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Author Topic: [2BTC BOUNTY] New useless scammy blockchains  (Read 4763 times)
ElectricMucus
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August 21, 2011, 08:59:32 PM
 #21

If these extra blockchain creators only where to lurk some more.....  Roll Eyes

protip: namecoin is doing it right.

First they ignore you, then they laugh at you, then they keep laughing, then they start choking on their laughter, and then they go and catch their breath. Then they start laughing even more.
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dree12
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August 21, 2011, 09:46:44 PM
 #22

The scam gets less profitable after each cycle, as more and more people anticipate the pattern.
"Less profitable" does not mean people will stop. Look at the miners, for example.
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August 21, 2011, 10:12:08 PM
 #23

The scam gets less profitable after each cycle, as more and more people anticipate the pattern.
"Less profitable" does not mean people will stop. Look at the miners, for example.

How about not profitable at all then? Exactly what happened with namecoin when people started realizing they
could make more via bitcoin directly.
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August 21, 2011, 10:15:29 PM
 #24

Let me clarify that statement by saying I am not against libertarians at all, but I think Bitcoin could be useful to the world in more ways than just the absolute extreme "change the entire world" way, and be accepted in the world much quicker if it weren't always promoted by people claiming it is supposed to 'destroy banks', etc. As far as I'm concerned, I hope banks use Bitcoins themselves.

Bit of a straw man there, Mathew. Libertarians are not out to destroy banks. You know better than that.
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August 21, 2011, 10:21:17 PM
 #25

it is really getting to me all these kids that are so hurt over the new gambling currencies.

they are like damn babies about it.

It isnt like any of these currencies did shit to you, you arent forced to mine, you arent forced to buy, then STFU about it.

the whinning is getting grating.

I made 12 coins in 12 hours on a 5770 and FO if you think I shouldnt have the right to gamble and play.. what the hell are you a farken dictator?


This is the free market, if you dont want to put your BTC or hash rate to the alternative currencies than dont.

Do you have a problem as well with all the gambling apps and games and crap that come out each day?

are you playing any of them? no? THEN QUIT CRYING AND GO BACK TO DOING WHAT YOU WANT TO DO.

None of us are trying to pay people to screw with what you are doing.. you know you are soliciting someone to break the law? a double spend is stealing. SO not only are you a winey little brat, but you are also a sleezy scummy dude., Grow the hell up and mind your own damn business.


I dont mind people warning others that is is gambling, but this sleezy whiny douchebag stuff is getting on my nerves. WOrry about your own damn life, let me worry about mine.  How would you feel if I offered a bounty to steal from you?

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fcmatt
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August 21, 2011, 10:31:30 PM
 #26

it is really getting to me all these kids that are so hurt over the new gambling currencies.

they are like damn babies about it.

It isnt like any of these currencies did shit to you, you arent forced to mine, you arent forced to buy, then STFU about it.

the whinning is getting grating.

I made 12 coins in 12 hours on a 5770 and FO if you think I shouldnt have the right to gamble and play.. what the hell are you a farken dictator?


This is the free market, if you dont want to put your BTC or hash rate to the alternative currencies than dont.

Do you have a problem as well with all the gambling apps and games and crap that come out each day?

are you playing any of them? no? THEN QUIT CRYING AND GO BACK TO DOING WHAT YOU WANT TO DO.

None of us are trying to pay people to screw with what you are doing.. you know you are soliciting someone to break the law? a double spend is stealing. SO not only are you a winey little brat, but you are also a sleezy scummy dude., Grow the hell up and mind your own damn business.


I dont mind people warning others that is is gambling, but this sleezy whiny douchebag stuff is getting on my nerves. WOrry about your own damn life, let me worry about mine.  How would you feel if I offered a bounty to steal from you?

perhaps the forum mods should just delete all these new block chain threads and the creators will have to spam other places to
get their "experiment" going.

and honestly... when you tell others to quit crying about it.. is that not basically a pot calling the kettle black?
foggyb
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August 21, 2011, 10:42:45 PM
 #27

it is really getting to me all these kids that are so hurt over the new gambling currencies.

they are like damn babies about it.


They are babies. Lots of kids in this forum who just got weaned.
joulesbeef
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August 21, 2011, 10:52:43 PM
 #28

Quote
and honestly... when you tell others to quit crying about it.. is that not basically a pot calling the kettle black?


Not when someone is offering a crook money to steal from me. No it is not. That is exactly the WRONG way to prove a security hole.

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pointbiz
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August 22, 2011, 12:31:17 AM
 #29

We had ixcoin, now solidcoin: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=38453.msg0#new
Will this stop? Unlikely
How can we stop that?

