Are corporations people?

[kizzoboy]

"Corporations" can only survive if they create value for its investors and shareholders (ie: selling attractive goods and services).  Corporations are a good thing - they resulted in the creation of the computers we're typing on, the power that we use to run the computer, and maybe even the hardware that was used to mine the first bitcoins.

FTFY.. capitalism at its best.

I disagree.  A corporation has to create value for people other than investors or shareholders to exist.  The investors and shareholders only make money if this happens.  IE: Investors and shareholders in Apple wouldn't make any money if Apple made lousy products that weren't valued.  It would be pointless for a corporation to only exist to serve its shareholders and investors.  That would vastly reduce the amount of consumers it would be making goods and services for.

[Lethn]

I can't believe people are actually debating this, corporations are an organisation or groups of organisations made up of people, they aren't 'people' by themselves, the stupid argument you Americans are having is whether or not a listed organisation is a human being, you are also stupid for trying to argue with someone as dumb as Mitt Romney.

corporation
  Use Corporation in a sentence
cor·po·ra·tion
[kawr-puh-rey-shuhn] Show IPA
noun
1.
an association of individuals, created by law or under authority of law, having a continuous existence independent of the existences of its members, and powers and liabilities distinct from those of its members. See also municipal corporation, public corporation.
2.
( initial capital letter ) the group of principal officials of a borough or other municipal division in England.
3.
any group of persons united or regarded as united in one body.
4.
Informal. a paunch; potbelly.

Corporations are a group of people, they are not a person.

[Hawker]

I can't believe people are actually debating this, corporations are an organisation or groups of organisations made up of people, they aren't 'people' by themselves, the stupid argument you Americans are having is whether or not a listed organisation is a human being, you are also stupid for trying to argue with someone as dumb as Mitt Romney.

corporation
  Use Corporation in a sentence
cor·po·ra·tion
[kawr-puh-rey-shuhn] Show IPA
noun
1.
an association of individuals, created by law or under authority of law, having a continuous existence independent of the existences of its members, and powers and liabilities distinct from those of its members. See also municipal corporation, public corporation.
2.
( initial capital letter ) the group of principal officials of a borough or other municipal division in England.
3.
any group of persons united or regarded as united in one body.
4.
Informal. a paunch; potbelly.

Corporations are a group of people, they are not a person.

In most common law jurisdictions, a legal fiction exists that a company is a person.

I can't help but notice a tone of contempt towards the people who invest in companies.  Most people who have pensions depend on stock exchange investments for their retirement income.  If you have not done this yourself, you should.

[hilariousandco]

Corporations are a group of people, they are not a person.

Are you arguing against Mitt Romney?

[beetcoin]

"Corporations" can only survive if they create value for its investors and shareholders (ie: selling attractive goods and services).  Corporations are a good thing - they resulted in the creation of the computers we're typing on, the power that we use to run the computer, and maybe even the hardware that was used to mine the first bitcoins.

FTFY.. capitalism at its best.

I disagree.  A corporation has to create value for people other than investors or shareholders to exist.  The investors and shareholders only make money if this happens.  IE: Investors and shareholders in Apple wouldn't make any money if Apple made lousy products that weren't valued.  It would be pointless for a corporation to only exist to serve its shareholders and investors.  That would vastly reduce the amount of consumers it would be making goods and services for.

corporations CAN possibly provide a service or product of great value to society, but it doesn't necessarily do so. its main concern is to make money, even if it means screwing over the rest of the population. that's the de facto way it is.

[Mike Christ]

corporations CAN possibly provide a service or product of great value to soceity, but it doesn't necessarily do so. its main concern is to make money, even if it means screwing over the rest of the population. that's the de facto way it is.

Though you and I realize this, so long as a corporation appears to provide a service or product of great value, it remains a legitimate business.  Take snake-oil, for example; so long as people believe it cures cancer and makes their skin smoother, they'll pay for it.  In this way, all businesses provide a benefit to society, even if we realize some don't; because we're a minority, popular belief always holds true that any business that stands on its own legs is a boon to us all.

