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Author Topic: Gold campaign moves to accept Bitcoin: "More than ever, we need an alternative c  (Read 1362 times)
bitrebel
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August 28, 2011, 10:10:38 PM
 #1

http://www.indybay.org/newsitems/2011/08/28/18688943.php

Great Article!

Gold's current price of almost $1900 will certainly mean more abuse, corruption, militarization and the erosion of indigenous rights around the world. This article describes the reasoning behind one gold mining campaign's reasoning for supporting bitcoin, an alternative currency.

With gold prices reaching a record high this month, ProtestBarrick – an all-volunteer campaign against the world's largest gold mining company – has decided to accept the new currency. Bitcoin is an electronic payment system that operates as a "decentralized digital currency", where information about every Bitcoin resides on every computer within the Bitcoin network. Much of Bitcoin's appeal is based in the fact that the number of Bitcoins produced in the world is limited by an open-source algorithm as opposed to the whims of a central government. Initially created in 2009, there are now over 6.5 million bitcoins in existence with a value of about $10 US each.

"We have seen currency insecurity lead to sky-rocketing gold prices, leading to the rapid destruction of indigenous and rural communities around the world,” stated Sakura Saunders, the co-founder and editor of ProtestBarrick.net. “Even in areas where human rights abuses are well-documented, gold mining is allowed to continue due to its huge profit margin. Now more than ever before, we need an alternative currency."

Since 2005, annual investment demand for gold has risen from 594.8 tonnes to a whopping 1,487 tonnes in 2010 – a 250% increase – according to the World Gold Council. This spike in demand has led to increased exploration, the exploitation of lower grade ore, and more coercive tactics being used against communities resisting this inherently destructive industry.

Just this summer, the body of Francisco Durán Ayala, an anti-mining activist in Cabañas, El Salvador was found with a single shot to the head. He is the fourth targeted assassination in the past two years in Cabañas after local activists were able to push Pacific Rim out of the area. Meanwhile, the Canadian gold miner is suing the state of El Salvador for hundreds of millions of dollars under the provisions of the Central America Free Trade Agreement (CAFTA), because El Salvador refused to grant mining extraction permits to the company.

The ProtestBarrick campaign is itself a strategy against the industry as a whole.

"We have over 750 articles about Barrick Gold, the world's largest and supposedly most 'socially responsible' gold mining company, doing bad things in over 10 different countries," explained Saunders. "The point is to show that this is not the case of a 'few bad apples', but that human rights abuses, corruption, and environmental devastation are in fact the status quo for gold mining all over the world."

Approximately 89% of gold annually is used for either jewelry or investment purposes. Meanwhile, basic human rights, such as the right to Free Prior and Informed Consent (FPIC), or the right for a community to say no to a mine, is not respected. Additionally, countries such as Canada, where the majority of mining companies are headquartered, have no laws to prevent their companies' human rights abuses abroad.

With almost 40% of gold supplied by recycled sources, the need for more gold mining has questionable social value, especially in light of the systemic issues related to the industry.

In turbulent economic times, gold's appeal to the investor centers on the fact that it's supply is limited and not subject to the political decisions of a country's leadership. Bitcoin presents the same appeal, while not causing abuses, rewarding corruption, promoting militarization and eroding indigenous rights around the world.
http://protestbarrick.net
§Gold has no social value
by Sakura Saunders Sunday Aug 28th, 2011 11:06 AM

Less than 11% of gold is used for anything other than jewelry or investment. Additionally, it is the most recycled metal on the planet. We could actually never mine the stuff again, but instead it is the most explored for mineral on the planet, bringing with it guaranteed environmental destruction. What's more, basic rights are not protected, such as Free Prior and Informed Consent, or the right to say no to mining "development" and most gold is mined on Indigenous lands (i.e. those with the least amount of political power within their nation-state.)
http://protestbarrick.net

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August 28, 2011, 11:00:56 PM
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I just called into Alex Jones and got on the air, AGAIN!

Got the mention of bitcoin in, just before the end of the show. I called to relate this exact article, and mentioned Indybay and Goldmining, and the toll on the environment. I then mentioned their advocacy of bitcoin before Alex cut me off and ended the show.

I believe this is now the 2nd mention of Bitcoins on the Alex Jones show.

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August 29, 2011, 12:15:37 AM
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very interesting slant on the gold debate.  i've been slugging it out over on the Economic forum with all the gold bugs. 
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August 29, 2011, 01:08:08 PM
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If gold is soaring up this much, why is Bitcoin (which is also a limited commodity and even easier to obtain/mine for normal people) then currently idling around?

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August 29, 2011, 01:14:34 PM
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Easy, risk. Bitcoin price can drop alot unexpectedly while gold not
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August 29, 2011, 01:23:10 PM
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I just called into Alex Jones and got on the air, AGAIN!

Got the mention of bitcoin in, just before the end of the show. I called to relate this exact article, and mentioned Indybay and Goldmining, and the toll on the environment. I then mentioned their advocacy of bitcoin before Alex cut me off and ended the show.

I believe this is now the 2nd mention of Bitcoins on the Alex Jones show.
That's interesting, how did he react? I'd imagine it would be quick before he'd come up with a reason to demonize us, like wikileaks or whatever. Bitcoin fits oh to well into the -no the nwo did it to transfer funds for drug trafficking, scheme-.

