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Author Topic: Bitcoin won't take over the world.  (Read 1502 times)
Anon136
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December 15, 2013, 06:25:49 PM
 #21

And we shouldn't try.

Don't threaten the establishment. Stop making claims of "taking down the dollar" or "uprooting the entire centralized banking structure"

We are not trying to do that.
We don't threaten the establishment.
We don't make claims to take down the dollar or anything else whatsoever.

Obviously you are talking for some other community and not the bitcoin one...

I think Kain35m sure has a point. 'We' as a community might not be doing that, at least not intentionally. But the concensus still pretty much seems to be that we're a bunch of anarchists and conspiracy theorists.

I'm an anarchist and a conspiracy theorist who loves and owns bitcoin so Its definitely true that some of are those things.

Rep Thread: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=381041
If one can not confer upon another a right which he does not himself first possess, by what means does the state derive the right to engage in behaviors from which the public is prohibited?
adworker
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December 15, 2013, 06:30:31 PM
 #22

And we shouldn't try.

Don't threaten the establishment. Stop making claims of "taking down the dollar" or "uprooting the entire centralized banking structure"

We are not trying to do that.
We don't threaten the establishment.
We don't make claims to take down the dollar or anything else whatsoever.

Obviously you are talking for some other community and not the bitcoin one...

I think Kain35m sure has a point. 'We' as a community might not be doing that, at least not intentionally. But the concensus still pretty much seems to be that we're a bunch of anarchists and conspiracy theorists.

I'm an anarchist and a conspiracy theorist who loves and owns bitcoin so Its definitely true that some of are those things.

Some just want to use better paying method over internet, like me  Smiley

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Anon136
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December 15, 2013, 06:36:50 PM
 #23

And we shouldn't try.

Don't threaten the establishment. Stop making claims of "taking down the dollar" or "uprooting the entire centralized banking structure"

We are not trying to do that.
We don't threaten the establishment.
We don't make claims to take down the dollar or anything else whatsoever.

Obviously you are talking for some other community and not the bitcoin one...

I think Kain35m sure has a point. 'We' as a community might not be doing that, at least not intentionally. But the concensus still pretty much seems to be that we're a bunch of anarchists and conspiracy theorists.

I'm an anarchist and a conspiracy theorist who loves and owns bitcoin so Its definitely true that some of are those things.

Some just want to use better paying method over internet, like me  Smiley

All are welcome Smiley

Rep Thread: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=381041
If one can not confer upon another a right which he does not himself first possess, by what means does the state derive the right to engage in behaviors from which the public is prohibited?
kain35m (OP)
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December 15, 2013, 11:03:36 PM
 #24

And we shouldn't try.

Don't threaten the establishment. Stop making claims of "taking down the dollar" or "uprooting the entire centralized banking structure"

We are not trying to do that.
We don't threaten the establishment.
We don't make claims to take down the dollar or anything else whatsoever.

Obviously you are talking for some other community and not the bitcoin one...

I think Kain35m sure has a point. 'We' as a community might not be doing that, at least not intentionally. But the concensus still pretty much seems to be that we're a bunch of anarchists and conspiracy theorists.

I'm an anarchist and a conspiracy theorist who loves and owns bitcoin so Its definitely true that some of are those things.

Some just want to use better paying method over internet, like me  Smiley

All are welcome Smiley

Troof! I love this forum.
Gnewt
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December 15, 2013, 11:40:51 PM
 #25

I worry a bit that the incredibly strong association between "taking down the financial institutions" and Bitcoin serves as a barrier to adoption. Bitcoin serves people who have an agenda against banks, but it also serves others too who may be driven away by such sentiment.
uininPeter
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December 16, 2013, 12:29:27 AM
 #26

I worry a bit that the incredibly strong association between "taking down the financial institutions" and Bitcoin serves as a barrier to adoption. Bitcoin serves people who have an agenda against banks, but it also serves others too who may be driven away by such sentiment.

