The biggest problem with bitcoin is these imcompetent exchanges

[nmtrader100]

I have almost had it.  MtGox, Bitstamp, and BTC-e are not acceptable exchanges.  You have to use a third-party API just to see the trade grid at Mtgox or Bitstamp.  Btc-e is by far the best of the big three but it looks like it was designed by a 12 year old, has no way to deposit USD, and no one trusts Russians.  Mcxnow was by far the best design yet... unlicensed and run by some anonymous guy with a bad reputation in some anonymous place, and he didn't realize that he would have to have a support desk and so he is shutting everything down.  And you couldn't trade bitcoins there anyways.  Bitfinex seems to be run by some guy and his girlfriend out of their garage and you better hope that they both don't die in a car accident at the same time or you can kiss your bitcoins goodbye.  MtGox and Bitstamp are the "OSX" of the exchanges, simplified for stupid people and you can't see what is going on and you have to constantly refresh the page just to see if your orders were filled, and they have that wonderful html "lag" that makes you feel like you are still on dial-up.  Gox is the worst of all.  The owners of MtGox are so incompetent I am surprised they don't have a bounty on their heads on some underground marketplace.  The "gox loop" that happens anytime a big sell order is placed is so absurd that I don't even have the words here to describe it.  These guys should be shot.  Bad Gateway errors.  Inability to cancel orders.  No method for USD withdrawals- and these guys are too stupid to get out of Japan and move to jurisdiction with less stringent banking regulations.  We are truly in the wild west and I cannot blame the media or anyone else for not taking bitcoin seriously.  I can't understand why one of these early adopters doesn't take some of his mega-millions and open up a proper exchange.  Hire a team of real programmers from MIT.  Start out with no fees for the first six months and watch their volume explode.  Do it right.  This bitcoin community is dying for a reliable, competent bitcoin/alt coin exchange.  The "big three" exchanges are run by regular, less than intelligent guys that were in the right place at the right time and I have to believe-- I have to pray-- that their time is limited.  Unreliable, incompetent, amateurish, unprofessional... those are a few good descriptions.  Here is one more, "Pathetic"!

[1715067771]

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[Nagle]

Yeah, we know.

Several times, there's been some outfit that said they were going to run a professional, legitimate Bitcoin exchange. They all turned out to be scammers that stole customer funds. Tradehill, for example.

Nobody has yet set up an exchange that qualifies as a securities broker/dealer in any major country. Nobody has set up an exchange with published outside audits. Nobody has even set up an exchange with a street address you can visit. (Some reporters found Mt. Gox HQ, went there, and were turned away.) Over half of all Bitcoin exchanges have gone bust, usually with customer funds.

[indiemax]

This one looks like it might come up to scratch for those in the Uk

http://www.bitprice.com/

[niothor]

That's why people go to localbitcoins. And a few months ago I considered that place doomed.

[PenAndPaper]

Bitfinex seems to be run by some guy and his girlfriend out of their garage and you better hope that they both don't die in a car accident at the same time or you can kiss your bitcoins goodbye. 

I can't stop laughing with that one 
Anyway in those crappy exchanges defence, i must say that they played a crucial role so far for bitcoin to be what it is today.
Yes they suck and they 'll get replaced if they don't evovle but their role to the rise of bitcoin is huge.

[GigaCoin]

This is proof we are still at the infancy, We have a long way to go guys this is just the start. Wait for 2014 More solid exchange will pop up 

[niothor]

This is proof we are still at the infancy, We have a long way to go guys this is just the start. Wait for 2014 More solid exchange will pop up 

I'm more concern with those we already have not surviving 2014 entirely.
We already had a " hacking " November.

[LiteCoinGuy]

Yeah, we know.

Several times, there's been some outfit that said they were going to run a professional, legitimate Bitcoin exchange. They all turned out to be scammers that stole customer funds. Tradehill, for example.