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August 29, 2011, 03:01:13 PM
 #7

If gold is soaring up this much, why is Bitcoin (which is also a limited commodity and even easier to obtain/mine for normal people) then currently idling around?

because it's not,  we're printing more bitcoins every 10 minutes than Zimbabwe... hence why we need a NEW $200,000 USD entering the bitcoin market to JUST keep the price stable every 4 weeks.

Gold doesn't have that rate of inflation,  in fact bitcoins have the largest rate of printing of all government backed currencies on the planet. 

If you want to keep the market value of bitcoins higher,  you're going to have to convince the bitcoin community to stop this at 8 million rather than 21 million OR get more than $200,000 dollars a month to enter to the market.

You'll have more luck with the latter. 





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August 29, 2011, 03:20:14 PM
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But we already know there will never be more than 21 millions of BTC
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August 29, 2011, 06:56:47 PM
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But we already know there will never be more than 21 millions of BTC

yep... we know that....  it's not the destination that concerns me.. it's how we're getting there that is...

Seriously to avoid huge drops like this in the future you need to pick one of two ways.

1 - slow down the rate of inflation (print less bitcoins)  this has a very low (if zero) chance of happening.

2 - get more than 200,000 dollars into the system every 2-4 weeks

The better choice of course is 2 ... but without any central PR or organization to put the positive word out and address legal concerns it's not going to happen..

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August 29, 2011, 07:08:04 PM
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2 - get more than 200,000 dollars into the system every 2-4 weeks

The better choice of course is 2 ... but without any central PR or organization to put the positive word out and address legal concerns it's not going to happen..

Give it some time, besides there is no way this gonna happen either. A centralized organization representing a decentralized network just doesn't fit well together. And besides that, a positive word has nothing to do with it, the legal issues are floating somewhere around and nobody can tell. Claiming to know whats gonna happen just for the sake of good will will not help either.

So what remains is seeing what comes and actually using the bitcoins you've got for something except hoarding. This is the main issue, the new bitcoins not moved has reduced dramatically and with good reason, new miners just don't make enough to spend it. So a falling price might actually a healthy development for bitcoin. People who hoped to get rich quick will quit, difficulty drop and the remaining miners would actually use them for something except selling them to speculators. 

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August 29, 2011, 07:28:56 PM
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But we already know there will never be more than 21 millions of BTC

yep... we know that....  it's not the destination that concerns me.. it's how we're getting there that is...

Seriously to avoid huge drops like this in the future you need to pick one of two ways.

1 - slow down the rate of inflation (print less bitcoins)  this has a very low (if zero) chance of happening.

2 - get more than 200,000 dollars into the system every 2-4 weeks

The better choice of course is 2 ... but without any central PR or organization to put the positive word out and address legal concerns it's not going to happen..

The inflation by new mined coins is constantly decreasing, because while we have a fixed supply rate we have an always greater total amount. A year ago there where less than 5 millions and a weekly supply rate of around 50000, resulting in 1% per week. These days we have more than 7 millions and still the same supply rate, so inflation is now down to 0.7% a week. So in effect inflation is ever decreasing.

And now look at this chart:
http://bitcoincharts.com/charts/mtgoxUSD#rg360zvzlztgMzm1g10zm2g25

And now tell me, can you see any effect of this inflation? No? Me neither Wink

Having said that, I welcome any positive bitcoin PR
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August 29, 2011, 07:52:06 PM
 #12

Gold and Bitcoin are, to me, a really good match and have some real potential to have a symbiotic relationship.  When I first got seriously interested in Bitcoin I was shocked and surprised at the level of animosity in the PM community toward Bitcoin.  And also their simple lack of interest.  I guess the former stems in part from a misguided suspicion of competition.

I see Bitcoin as a really good way to work around the difficulties associated with PM's being a physical.  I would like to eventually be able to have Gold disappear in one continent and pop up in another.  When I quit my day job it might be a system that I work on...being unimpressed with the current escrow frameworks.

I wish you luck and encouragement in your efforts here Bitrebel.  I suspect that the Alex Jones show is among the more fertile fields to till in sparking interest in Bitcoin.  I hope Max Keiser (and Stacy) will continue their work on the subject and some of the regulars on these types of shows will pick up on it.  Like that whats-his-name 'end is near' NY guy...um...Gerald Cilantro or whatever.

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August 29, 2011, 08:04:05 PM
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Thanks for posting; I enjoyed the article.

I've found that most pro-gold debaters use primarily anti-fiat and anti-inflation arguments. Bitcoin, while arguably fiat, solves many of these issues. The most useful argument I've found for gold bugs is that gold is an inefficient transaction medium in a globalized economy. If the USD and EUR die tomorrow, gold will skyrocket, but companies will struggle to do business. Bitcoin is their solution.

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August 29, 2011, 09:31:15 PM
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Thanks for posting; I enjoyed the article.

I've found that most pro-gold debaters use primarily anti-fiat and anti-inflation arguments. Bitcoin, while arguably fiat, solves many of these issues. The most useful argument I've found for gold bugs is that gold is an inefficient transaction medium in a globalized economy. If the USD and EUR die tomorrow, gold will skyrocket, but companies will struggle to do business. Bitcoin is their solution.

You make a very point, and it was this exact point I was going to bring up, if I had enough time. Next time!

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