ups and downs...with all the FUD going around about Mazacoin's price drop...Im happy it did...because this gives us a chance to build up Mazacoins true price and make it to something more stable. Mazacoin was not meant to be a Speculators coin...it was meant to be a daily usage coin.
We'll get through this and thrive...

http://youtu.be/2g7LkOgTGeY


Payu


 

[ProfMac]

The Mazacoin project developed initially as a side project of the BTC Oyate initiative in order to develop a truly sovereign crypto currency it has since had it's ups and downs...with all the FUD going around about Mazacoin's price drop...Im happy it did...because this gives us a chance to build up Mazacoins true price and make it to something more stable. Mazacoin was not meant to be a Speculators coin...it was meant to be a daily usage coin.
We'll get through this and thrive...

http://youtu.be/2g7LkOgTGeY


Payu


 

I think that bitcoin itself could use this advice.  Unless it is a currency with low volatility, it can't reach it's true value.

[jonald_fyookball]

Ahhh ok well maybe one thing I need help with is someone that can help with writing this more effectively...this project is merely meant to be a starting point for the tribe to take a more active role in bitcoin development in the future...I have the mining aspect in there because mining is how bitcoins are generated...also as part of that phase of the project I would hope to see perhaps the Tribal College, Sinte Gleska, or OLC take a interest and perhaps develop a course around chipset designs, SHA and SCRYPT Algorithms, Opensource Mining application development, etc.  I feel this would be productive because of Bitcoins inherent Open source platform which would allow a smaller college to develop a course structure around Bitcoin and Crypto technology Bit still the question will come up...How are bitcoins made? and where do they come from? The Mining aspect isn't meant to be a big income producer...it's meant simply to generate enough btc so that the second phase will have a greater chance of success...that being exchange trading. Exchange trading opens the door to market study, how Crypto currency exchanges work and how to exchange Crypto to Fiat and back. this part of the project also seeks to address the Sovereignty question and how tribal Sovereignty can be used to safeguard bitcoin technology and foster it's future growth. look at start ups like Bitinstant, Bitfloor and other exchanges and services that had good services, good aspirations, and good people behind the wheel...but were stopped due to federal regulations and state interference because of misinformation and pressure from the Fiat based banking community. Had a start up like Bitfloor partnered with a Native american tribe, the tribe could have hosted their servers or even helped run a brick and mortar exchange under Tribal Unified Commercial Codes and insulated them from crippling federal regulations...kinda like how places like costa rica host Online Poker sites due to it's international Sovereignty...only in this case you can drive to South Dakota. But there again..the bitcoins need to come from somewhere...and I wont lie there is a amount of risk involved in this project...but rather then asking for people to blindly donate BTC/LTC for us to experiment with...we're looking to fund a way to generate them ourselves we're also look for people who could come out after the project is started and give talks, guidance, advice and more to people here that want to learn. Im not a expert in mining gear...but there are some of you out there that are...that have designed your own units...I know there are people out there that are more experienced with setting up exchanges and how they run...if we get this project started even at a minimal level...how many would be willing to come out to SD and work hands on with the project to help develop it ? if people are leery of donating used gear or BTC how many of you would be willing to donate your time?

You need to work on your communication skills.

Have you ever heard of breaking up your writing
into easy to read paragraphs, like this? 

See how much easier that is on the eyes?