Nobody has yet set up an exchange that qualifies as a securities broker/dealer in any major country. Nobody has set up an exchange with published outside audits. Nobody has even set up an exchange with a street address you can visit. (Some reporters found Mt. Gox HQ, went there, and were turned away.) Over half of all Bitcoin exchanges have gone bust, usually with customer funds.

true but that will change in the next years. its still wild west here.

by the way, whats wrong with bitstamp  ?

[olloman]

bitcoin.de is a blessing compared to all the other exchanges, very nice design and functions, you don't have to deposit money on it, only bitcoins, and you pay directly to the seller with bank transfer, and you can even spend up to $2,500 before needing a complete registration...only problem, if we want to call it so, is that you need to be in the Euro zone, sorry Americans&Asians&rest of the world  btc-e and the others are good only for coin-coin exchanges...anyway I have no affiliation at all with bitcoin.de, just sharing my experiences, all other exchanges should be like that, and not only for the Euro zone...

[niothor]

bitcoin.de is a blessing compared to all the other exchanges, very nice design and functions, you don't have to deposit money on it, only bitcoins, and you pay directly to the seller with bank transfer, and you can even spend up to $2,500 before needing a complete registration...only problem, if we want to call it so, is that you need to be in the Euro zone, sorry Americans&Asians&rest of the world  btc-e and the others are good only for coin-coin exchanges...anyway I have no affiliation at all with bitcoin.de, just sharing my experiences, all other exchanges should be like that, and not only for the Euro zone...

Euro zone , or European Union?
Cause I'm getting interested on this , heard a lot of good stuff about it.

[Mylon]

Thanks for the great read!

Yea we really need a truly decentralized exchange, which allows trading of any crypto currency. (decentralized or centralized, though both have to be open-source)

[Financisto]

[...]Yea we really need a truly decentralized exchange, which allows trading of any crypto currency.[...]

+1

...and we need it now. Urgently!

[olloman]

bitcoin.de is a blessing compared to all the other exchanges, very nice design and functions, you don't have to deposit money on it, only bitcoins, and you pay directly to the seller with bank transfer, and you can even spend up to $2,500 before needing a complete registration...only problem, if we want to call it so, is that you need to be in the Euro zone, sorry Americans&Asians&rest of the world   btc-e and the others are good only for coin-coin exchanges...anyway I have no affiliation at all with bitcoin.de, just sharing my experiences, all other exchanges should be like that, and not only for the Euro zone...

Euro zone , or European Union?
Cause I'm getting interested on this , heard a lot of good stuff about it.

well, I can tell you that you have to pay through SEPA bank transfer (or national bank transfer, if the seller's bank is in the same nation as your bank), which is only available for banks of the countries that are in the Euro Zone I think...quote from Wikipedia: "The Single Euro Payments Area (SEPA) is a payment-integration initiative of the European Union for simplification of bank transfers denominated in euro. As of November 2013, SEPA consists of the 28 EU member states, the four members of the EFTA (Iceland, Liechtenstein, Norway and Switzerland) and Monaco"

As I said, I recommend bitcoin.de, I personally made more than 10 trades, all successful, and the community is generally friendly, and the coin disbursement doesn't usually take more than half an hour...in addition the possibility to spend up to 2,500 euros before a complete verification (only with a bank account verification) is a great feature

[niothor]

[...]Yea we really need a truly decentralized exchange, which allows trading of any crypto currency.[...]

+1

...and we need it now. Urgently!

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=172705.0
Unfortunately.....

[niothor]

bitcoin.de is a blessing compared to all the other exchanges, very nice design and functions, you don't have to deposit money on it, only bitcoins, and you pay directly to the seller with bank transfer, and you can even spend up to $2,500 before needing a complete registration...only problem, if we want to call it so, is that you need to be in the Euro zone, sorry Americans&Asians&rest of the world   btc-e and the others are good only for coin-coin exchanges...anyway I have no affiliation at all with bitcoin.de, just sharing my experiences, all other exchanges should be like that, and not only for the Euro zone...