I pledge 1BTC for a proved successful double-spend attack on solidcoin in the next 3 days
Anybody with me?

Jackjack, you're awesome!

I keep thinking is i0 or ix the joke?

In my opinion, the largest threat to bitcoin was/is an alt chain fork. Undefended by Satoshi's code or his choice of licence. I agree with the poster who said the more scammy chains the better; I realize this is the only method that will de-legitimize them.

ix and solid are also scams on the namecoin reputation. Namecoin is genuine innovation that serves a purpose and solves a problem. It's unique and does not compete with Bitcoin.

Anyone with genuine intentions towards Bitcoin would not create a fork that directly competes with bitcoins. These are folks who want to pull a greedy scam, I don't think they are currency speculators because why would they want to fuck with the value of BTC.

If Bitcoin is analogous to gold, it may one day require a sister silver. But today it's too early for that. I hope non of these alt chains that are analogous to commodity money survives.

Bitcoin ~= commodity money
Namecoin ~= BitDNS tokens

i0coin/ixcoin/solidcoin == shit coins

Like some people suggested I won't be pointing my BTC or rigs @ shit coins

The one nice thing about shit coins is they help to demonstrate the intrinsic value of Bitcoins.

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dree12
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August 22, 2011, 12:33:01 AM
 #30

The scam gets less profitable after each cycle, as more and more people anticipate the pattern.
"Less profitable" does not mean people will stop. Look at the miners, for example.
How about not profitable at all then? Exactly what happened with namecoin when people started realizing they
could make more via bitcoin directly.
Gambling is not profitable at all. People haven't stopped that, last time I checked.
joulesbeef
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August 22, 2011, 01:18:10 AM
 #31

if you offered a $1million  bounty to prove the bank of americans banking system was flawed.. what do you think would happen?
a bunch of people attacking their system, it doesnt matter whose money it is, and you might want to read up on your law, he is offering a bounty for the attack, he is not a security research following a code of ethics.


There very well could be legal ramifications for paying someone to destroy solid coin. But hey it isnt my ass

I screamed to high heaven that ixcoin was a scam, But I never tried to sabotage it.

Dont get me wrong, i like jackjack, he seems to be a decent enough guy, despite the heated discussion, but he is dead wrong on this. That is the absolutely wrong way to go about it. You cant publicly call for people to hack a system, if you have no part in that system.

mooo for rent
Jack of Diamonds
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August 22, 2011, 01:30:11 AM
 #32

if you offered a $1million  bounty to prove the bank of americans banking system was flawed.. what do you think would happen?
a bunch of people attacking their system, it doesnt matter whose money it is, and you might want to read up on your law, he is offering a bounty for the attack, he is not a security research following a code of ethics.


There very well could be legal ramifications for paying someone to destroy solid coin. But hey it isnt my ass

I screamed to high heaven that ixcoin was a scam, But I never tried to sabotage it.

Dont get me wrong, i like jackjack, he seems to be a decent enough guy, despite the heated discussion, but he is dead wrong on this. That is the absolutely wrong way to go about it. You cant publicly call for people to hack a system, if you have no part in that system.

Making a double spending attack on one of these whatshisname-coins is fully legal.
It can be done with coins only you own, for example. As long as you create the longest chain, your transactions become legitimate & you can reverse past transactions.

Anyone can feel free to try that on the bitcoin blockchain as well, if you have a couple million dollars lying around for hardware.
There are no legal ramifications because you are not destroying anything. The longest blockchain is only maintained by the consensus of other miners.

If you can create the longest blockchain then that one becomes legitimate & you get to decide it's history.
This is especially easy in the case of very low-difficulty blockchains like solidcoin.

A bigger miner like Vladimir or ArtForz alone could hijack the ixcoin/solidcoin blockchain within a few hours if they wanted to.

1f3gHNoBodYw1LLs3ndY0UanYB1tC0lnsBec4USeYoU9AREaCH34PBeGgAR67fx
joulesbeef
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moOo


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August 22, 2011, 02:39:07 AM
 #33

Quote
If you can create the longest blockchain then that one becomes legitimate & you get to decide it's history.

Not sure why you cant see that is destruction.. and he isnt doing security research he is inviting people to attack the chain. which will bring a few people attacking the chain.. it doesnt matter if it is your own money, it doesnt matter if you dont mess with anything else in the chain.. you control it;s history.. you broke the chain. it is no longer trustworthy. And sure people can do this, but it is different when you call on people to do this.

What ever, It is still the wrong way to approach the "scammy coins" and I may complain and call them scammy, but I would never hire a hacker to actively make people lose money, that is just antithesis to the bitcoin community.


