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Author Topic: Randomness from a chinese.  (Read 4677 times)
Kaliber1 (OP)
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December 30, 2013, 01:47:17 AM
Last edit: December 30, 2013, 09:02:07 AM by Kaliber1
 #1

Hi there,
somebody might already know me because of my first introduction in this forum one week ago.

I'm a chinese citizen and I feel strange to read all this news about China, India, Russia, Bulgaria, Slovenia from people that lives in other countries.
I think if people really needs to know something about a country should go there and check or at least talk with a chinese, indian, russian or whoever.

So, here I can tell you my point of view from my window in one of the biggest chinese cities (I wouldn't tell you which one but you can easily guess).

Chinese people has been described as crazy investors, crazy traders, everything crazy.
But the reality is that chinese people are really careful in investments and this means something that probably only a few people knows. The 75% of all the mining activity it's here.
What does that means? Everybody told us that chinese invest invest invest.

No, only a few people invest, and the majority of them it's already gone and actually BTC as itself really didn't care too much about it cos the price is now stable between 700-750.

So what actually happened when there was the biggest bubble in BTC? Chinese investor arrived?
No.

It's the overall people mentality that make that bubble. Like all the other bubble like if today I tell you that my compound friend is buying some scamcoin in particular. I know that for many people it's still hard to think that this market can be real, can be solid and can go far because it's not BTC it's the crypto-coins idea that is strong enough.

Only a few people looked at the BTC China datas(also because at this point of the story it's hard to see anything cos they hide all the details about their losses).

But I can tell you the ones I clearly remember and know.
One month ago BTC China was the biggest Exchange in the world with around 130.000 BTC nobody still seen today how many are the BTCs that they owns. ฿3,456.67 this is the number today.

So to whom still saying china this, china that this is the reality. China is out.
Now many people will come and say yes but you have other big exchange like fxbtc bla bla bla.

The ONLY real company is BTC CHINA. The CEO is litecoin's founder brother, it's a forward-thinking guy for sure.
All the other exchange are personal people that open a bank account and try to obey the law doing some little thing.


So to close this argument (I already know that will never be closed because people thinks that will gain money to invent some good lies about me and my country) the only thing you should care about us is that tons of people is mining BTC in particular. AVALON ASICs are best seller here and even parents of little child do the mining for fun.
This is the real problem, my country is a country that moves like sheep group so if one starts all the other will follow, and after they realise that trading it's dangerous everybody said mining is not. (Even if the investment today it's ridiculous because the difficulty two weeks ago was 900.000 and now is 1.100.000 ahah)


I hope that I made a clear enough description for whom it's really interested in. I also know that many people will say yes, it's ok but you don't have to say the reality cos this market is good just because people is ignorant. Yes.


EDIT: I removed the NXT opinion because everybody thinks that 3 lines in a topic is important to push people to buy some coins. Huh
empoweoqwj
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December 30, 2013, 02:04:55 AM
 #2

I've read your piece twice and I'm trying hard but .... I don't see the main point you are trying to make. Can you summarise a a bullet list?
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December 30, 2013, 02:11:45 AM
 #3

He's saying we created the China bubble, not investors in China itself, and the majority of the Chinese interest is in mining rather than investing.
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December 30, 2013, 02:12:10 AM
 #4

I've read your piece twice and I'm trying hard but .... I don't see the main point you are trying to make. Can you summarise a a bullet list?
Yeah, I can summarize the whole thing.  This guy thinks NXT is better than bitcoin and he thinks he knows what every single person in China is thinking.
Kaliber1 (OP)
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December 30, 2013, 02:14:41 AM
 #5

- Chinese are not buying and sell like crazy just mining like crazy and this is also why the difficulty rate is going crazy fast higher.
- BTC CHINA crash down one week and a half ago and BTC resists really well, no other shot will given to BTC stability
- Open minded chinese are moving on NXT
- BTC CHINA stopped any buy and selling activity, if you try by tickets it doesn't work so no way the website will be up until the government will solve it.
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December 30, 2013, 02:16:39 AM
 #6

To me this crypto is NXT, I have many reasons to say that but I will not talk about that here by the way I'm doing all I can to pile some open minded investors in this Crypto and I hope one day I will know the owner of it and say thanks to him to make my life easier with a real new crypto.

I hope that I made a clear enough description for whom it's really interested in. I also know that many people will say yes, it's ok but you don't have to say the reality cos this market is good just because people is ignorant. Yes.
Translation:  I am pushing NXT.  Please buy it.  I want this specific coin to go up so I can make a lot of money.