Euro zone , or European Union?
Cause I'm getting interested on this , heard a lot of good stuff about it.

well, I can tell you that you have to pay through SEPA bank transfer (or national bank transfer, if the seller's bank is in the same nation as your bank), which is only available for banks of the countries that are in the Euro Zone I think...quote from Wikipedia: "The Single Euro Payments Area (SEPA) is a payment-integration initiative of the European Union for simplification of bank transfers denominated in euro. As of November 2013, SEPA consists of the 28 EU member states, the four members of the EFTA (Iceland, Liechtenstein, Norway and Switzerland) and Monaco"

As I said, I recommend bitcoin.de, I personally made more than 10 trades, all successful, and the community is generally friendly, and the coin disbursement doesn't usually take more than half an hour...in addition the possibility to spend up to 2,500 euros before a complete verification (only with a bank account verification) is a great feature

The euro zone means the states that adopted the euro as a currency. That got me curios.
SEPA is for the whole Eurpean Union.

I'll give it a try , what the hell!

[GigaCoin]

[...]Yea we really need a truly decentralized exchange, which allows trading of any crypto currency.[...]

+1

...and we need it now. Urgently!

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=172705.0
Unfortunately.....

did that project die ?

[niothor]

[...]Yea we really need a truly decentralized exchange, which allows trading of any crypto currency.[...]

+1

...and we need it now. Urgently!

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=172705.0
Unfortunately.....

did that project die ?

Yeah , and all others like it.
Of course you can't say it died for sure but no news from them .

[olloman]

bitcoin.de is a blessing compared to all the other exchanges, very nice design and functions, you don't have to deposit money on it, only bitcoins, and you pay directly to the seller with bank transfer, and you can even spend up to $2,500 before needing a complete registration...only problem, if we want to call it so, is that you need to be in the Euro zone, sorry Americans&Asians&rest of the world   btc-e and the others are good only for coin-coin exchanges...anyway I have no affiliation at all with bitcoin.de, just sharing my experiences, all other exchanges should be like that, and not only for the Euro zone...

Euro zone , or European Union?
Cause I'm getting interested on this , heard a lot of good stuff about it.

well, I can tell you that you have to pay through SEPA bank transfer (or national bank transfer, if the seller's bank is in the same nation as your bank), which is only available for banks of the countries that are in the Euro Zone I think...quote from Wikipedia: "The Single Euro Payments Area (SEPA) is a payment-integration initiative of the European Union for simplification of bank transfers denominated in euro. As of November 2013, SEPA consists of the 28 EU member states, the four members of the EFTA (Iceland, Liechtenstein, Norway and Switzerland) and Monaco"

As I said, I recommend bitcoin.de, I personally made more than 10 trades, all successful, and the community is generally friendly, and the coin disbursement doesn't usually take more than half an hour...in addition the possibility to spend up to 2,500 euros before a complete verification (only with a bank account verification) is a great feature

The euro zone means the states that adopted the euro as a currency. That got me curios.
SEPA is for the whole Eurpean Union.

I'll give it a try , what the hell!

alright, my mistake   by the way I think you will not regret it, it is really worth trying! It is obviously not intended for daily traders since the bank transfers can take up to one or two days, but if you just want to get some bitcoins to store away or move to other exchanges, or don't want to/can't get a full verification, it is the best site at the moment in my opinion!

EDIT: I think it is important to add that the 2,500 euros without verification are annual, so if you start trading now, in less than a month you will be able to spend 2,500 more euros without verification 

[uMMcQxCWELNzkt]

I am trying to setup a Bitcoin exchange in the UK however I have found it very difficult to get support. 

btcsense.co.uk

[GigaCoin]

I am trying to setup a Bitcoin exchange in the UK however I have found it very difficult to get support. 

btcsense.co.uk

Cool, wish you all the best with that. Funding can be a pain you might try approaching so capital venture and pitch in your idea.

[olloman]

I am trying to setup a Bitcoin exchange in the UK however I have found it very difficult to get support. 

btcsense.co.uk

the design looks really cool, good luck! 

[Desensitizer]

I think the big problem is that all the mainstream large bitcoin exchanges have problems with them, but given the fact that massive quantities of people use them and they are considered go-to's they end up getting away with having less than adequate conditions. Furthermore, the fact that you have to have a lot of startup cash, servers, and web/money knowledge means that there is a huge barrier that up and comers have to hurdle just in order to start up. This really puts a damper on innovation.