There's nothing a person can do without knowledge; all businesses are good in the eyes of the typical consumer.  The only solution, of course, is knowledge.

[kizzoboy]

"Corporations" can only survive if they create value for its investors and shareholders (ie: selling attractive goods and services).  Corporations are a good thing - they resulted in the creation of the computers we're typing on, the power that we use to run the computer, and maybe even the hardware that was used to mine the first bitcoins.

FTFY.. capitalism at its best.

I disagree.  A corporation has to create value for people other than investors or shareholders to exist.  The investors and shareholders only make money if this happens.  IE: Investors and shareholders in Apple wouldn't make any money if Apple made lousy products that weren't valued.  It would be pointless for a corporation to only exist to serve its shareholders and investors.  That would vastly reduce the amount of consumers it would be making goods and services for.

corporations CAN possibly provide a service or product of great value to society, but it doesn't necessarily do so. its main concern is to make money, even if it means screwing over the rest of the population. that's the de facto way it is.

I haven't heard of a corporation that's stayed in business very long by screwing over entire populations.  The only way for a corporation to make money would be to provide valuable good or service that people want to buy.

[beetcoin]

"Corporations" can only survive if they create value for its investors and shareholders (ie: selling attractive goods and services).  Corporations are a good thing - they resulted in the creation of the computers we're typing on, the power that we use to run the computer, and maybe even the hardware that was used to mine the first bitcoins.

FTFY.. capitalism at its best.

I disagree.  A corporation has to create value for people other than investors or shareholders to exist.  The investors and shareholders only make money if this happens.  IE: Investors and shareholders in Apple wouldn't make any money if Apple made lousy products that weren't valued.  It would be pointless for a corporation to only exist to serve its shareholders and investors.  That would vastly reduce the amount of consumers it would be making goods and services for.

corporations CAN possibly provide a service or product of great value to society, but it doesn't necessarily do so. its main concern is to make money, even if it means screwing over the rest of the population. that's the de facto way it is.

I haven't heard of a corporation that's stayed in business very long by screwing over entire populations.  The only way for a corporation to make money would be to provide valuable good or service that people want to buy.

you must live in a bubble. heard of the income disparity? the middle class is dying along with the economy. what do you think is contributing to this? why do you think 4 of the top 10 richest people in the U.S. are the waltons, yet they are "struggling" to pay their employees minimum wage at part-time rates, just so that government can come in and pick the rest of the bills for the employees?

[kizzoboy]

"Corporations" can only survive if they create value for its investors and shareholders (ie: selling attractive goods and services).  Corporations are a good thing - they resulted in the creation of the computers we're typing on, the power that we use to run the computer, and maybe even the hardware that was used to mine the first bitcoins.

FTFY.. capitalism at its best.

I disagree.  A corporation has to create value for people other than investors or shareholders to exist.  The investors and shareholders only make money if this happens.  IE: Investors and shareholders in Apple wouldn't make any money if Apple made lousy products that weren't valued.  It would be pointless for a corporation to only exist to serve its shareholders and investors.  That would vastly reduce the amount of consumers it would be making goods and services for.

corporations CAN possibly provide a service or product of great value to society, but it doesn't necessarily do so. its main concern is to make money, even if it means screwing over the rest of the population. that's the de facto way it is.

I haven't heard of a corporation that's stayed in business very long by screwing over entire populations.  The only way for a corporation to make money would be to provide valuable good or service that people want to buy.

you must live in a bubble. heard of the income disparity? the middle class is dying along with the economy. what do you think is contributing to this? why do you think 4 of the top 10 richest people in the U.S. are the waltons, yet they are "struggling" to pay their employees minimum wage at part-time rates, just so that government can come in and pick the rest of the bills for the employees?

The heirs to Walmart are rich because they're invested in one of the most successful retail companies on earth.  Company is only successful because millions of consumers benefit from the valuable service that Walmart provides.

