Idea for enabling BTC-backed alternate cryptocurrencies

[crazy_rabbit]

Very nice idea! Although- isn't this somewhat what mastercoin is trying to do? You should check them out.

[infinitybo]

Amincd, I am not certain if your hypothesis is true, nevertheless I like the basic concept of a BTC-Backed.

[amincd]

Make a bip

Don't know the protocol well enough, and there are still a couple details I need to work out anyway, like how to prevent a dishonest mining party from trivially robbing the POW address of the BTC stored at it.

Very nice idea! Although- isn't this somewhat what mastercoin is trying to do? You should check them out.

Thanks! I think Mastercoin is trying to do something similar to colored coins, in using the Bitcoin blockchain to store transaction data for its protocol.

I like Mastercoin for the same reason I like colored coins: it's using BTC as an underlying protocol and network so that it can focus only on the added features, rather than trying to recreate everything from scratch like other altcoins. It has a different goal from this proposal however, in that it's not trying to minimize blockchain bloat and network bandwidth requirements (in fact, it will greatly increase them), while the point of the POW transaction is to be able to use other blockchains to store transaction data, while still having the coins in those blockchains backed by BTC.

[spartacusrex]

Like it.

Been thinking about a similar system ever since I read TierNolan's post

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=145380.0

In your system, why not just keep all the TXN's to Bitcoins.

When you put the money on an altchain - it just stores the amount of BTC you send. Not some other alt coin. There would be no rewards for mining except fees.

Then you can use your btc with anyone on the sub-chain, and check out to the Main Chain, one level up.

This system could be cascadeable. Altchain off an altchain off Bitcoin..

The only bit I am unsure about is the Trust levels required.

You would need TO TRUST the owner of the sub chain. Since he could post an invalid Merkle-Root hash that assigned him all the btc. And cash out. You can't really have the main chain check the TXNS, as that defeats the object of it being off-chain! lol..

This is not so bad quite frankly, since their treachery would be visible. They could not do it without being busted. And destroying what was probably a very profitable enterprise.

But is there a way of doing it without ANY TRUST ?

[amincd]

Like it.

Been thinking about a similar system ever since I read TierNolan's post

https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=145380.0

That's very interesting, thanks for pointing it out to me.

In your system, why not just keep all the TXN's to Bitcoins.

When you put the money on an altchain - it just stores the amount of BTC you send. Not some other alt coin. There would be no rewards for mining except fees.

I would like it to be used to back sub-chains that get all of their value from the BTC-backing them, for example bitcoin substitutes intended to be used within specific geographic regions, but I think technically these bitcoin-substitute coins are still 'alternate cryptocurrencies', since they are not residing on the Bitcoin blockchain.

I think there's also value in making the proof of work transaction protocol flexible, and allowing people to design the sub-chains in any way they want, whether that means chains intended to be substitutes of bitcoin, or chains that are only partially backed by bitcoin, and are intended to be fully separate cryptocurrencies. Flexibility increases the space for innovation.

This system could be cascadeable. Altchain off an altchain off Bitcoin..

Well the sub-chains can have any rules they want, including having their own sub-chains. There are no constraints on how the sub-chains are designed, since the proposed proof of work transaction is validated only by the sub-chain block header.

The only bit I am unsure about is the Trust levels required.

You would need TO TRUST the owner of the sub chain. Since he could post an invalid Merkle-Root hash that assigned him all the btc. And cash out.

The owners are the miners, and yes you would have to trust them. If the Bitcoin nodes are going to validate the authenticity of the Bitcoin transaction the sub-chain miners are offering, then Bitcoin nodes would need to store all transactions in the sub-chain too, defeating the purpose of the sub-chains.

[amincd]

The proposal needs some work done on it. Ideally, all of the information needed to calculate the target difficulty of the transaction that spends BTC at a POW UTXO would be encoded in the POW address. I believe this could be done if the 'time since start of new difficulty period' (sum_time), the 'number of blocks in difficulty period' (block_number), and the timestamps of each of the previous 11 blocks are included in the POW address. That way, Bitcoin nodes could validate that a POW tx meets the target difficulty and has accurately updated the 'sum_time' and 'block_number' counters, and timestamp register, only by looking at the prev_out.

[johnytelevision]

Aren't all altcoins are backed up by bitcoin in one way or another...

I'm not sure if it good idea to enforce it.

[amincd]

No, altcoins are not backed up by Bitcoin. They have independent coin issuance and coin supplies.

[amincd]

Given the recent sidechain publication, I thought now would be a good time to expand on how sidechains can allow for much more efficient resource usage, and can increase decentralization, with this diagram representing the data structure of the Bitcoin blockchain and hypothetical regional sidechains:



People in each region do the vast majority of their transactions with parties in the same region, and therefore rarely do they need to have knowledge of the transaction data of other regions. A regional blockchain would therefore give a person living in the region access to almost all of the information they need to validate the transactions they will be doing, while containing significantly less data than the global aggregate of transaction data that would be contained if everyone shared the same blockchain.

We can imagine scenarios where ordinary people store two blockchains: a sidechain for their region, and the main Bitcoin blockchain, while professional users (e.g. international businesses) who do significant international business store all of the regional sidechains as well as the Bitcoin blockchain, so that they can easily transact in any sidechain coin.

Moving to this sort of architecture can allow for ordinary people to help validate the transaction data, instead of using SPV clients and relying on full nodes to do the validation. Miners can even source their sidechain transaction data from ordinary people running the full-sidechain nodes of their respective region using the getblocktemplate protocol, putting almost the power of transaction validation in the hands of small users.

[DhaniBoy]

actually between one another crypto interrelated and complementary, indeed to the current crypto bitcoin is the highest compared to its selling value crypto others, but it does not guarantee that bitcoin will have a high exchange rate forever, so for the moment you may collect other types of crypto like Dogecoin, altcoin or Litecoin, cryptocurrency alternatives such as the example above may be beyond the current bitcoin exchange rates, depending on how the markets react to