[zimmah]

kraken

localbitcoins.

two very valid options often overlooked.

[bryant.coleman]

I am using BTC-E for a year now and never had any problems. Still some people spread false rumors, because it is owned by Russians. And BTC-E is the place where you get the cheapest BTCs.

[olloman]

I am using BTC-E for a year now and never had any problems. Still some people spread false rumors, because it is owned by Russians. And BTC-E is the place where you get the cheapest BTCs.

as I said, btc-e works fine for coins-coins exchange, but I don't think I will ever deposit money on it. That's because I actually wanted to but had some issues, contacted support and I got this precise answer from their support team: "change bank coz our details correct"...I swear this was the answer I got, as if it was written by a 12-years old brat...does it seem professional to you?

[PenAndPaper]

bitcoin.de is a blessing compared to all the other exchanges, very nice design and functions, you don't have to deposit money on it, only bitcoins, and you pay directly to the seller with bank transfer, and you can even spend up to $2,500 before needing a complete registration...only problem, if we want to call it so, is that you need to be in the Euro zone, sorry Americans&Asians&rest of the world  btc-e and the others are good only for coin-coin exchanges...anyway I have no affiliation at all with bitcoin.de, just sharing my experiences, all other exchanges should be like that, and not only for the Euro zone...

bitcoin.de is not a traditional exchange like gox or bitstamp. Pretty much it brings together buyers and sellers and that can cause problems because people often change their mind based on how the price moves and transactions are never completed.

[Nagle]

kraken

It's not clear who "Kraken" is. Their street address in San Francisco is a cheap mailbox service on Market St. The same one Tradehill used. No audits. No broker/dealer license. And, already, user complaints about failure to pay up.

localbitcoins.

You get to deal with anonymous individuals trying to use PayPal in violation of PayPal's TOS. Plus the spreads are huge.

[samurai1200]

just want to drop a note here that btc-e can interface with MT4 (metatrader 4).

[miner2002]

There's no reason to be upset about it, as another person mentioned it just shows how early we are in crypto and how much room there is to grow.  You need to guard yourself against well known exchanges going belly up and running off with your coins.  Only do trades in batches you can afford to lose.  

What needs to happen is someone, who is willing to NOT be anonymous, goes offshore (Cayman Islands, etc) and works locally with that gov to establish some rules for how things will go. Then put together a team, also NOT anonymous, that includes people with experience running/maintaining true exchanges like BATS/NASDAQ/ETC.  In addition, they'll need a team of programmers who can put together a website that can handle the volume and also provide support.

If you can do the above, you'll have a golden business, but that's going to take multi-millions of dollars and time to put it together correctly. Based on the market continuing to expand, you can bet someone is working on something similar to what I have described above as we speak.

[VforVictory]

There's no reason to be upset about it, as another person mentioned it just shows how early we are in crypto and how much room there is to grow.  You need to guard yourself against well known exchanges going belly up and running off with your coins.  Only do trades in batches you can afford to lose.  

What needs to happen is someone, who is willing to NOT be anonymous, goes offshore (Cayman Islands, etc) and works locally with that gov to establish some rules for how things will go. Then put together a team, also NOT anonymous, that includes people with experience running/maintaining true exchanges like BATS/NASDAQ/ETC.  In addition, they'll need a team of programmers who can put together a website that can handle the volume and also provide support.

If you can do the above, you'll have a golden business, but that's going to take multi-millions of dollars and time to put it together correctly. Based on the market continuing to expand, you can bet someone is working on something similar to what I have described above as we speak.

Why Cayman, when you can go to Cuba? 

[QuestionAuthority]

If you have a better way to do it then you should make one yourself. I'm sure that's what Jered Kenna thought too. We all know how that worked out.

[PenAndPaper]

kraken

It's not clear who "Kraken" is. Their street address in San Francisco is a cheap mailbox service on Market St. The same one Tradehill used. No audits. No broker/dealer license. And, already, user complaints about failure to pay up.

