Will this cause France to get into Bitcoin - 75% Tax on Rich

[beetcoin]

Everybody here is saying that a 75% tax is a barrier to entrepreneurship and will make most rich people flee.

Did you know that the federal income tax rate in the US was 91% on income over $200,000 (approx. $2.5 million in today's dollars) between 1946 and 1962?
Did it cause a great exile of brains and innovators?

I'm French, there's a good chance I will make more than 1 million a year in a few years, but I still welcome this 75% tax. Millionaires build their fortune on the shoulder of many people who implement their ideas, and thanks to a functioning government and a safe environment, which is payed for by taxes.
Also it's not as bad as it seems. If you earn $1'000'001, only the $1 dollar above 1 million is taxed at 70%. Plus, it is in fact a 50% tax which when social security charges are added reaches 75%

yeah, people still need/want to make money.. even if tax rates are ludicrously high. historically speaking, its impact hasn't been as bad as most republicans/rich people say. still though, 75% is way too damn high. rich people shouldn't be footing that much of the bill. all i expect is something fair (ie less than 50% progressive tax).

[davedx]

Everybody here is saying that a 75% tax is a barrier to entrepreneurship and will make most rich people flee.

Did you know that the federal income tax rate in the US was 91% on income over $200,000 (approx. $2.5 million in today's dollars) between 1946 and 1962?
Did it cause a great exile of brains and innovators?

I'm French, there's a good chance I will make more than 1 million a year in a few years, but I still welcome this 75% tax. Millionaires build their fortune on the shoulder of many people who implement their ideas, and thanks to a functioning government and a safe environment, which is payed for by taxes.
Also it's not as bad as it seems. If you earn $1'000'001, only the $1 dollar above 1 million is taxed at 70%. Plus, it is in fact a 50% tax which when social security charges are added reaches 75%

Thanks for posting!

I find it so annoying that all the people foaming at the mouth about this tax are those who will never be affected by it. Armchair libertarians on this forum, by reading some of those posts.

I'm also a reasonably high earner here in the Netherlands, and I am very happy paying the high income tax here, because the government in general provides fantastic infrastructure and a safe, secure society. Sure there are problems here but in general I feel like my tax euros go to good use.

There are definitely taxes I do oppose here -- there's a nasty double taxation scheme on savings and assets worth more than 21k, where you pay a 30% tax on a nominal "assumed" appreciation of 4% -- so it's only 1.2%, but that's slapped on all of my savings above 21k euros, and on the value of my house every year if I own it. Now that is bullshit.

[skivrmt]

Everybody here is saying that a 75% tax is a barrier to entrepreneurship and will make most rich people flee.

Did you know that the federal income tax rate in the US was 91% on income over $200,000 (approx. $2.5 million in today's dollars) between 1946 and 1962?
Did it cause a great exile of brains and innovators?

I'm French, there's a good chance I will make more than 1 million a year in a few years, but I still welcome this 75% tax. Millionaires build their fortune on the shoulder of many people who implement their ideas, and thanks to a functioning government and a safe environment, which is payed for by taxes.
Also it's not as bad as it seems. If you earn $1'000'001, only the $1 dollar above 1 million is taxed at 75%. Plus, it is in fact a 50% tax which when social security charges are added reaches 75%

Yes, I did.  And do you know what happened?  All those politicians who voted for those progressive increases throughout the years eventually got voted out (took about 10-15 years) of office and the tax rates become lower and lower until the mid 90's and early 2000's.  The other thing to remember, inflation adjusted $200,000 in 1943 is ~$2.5MM in today's levels.  The amount of higher earners in the 40-50's was a lot lower than today for various reasons. 

More power to you if you want to stay and pay that much tax in France if and when you earn more than $1MM.  It's a relatively free world out there compared to most times in history.  We are free to stay in one country or move to another.

[Johnny Bitcoinseed]

The true tax rate is higher then 75%.  75% is the rate that working class folk pay. The pay council tax, income tax, vat,  inflation tax, and tax that indirectly make goods and services more expensive because of verious business taxes.

France is currently ruled by the Socialist party. There is a methodology adopted by the socialist parties all over the world to retain power. It is like this:

1. Tax to death the 10% hard working people and squeeze as much money as possible.

2. Give this tax money as benefits to the remaining 90%, lazy people.

3. After a few years, most of the hard working people will run away and the economy will collapse.

4. Now blame the economic collapse on Capitalist forces

5. Brainwash the remaining population (by this time will be living in ghettoes and slums), so that no other party will be elected to power other than the socialist party.

This has been successfully conducted in many of the world nations. Let's wait to see whether their experiment in France will be a successful one or not.

Spot on.

When the masses of people discover they can vote themselves other peoples money then the game is over - all you hear is a giant swirling rushing sound as the economy goes down the toilet.