I believe very few really believe Bitcoin can take down the financial institutions.
I think it is even not possible, you need physical payment system when electricity is down

mindfulmojo
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December 16, 2013, 12:42:28 AM
 #27

I worry a bit that the incredibly strong association between "taking down the financial institutions" and Bitcoin serves as a barrier to adoption. Bitcoin serves people who have an agenda against banks, but it also serves others too who may be driven away by such sentiment.

I believe very few really believe Bitcoin can take down the financial institutions.
I think it is even not possible, you need physical payment system when electricity is down

And the banks aren't in the least scared of bitcoin. They can buy every last bitcoin with out even thinking about.

It truly is a drop in bucket compared to the amount of wealth and power they control...
Gnewt
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December 16, 2013, 01:15:57 AM
 #28

Not sure I agree. They won't be able to buy "every last bitcoin" if Bitcoin increases greatly in value. Of course nobody can tell you whether or not that will happen.
Ninetoe
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December 16, 2013, 01:19:13 AM
 #29

goverments arent scared, they are already discussing how to tax it. ><
tondaS
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December 16, 2013, 01:23:57 AM
 #30


And the banks aren't in the least scared of bitcoin. They can buy every last bitcoin with out even thinking about.

There is not enought money to buy all Bitcoins, many Bitcoins are lost already  Tongue
mindfulmojo
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December 16, 2013, 01:49:47 AM
 #31


And the banks aren't in the least scared of bitcoin. They can buy every last bitcoin with out even thinking about.

There is not enought money to buy all Bitcoins, many Bitcoins are lost already  Tongue

Ok, they can't buy the lost bitcoins...lol But the bitcoin market really isn't that big.

http://bitcoinwatch.com/

Right now all of the bitcoins that exist is worth 10,864,643,028 USD

That is a lot of money, but you can't say there isn't a LOT more money on the planet than that.


zeraTunerse
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December 16, 2013, 01:55:38 AM
 #32

http://bitcoinwatch.com/

Right now all of the bitcoins that exist is worth 10,864,643,028 USD


This is not true, every Bitcoin you buy increase the price. Market cap is useless number, all Bitcoins cant be sold at current market price, only the first Bitcoins you buy...
mindfulmojo
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December 16, 2013, 02:02:29 AM
 #33

http://bitcoinwatch.com/

Right now all of the bitcoins that exist is worth 10,864,643,028 USD


This is not true, every Bitcoin you buy increase the price. Market cap is useless number, all Bitcoins cant be sold at current market price, only the first Bitcoins you buy...

Listen, I love bitcoin myself... But if the big banks wanted they could crush it easily. They are experts at price manipulation, they would buy a huge amount, then sell / dump it all, drastically lowering the price.

Then they could then buy it all back up again... and repeat. What do you think happens with gold and silver markets?
 
tearfereon
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December 16, 2013, 03:07:11 AM
 #34

goverments arent scared, they are already discussing how to tax it. ><

Taxing movements of money? Seems new way to help pay the debt  Smiley
agx56
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December 16, 2013, 03:32:04 AM
 #35

And we shouldn't try.
[...]
Why do I make such a request? not because these claims are impossible, not even because I don't believe they'll happen. It's only because the bigger and more public the threat, the more steps the established power structure will take in an attempt to discredit, disprove, and dismantle bitcoin.(and soon enough, they could succeed)
I dont WANT a payment processing and currency system that isnt safe vs such attacks. I want a currency that proves to be victorious after beeing fought by the very most powerful people in this world, including those who own much fiat. Because only after that, it is worthy to replace any fiat.

Just pay attention. Can't you see it happening already? bitcoin prices surge, they call it a bubble, we respond by laughing in their faces and the price just drives higher. They get nervous and  start issuing warnings about bitcoin. and not just bitcoin, the whole bitcoin community at large. Are we criminals, or investors looking for a get-rich-quick?
I do issue warning aswell, whenever i want to buy an altcoin below the value it actually deserves. Scare away unexperienced people from markets where long-term thinking is needed. Nothing bad about that (except for selfish motives, as in my personal example, of course).