The biggest issue with Kraken is the low daily volume. I mean its something like 300 btc right now. 

[Nagle]

kraken

It's not clear who "Kraken" is. Their street address in San Francisco is a cheap mailbox service on Market St. The same one Tradehill used. No audits. No broker/dealer license. And, already, user complaints about failure to pay up.

The biggest issue with Kraken is the low daily volume. I mean its something like 300 btc right now. 

Given their flakyness, it's good that nobody is using them.

[Abdi Shakur]

As others have stated it is early days, patience will be required it does take a lot of technological, legal and financial resources
to start and run an exchange effectively.

Hopefully others who are looking to start are reading the feedback, and will learn from 
problems the early exchanges have had.

[mateo]

bitcoin.de is a blessing compared to all the other exchanges, very nice design and functions, you don't have to deposit money on it, only bitcoins, and you pay directly to the seller with bank transfer, and you can even spend up to $2,500 before needing a complete registration...only problem, if we want to call it so, is that you need to be in the Euro zone, sorry Americans&Asians&rest of the world  btc-e and the others are good only for coin-coin exchanges...anyway I have no affiliation at all with bitcoin.de, just sharing my experiences, all other exchanges should be like that, and not only for the Euro zone...

So, when I sell BTC on bitcoin.de that particular member will have to make a bank transfer to my account? Not the exchange itself?

[Barek]

bitcoin.de is a blessing compared to all the other exchanges, very nice design and functions, you don't have to deposit money on it, only bitcoins, and you pay directly to the seller with bank transfer, and you can even spend up to $2,500 before needing a complete registration...only problem, if we want to call it so, is that you need to be in the Euro zone, sorry Americans&Asians&rest of the world  btc-e and the others are good only for coin-coin exchanges...anyway I have no affiliation at all with bitcoin.de, just sharing my experiences, all other exchanges should be like that, and not only for the Euro zone...

So, when I sell BTC on bitcoin.de that particular member will have to make a bank transfer to my account? Not the exchange itself?

Yep, asks/bids are not matched automatically. You pick your bid/ask and then wire the money or wait for money to be wired. There are some deadlines and trust rating. It is a little bit like localbitcoins, but with specific bids/asks. Bitcoin.de does escrow and identity verification, but they don't seem to do much in fraud cases (canceled wire transfers, delayed transfers, ...).

[olloman]

bitcoin.de is a blessing compared to all the other exchanges, very nice design and functions, you don't have to deposit money on it, only bitcoins, and you pay directly to the seller with bank transfer, and you can even spend up to $2,500 before needing a complete registration...only problem, if we want to call it so, is that you need to be in the Euro zone, sorry Americans&Asians&rest of the world  btc-e and the others are good only for coin-coin exchanges...anyway I have no affiliation at all with bitcoin.de, just sharing my experiences, all other exchanges should be like that, and not only for the Euro zone...

bitcoin.de is not a traditional exchange like gox or bitstamp. Pretty much it brings together buyers and sellers and that can cause problems because people often change their mind based on how the price moves and transactions are never completed.

I made more than 10 trades (only buy) on bitcoin.de, and for example most of the times, by the time I received my bitcoins, the price was already doubled, but the sellers always confirmed the transaction. I might have been lucky, but as I said, the community so far looks really friendly and mature (in terms of user-user private messages during trades and respect of the trade even with high price changes between bank transfer and btc transfer)

[Jcw188]

I agree with this.  I'd love to be more involved with BTC but especially in US, I think, it's tough to fund and withdraw.  They all claim to be special and professional but they just seem to be incompetent or fraudsters.

[Nagle]

I agree with this.  I'd love to be more involved with BTC but especially in US, I think, it's tough to fund and withdraw.  They all claim to be special and professional but they just seem to be incompetent or fraudsters.

True. What's needed is for some existing small securities firm to start a Bitcoin exchange. A firm that is already an SEC registered broker/dealer, has banking relationships, SIPC insurance, FINRA supervision, auditors, and people who have passed the FINRA exams.

