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Author Topic: Selling BTC vs Borrowing with BTC collateral in US  (Read 242 times)
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May 15, 2018, 10:21:51 PM
 #21

Let's say I bought 1 BTC at $8k, and I am selling it for $10k.
My profit is $2k.
I have the option to declare $2k profit and pay taxes, or use it as collateral for a loan.
case 1: have 1 BTC bought at $8k, then sell for $10k.
action: selling BTC to get cash and generate $2k income in the process
tax report: 35% of $2k profit

case 2: have 1 BTC bought at $8k, use for collateral to get cash US$8k (lets say this to make easy example)
action: take US$8k loan to generate income of $2k but have to pay interest $1,500 (just for example)
tax report: 35% of $2k profit (not on net profit $500)
you are still paying tax on the same $2k profit even if you have to pay interest

So let's say I have to pay 35% taxes for the $2k profit.
If I can take a 1-year loan for 19% APR, it would be better to take a loan, correct?
are you thinking to deduct the loan interest from $2k profit, so that you paying tax only on $500
I think you can't do that if you are doing it personally unless you are reporting tax as a business

Interest paid on personal loans is not tax-deductible. If you borrow to buy a car for personal use or to cover other personal expenses, the interest you pay on that loan does not reduce your tax liability.
...
Exceptions to the Rule
If you use a personal loan or credit card to finance business expenses in addition to personal expenditures, you may be able to claim the interest paid on those expenses on your taxes. You must be the person legally liable for the loan, and you must be able to itemize what portion of the interest paid is attributable to legitimate business expenses.

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jseverson
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May 16, 2018, 07:08:52 AM
 #22

Is it better to borrow cash using BTC as collateral, or just to sell BTC?
In terms of the taxes in the US.
Selling makes income, income have to be declared and paid taxes of it.
Borrowing means no income = no taxes.

How do you plan on making this work, exactly? Do you plan on purposefully defaulting on your loan to essentially get earnings without directly selling? That might work in theory, but the collateral must have higher value than the actual loan in practice. You might lose more money in taxes than defaulting your collateral, depending on the amount, but it's really better to simply pay your taxes to avoid any potential legal complications. If you're going to incur fees anyway, you may as well go the (explicitly) legal route.

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May 16, 2018, 11:57:04 AM
 #23

Borrowing money on bitcoin guarantees I think it's very dangerous, because bitcoin prices are never stable and we can lose when prices rise when we borrow money with bitcoin guarantees.
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May 17, 2018, 04:13:12 AM
 #24

If you borrow with bitcoin guarantees it's pretty risky, and you should sell bitcoin even if taxable it does not matter because we directly help the country with taxes.
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May 17, 2018, 04:20:17 PM
 #25

First of all, I would like to stress I am looking only for legal (in the US) ways to minimize taxes.
No cheating.
Just like in that movie, The Shawshank Redemption, Andy's advice saved a few bucks for Byron.

are you thinking to deduct the loan interest from $2k profit, so that you paying tax only on $500
I think you can't do that if you are doing it personally unless you are reporting tax as a business

Interest paid on personal loans is not tax-deductible. If you borrow to buy a car for personal use or to cover other personal expenses, the interest you pay on that loan does not reduce your tax liability.
...
Exceptions to the Rule
If you use a personal loan or credit card to finance business expenses in addition to personal expenditures, you may be able to claim the interest paid on those expenses on your taxes. You must be the person legally liable for the loan, and you must be able to itemize what portion of the interest paid is attributable to legitimate business expenses.


That is pretty close to what I'm thinking about.
It seems there are no elegant and simple solutions.

Thanks to everyone for contributing to this topic.
Magic Sarap
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May 17, 2018, 04:35:36 PM
 #26

Is it better to borrow cash using BTC as collateral, or just to sell BTC?
In terms of the taxes in the US.
Selling makes income, income have to be declared and paid taxes of it.
Borrowing means no income = no taxes.
Is it right?
Thanks for answering.
Borrowing bitcoin is surely dangerous

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