Your view on shale gas exploration ?

[Schleicher]

Wind energy is extremely expensive. And it destroys the natural beauty as well. I will not support wind farms, unless they are capable of producing energy at the rate of less than $ 0.02 per KWH.

Well, depends on your definition of expensive.
Here in Germany it's 0.08 Euro/kWh, sometimes less.
And the natual beauty...
What do you prefer?
More hurricanes, more cancer or less natural beauty in areas with lots of wind?

[bryant.coleman]

Well, depends on your definition of expensive.
Here in Germany it's 0.08 Euro/kWh, sometimes less.

You will be able to produce nuclear energy for 0.02 Euro / kWh. Then why depend on expensive forms of energy?

And the natual beauty...
What do you prefer?
More hurricanes, more cancer or less natural beauty in areas with lots of wind?

I prefer none of the above.

[Spendulus]

...Point is that hydro is nearly one viable option to compensate the renevables.

Does not matter.  Hydro is tapped out, while power needs are growing by 2% a year (USA, but probably at least that, worldwide).

A 'tapped out resource' does not compensate for anything which is trailing behind in production...

[bryant.coleman]

...Point is that hydro is nearly one viable option to compensate the renevables.

Does not matter.  Hydro is tapped out, while power needs are growing by 2% a year (USA, but probably at least that, worldwide).

A 'tapped out resource' does not compensate for anything which is trailing behind in production...

Oh god.. I don't want any more hydro power dams. Just take a look at this:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Belo_Monte_Dam

Another 122,200 acres of Amazon forest gone. And more than 600 species of fish will become extinct.

There is also a proposal for another dam at Babaquara. It will destroy 1,517,000 acres of Amazon forest.

[Spendulus]

....

Another 122,200 acres of Amazon forest gone. And more than 600 species of fish will become extinct.
....

Just curious.

How does putting about a 14x14 square mile piece of land under water kill off 600 species of fish?

[niothor]

....

Another 122,200 acres of Amazon forest gone. And more than 600 species of fish will become extinct.
....

Just curious.

How does putting about a 14x14 square mile piece of land under water kill off 600 species of fish?

It will destroy the route of migrating fish and you can't compare the lake that will form behind the dam with a river. Some species will lose their natural habitat forever

[Spendulus]

....

Another 122,200 acres of Amazon forest gone. And more than 600 species of fish will become extinct.
....

Just curious.

How does putting about a 14x14 square mile piece of land under water kill off 600 species of fish?

It will destroy the route of migrating fish and you can't compare the lake that will form behind the dam with a river. Some species will lose their natural habitat forever

Really?  And all salmon go up the same river?

Just asking.  I mean, come on.  600 species of fish?

[Wilikon]

Hospital surgeries were cancelled, phone service was knocked out and technicians were sent scrambling on Quebec's north shore after a beaver dam collapsed, chopping a fibre-optic cable.

The Internet was also cut off when the large rodent-made structure gave way on Monday evening along a highway 750 km northeast of Montreal.

The cable was severed at a point where it crosses a river.

The local health network was hit hard. Some labs at the hospital in Sept-Iles, Que., were shut down and appointments were cancelled as a precautionary measure to avoid possible errors during manual data entry.

This past spring, a beaver dam flooded a north shore highway.

BEAVER: FRIEND OR FOE?

Canadians have had a love-hate relationship with our national critter, as evidenced in these stories from recent years:

— Conservative Sen. Nicole Eaton, peeved about chunks chomped from the dock of her cottage, pushed for the polar bear to replace the beaver as Canada's official animal. The senator called the beaver "a has-been" and "a big rat, that doesn't reflect our new values."

— Officials in Bonnyville, Alta., blew up more than 70 beaver dams that threatened to flood farmland.

— Ramara Township, Ont., paid trappers $100 per beaver after the rodents overran the area. "They breed faster than we can trap them," one official said.

— Residents of Ottawa's Stittsville community successfully rallied to prevent the city from killing two beavers that had moved into a local pond.




http://www.torontosun.com/2013/10/02/beaver-dam-collapse-wreaks-havoc-on-quebecs-north-shore

[Spendulus]

....
— Officials in Bonnyville, Alta., blew up more than 70 beaver dams....

Cool....

Airstrikes?

[Wilikon]

....
— Officials in Bonnyville, Alta., blew up more than 70 beaver dams....

Cool....

Airstrikes?

CIA Drones...

[Spendulus]

....
— Officials in Bonnyville, Alta., blew up more than 70 beaver dams....