The reason for all those requirements is that stockbrokers were once, in the 1920s, as flaky as Bitcoin exchanges are now. That got fixed. It's very rare for customers of a US registered broker to lose money through broker fraud. Even Madoff's customers got their first $500,000 back from SIPC insurance, and are gradually getting more of their money back as the receiver claws back profits from Madoff's friends. (Madoff himself, of course, is in a cell in the federal pen in Butner, NC.)

[subcoin]

MtGox, Bitstamp, and BTC-e are not acceptable exchanges.

Nobody is stopping you from setting up a new, perfect one.

P.S. BTC-E is not Russian. I never had any problems with them.
Trading, depositing or withdrawal was quick and problem-free.

[PenAndPaper]

I agree with this.  I'd love to be more involved with BTC but especially in US, I think, it's tough to fund and withdraw.  They all claim to be special and professional but they just seem to be incompetent or fraudsters.

Isn't coinbase trustworthy enough? I mean that's one option in the us that afaik no other country has.

[Flashback]

I am interested in starting a REAL PROFESSIONAL BITCOIN EXCHANGE with a real team for support, administration, etc. but there is one slight problem. I am based in Romania. I am afraid that people will not trust the service because Romania doesn't have very good image worldwide. What is your opinion?  

[Operatr]

Bitshares, Open Transactions, and Mastercoin are all the real way this is being dealt with, in what are p2p exchange nodes that can be used to generate and trade any kind of currency or asset. These are new layers being built on top of Bitcoin and other blockchains to facilitate decentralized exchange.

For centralized exchanges, there are things like ItBit that are throwing down some serious venture capital to create a robust system.

[giveBTCpls]

bitcoin.de is a blessing compared to all the other exchanges, very nice design and functions, you don't have to deposit money on it, only bitcoins, and you pay directly to the seller with bank transfer, and you can even spend up to $2,500 before needing a complete registration...only problem, if we want to call it so, is that you need to be in the Euro zone, sorry Americans&Asians&rest of the world  btc-e and the others are good only for coin-coin exchanges...anyway I have no affiliation at all with bitcoin.de, just sharing my experiences, all other exchanges should be like that, and not only for the Euro zone...

Im gonna go there to do some buy and hold operations, but bitcoin.de is useless for day trading because you can't deposit fiat. You need to get your fiat instantly delivered in a deposit to do quick buy/sell movements. You can't do this with bitcoin.de because the fiat goes directly to your bank 1-3 days later. It's like localbitcoins.
Also, what kind of information do you need to break the 2,500 limitation?

[giveBTCpls]

bitcoin.de is a blessing compared to all the other exchanges, very nice design and functions, you don't have to deposit money on it, only bitcoins, and you pay directly to the seller with bank transfer, and you can even spend up to $2,500 before needing a complete registration...only problem, if we want to call it so, is that you need to be in the Euro zone, sorry Americans&Asians&rest of the world   btc-e and the others are good only for coin-coin exchanges...anyway I have no affiliation at all with bitcoin.de, just sharing my experiences, all other exchanges should be like that, and not only for the Euro zone...

Euro zone , or European Union?
Cause I'm getting interested on this , heard a lot of good stuff about it.

well, I can tell you that you have to pay through SEPA bank transfer (or national bank transfer, if the seller's bank is in the same nation as your bank), which is only available for banks of the countries that are in the Euro Zone I think...quote from Wikipedia: "The Single Euro Payments Area (SEPA) is a payment-integration initiative of the European Union for simplification of bank transfers denominated in euro. As of November 2013, SEPA consists of the 28 EU member states, the four members of the EFTA (Iceland, Liechtenstein, Norway and Switzerland) and Monaco"

As I said, I recommend bitcoin.de, I personally made more than 10 trades, all successful, and the community is generally friendly, and the coin disbursement doesn't usually take more than half an hour...in addition the possibility to spend up to 2,500 euros before a complete verification (only with a bank account verification) is a great feature

The euro zone means the states that adopted the euro as a currency. That got me curios.
SEPA is for the whole Eurpean Union.

