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Author Topic: Bitcoin's legacy  (Read 736 times)
cbeast
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September 02, 2011, 10:57:02 AM
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An simplified evolution of economy:
1. Barter was commodities traded between individuals.
2. Money was decreed, issued, and valued, still ultimately by an individual used to trade commodities.
3  Bitcoin is the first socially decreed and issued money that is itself a virtual commodity with as yet undetermined value.
N. The next evolutionary stage will probably be algorithms that intelligently manage resources. Bitcoin may be the first stage that allows this to happen because it is decentralized, scalable, secure, and yet completely transparent.

Any significantly advanced cryptocurrency is indistinguishable from Ponzi Tulips.
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hugolp
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September 02, 2011, 11:30:38 AM
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An simplified evolution of economy:
1. Barter was commodities traded between individuals.
2. Money was decreed, issued, and valued, still ultimately by an individual used to trade commodities.
3  Bitcoin is the first socially decreed and issued money that is itself a virtual commodity with as yet undetermined value.
N. The next evolutionary stage will probably be algorithms that intelligently manage resources. Bitcoin may be the first stage that allows this to happen because it is decentralized, scalable, secure, and yet completely transparent.

You can already create programs that trade commodities without the need of money. But using money is convenient because it simplifies a lot the economic calculation.

For example, when you are planning something is easier to think in terms of just one thing, money (I need 300 bitcoins for this project), than a list of commodities. It also allows for unexptected contingencies (I need 250 bitcoins plus 50 to be safe). Money is useful and makes things easy helping human development. Thats why we use it.

Also, your point 2 is wrong. Money is not decreed. The decree comes later when people is already using it as a means of creating a monopolly. Gold, silver, etc... were socially selected.
cbeast
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September 02, 2011, 01:24:57 PM
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An simplified evolution of economy:
1. Barter was commodities traded between individuals.
2. Money was decreed, issued, and valued, still ultimately by an individual used to trade commodities.
3  Bitcoin is the first socially decreed and issued money that is itself a virtual commodity with as yet undetermined value.
N. The next evolutionary stage will probably be algorithms that intelligently manage resources. Bitcoin may be the first stage that allows this to happen because it is decentralized, scalable, secure, and yet completely transparent.

You can already create programs that trade commodities without the need of money. But using money is convenient because it simplifies a lot the economic calculation.

For example, when you are planning something is easier to think in terms of just one thing, money (I need 300 bitcoins for this project), than a list of commodities. It also allows for unexptected contingencies (I need 250 bitcoins plus 50 to be safe). Money is useful and makes things easy helping human development. Thats why we use it.

Also, your point 2 is wrong. Money is not decreed. The decree comes later when people is already using it as a means of creating a monopolly. Gold, silver, etc... were socially selected.
I won't get into the debate about who issues money. Historians and coin collectors might have better opinions about that.
Of course we trade commodities with money, but fiat money has problems with local currency regulation. I wasn't aware of "programs that trade commodities without the need of money." This electronic barter is common?

Here's my point about the next step in the evolution of money. At some point, this technology will eliminate economic tribalism. Efficiency and security will replace trust. This technology will help create a global economy independent of nations, because it eliminates the need for trust of tribal leaders.

Any significantly advanced cryptocurrency is indistinguishable from Ponzi Tulips.
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September 02, 2011, 03:52:38 PM
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An simplified evolution of economy:
1. Barter was commodities traded between individuals.
2. Money was decreed, issued, and valued, still ultimately by an individual used to trade commodities.
3  Bitcoin is the first socially decreed and issued money that is itself a virtual commodity with as yet undetermined value.
N. The next evolutionary stage will probably be algorithms that intelligently manage resources. Bitcoin may be the first stage that allows this to happen because it is decentralized, scalable, secure, and yet completely transparent.

Bitcoin isn't going to have a legacy. People use Money because it has a value that is stable and is exchangeable for goods. bitcoin lacks both of these because of the way its implemented and isn't even decentralised or secure (the multiple hacks of large bitcoin banks and exchanges should demonstrate this, along with tracing transactions through the blackchain makes it possible to figure out who is who), and unless it fixes a lot of these issues its gonna die a slow death fairly soon, I'm guessing.
Vladimir
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September 02, 2011, 03:55:25 PM
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Legacy? You must be kidding!

Do newborn babies have legacies?

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NghtRppr
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September 02, 2011, 10:49:34 PM
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the multiple hacks of large bitcoin banks and exchanges should demonstrate this

Regular banks get robbed too.
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September 03, 2011, 12:00:46 AM
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regular banks legally rape people of their economic productivity too.

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onesalt
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September 03, 2011, 12:40:30 AM
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the multiple hacks of large bitcoin banks and exchanges should demonstrate this

Regular banks get robbed too.

Most banks aren't broken into via a sql injection exploits.
Revalin
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September 03, 2011, 03:16:47 AM
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Most banks aren't broken into via a sql injection exploits.

Nope.  Sometimes it's even easier.  Like Citi:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2003393/How-Citigroup-hackers-broke-door-using-banks-website.html

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Bitcoin is the Devil's way of teaching geeks economics.  --Revalin 165YUuQUWhBz3d27iXKxRiazQnjEtJNG9g
Rage
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September 03, 2011, 11:15:13 AM
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Bitcoin isn't going to have a legacy. People use Money because it has a value that is stable and is exchangeable for goods. bitcoin lacks both of these because of the way its implemented and isn't even decentralised or secure (the multiple hacks of large bitcoin banks and exchanges should demonstrate this, along with tracing transactions through the blackchain makes it possible to figure out who is who), and unless it fixes a lot of these issues its gonna die a slow death fairly soon, I'm guessing.

You're looking at security the wrong way. The various exchanges and online wallets being hacked in no way demonstrates that Bitcoin is insecure any more than a bank being robbed demonstrates the insecurity of fiat money or a gold warehouse being robbed demonstrates the insecurity of gold. What the hacks demonstrate (and the various other robberies we discussed here) is the insecurity of the *exchanges*. This is poor programming in action and has nothing to do with Bitcoin. If someone figured out how to break Bitcoin encryption, create duplicate coins that would be accepted by the network, etc, then *that* would demonstrate a problem with Bitcoin itself; the hacks do not.
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