Many of you here on this forum are mixing up banksters with hard working entrepreneurs (the people who start small and medium sized successful businesses that more often than not employ you, pay the majority of taxes, etc).

Kill the economic incentive and these people have no reason what-so-ever to take risks, work eighty hours a week, and innovate.  They will also have absolutely no reason to keep you employed.  But, of course, you can always become a parasite on the taxpayers as is the current method in favor by millions of people who choose not to work for a living.

[ixne]

France is currently ruled by the Socialist party. There is a methodology adopted by the socialist parties all over the world to retain power.

Tin foil hat time, eh.

It is like this:

1. Tax to death the 10% hard working people and squeeze as much money as possible.

2. Give this tax money as benefits to the remaining 90%, lazy people.

Let's just dispense right now with the notion that how much money you make is proportional to personal effort. That is an insult to school teachers, police, scientists - well, pretty much anyone who earns a wage for services.

That is not to say that capitalism isn't the best engine of economic growth available, just that it has little to do with fairness. The idea that everyone could be a fantastically wealthy hedge fund manager if they just worked hard enough is patently false, but that's the implication that is made when you equate wealth with hard work. Certainly it's easier to be wealthy if you work hard, but then again that applies to any goal in life.

That said, looks like this French law is temporary - 2 years. I suppose they figure that's short enough to prevent companies from relocating.

[Findus]

Kill the economic incentive and these people have no reason what-so-ever to take risks, work eighty hours a week, and innovate.

Sure, who would work eighty hours a week, and innovate for salaries less than 100k a year?
Except you know, all researchers.

Who would take risk for low salaries?
Except you know, all policemen.

[bryant.coleman]

Let's just dispense right now with the notion that how much money you make is proportional to personal effort. That is an insult to school teachers, police, scientists - well, pretty much anyone who earns a wage for services.

Let's not group the school teachers with police and scientists. The cops and the researchers work hard, so we can't blame them. The teachers on the other hand, have proliferated with the support from their unions. They work for less than 10 hours a week, and carry almost four times the salary which an average council worker (who works for 60 h / week) receives. And what do they do? They just brainwash the students with their political messages. No one is going to disagree if I claim that the quality of teaching has gone down the drain for the last few decades or so.

[luqash3]

mskryxz thanks for sharing the news about the cruelty of France government on civilians by enhancing the tax. Yes for sure I guess salary in bitcoins could protect the salaried person otherwise taxes will eat up all the hard earned money. Surely bitcoin could today safeguard the civilians not only of France but everywhere. 

[davedx]

Let's just dispense right now with the notion that how much money you make is proportional to personal effort. That is an insult to school teachers, police, scientists - well, pretty much anyone who earns a wage for services.

Let's not group the school teachers with police and scientists. The cops and the researchers work hard, so we can't blame them. The teachers on the other hand, have proliferated with the support from their unions. They work for less than 10 hours a week, and carry almost four times the salary which an average council worker (who works for 60 h / week) receives. And what do they do? They just brainwash the students with their political messages. No one is going to disagree if I claim that the quality of teaching has gone down the drain for the last few decades or so.

Source that teachers in France work 10 hours/week please?

[Johnny Bitcoinseed]

All I know, as a successful entrepreneur, is the more I work and give value to the world the more I am worth and the more money I make.

Indeed, the world is better off for my innovative efforts.

I am already taxed 40%.  Tax me 75% and I am outta here after laying off my employees and shutting down the business.

When thousands upon thousands of overtaxed people quit their businesses and services, you will see widespread unemployment and poverty like you wouldn't believe.

Not rocket science my friends.  Too many people are jealous that they too cannot come up with and launch ideas that other people value enough to pay good money for.  So the solution they lobby for is to tax those "rich" people because after all it is soooo unfair that someone can earn more than someone else.

PS - if school teachers and policemen want to earn more money all they have to do is start their own businesses if they think that is so easy LOL

Stop using government guns to force your idea of economic fairness onto others.  Isn't that what Bitcoin is all about?

[CompNsci]

France is shooting itself in the foot, may as well be shooting itself in the head.  When these key people in the economy decide to either leave France or just plain stop doing what they do the French economy will slide ever more quickly into the gutter.

They never learn, do they?

Sort of like in "Atlas Shrugged".

[cr1776]

All I know, as a successful entrepreneur, is the more I work and give value to the world the more I am worth and the more money I make.

Indeed, the world is better off for my innovative efforts.

I am already taxed 40%.  Tax me 75% and I am outta here after laying off my employees and shutting down the business.

When thousands upon thousands of overtaxed people quit their businesses and services, you will see widespread unemployment and poverty like you wouldn't believe.

