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Author Topic: Cuckoo Cycle: a new memory-hard proof-of-work system  (Read 10833 times)
neuroMode
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April 03, 2014, 07:56:32 AM
 #41

Us boys over at MyriadCoin will keep an eye on this algorithm Wink

Myriadcoin - the first multi-PoW blockchain! (Mine with SHA256 [ASICs], Scrypt [GPU/ASICs], Skein [GPUs], Groestl [GPUs], OR Qubit [CPUs/GPUs]).
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tromp (OP)
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April 07, 2014, 03:19:14 AM
 #42

At John's request, I've taken a look at this and scribbled up my initial comments.
They might be wrong!  Please take them in the spirit of continuing the discussion, not as the final word.
http://da-data.blogspot.com/2014/03/a-public-review-of-cuckoo-cycle.html
I'll post an addendum to the blog post (and here) with anything that's shown to be wrong.

Dave has shown my algorithm is not as tmto-hard as I thought it was.
Excellent work, Dave!

For now, I amended my README at https://github.com/tromp/cuckoo with the following

UPDATE: Dave Anderson proposed an alternative algorithm on his blog

http://da-data.blogspot.com/2014/03/a-public-review-of-cuckoo-cycle.html

that uses significantly less memory than mine at potentially less than an order of magnitude slowdown. I hope to soon implement his algorithm and quantify the "tomato" (his pronouncable spelling of tmto, or time-memory trade-off).

Baseline:  My code uses 10x less memory and runs 2x slower (on a laptop instead of an i7).  At 6x less memory, it should have speed parity.  Could be optimized substantially - I sent you some very hacked up code.  Happy to post it publicly if anyone's interested, but it's trashy - I just wrote it as a proof of concept for the pre-filtering before invoking the cycle finder.  But it gets the point across.

A complete working implementation of Dave's scheme is now available on my github.
Makefile targets cuckooNN still use the old memory hungry algorithm,
while targets tomatoNN use his edge trimming (12 rounds by default).
I haven't figured out how to achieve speed parity:-(

Suggestions for further improvement are more than welcome!

-John
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April 07, 2014, 04:20:28 PM
 #43

I haven't figured out how to achieve speed parity:-(

Suggestions for further improvement are more than welcome!

Next on the to-do list is another of Dave's suggestions:
to bucketize the array of nodes to work on, to improve
main-memory locality. That will help the edge trimming,
which works on only one edge endpoint at a time,
but won't help the original algorithm, which needs to work
on both edge endpoints at the same time.
So that may well achieve speed-parity...
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April 08, 2014, 03:21:30 PM
 #44

I haven't figured out how to achieve speed parity:-(

Suggestions for further improvement are more than welcome!

Next on the to-do list is another of Dave's suggestions:
to bucketize the array of nodes to work on, to improve
main-memory locality. That will help the edge trimming,
which works on only one edge endpoint at a time,
but won't help the original algorithm, which needs to work
on both edge endpoints at the same time.
So that may well achieve speed-parity...

And so it did! Reducing the number of page faults is a big gain.

Edge-trimming is 33% faster single-threaded, but multi-threading
speedups are very erratic, e.g. 7-11 threads are all worse than
6 threads, 12 is much faster but then slow down through
19 threads, and finally gain more than double at 20 threads.

The new code is up at https://github.com/tromp/cuckoo,
as Makefile targets cuckooNN (for various value of NN).
The old code is now only useful for small instances and
relative easiness > 50% (at which edge trimming fails).
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April 08, 2014, 06:06:48 PM
 #45

The new code is up at https://github.com/tromp/cuckoo,
as Makefile targets cuckooNN (for various value of NN).
The old code is now only useful for small instances and
relative easiness > 50% (at which edge trimming fails).

Apparently this is due to the use of C++ atomic datatypes.
Experiments using plain non-atomic datatypes instead,
show negligable differences, so that is now the default.

Current performance is listed in the README as

 6) running time on high end x86 is 9min/GB single-threaded, and 1min/GB for 20 threads.

The big open question is still how well a GPU can perform Cuckoo Cycle.

Most main memory accesses in (the current algorithm for) Cuckoo Cycle
are to different 64-byte segments (GPU cache line size), making latency
of prime importance. And that's where GPUs fare worse than CPUs...

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April 11, 2014, 03:31:07 PM
 #46

Next on the to-do list is another of Dave's suggestions:
to bucketize the array of nodes to work on, to improve
main-memory locality. That will help the edge trimming,
which works on only one edge endpoint at a time,
but won't help the original algorithm, which needs to work
on both edge endpoints at the same time.
So that may well achieve speed-parity...

And so it did! Reducing the number of page faults is a big gain.

Actually, the bucketing doesn't affect page faults.
Profiling shows that the large speedup is due to big reductions in
stalled-cycles-frontend and stalled-cycles-backend. Somehow
alternating siphash computations with main memory accesses causes
lots of stalls, while doing a bunch of hashes followed by a bunch of
main memory accesses is much better.
Damn; performance optimization is hard...
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April 13, 2014, 09:19:27 PM
 #47

Next on the to-do list is another of Dave's suggestions:
to bucketize the array of nodes to work on, to improve
main-memory locality. That will help the edge trimming,
which works on only one edge endpoint at a time,
but won't help the original algorithm, which needs to work
on both edge endpoints at the same time.
So that may well achieve speed-parity...