1, "criminals" evolve into "terrorists", soon enough a bomb goes off somewhere killing innocent people and payoff for the hit was made in BTC. Public outrage and suddenly people all over the world start turning their backs on BTC.
You cant pull another 9/11 for ever ennoyance to any western government. that trick only works as long as it isnt overused, and currently, it is. People in Europa laugh whenever US feds declare something bad or good based on the classic MUH TERRORISM argument.

2, The "warnings" turn into "threats". many many people get their bitcoin wallets hacked and/or stolen in an attempt to disprove bitcoins inherent security.(lots of people don't have good security, or passwords) While the bitcoin infrastructure may be impenetrable, human error is always evident. and it'll be the most vulnerable of bitcoiners that get hit the hardest. thousands of wallets are taken and people lose faith.
Again, people who profit from that will even jump in and spread more fear. Just to make their thing clients/websites/apps and remote wallets look nicer.

3, they use their fantastic purchasing power to buy up every bitcoin they can get their hands on and either make BTC either so expensive that no one can ever afford one, or so cheap that no one ever wants one.
Okay, im in. They will make me rich. If they crash it, speculating investors will balance it out soon enough and back to business as usual.

world business is forced to evolve
yes. transaction speed and low fees are just TOO GOOD for any bank to seriously expects customers to wait weeks ust because the target is in based russia.

IMO Bitcoin is NOT like the internet. Bitcoin is more like Tor: It's not very well understood, it holds an extreme level of value to certain people, some people use it for less than honourable ventures, some people have tried it and could care less. I think that if we treat BTC more like Tor, it will be much better accepted, and much less scary for the sheep who inevitably won't give a s&*t in the end either way.
YESS. And as better means of making cryptocurrencies understandable for everyone (like MegaCoin, look at their fully translated website) evolve, things will more and more get normal and people will get used to it. And eventually Cryptos will just be like fiat and debit cards, and people will learn how to pay with a third mean with other individual advantages and disadvantages.
pand70
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December 16, 2013, 09:57:29 AM
 #36

And we shouldn't try.

Don't threaten the establishment. Stop making claims of "taking down the dollar" or "uprooting the entire centralized banking structure"

We are not trying to do that.
We don't threaten the establishment.
We don't make claims to take down the dollar or anything else whatsoever.

Obviously you are talking for some other community and not the bitcoin one...

I think Kain35m sure has a point. 'We' as a community might not be doing that, at least not intentionally. But the concensus still pretty much seems to be that we're a bunch of anarchists and conspiracy theorists.

I'm an anarchist and a conspiracy theorist who loves and owns bitcoin so Its definitely true that some of are those things.

You own and use toilet paper as well. Like all conspiracy theorists i guess. That doesn't mean that there is a conspiracy around it...

hilariousandco
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December 16, 2013, 10:24:21 AM
 #37

I worry a bit that the incredibly strong association between "taking down the financial institutions" and Bitcoin serves as a barrier to adoption. Bitcoin serves people who have an agenda against banks, but it also serves others too who may be driven away by such sentiment.

I believe very few really believe Bitcoin can take down the financial institutions.
I think it is even not possible, you need physical payment system when electricity is down

Bitcoin can be used in any way somebody sees fit. Sure it could theoretically take down the banks and/or take power away from them, or it can work alongside them. I'll bet it will work alongside them for many years, but the benefits of Bitcoin will hopefully slowly cripple the corrupt banking institutions and prove to the mainstream which is better. Hopefully Bitcoin wont become corrupted or manipulated and abused too, but only the future will tell us on that front.

You can also pay with physical Bitcoins. If electricity goes down, then so will the fiat credit systems.

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Xenoph0bia
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December 16, 2013, 10:38:11 AM
 #38

You can also pay with physical Bitcoins.

With physical Bitcoins you have to trust the manufacturer. I would trust government much more than manufacturer (one person)
hilariousandco
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December 16, 2013, 10:50:42 AM
 #39

You can also pay with physical Bitcoins.

With physical Bitcoins you have to trust the manufacturer. I would trust government much more than manufacturer (one person)

Not entirely. With coins, sure, but with Paper Wallets you could just scan the buyers paper wallet and take the funds on your phone or computer.

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