Not rocket science my friends.  Too many people are jealous that they too cannot come up with and launch ideas that other people value enough to pay good money for.  So the solution they lobby for is to tax those "rich" people because after all it is soooo unfair that someone can earn more than someone else.

PS - if school teachers and policemen want to earn more money all they have to do is start their own businesses if they think that is so easy LOL

Stop using government guns to force your idea of economic fairness onto others.  Isn't that what Bitcoin is all about?

+1. It is not easy. If you don't put in tons of hours for years, you can forget about it..

The socialists always want to test how far they can push things with force.  If you can't do it in a free, voluntary manner, perhaps one will see eventually when it is done TO them..

[allthingsluxury]

A 75% tax rate will do much more harm than good. Sadly most politicians have a hard time grasping economics 101.

[beetcoin]

A 75% tax rate will do much more harm than good. Sadly most politicians have a hard time grasping economics 101.

history, as stated prior, does not support your claim. i don't know how it's going to end up in france, but high taxes historically have not hindered the economy.

[CompNsci]

history, as stated prior, does not support your claim. i don't know how it's going to end up in france, but high taxes historically have not hindered the economy.

It strikes me as rather difficult to prove such a claim or its contrary on a historical basis with any degree of certainty. There are a lot of other confounding factors.

[skivrmt]

France is shooting itself in the foot, may as well be shooting itself in the head.  When these key people in the economy decide to either leave France or just plain stop doing what they do the French economy will slide ever more quickly into the gutter.

They never learn, do they?

Sort of like in "Atlas Shrugged".

I was wondering how long it would take for someone to quote Atlas Shrugged or at least reference it. Many of the worlds countries are moving towards an Atlas Shrugged scenario. It still many be many years off, but I honestly think it's happening around the world, and to some extent in the US.

I wonder what Rand would say about something like Bitcoin? I personally feel she would love it that it crosses international boundaries and is away from government regulation.  Her modernized version of repaying everyone owed in gold

[Don007]

I think some of the might get into Bitcoin indeed, but even more will move out of France. By moving out of the country they won't help the economy anymore, so this decision has negative effects.

I think it's okay to tax the most rich people more than poor people (absolute, but also relative), but you shouldn't harm them. 75%... that's way too much. Being an entrepreneur in the Netherlands you have to pay 52% tax in the highest "tax stage" (if you earn more than €56,000.00 income per year).

[drgyoza]

Everybody here is saying that a 75% tax is a barrier to entrepreneurship and will make most rich people flee.

Did you know that the federal income tax rate in the US was 91% on income over $200,000 (approx. $2.5 million in today's dollars) between 1946 and 1962?
Did it cause a great exile of brains and innovators?

I'm French, there's a good chance I will make more than 1 million a year in a few years, but I still welcome this 75% tax. Millionaires build their fortune on the shoulder of many people who implement their ideas, and thanks to a functioning government and a safe environment, which is payed for by taxes.
Also it's not as bad as it seems. If you earn $1'000'001, only the $1 dollar above 1 million is taxed at 70%. Plus, it is in fact a 50% tax which when social security charges are added reaches 75%

Thanks for posting!

I find it so annoying that all the people foaming at the mouth about this tax are those who will never be affected by it. Armchair libertarians on this forum, by reading some of those posts.

I'm also a reasonably high earner here in the Netherlands, and I am very happy paying the high income tax here, because the government in general provides fantastic infrastructure and a safe, secure society. Sure there are problems here but in general I feel like my tax euros go to good use.

There are definitely taxes I do oppose here -- there's a nasty double taxation scheme on savings and assets worth more than 21k, where you pay a 30% tax on a nominal "assumed" appreciation of 4% -- so it's only 1.2%, but that's slapped on all of my savings above 21k euros, and on the value of my house every year if I own it. Now that is bullshit.

You didn't mentioned the fact that this tax will be applied ONLY FOR TWO YEARS. The French elite concerned by the tax represent a few people, who usually do not show appetite for innovations like bitcoin. I don't imagine them turning the 25% left into btc just to make sure. What could have a real impact on btc price is a 10% taxation on savings as advised by the IMF - France seems to be in sights but also other European countries.

[Lethn]

You know, I almost want the economy to collapse regardless of ridiculous tax hikes like this just so that people realise what the real problem is here, fucking crowd panderers.

I find it so annoying that all the people foaming at the mouth about this tax are those who will never be affected by it. Armchair libertarians on this forum, by reading some of those posts.

You're right! Because we all trade in Bitcoin we don't have to suffer them! HAH!

[gurcani]

PS - if school teachers and policemen want to earn more money all they have to do is start their own businesses if they think that is so easy LOL

and what would happen if all the police and the school teachers turned to businessmen/women? You as a businessmen would have no secuity and no skilled labor to run your business, no?