And so it did! Reducing the number of page faults is a big gain.

Actually, the bucketing doesn't affect page faults.
Profiling shows that the large speedup is due to big reductions in
stalled-cycles-frontend and stalled-cycles-backend. Somehow
alternating siphash computations with main memory accesses causes
lots of stalls, while doing a bunch of hashes followed by a bunch of
main memory accesses is much better.
Damn; performance optimization is hard...

Bucketing at the size you're doing isn't about page faults, it's more about cache misses.  A cache miss causes a stalled cycle.

Also, you don't mean page faults:  You mean TLB misses.  Page faults are huge and rare.  A TLB miss, at various levels of the hierarchy, is common.

You can eliminate the TLB misses as a factor by allocating your data structures in hugepages.  see, for example,

http://lxr.free-electrons.com/source/tools/testing/selftests/vm/map_hugetlb.c


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April 13, 2014, 10:24:29 PM
 #48

Bucketing at the size you're doing isn't about page faults, it's more about cache misses.  A cache miss causes a stalled cycle.

Also, you don't mean page faults:  You mean TLB misses.  Page faults are huge and rare.  A TLB miss, at various levels of the hierarchy, is common.

You're right about the TLBs. Bucketing reduces TLB load misses from 2.8 billion to 0.56 billion
(even while increasing TLB store misses from 1.7 million to 467 million).

My stalled cycles do not appear due to cache misses though.
The bucketed version has slightly more cache misses; 3.51 billion versus 3.14 billion.

Maybe the stalled cycles are also due to the TLB misses?!
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April 30, 2014, 10:11:40 PM
 #49

So while your statement is true, it's not necessarily the right truth.  Is Cuckoo Cycle better or worse than adaptive scrypt-N?  Is it better than a variant of Invictus's Momentum PoW that has an adaptive N factor?

Neither of us knows the answer to this question.  There is a chance that it's stronger.  But there's also a very real chance that the requirement to find a cycle, instead of a simple collision, will mean that the approach can yield to something with sublinear memory requirements and, in fact, underperform compared to Momentum in its memory requirements.

It cannot "underperform compared to Momentum in its memory requirements"
because Cuckoo Cycle generalizes Momentum.

Momentum looks for collisions of a hash function mapping 2^{26} nonces to 50-bit outputs.
Each nonce corresponds to an edge in a bi-partite graph on nodes M union L, where
M is all possible 25-most-significant bits of hash output, and
L is all possible 25-least-significant bits of hash output,
and so each collision is a 2-cycle in this graph.

Thus, it is more likely that Momentum, being a special case of Cuckoo Cycle,
underperforms in its memory requirements.
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May 24, 2014, 08:16:45 PM
 #50

any coins using this algo atm?

"Buy, sell, trade, chat. Leave nothing but a Shadow." - www.shadow.cash
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May 24, 2014, 09:49:08 PM
 #51

any coins using this algo atm?

Nope...
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June 23, 2014, 10:24:29 PM
 #52

tromp - after our discussion on k-SUM, I went back and tried to categorize why I was uncomfortable with Cuckoo Cycle in its present state right now.  Basically it comes down to:

- It seems like the selection of 42 for the cycle length was based on experimentation, but there doesn't seem to be a hard proof for this (dga mentions this).  I was originally looking at kSUM because the difficulty of kSUM is well known.  In the case of cycle finding, I'm not sure if the difficulty is proven.

- One way of proving this might be to instead establish the probability of a cycle of length k occurring in a randomly generated graph, and then tweaking parameters so the expectation is only 1 cycle is found.

- Separately might it make sense to look deeper at k-cliques? Their probability seems to be much better understood, and might provide a more provably secure basis.

Quick starting point:

Assume G(n,p) - Erdős–Rényi graph
let pK = Probability k nodes are a clique p^(k choose 2)
let pNK = Probability no k-clique exists (1-pK)^(n choose k)
Probability at least 1 k-clique exists = 1-pNK

Thoughts?
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June 24, 2014, 06:45:23 PM
 #53

tromp - after our discussion on k-SUM, I went back and tried to categorize why I was uncomfortable with Cuckoo Cycle in its present state right now.  Basically it comes down to:

- It seems like the selection of 42 for the cycle length was based on experimentation

You can find the motivation for choice of cycle length in the whitepaper; I devoted a section to it.

but there doesn't seem to be a hard proof

Proofs are for theorems, not for parameter choices.

 I was originally looking at kSUM because the difficulty of kSUM is well known.  In the case of cycle finding, I'm not sure if the difficulty is proven.
There is more literature on cycle detection in graphs than on k-SUM, and very little
on k-SUM in cyclic groups as you consider.

- One way of proving this might be to instead establish the probability of a cycle of length k occurring in a randomly generated graph, and then tweaking parameters so the expectation is only 1 cycle is found.