I'll give it a try , what the hell!

alright, my mistake   by the way I think you will not regret it, it is really worth trying! It is obviously not intended for daily traders since the bank transfers can take up to one or two days, but if you just want to get some bitcoins to store away or move to other exchanges, or don't want to/can't get a full verification, it is the best site at the moment in my opinion!

EDIT: I think it is important to add that the 2,500 euros without verification are annual, so if you start trading now, in less than a month you will be able to spend 2,500 more euros without verification 

My bank acount isnt verified yet and when I try to click buy/sell I get this message:
"In order to trade on bitcoin.de, you have to verify the bank data. "

[giveBTCpls]

bitcoin.de is a blessing compared to all the other exchanges, very nice design and functions, you don't have to deposit money on it, only bitcoins, and you pay directly to the seller with bank transfer, and you can even spend up to $2,500 before needing a complete registration...only problem, if we want to call it so, is that you need to be in the Euro zone, sorry Americans&Asians&rest of the world  btc-e and the others are good only for coin-coin exchanges...anyway I have no affiliation at all with bitcoin.de, just sharing my experiences, all other exchanges should be like that, and not only for the Euro zone...

So, when I sell BTC on bitcoin.de that particular member will have to make a bank transfer to my account? Not the exchange itself?

Yep, asks/bids are not matched automatically. You pick your bid/ask and then wire the money or wait for money to be wired. There are some deadlines and trust rating. It is a little bit like localbitcoins, but with specific bids/asks. Bitcoin.de does escrow and identity verification, but they don't seem to do much in fraud cases (canceled wire transfers, delayed transfers, ...).

Really? So what stops people from scaming and getting rich if they do nothing about fraud?

[olloman]

bitcoin.de is a blessing compared to all the other exchanges, very nice design and functions, you don't have to deposit money on it, only bitcoins, and you pay directly to the seller with bank transfer, and you can even spend up to $2,500 before needing a complete registration...only problem, if we want to call it so, is that you need to be in the Euro zone, sorry Americans&Asians&rest of the world  btc-e and the others are good only for coin-coin exchanges...anyway I have no affiliation at all with bitcoin.de, just sharing my experiences, all other exchanges should be like that, and not only for the Euro zone...

Im gonna go there to do some buy and hold operations, but bitcoin.de is useless for day trading because you can't deposit fiat. You need to get your fiat instantly delivered in a deposit to do quick buy/sell movements. You can't do this with bitcoin.de because the fiat goes directly to your bank 1-3 days later. It's like localbitcoins.
Also, what kind of information do you need to break the 2,500 limitation?

yeah, that's why in one of my other messages I wrote that bitcoin.de is great to purchase bitcoin for long term hold or to send to other exchanges, daily trading is indeed impossible 

To get a full verification and get unlimited trade you need to send a copy of your ID and residence proof (like the other exchanges), and you also need to fill a form with the supervision of a third party authority (they suggest for example notary's office, solicitor's office or credit institution)...anyway the 2,500 euro limit is annual 

[olloman]

bitcoin.de is a blessing compared to all the other exchanges, very nice design and functions, you don't have to deposit money on it, only bitcoins, and you pay directly to the seller with bank transfer, and you can even spend up to $2,500 before needing a complete registration...only problem, if we want to call it so, is that you need to be in the Euro zone, sorry Americans&Asians&rest of the world  btc-e and the others are good only for coin-coin exchanges...anyway I have no affiliation at all with bitcoin.de, just sharing my experiences, all other exchanges should be like that, and not only for the Euro zone...

So, when I sell BTC on bitcoin.de that particular member will have to make a bank transfer to my account? Not the exchange itself?

Yep, asks/bids are not matched automatically. You pick your bid/ask and then wire the money or wait for money to be wired. There are some deadlines and trust rating. It is a little bit like localbitcoins, but with specific bids/asks. Bitcoin.de does escrow and identity verification, but they don't seem to do much in fraud cases (canceled wire transfers, delayed transfers, ...).

