Coinbase: a bad experience :(

[Birdman01234]

Hey everyone,

I've been into bitcoin since the end of last summer and have followed this forum closely since. Most of you combine your bitcoin knowledge with your everyday business/finance knowledge and common sense and have pretty good insights into things. Being relatively knew to bitcoin I didn't see a point in trying to give helpful answers when I probably knew the least so I've stayed quiet and followed along and, fortunately, got a ton of free education along the way (thanks guys!).

That said, I'm looking for some advice on a serious issue. I've been using coinbase for all my bitcoin purchases since I started buying at the end of August. I have to say, I've made several successful purchases with them without problem. On December 13, I purchased 10 bitcoin. The money was withdrawn from my bank account later that day. I got a confirmation email on 12/18 stating "the 10 BTC you purchased are now in your account." They were not. I emailed them several times about this. Finally, on 12/23 I got the following email:

DEC 23, 2013  |  01:34PM PST
Alex replied:

Hi there,

Thanks for contacting us on this. I can see that for some reason the 10.00 BTC from one of those transactions (********) never made it into your account. I am going to go ahead and escalate this case so we can get this situation taken care of as quickly as possible. I sincerely apologize for any inconvenience this may have caused.



I have not heard from them since despite several more emails - all I was asking for was an update and still no response. Does anyone have any advice on where to go from here? It seems crazy to me that they have had my money for almost 4 weeks, know they haven't not delievered the BTC, and seem to be in no hurry distribute my BTC. Obviously it is a lot of money. Does anyone have any suggestions on where to go from here? I could continue to email them like crazy but i'm not sure that would help. What do you guys/girls think i should do?

I am surprised a promising company that is just starting out would be that OK with such flagarantly poor customer service. Hopefully poor customer service is all it is...

Thank you in advance for your help!

[coinrevo]

I believe coinbase is not good for bitcoin, for several reasons. Basically you pay a lot of fees, and what they do is not good for the ecosystem. They have 700,000 accounts and just a couple of people working there, so such an experience is not unexpected for me at least. What really annoys me is that they get support from the dev team.
Why are you not going to the exchanges?

[TheQuote]

I know for sure next time he will.. But your not helping him

Maby you can try contact them on twitter and facebook?

[Birdman01234]

I believe coinbase is not good for bitcoin, for several reasons. Basically you pay a lot of fees, and what they do is not good for the ecosystem. They have 700,000 accounts and just a couple of people working there, so such an experience is not unexpected for me at least. What really annoys me is that they get support from the dev team.
Why are you not going to the exchanges?

A very bright and trusted friend who first got in to bitcoin in 2009 recommended coinbase, simple as that.

[chaoticbrain]

I've heard a number of horror stories around coinbase, we should probably spread the word more that coinbase is not to be used.

[amp]

I have a hard time thinking this is the norm. They have probably sold bitcoin to at lest 250,000 people in the last few months. Seems like anyone with a large transaction has had a higher chance of a issue.

[Seals881]

I tried Coinbase for fun a few weeks ago, and once they informed me it would take two weeks to process the transaction I got a bad feeling. I stopped the payment, and used Localbitcoin. It was simple, and got my coins in a few mins. My opinion is that they use customers funds as a way to fund their trading. As BTC is so volatile they can make a few trades with your money, and than send you your BTC.

When I sent in a support ticket to stop the transaction they replied a few days later with a off topic reply. Fast forward a week later they emailed me saying the bank refused to pay them and they can't process the transaction.

You may need to find outside help to deal with this, and keep on trying to contact their support. Also try mailing a certified letter to them. Keep all documents to support that you've contacted them.

Good luck

[FenixRD]

I had an issue with about 80 plus another 60 or so BTC over the holiday too (not like your issue). Still mostly unresolved. I got a quick email but then nothing. For the moment I am forced to assume it is poor planning and woefully inadequate customer support over the holiday period. However, I wasn't a fan of the "victim of our own success" when Gox used it, and I don't like seeing the same thing out of Coinbase. Sadly, the market cannot yet punish their behavior, so here we are. I perform Coinbase-like services among many things for my clients, but I am not a SaaS platform, and I only do medium to large transactions unless for an established client. I have thought many times of developing my system into something more proper and autonomous. Maybe it they don't get their shit together...