My whitepaper has sufficient data on probability of cycles occurring. You don't need
expectation equal to 1. Any non-negligable constant less than 1 works just as well.
[/quote]

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June 24, 2014, 07:43:15 PM
 #54

Quote
You can find the motivation for choice of cycle length in the whitepaper; I devoted a section to it.
While the Cuckoo Cycle paper does devote a section to this, the section lacks any hard guarantees on whether the parameter choices are correct or optimal.  The graphs in the paper were derived from what seem like experimentation, but the problem with such an approach is it leaves open the possibility that more efficient and effective attacks exist.

There needs to be provable formulae establishing the relationships between parameter choices, the likelihood of cycles, and in turn the theoretical bounds that any attacking implementation could have.  Without this, it leaves open the possibility of novel attacks that may not have been identified yet, which is no basis for a currency.

Quote
There is more literature on cycle detection in graphs than on k-SUM, and very little
on k-SUM in cyclic groups as you consider.

I'm not advocating k-SUM as I think we've established it is a dead-end.  That said, while there is much literature on cycle detection in graphs, I haven't found much in terms of proofs that concretely establish the probability of n-length such cycles existing in a G(n,p) graph.  Would certainly appreciate information here if you are familiar with work in this area, and I think it would go a long way towards strengthening the fundamentals of Cuckoo Cycle as proposed.
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June 25, 2014, 08:06:19 AM
 #55

Quote
You can find the motivation for choice of cycle length in the whitepaper; I devoted a section to it.
While the Cuckoo Cycle paper does devote a section to this, the section lacks any hard guarantees on whether the parameter choices are correct or optimal.
Remind me again, which other Proof-of-Works have guarantees of parameter optimality,
and where to find proof of these?
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June 25, 2014, 01:57:59 PM
Last edit: June 25, 2014, 03:54:23 PM by optimiz3
 #56

Momentum is trivial to prove for any parameter selection because it is based on a well known problem.

Cuckoo Cycle is based on a novel graph-theoretic approach which may or may not have vulnerabilities, but without a proof of difficulty for a particular set of parameters, there is no way to asses the vulnerability to future attacks.

Optimality comes through applying engineering requirements to a defined set of provable algorithm characteristics.  We don't have that (yet) for Cuckoo Cycle.

EDIT #2: Grammar, also some searching turned up this recent (2009) paper "Deviation inequality for the number of k-cycles in a random graph" by Wang and Gao.  Perhaps it may be of use?
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June 25, 2014, 10:13:52 PM
 #57

Momentum is trivial to prove for any parameter selection because it is based on a well known problem.
Cuckoo Cycle is based on a novel graph-theoretic approach which may or may not have vulnerabilities, but without a proof of difficulty for a particular set of parameters, there is no way to asses the vulnerability to future attacks.

I'm afraid you're not making much sense.

If we're going to continue this discussion you should first define your terminology.
What mathematical statement about Momentum is trivial to proof?
What constitutes a vulnerability of a proof-of-work?
What is a proof of difficulty?

And how do you rhyme the above with my Apr 30 observation that Momentum is a special case of
Cuckoo Cycle where cycle length equals 2, a choice which leads it to be particularly memory-easy?
[/quote]
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June 26, 2014, 12:26:18 AM
 #58

What doesn't make sense?

Quote
What mathematical statement about Momentum is trivial to proof?

It is an instance of the birthday problem, where complexity is understood.

Quote
What constitutes a vulnerability of a proof-of-work?

The possibility implementations exist that exploit unaccounted for (lower and amortized) bounds in memory and/or execution time.

Quote
What is a proof of difficulty?

A proof the amortized limits of memory and execution time cannot be less than the proposed implementation for a PoW.

Quote
And how do you rhyme the above with my Apr 30 observation that Momentum is a special case of
Cuckoo Cycle where cycle length equals 2, a choice which leads it to be particularly memory-easy?

Cycle lengths of 2 and 3 are special cases because they can be restated in terms of the birthday problem and 3-cliques respectively.  They do not generalize to k-cycle (nor 42-cycle), which is the concern.
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June 26, 2014, 08:15:14 AM
 #59


Quote
What mathematical statement about Momentum is trivial to proof?
It is an instance of the birthday problem, where complexity is understood.

I don't think this is understood.

Quote
Quote
What constitutes a vulnerability of a proof-of-work?
The possibility implementations exist that exploit unaccounted for (lower and amortized) bounds in memory and/or execution time.

Quote
What is a proof of difficulty?
A proof the amortized limits of memory and execution time cannot be less than the proposed implementation for a PoW.

What is the minimum memory usage for a Momentum implementation?
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June 26, 2014, 02:07:47 PM
 #60

Quote
Quote from: optimiz3 on Today at 12:26:18 AM

Quote
What mathematical statement about Momentum is trivial to proof?
It is an instance of the birthday problem, where complexity is understood.

I don't think this is understood.

Why don't you think the complexity of Momentum understood/proven?

From your Cuckoo Cycle paper:

Quote
"For example, for L = 2 the problem reduces to finding a birthday collision as in the Momentum proof-
of-work."
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