Really? So what stops people from scaming and getting rich if they do nothing about fraud?

as I already said, the community is generally mature and trustworthy, and obviously since every user has a trust rate, you might try and fool someone once, but then nobody will ever trade with you again

[olloman]

bitcoin.de is a blessing compared to all the other exchanges, very nice design and functions, you don't have to deposit money on it, only bitcoins, and you pay directly to the seller with bank transfer, and you can even spend up to $2,500 before needing a complete registration...only problem, if we want to call it so, is that you need to be in the Euro zone, sorry Americans&Asians&rest of the world   btc-e and the others are good only for coin-coin exchanges...anyway I have no affiliation at all with bitcoin.de, just sharing my experiences, all other exchanges should be like that, and not only for the Euro zone...

Euro zone , or European Union?
Cause I'm getting interested on this , heard a lot of good stuff about it.

well, I can tell you that you have to pay through SEPA bank transfer (or national bank transfer, if the seller's bank is in the same nation as your bank), which is only available for banks of the countries that are in the Euro Zone I think...quote from Wikipedia: "The Single Euro Payments Area (SEPA) is a payment-integration initiative of the European Union for simplification of bank transfers denominated in euro. As of November 2013, SEPA consists of the 28 EU member states, the four members of the EFTA (Iceland, Liechtenstein, Norway and Switzerland) and Monaco"

As I said, I recommend bitcoin.de, I personally made more than 10 trades, all successful, and the community is generally friendly, and the coin disbursement doesn't usually take more than half an hour...in addition the possibility to spend up to 2,500 euros before a complete verification (only with a bank account verification) is a great feature

The euro zone means the states that adopted the euro as a currency. That got me curios.
SEPA is for the whole Eurpean Union.

I'll give it a try , what the hell!

alright, my mistake   by the way I think you will not regret it, it is really worth trying! It is obviously not intended for daily traders since the bank transfers can take up to one or two days, but if you just want to get some bitcoins to store away or move to other exchanges, or don't want to/can't get a full verification, it is the best site at the moment in my opinion!

EDIT: I think it is important to add that the 2,500 euros without verification are annual, so if you start trading now, in less than a month you will be able to spend 2,500 more euros without verification 

My bank acount isnt verified yet and when I try to click buy/sell I get this message:
"In order to trade on bitcoin.de, you have to verify the bank data. "

well I said that you don't need a complete verification (ID and residence proof), but to trade you need to validate at least your bank account...nothing special, you just give them your bank account details, they send you 9 cents and you have to put in the website the code you get in the "details" section of the transfer...I guess it is to have a minimum of control and trust, and also because if you just want to sell, they need to have your bank account details to inform the buyer

[Malooka]

You can add Campbx.com to the list of incompetent idiots.

Their website states, in bold letters, that all money orders will be credited within 2 business days of receipt.

They have cashed 3 $500 money orders of mine last week.  One arrived Monday (was finally credited Sunday morning), another arrived Wednesday, not sure when the other arrived but it had to have been around the same time as they were all cashed the same day.

Nothing has been credited to my account at all from the last $1000 they've cashed.  If just $500 had been credited by Saturday I could have had $633 (or less) BTC.  They are too lazy to live up to their own terms, and now the price is well over $900.

If you look at their Facebook page it seems they may be about to go under.  They're ripping off everybody.

[other_side]

The solution is not the new exchange, but ETF, that trades on existing conventional exchanges.

[pgbit]

More exchanges will come to light over the next few months.
Just wait for a few big timers to enter the exchange scene. 

Exchanges that don't shape up and earn levels of trust with stable honest service will fail, sooner than they appreciate. If trust vanishes, they will be swallowed up by decentralised services in their entirety in an even shorter period of time. To be fair, problems that arise currently are closely associated with periods of massive demand  (it's been crazy, hasn't it?), but this doesnt explain all the shenanigans going on with random balance debits (never credits eh?). Exchanges with a fairly limited set of alts (i.e. not over 40) tend have the most stable web interfaces. It's crying out to be decentralised at the moment. Some exchanges are genuinely helpful, and I hope that the situation improves so that levels of trust in all of them can be improved to an acceptable level.