Walmart should spend time working on how to accept Bitcoin and less time responding to political interest groups haha

[beetcoin]

"Corporations" can only survive if they create value for its investors and shareholders (ie: selling attractive goods and services).  Corporations are a good thing - they resulted in the creation of the computers we're typing on, the power that we use to run the computer, and maybe even the hardware that was used to mine the first bitcoins.

FTFY.. capitalism at its best.

I disagree.  A corporation has to create value for people other than investors or shareholders to exist.  The investors and shareholders only make money if this happens.  IE: Investors and shareholders in Apple wouldn't make any money if Apple made lousy products that weren't valued.  It would be pointless for a corporation to only exist to serve its shareholders and investors.  That would vastly reduce the amount of consumers it would be making goods and services for.

corporations CAN possibly provide a service or product of great value to society, but it doesn't necessarily do so. its main concern is to make money, even if it means screwing over the rest of the population. that's the de facto way it is.

I haven't heard of a corporation that's stayed in business very long by screwing over entire populations.  The only way for a corporation to make money would be to provide valuable good or service that people want to buy.

you must live in a bubble. heard of the income disparity? the middle class is dying along with the economy. what do you think is contributing to this? why do you think 4 of the top 10 richest people in the U.S. are the waltons, yet they are "struggling" to pay their employees minimum wage at part-time rates, just so that government can come in and pick the rest of the bills for the employees?

The heirs to Walmart are rich because they're invested in one of the most successful retail companies on earth.  Company is only successful because millions of consumers benefit from the valuable service that Walmart provides.

Walmart should spend time working on how to accept Bitcoin and less time responding to political interest groups haha

at this point i really don't know what to tell you anymore. you did not counter my argument, all you said was "walmart founders are really rich because they invested in the retail company."

[Hideyoshi]

you must live in a bubble. heard of the income disparity? the middle class is dying along with the economy. what do you think is contributing to this? why do you think 4 of the top 10 richest people in the U.S. are the waltons, yet they are "struggling" to pay their employees minimum wage at part-time rates, just so that government can come in and pick the rest of the bills for the employees?

These Waltons, how do they and their company makes money? Do they provide useful service? If not, why do they make money? Who are they taking profits from, underpaid employees? Are you saying  these employees are actually contributing millions of dollars to economy, but Waltons are taking all those millions for themselves, and only paying them  minimum wage? They must be very spectacular employees.

[beetcoin]

you must live in a bubble. heard of the income disparity? the middle class is dying along with the economy. what do you think is contributing to this? why do you think 4 of the top 10 richest people in the U.S. are the waltons, yet they are "struggling" to pay their employees minimum wage at part-time rates, just so that government can come in and pick the rest of the bills for the employees?

These Waltons, how do they and their company makes money? Do they provide useful service? If not, why do they make money? Who are they taking profits from, underpaid employees? Are you saying  these employees are actually contributing millions of dollars to economy, but Waltons are taking all those millions for themselves, and only paying them  minimum wage? They must be very spectacular employees.

im not sure where i said that they did not provide a service to society. what i said was that they game the system to pay employees at part-time wages, which means they won't make enough money and will require government assistance. it's so bad that even have their own "specialists" that help employees sign up for government assistance.

[kizzoboy]

They should hire bitcoin specialists instead!

[Hideyoshi]

im not sure where i said that they did not provide a service to society. what i said was that they game the system to pay employees at part-time wages, which means they won't make enough money and will require government assistance. it's so bad that even have their own "specialists" that help employees sign up for government assistance.

Why not employees ask for more, or quit and find a better job? Or move to find a better job if they have to. Or move back in with their parents, and spend time learning new skill so they do not have to work as cashiers? It is strange for us in our country to see people in America struggling to live on their own, making so little money and barely able to survive. Here they would just live with rest of family until they actually have money to move out. Even if they do not have good job and much money, they can still share house and food with family, and be ok. Why must everyone have their own house, their own car, and their own everything?

[Mike Christ]

Why not employees ask for more, or quit and find a better job? Or move to find a better job if they have to. Or move back in with their parents, and spend time learning new skill so they do not have to work as cashiers? It is strange for us in our country to see people in America struggling to live on their own, making so little money and barely able to survive. Here they would just live with rest of family until they actually have money to move out. Even if they do not have good job and much money, they can still share house and food with family, and be ok. Why must everyone have their own house, their own car, and their own everything?