In the meantime, being visible and obnoxious on r/Coinbase seems to get responses, at least at first, Then move on to r/Bitcoin if that doesn't help. FWIW, I tried both those things and they're still silent. I don't know if that is because I threatened to visit Steve Stockman (who is a tennis buddy) and shut them down before litigating them into oblivion, or if that is their practice with everyone. I let the amounts involved make me see red, since I had been predicting a surge on the 2nd, and again the 6th, and those coins were bought between $650 and $725, and there are only a few times where the perfect storm of multiple non-banking holidays and weekends stack up together with good news like this, to make such a clear case for a spike and then correction. Without question, CB cost my business between $25,000 and $35,000 through their incompetence and poor business practices.

So, I was pretty irritated. You may catch more flies with honey. Good luck and keep us posted. There I guess is always the possibility that they've made some poor choices and are floundering financially. $25M in funding sounds like a lot, but I've run the numbers to see if I could make a competing service. It is not that much when you have the size of their customer base and their business model. If somebody screwed the pooch just two or three times, they could be in trouble.

I hope they just sort it out. We let these companies get away with murder, because the community is so libertarian that we all feel subconsciously that it is an admission of a flaw to seek corrective action via state channels. Also, if time is money, I have no intention of giving them massive amounts more of both.

[bitgod2]

I did not know that Coinbase was this bad. I opened an account a couple of weeks ago and purchased BTC with them which they took almost a week to deposit into my account. I guess I need to move away from them if they are treating their customers like this.

[CrashX]

Im worry now, I have 5 BTC with them and my others spread around.

I just contacted them and gave them this link, and ask them to verified time that I will get  my cash if I sold my BTC.

[FenixRD]

Im worry now, I have 5 BTC with them and my others spread around.

I just contacted them and gave them this link, and ask them to verified time that I will get  my cash if I sold my BTC.

I did not know that Coinbase was this bad. I opened an account a couple of weeks ago and purchased BTC with them which they took almost a week to deposit into my account. I guess I need to move away from them if they are treating their customers like this.

I would be advocate being cautiously concerned, for now. I have also traded many times with them, without issue. Their "fraud" algorithm is the biggest controversy. My background is applied mathematics more than anything else. I am almost 100% sure that their algorithm would not stand up to scrutiny, because they aren't actually exposed to hardly any risk, with ACH. This is by their own admission somewhere on Reddit, too, that they have no plans to absorb any fraud, and have no legal liability to do so, outside of actual hacked servers or something. So when a user account gets accessed incorrectly, due to user mismanagement of 2FA or whatever, that sucks, and yes, I'm sure their fraud algo looks for that too, but that's not its primary function, from all analysis I've been able to do. It seems that it looks for cases when they can profit extra by flagging a transaction that went in a particular direction of the market. I think they only do it when it is a "higher risk" appearing transaction, by whatever pattern of use they see as normal... but they don't flag all the time. The algorithm and the fraud bit is just a bit of what you might call "parallel reconstruction" to try and make a somewhat plausible supporting case for why they cancelled it.

Just my opinion. Can't be proven unless they ever do get subpoenaed and forced to have it analyzed. I figure competitors will arise, and they will also have gained sufficient liquidity, that they can tone it back. It's already less severe than it had been. I think the holiday period just swamped them again. Which is still dishonest; they should just put up the "sorry, out of BTC" sign (though some media did blast them for that, so you can't win I guess). Or use a bigger bid-ask spread. I already think the fee is kind of silly, because it just masks what is effectively a larger bid-ask spread already, because they aren't an actual trade-matching exchange.

My 2 uBTC.

[CrashX]

Blake replied:

Hi *******,

Thanks for contacting us on this. Sell/Buy transactions can take 1-4 days depending on the method used, and your personal banking account. Your coin is completely safe and accessible by you on your Coinbase account.

Thank you for using Coinbase!

This is the reply I received.

[FenixRD]

Blake replied:

Hi *******,

Thanks for contacting us on this. Sell/Buy transactions can take 1-4 days depending on the method used, and your personal banking account. Your coin is completely safe and accessible by you on your Coinbase account.