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December 30, 2013, 02:20:48 AM
 #7

Translation:  I am pushing NXT.  Please buy it.  I want this specific coin to go up so I can make a lot of money.

Surprised it took this many posts for someone to call this out.  Obvious NXT fluffer, IMO

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December 30, 2013, 02:25:42 AM
 #8

Kaliber1 I disagree with you, BTC China driven the bubble and everybody followed. I don't think anybody else in the world took the time to transfer money to BTCChina? If it's 10 or 10000 people I don't know.

I don't even want to start on NXT
Kaliber1 (OP)
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December 30, 2013, 02:26:26 AM
 #9

I've read your piece twice and I'm trying hard but .... I don't see the main point you are trying to make. Can you summarise a a bullet list?
Yeah, I can summarize the whole thing.  This guy thinks NXT is better than bitcoin and he thinks he knows what every single person in China is thinking.

This is my point of view, if you want I can give you telephone numbers of tons of people that will say the same, many people already quit every kind of business with BTC, believe me, if I say that is because I have proof and why I don't tell you the city I live in should be your reply.

NXT is another story
Kaliber1 (OP)
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December 30, 2013, 02:32:44 AM
 #10

Translation:  I am pushing NXT.  Please buy it.  I want this specific coin to go up so I can make a lot of money.

Surprised it took this many posts for someone to call this out.  Obvious NXT fluffer, IMO

Removed the NXT Part IMO
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December 30, 2013, 02:35:04 AM
 #11

I've done a tour around China a few months ago, it's a great country full of friendly people.

But sorry you are missing out on BTC, it's definitely going places with or without you. Have fun gambling with NXT




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Kaliber1 (OP)
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December 30, 2013, 02:49:29 AM
 #12

So finally my post was:

I WANT TO LET YOU BUY BUY BUY NXT
and
EVERY CHINESE DO THE SAME AS MEEEE!

This is why nobody of us talk and explain to anybody else. People thinks that we have some particular interests in talking.
To who says that chinese people it's really about BTC and continuing to buy (even without me )

this is BTC China https://vip.btcchina.com
And I am one of the most rated users as you can check. Btw I'm sorry about my opinion on NXT really If i knew that before I would never talk about it.
empoweoqwj
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December 30, 2013, 03:19:11 AM
 #13

How strange you won't even say what city you live in? But then you will give out lots of phone numbers of people? Sure they will thank you for that Wink

I'll leave this one alone, mark it down as "lost in translation"
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December 30, 2013, 03:38:53 AM
 #14

This is what I can gather:

- It was a bubble and people flocked to trading coins like sheep because their peers told them to.

- Now the bubble has well and truly burst. They are no longer interested in trading and instead have gotten into mining. Mining is again a waste of money in his opinion because of the insane difficulty. I think he's saying this bubble will burst too.

- BTCChina is the one and only exchange that mattered. Now it is dying and no longer a viable business in his opinion.

- He says the Chinese don't care about bitcoins and are only interested in it because of the get rich quick potential.

I've done a tour around China a few months ago, it's a great country full of friendly people.

But sorry you are missing out on BTC, it's definitely going places with or without you. Have fun gambling with NXT

They're not missing out on BTC! On the contrary the majority of the mining capacity is in their country and all of the mining hardware is made there.
qualia8
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December 30, 2013, 03:57:34 AM
 #15

Kaliber1 I disagree with you, BTC China driven the bubble and everybody followed. I don't think anybody else in the world took the time to transfer money to BTCChina? If it's 10 or 10000 people I don't know.


BTTChina was between $100 and $150 higher than Gox for much of the boom.  Yes, that was speculative inteterst, not miners selling.  Was it all foreigners?  Foreign investment was in BTC, not RMB, so how could they push the price up?  Only down.
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December 30, 2013, 04:10:44 AM
 #16

Kaliber1 I disagree with you, BTC China driven the bubble and everybody followed. I don't think anybody else in the world took the time to transfer money to BTCChina? If it's 10 or 10000 people I don't know.


BTTChina was between $100 and $150 higher than Gox for much of the boom.  Yes, that was speculative inteterst, not miners selling.  Was it all foreigners?  Foreign investment was in BTC, not RMB, so how could they push the price up?  Only down.

The Chinese op is trying to stick up for the Chinese people and saying not to blame them. But let's face it the Chinese definitely contributed to the bubble!