Americans are trained to attack anyone who lives with their parents; you can find examples of this all over the site.  As such, they have this idea that they must live by themselves, even if it means sacrificing their potential futures, just to ensure nobody thinks lesser of them.  Once this condition is met, the individual is then accepted as a participating member of society, and never a moment before.

[beetcoin]

i always hear this argument.. but no matter what you do, there will always be unskilled/uneducated people. sometimes you are so financially strapped that you don't even have the money or time invest in training for a new skill. the worst thing about it is that even if you did go to a vocational school, there are still less and less jobs available.

here's an example of how hard it is to even get a super low paying job http://www.the-american-interest.com/blog/2013/11/20/dc-residents-clamor-for-walmart-jobs/

more applicants get into harvard than a walmart..

[Mike Christ]

i always hear this argument.. but no matter what you do, there will always be unskilled/uneducated people. sometimes you are so financially strapped that you don't even have the money or time invest in training for a new skill. the worst thing about it is that even if you did go to a vocational school, there are still less and less jobs available.

here's an example of how hard it is to even get a super low paying job http://www.the-american-interest.com/blog/2013/11/20/dc-residents-clamor-for-walmart-jobs/

more applicants get into harvard than a walmart..

The problem isn't unskilled people, the problem is a shrinking economy; the obvious answer is, "Just go out and make your own job", but this is killed with higher and higher levels of regulation until the only option you have is applying for some other business who can afford the extra fees of operating a business (odds are, this is a corporation; this is not a coincidence.)  All America has to do is unclench its regulatory asshole and we'll be fine, but that doesn't seem to be happening; people are actually asking for more regulation.  When people have more wealth, they have more time with less exhaustion, and when they have more time and more energy, they have the opportunity to become more skilled, and so the economy improves as more work emerges and more wealth is spreading around.

[Hideyoshi]

i always hear this argument.. but no matter what you do, there will always be unskilled/uneducated people. sometimes you are so financially strapped that you don't even have the money or time invest in training for a new skill. the worst thing about it is that even if you did go to a vocational school, there are still less and less jobs available.

here's an example of how hard it is to even get a super low paying job http://www.the-american-interest.com/blog/2013/11/20/dc-residents-clamor-for-walmart-jobs/

more applicants get into harvard than a walmart..

This sounds like there are many unskilled people in America. Why are they unskilled? Is no one interested in learning how to do things that actually get good jobs and pay money?

[beetcoin]

i always hear this argument.. but no matter what you do, there will always be unskilled/uneducated people. sometimes you are so financially strapped that you don't even have the money or time invest in training for a new skill. the worst thing about it is that even if you did go to a vocational school, there are still less and less jobs available.

here's an example of how hard it is to even get a super low paying job http://www.the-american-interest.com/blog/2013/11/20/dc-residents-clamor-for-walmart-jobs/

more applicants get into harvard than a walmart..

This sounds like there are many unskilled people in America. Why are they unskilled? Is no one interested in learning how to do things that actually get good jobs and pay money?

like i said, "good jobs" are a dying breed. the middle class is dying. and yes, there are a lot of uneducated people in america.. and it's moreso the ethnic minorities that get the shaft. it's not easy being broke, going to school and racking up a big bill for a "possible" job that may or may not pay out. for example, medical assistants pay $20k for training, and once they finish, they often start with $11/hour jobs. their debt just piles up while they earn $20k a year to live off of.

[duke1839]

Hey Beetcoin,

I agree with you that the middle class is under assault but it's not from corporations.  If you think income inequality is a problem then reduce all the needless licensing and red tape that has to be followed for someone to start a business.  And how do you know Walmart underpays its employees?  Who are you who thinks they know better than the employee and and employer who arrived at an agreed rate of compensation that the rate they both agreed to was wrong.  If a Walmart employee wants to hire you to negotiate his salary for him that's fine otherwise mind your own business.