Thank you for using Coinbase!

This is the reply I received.

I have never seen an issue, and if there have been they are not widespread, regarding sales of BTC. The problem is when the market is clearly on the rise, and everyone flocks to buy, they've trended toward never using the "we are out of BTC" flag, and instead take your money and hold it, and promise BTC a week later. This would be okay, in the sense that they told me and I agreed with it -- that's how the market should work! -- but when they pseudorandomly decide not to deliver at the last second, that can really mess up your day.

[aso118]

I bought coins through Coinbase w/o Dec 13th as well.  The money was withdrawn from my checking and I also received the notification.  When I looked the coins weren't there...  I reported it and they credited my account.

It sounds like your transaction might have been effected by the same 'glitch' that my transaction encurred.  Hopefully you will receive your coins soon!

[CrashX]

Blake replied:

Hi *******,

Thanks for contacting us on this. Sell/Buy transactions can take 1-4 days depending on the method used, and your personal banking account. Your coin is completely safe and accessible by you on your Coinbase account.

Thank you for using Coinbase!

This is the reply I received.

I have never seen an issue, and if there have been they are not widespread, regarding sales of BTC. The problem is when the market is clearly on the rise, and everyone flocks to buy, they've trended toward never using the "we are out of BTC" flag, and instead take your money and hold it, and promise BTC a week later. This would be okay, in the sense that they told me and I agreed with it -- that's how the market should work! -- but when they pseudorandomly decide not to deliver at the last second, that can really mess up your day.

I'm going to sell 1 BTC and I will also Buy 1 BTC - I'll will let you know how long it takes to received the money or the BTC.

[camolist]

I'm going to sell 1 BTC and I will also Buy 1 BTC - I'll will let you know how long it takes to received the money or the BTC.

make sure you have the dollars to support the 1btc

they will likely withdraw money for your purchase a day before the money from the sale shows up

i think a lot of their complaints are from people trying to daytrade like this and not having the dollars to back it up assuming their deposit from selling will make it in time

had a depost for a sale of 22btc monday show up today. had i bought 22btc monday i would have expected the withdraw  to have hit my bank either tuesday or wednesday

[CrashX]

I'm going to sell 1 BTC and I will also Buy 1 BTC - I'll will let you know how long it takes to received the money or the BTC.

make sure you have the dollars to support the 1btc

they will likely withdraw money for your purchase a day before the money from the sale shows up

i think a lot of their complaints are from people trying to daytrade like this and not having the dollars to back it up assuming their deposit from selling will make it in time

had a depost for a sale of 22btc monday show up today. had i bought 22btc monday i would have expected the withdraw  to have hit my bank either tuesday or wednesday

I wouldn't use Coinbase to trade, I my self use BTC-e  to trading, I just want to use Coinbase as the withdrawal  point  and when its low to Buy afew extra BTC's.

You received 19k to your Bank Account 3 Biz days later?

[CrashX]

Never mind,  I now think that Coinbase is legit.

Being that Overstock.com will use them as their exchange.   So if its good for Overstock is good for me.

http://www.wired.com/business/2014/01/overstock-bitcoin-live/

[FenixRD]

Never mind,  I now think that Coinbase is legit.

Being that Overstock.com will use them as their exchange.   So if its good for Overstock is good for me.

http://www.wired.com/business/2014/01/overstock-bitcoin-live/

They are legit, they've just been... Swamped, and are trying very hard to mask how swamped they are, and a fee people have gotten screwed in the process.

This is separate from people day trading on Coinbase and getting coins cancelled for NSF. My bank once held a check for 10 days and I tried to buy, only to get cancelled. I know he's  that looks like, too.

Anyway I always have believed this will pass, and CB is the most legit of the exchange-ish things to come out yet, but they still were a little shady during the holiday period. So, until this is unheard of, I wouldn't bet my life on coins not being cancelled. It's rare, and overall CB is great, but *IF* they are cancelled and then you're out the $ too for 4 business days... IF that would ruin you financially, you night think twice. For other things you're fine.

CB isn't directly stealing anything. They have indirectly cost a bit of money however.

[CrashX]

Also their fee is kind of high.

I just sold some BTC, they charge me $110 + 0.15.