The thing isnt bothering you, why hire a hitman?

mooo for rent
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August 22, 2011, 02:47:00 AM
 #34


Making a double spending attack on one of these whatshisname-coins is fully legal.
It can be done with coins only you own, for example. As long as you create the longest chain, your transactions become legitimate & you can reverse past transactions.

Anyone can feel free to try that on the bitcoin blockchain as well, if you have a couple million dollars lying around for hardware.
There are no legal ramifications because you are not destroying anything. The longest blockchain is only maintained by the consensus of other miners.

If you can create the longest blockchain then that one becomes legitimate & you get to decide it's history.
This is especially easy in the case of very low-difficulty blockchains like solidcoin.

A bigger miner like Vladimir or ArtForz alone could hijack the ixcoin/solidcoin blockchain within a few hours if they wanted to.

While from a technical perspective I'd like to see some double-spend attempts on an alternative chain - I don't see how you can argue it has no legal ramifications due to some implied consensus of other miners.
You may as well argue that some HTTP software 'agreed' to send you some private documents when you sent some perfectly valid HTTP requests that were crafted to take advantage.  
It's not what the protocols or systems allow - it's the intent.  

Deliberately invalidating other people's transactions that were made in good faith can't be defended on the basis that you had the technical capability to do it.

Now.. given that there is no specific company behind the chain.. so therefore no obvious terms & conditions.. it might make the case very 'interesting' and/or difficult to proceed with, but in theory any affected individual could argue that you had defrauded them.

If you could perform a double-spend against another of your own wallets, or with a party who agreed to it - then I guess that would be fine so long as you didn't invalidate any 3rd party transactions in the process.

EDIT: I guess you hinted at this with "you get to decide it's history. "     If you meant that in this history you ensured that all other legitimate transactions were maintained.. then I suppose this could be done without any 'damage'.. aside from proof that the system is vulnerable.


@electricwings   BM-GtyD5exuDJ2kvEbr41XchkC8x9hPxdFd
fcmatt
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August 22, 2011, 03:22:38 AM
 #35

Just throwing this out there....

Bitcoin and others are a p2p currency that is controlled/managed by the "network".

If the "network", a majority of it, consists of one or more people working together to manage it.. well that is how it
goes. No crime was committed when the program is working as expected. It was designed this way. The minority
may get their panties in a knot with the result but they signed on knowing, in many cases, that this could happen.

So what is the problem here? What crime is being committed? Sucks to be using an insecure scammy fly by night currency eh?

It seems you have to take the bad with the good. With bitcoin it is unlikely to happen. With scamcoins it has a higher
chance of happening and the "majority of the network" is always right. Right?
Maged
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August 22, 2011, 05:56:54 AM
 #36

perhaps the forum mods should just delete all these new block chain threads and the creators will have to spam other places to
get their "experiment" going.
I was in support of doing that, but we decided to just put them all in the trash binAlternate cryptocurrencies board instead. The justification (which I agree with) was that members of this forum might be interested in it. That said, no subforums for individual alternate cryptocurrencies will be created, because this is not supposed to be the primary community for these cryptocurrencies.

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August 22, 2011, 08:04:49 AM
 #37

I'll pay a 3000 sc bounty for someone to dox the op Smiley

Lets see which gets done first.

Edit: I'll match the op on btc if you can do a proven double spend also.
RandyFolds
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August 23, 2011, 11:31:32 PM
 #38

We had ixcoin, now solidcoin: https://bitcointalk.org/index.php?topic=38453.msg0#new
Will this stop? Unlikely
How can we stop that?

I pledge 1BTC for a proved successful double-spend attack on solidcoin in the next 3 days
Anybody with me?

No need to stop ! It is like it should be ! Maybe you still didnt see in how many ways SolidCoin is better than BitCoin Huh We need this to happen so better blockchain will be chosen by the most of the people regarding its positives and negatives...

And why you call SolidCoin useless when you can make payment 3 times faster than with BitCoin---with 1/3 of the security ? So you can go in some shop or pub or hypermarket and make payment for something you buy and it will pass for 18 minutes instead of 60 !

FTFY

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August 24, 2011, 02:08:13 AM
 #39

For educational purposes only: You cannot double spend someone else's coins. You can only change your mind and double spend your own coins if you have sufficient CPU power to build the longest chain.

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August 26, 2011, 02:51:48 PM
 #40

For educational purposes only: You cannot double spend someone else's coins. You can only change your mind and double spend your own coins if you have sufficient CPU power to build the longest chain.

Lawl

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