Cool....

Airstrikes?

CIA Drones...

What were those dam beavers going to do with all that hyroelectirc power anyway?

[Wilikon]

....
— Officials in Bonnyville, Alta., blew up more than 70 beaver dams....

Cool....

Airstrikes?

CIA Drones...

What were those dam beavers going to do with all that hyroelectirc power anyway?

Only bryant would know 

[Spendulus]

....
— Officials in Bonnyville, Alta., blew up more than 70 beaver dams....

Cool....

Airstrikes?

CIA Drones...

What were those dam beavers going to do with all that hyroelectirc power anyway?

Only bryant would know 

HEADLINE:  600 Species of Fish Lost to Dam Beavers

Massive fish depopulation and species extinction is highly correlated with beaver dams, scientists say in the new issue of Climatic Changersaurus.  Initial conclusions are that all the fish were eaten.  Additional research is needed. 

[Wilikon]

Beaver dam funding is needed for the good of the dead fish says the UN.

[bryant.coleman]

How does putting about a 14x14 square mile piece of land under water kill off 600 species of fish?

The upper region of Xingu river is having a great variety of aquatic species, most of which is not found anywhere else. The ecology is very delicate and needs moving water to survive. If the water becomes static, then the food chain will become affected and the entire system will collapse.

[Spendulus]

How does putting about a 14x14 square mile piece of land under water kill off 600 species of fish?

The upper region of Xingu river is having a great variety of aquatic species, most of which is not found anywhere else. The ecology is very delicate and needs moving water to survive. If the water becomes static, then the food chain will become affected and the entire system will collapse.

First of all, 'aquatic species' is a way different thing than 'fish'.

As for the entire system collapsing, I don't think that's correct.

Change would occur as the two major rivers mixed their waters.  Maybe several species of fish would die.  Others of course, would thrive.

There isn't anything sacred about the pristine untouched state of nature.  It's okay if we screw around with it.  Now that we can mess with DNA, maybe we could bring species back, too.  Some really weird ones would be cool.  After all, this is the 21st century.

[bryant.coleman]

First of all, 'aquatic species' is a way different thing than 'fish'.

Either way, I am not comfortable with so many species dying out.

There isn't anything sacred about the pristine untouched state of nature.  It's okay if we screw around with it. 

Hmm... let me guess. Let's destroy this planet and its living things. After that what we'll do? Will we go to some other planet and do the same?

[Spendulus]

First of all, 'aquatic species' is a way different thing than 'fish'.

Either way, I am not comfortable with so many species dying out.

Yeah...but by this logic, not a single city would exist today.  No farms, ranches, mines, quarries, and most fishing would not be allowed.  Obviously war could not be permitted (lol).  And here you are talking about the direct impact of man's changes on the land he does it on.  Once you start talking about co2, then you want to control his activities for the alleged impact of them half way around the world.

Have fun!

There isn't anything sacred about the pristine untouched state of nature.  It's okay if we screw around with it.  

Hmm... let me guess. Let's destroy this planet and its living things. After that what we'll do? Will we go to some other planet and do the same?

You can't walk down the street without crushing some helpless micro organisms.  So where are you going to draw the line?  More importantly, who draws the line?

If I go camping, shoot a deer, a rabbit and a pig, then collect some dead branches to make a fire and cook them with, I have altered the pristine untouched state of nature.  So yes in part, you can say that we are going to 'destroy (a part of) the planet' with every single thing we do.

But we invented barbecue sauce for those tasty treats that we kill, skin and eat.

Must have been a reason.

[xkeyscore89]

Exploration should be done sonographically rather than physically. The results of physical, on-the-job experience have unknown consequences for the future of the land where this is taking place.  There is some correlative data to suggest fracking has caused localized earthquakes in Ohio, at least.

[bryant.coleman]

Yeah...but by this logic, not a single city would exist today.  No farms, ranches, mines, quarries, and most fishing would not be allowed.  Obviously war could not be permitted (lol).  And here you are talking about the direct impact of man's changes on the land he does it on.  Once you start talking about co2, then you want to control his activities for the alleged impact of them half way around the world.

Have fun!

Again, you are generalizing everything. The Alto Xingu region is one of the areas with highest biodiversity in the whole planet. Destroying 122,000 acres there is like destroying 122 million acres somewhere else, like Canada. We should at least preserve 1% of our planet, where the maximum amount of living species are found. Already only around 15% of the earth's area is under primary vegetation. The remaining has been cut down or destroyed by humans during the last few centuries.