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December 30, 2013, 04:18:28 AM
 #17

Is anyone really surprised that a communist dictatorship won't tolerate bitcoin.

bitcoin doesn't need china.
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December 30, 2013, 04:54:00 AM
Last edit: December 30, 2013, 05:05:21 AM by FenixRD
 #18

...
Chinese people has been described as crazy investors, crazy traders, everything crazy.
But the reality is that chinese people are really careful in investments and this means something that probably only a few people knows. The 75% of all the mining activity it's here.
What does that means? Everybody told us that chinese invest invest invest.

No, only a few people invest, and the majority of them it's already gone and actually BTC as itself really didn't  China datas(also because at this point of the story it's hard to see anything cos they hide all the details about their losses).

...

The ONLY real company is BTC CHINA. The CEO is litecoin's founder brother, it's a forward-thinking guy for sure.
All the other exchange are personal people that open a bank account and try to obey the law doing some little thing.

...

EDIT: I removed the NXT opinion because everybody thinks that 3 lines in a topic is important to push people to buy some coins. Huh

1. Yes, just watching the data at BTCChina was enough to prove that Chinese are more cautious and less greedy. Also, since I translated the "bad news" out of China through an actual service, not google or reddit, I knew the market reaction wasn't initiated by the Chinese (this was ALSO evident from exchange data), because the news wasn't bad. It grew progressively more strict, but not much more than the US FinCEN's apparent position in March. Perhaps less so. At least China gave specific direction. FinCEN was vague, as if they were trying to leave ways for users to get screwed by them later, when they clarify their position.

Additionally, volatility analysis shows much more "signal" and far less "noise" in BTCChina trade patterns. This is evidence of Western greed and shortsightedness and emotional trades, while China (despite the "source" of bad news) traded logically. You don't need to be an applied math major to see this: just go to the 1hr chart or so, on bitcoinwisdom, and compare the 2 or 3 week periods starting before Thanksgiving. The candles are not anywhere near as thick in either direction of overall movement. Thus, the Chinese (despite great volume and zero fees at the time, which should have encouraged even less thought in trading), at least those investing in Bitcoin, are considerably wiser traders than their counterparts in the rest of the exchanges.

This depresses me, but then given our placement in math and science and other scholastic achievement measures, I can't say I'm surprised that overall, China is a better fit with Bitcoin, both in trading and in ability to understand it in the first place.

2. Yes. Any insight into OKCoin's impossible (??) trade volume? Or is it legit because of the ability to arbitrage using LTC? BTC-e is the top in volume (normalized to BTC) followed by OKCoin, so perhaps it is legitimate?

3. Don't worry, people are testy about alt-coins. I'm not sure about NXT, but the trio of BTC, LTC, and PPC are all in my mind probably pretty permanent in the sector. Competition is good, and not for a warm, fuzzy reason but genuinely because there is extensive math I could whip out (having spent days on it) that shows having at least two, preferably several (subject to the usual law of diminishing returns) solid, differentiated (scrypt / PoW+PoS hybrid / etc.) near-frictionless transparent-chain cryptos is necessary for the market to thrive. Contrary to belief, BTC is worth more, and safer, as a system because LTC exists. PPC, as the 3rd, not as influential but still. Garbage alt-coins (devcoin etc) do weaken the ecosystem somewhat, but not extensively.

Cheers, and keep mining and investing. Don't sweat what "people" think. The market thinks what the math says. Eventually the people will follow, whether they know why or not.

Uberlurker. Been here since the Finney transaction. Please consider this before replying; there is a good chance I've heard it before.

-Citizenfive
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December 30, 2013, 05:06:00 AM
 #19

...oh, and:

As for everyone who thinks its the Chinese investors' fault for not absorbing the crash that was initiated elsewhere... I'm not sure how to answer that. If all investors behaved with superrationality there'd have been no crash, just the true value declining based on added "friction" to the exchange equation. It sounds like you're saying everyone acted as can be expected as individual investors, but you believe the onus was on China to have evolved a hive-mind required for superrationality, and also had the benevolence to dampen the market blow from elsewhere by firmly holding. Religious, at best... I believe in Bitcoin's ultimate upward trajectory, and I even know the math and the game theory implications of superrationality and markets, but that doesn't change everyone else who doesn't. I'd be foolish and irrational to attempt to enforce superrationality by simply following it myself, while the value dropped. No, like any other sane being watching an insane market, I made the intelligent choice, pulled out, waited for my guess as to the bottom, and bought back in. The fact that many Chinese did this as well does not make it their fault any more than any other investor. It's only possible because, we are all still human and only rational at best.

Uberlurker. Been here since the Finney transaction. Please consider this before replying; there is a good chance I've heard it before.

-Citizenfive
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December 30, 2013, 05:24:18 AM
 #20

Stupid advertisement for BTCC & Nxt sh1t Grin
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